[quote]LankyMofo wrote:
Wow. Well, I guess, before I get punked in the forums, I might as well tell everyone here that I plan to decline Mr. OK Hoss’ competition. On a more comical note, check out the PM he sent me:
Whew! Anyone wanna begin with how retarded this sounds?[/quote]
DO IT you cheese steak eating pussy… lol
[quote]LankyMofo wrote:
Wow. Well, I guess, before I get punked in the forums, I might as well tell everyone here that I plan to decline Mr. OK Hoss’ competition. On a more comical note, check out the PM he sent me:
Whew! Anyone wanna begin with how retarded this sounds?[/quote]
Even more comical is taht this is in the bodybuilding forum and the only mention of progress has been related to strength gains.
Found an HD2 sample schedule (please look at the day number I’ve put in caps to realize how little training time is being put in here). I think this one is identical to what was in HD2. Unreal.
The Routine:
Day ONE Chest and Back
DB flyes supersetted with flat or incline DB press
DB pullovers supersetted with reverse grip barbell rows
Deadlifts
Day FIVE Legs
Leg Extensions supersetted with Squats
Calf raises
Day NINE Delts and Arms
DB side raises
DB rear delt laterals
Barbell Curls
Lying French Press supersetted with Dips
Day THIRTEEN Legs
Same exercises as Day 5, Legs
Day SEVENTEEN
Repeat cycle, beginning with Day 1, Chest and Back
Here’s what an HD devotee reduced his workout to. This is actually a recipe for a sedentary, dysfunctional, out-of-shape, fat body ridden with structural imbalances.
From: www.mikementzer.com/howbrief.html
"I consequently further reduced my workout to the following:
Workout 1: (1) set of pulldowns
Workout 2: (1) set of incline presses
Workout 3: (1) set of squats
Each workout was followed by 4 days off (later increased to 5, then 6 days off). After not having made any significant strength gains in the previous 8 months, I increased strength in EVERY workout for 2-1/2 months! I was especially amazed since one of the exercises (pulldowns) I had not increased in strength in 2 years!
I had previously been thinking that my days of strength increases were over forever - something I did not even want to consider. However, by thinking â??outside the boxâ??, and testing objectively (as Mike encouraged), I was able to break through to the next level.
By the way, the only reason I didnâ??t continue my strength increases past 2-1/2 months was due to two significant health issues back-to-back. However, I am now back in top shape, have just started back on that Super Consolidated Routine, and will report my progress as it occurs.
Mike, you were right - once again!"
Found the abbreviated routine intended to be done once per week, alternating workouts.
Mike Mentzer Workout
Below is a sample bodybuilding routine inspired by Mentzer principles:
Workout 1
Leg Extention with no rest do Barbell Squat - 2 super sets of 6 to 8 reps each.
Standing Calf Raise - 2 sets of 8 to 12 reps.
Pec Deck with no rest do Bench Press - 2 super sets of 6 to 8 reps each.
60 second Super Slow Chin - 1 rep. (Go very slow, 30 seconds up and 30 seconds down) With no rest do Standing barbell curl for 6 to 8 reps. Do 2 Super Sets.
Workout 2
Pullover with no rest do Lat Pulldown - 2 super sets of 6 to 8 reps.
Lateral raise with no rest do Overhead Press - 2 super sets of 6 to 8 reps.
Super Slow Dip - 1 rep. (Go very slow, 30 seconds down and 30 seconds up) With no rest do Tricep Extentions for 6 to 8 reps. Do 2 Super Sets.
[quote]Bricknyce wrote:
Found the abbreviated routine intended to be done once per week, alternating workouts.
Mike Mentzer Workout
Below is a sample bodybuilding routine inspired by Mentzer principles:
Workout 1
Leg Extention with no rest do Barbell Squat - 2 super sets of 6 to 8 reps each.
Standing Calf Raise - 2 sets of 8 to 12 reps.
Pec Deck with no rest do Bench Press - 2 super sets of 6 to 8 reps each.
60 second Super Slow Chin - 1 rep. (Go very slow, 30 seconds up and 30 seconds down) With no rest do Standing barbell curl for 6 to 8 reps. Do 2 Super Sets.
Workout 2
Pullover with no rest do Lat Pulldown - 2 super sets of 6 to 8 reps.
Lateral raise with no rest do Overhead Press - 2 super sets of 6 to 8 reps.
Super Slow Dip - 1 rep. (Go very slow, 30 seconds down and 30 seconds up) With no rest do Tricep Extentions for 6 to 8 reps. Do 2 Super Sets.[/quote]
Fuck me get over it. lol
This guy has to be one of the DUMBEST members of all time. Right up there with the “shoe guy”, the “backflip kid” who called out HM and all the retards who posted anorexic pics on RMP.
This guy joined in less than 4 months ago and totally wasted everyone’s time. First the Cbear thread, then he asked what 5/3/1 was when it’s all over the fucking internet and now this. WTF?? Seriously??
I’ll probably be receiving a PM in 5…4…3…
[quote]B.L.U. Ninja wrote:
This guy has to be one of the DUMBEST members of all time. [/quote]
x2
[quote]MODOK wrote:
You do know that most people who enter our level 1 trauma unit at Vanderbilt Medical Center are discharged home sooner than you are training the bodypart again?[/quote]
Awesome post lol
[quote]babaganoosh wrote:
[quote]Heracles_rocks wrote:
Here’s an excerpt pertaining to HIT training. The paragraph that starts off with DR Fred Hatfield relates to why someone will need a long time to recover(second paragraph from bottom).
[quote]
Dr. Fred Hatfield commented best on HIT style training when he compared it to contest performance. I remember him stating that when Hit was performed right, it could take a person weeks to recover from it. Just think about it.
If you�¢??ve ever competed in a tournament, or a power lifting event. Everything you are, and everything you�¢??ve trained for comes down to a few short moments, in which you must pore out your very being into the actions you take. This can drain you mentally, physically, as well as emotionally.
A true Dorian style workout, will give you butterflies in anticipation of the training session, in which you will place your body underneath relentless agony! Indeed, there are few who can carry such a workout, out correctly.[/quote][/quote]
Without “being a dick”, I call bullshit on that. If it took me weeks to recover from a session, I would not assume that was a good thing. In fact i would be certain to not repeat it, I mean does it really sound like a good idea?
I highly doubt it is even possible to hammer yourself hard enough for that to happen, unless you are just being stupid (way undereating, no/little sleep, ridiculous exercises/amount/etc) or completely sedentary/untrained.[/quote]
I’m at a point where I say do what makes you happy, but I just wanted to make it clear that Dr. Fred Hatfield does not endorse or recommend HIT in any way. This quote makes it appear as though he thinks it’s a good thing.
[quote]OklahomaHoss wrote:
[quote]BONEZ217 wrote:
[quote]on edge wrote:
[quote]OklahomaHoss wrote:
I like that term “blast” set. That’s kinda what you do with Heavy Duty.
[/quote]
That was my point. Basically most people train “Heavy Duty” now, weather they know it or not.[/quote]
Most people are not spending 2 days per week in the gym. Not people taking bodybuilding seriously, at least. Yates didnt do that and Mentzer didnt build his physique doing that either. [/quote]
Actually, he did. He was trained mainly by Arthur Jones, inventor of Nautilus, who espoused brief, infrequent to-failure training.
And incidentally, Dorian Yates was trained by Mike Mentzer and developed an Olympia-winning physique.[/quote]
I don’t think that’s true. Mentzer trained under Jones for a very brief period and soon went back to more volume and frequency. Dorian Yates was trained by Mentzer on a few occasions. Yates claimed that he used Mentzer’s principles but did NOT follow a Heavy Duty routine.
Mentzer didn’t really train so different from his peers in his competition phase. I think he simply didn’t count warm up sets (or ramping sets), and gave himself a few more rest days.
I think it works as a form of strategic detraining if your body needs a break. But it never worked for me more than three weeks at a time.
[quote]MytchBucanan wrote:
[quote]OklahomaHoss wrote:
[quote]BONEZ217 wrote:
[quote]on edge wrote:
[quote]OklahomaHoss wrote:
I like that term “blast” set. That’s kinda what you do with Heavy Duty.
[/quote]
That was my point. Basically most people train “Heavy Duty” now, weather they know it or not.[/quote]
Most people are not spending 2 days per week in the gym. Not people taking bodybuilding seriously, at least. Yates didnt do that and Mentzer didnt build his physique doing that either. [/quote]
Actually, he did. He was trained mainly by Arthur Jones, inventor of Nautilus, who espoused brief, infrequent to-failure training.
And incidentally, Dorian Yates was trained by Mike Mentzer and developed an Olympia-winning physique.[/quote]
I don’t think that’s true. Mentzer trained under Jones for a very brief period and soon went back to more volume and frequency. Dorian Yates was trained by Mentzer on a few occasions. Yates claimed that he used Mentzer’s principles but did NOT follow a Heavy Duty routine.
Mentzer didn’t really train so different from his peers in his competition phase. I think he simply didn’t count warm up sets (or ramping sets), and gave himself a few more rest days.
I think it works as a form of strategic detraining if your body needs a break. But it never worked for me more than three weeks at a time.[/quote]
Well as I’ve said in two posts before, Dorian was not trained by Mentzer! Sharing three workouts at Gold’s isn’t personal training for someone like Dorian.
Dorian ever had a trainer or a nutritionist and did damn well for himself.
Dorian has said numerous times in interviews - including in one on here - that Mike never trained him.
Besides, does the following workout - one of Dorian’s - look like some feefy, ridiculous, abbreviated HIT routine?
LEGS
Leg extensions
Smith machine squats or leg presses
Hack squats
Leg curls
Stiff-legged deadlits
Standing leg curls
Standing calf raise
Seated calf raise
Here’s another:
CHEST AND BIS
Incline bench press
Seated HS bench press
Incline flys
Cable crossover
Incline dumbbell curls
Bar curls
Machine concentration curls
Really groundbreaking and different than the way everyone else trains, eh? So HIT style!
[quote]MytchBucanan wrote:
Mentzer didn’t really train so different from his peers in his competition phase. I think he simply didn’t count warm up sets (or ramping sets), and gave himself a few more rest days.
[/quote]
The real and ONLY differences are that he used less ramp-up sets on some of his exercises later in the workout (eg, first versus 5th exercise in a workout) and only counted his last set as a work set.
For example, in the “chest and bis” workout above, he did FOUR warmup/ramp-up sets for the incline press, but only ONE for concentration curls. For seated calf raises, he did NO warm-up or ramp-up sets at all - just ONE set total.
Barring his first year and a half of training in which he performed three workouts per week, he was in the gym 4 to 6 days per week like everyone else, using 2-on/1-off (4 way split) and 2-on/1-off/1-on/1-off (3-way split) schedules.
He also performed 3 to 6 cardio workouts per week depending on in- or off-season, unlike the HIT crew’s calorie-deprivation-only weight loss tactic and stuffing yourself with tons of carbs and little protein.
[quote]Bricknyce wrote:
[quote]MytchBucanan wrote:
[quote]OklahomaHoss wrote:
[quote]BONEZ217 wrote:
[quote]on edge wrote:
[quote]OklahomaHoss wrote:
I like that term “blast” set. That’s kinda what you do with Heavy Duty.
[/quote]
That was my point. Basically most people train “Heavy Duty” now, weather they know it or not.[/quote]
Most people are not spending 2 days per week in the gym. Not people taking bodybuilding seriously, at least. Yates didnt do that and Mentzer didnt build his physique doing that either. [/quote]
Actually, he did. He was trained mainly by Arthur Jones, inventor of Nautilus, who espoused brief, infrequent to-failure training.
And incidentally, Dorian Yates was trained by Mike Mentzer and developed an Olympia-winning physique.[/quote]
I don’t think that’s true. Mentzer trained under Jones for a very brief period and soon went back to more volume and frequency. Dorian Yates was trained by Mentzer on a few occasions. Yates claimed that he used Mentzer’s principles but did NOT follow a Heavy Duty routine.
Mentzer didn’t really train so different from his peers in his competition phase. I think he simply didn’t count warm up sets (or ramping sets), and gave himself a few more rest days.
I think it works as a form of strategic detraining if your body needs a break. But it never worked for me more than three weeks at a time.[/quote]
Well as I’ve said in two posts before, Dorian was not trained by Mentzer! Sharing three workouts at Gold’s isn’t personal training for someone like Dorian.
Dorian ever had a trainer or a nutritionist and did damn well for himself.
Dorian has said numerous times in interviews - including in one on here - that Mike never trained him.
Besides, does the following workout - one of Dorian’s - look like some feefy, ridiculous, abbreviated HIT routine?
LEGS
Leg extensions
Smith machine squats or leg presses
Hack squats
Leg curls
Stiff-legged deadlits
Standing leg curls
Standing calf raise
Seated calf raise
Here’s another:
CHEST AND BIS
Incline bench press
Seated HS bench press
Incline flys
Cable crossover
Incline dumbbell curls
Bar curls
Machine concentration curls
Really groundbreaking and different than the way everyone else trains, eh? So HIT style!
[/quote]
You guys are still talking about this? Anyway…
Brick, you need to back away from the coffee pot. Mopping up the thread with my original post is not cool esp. after I had already explained in a subsequent post that the intensity part of Heavy Duty is what I took away from it. I initially forgot about the extreme infrequency that Mentzer drifted to in the early 90’s. That was nearly 20 years ago, after all.
Jumping into the Yates discussion, I agree and already said Yates wasn’t trained by Mentzer. I would not agree he was training like the other bodybuilders of his time. I remember that Yates was training once a day, four or five times a week while many, if not most of his competitors were training 5 to 6 days a week with many of those days as “two a days”. I think he was also the first top bodybuilder to stick with heavy weights while cutting.
[quote]on edge wrote:
[quote]Bricknyce wrote:
[quote]MytchBucanan wrote:
[quote]OklahomaHoss wrote:
[quote]BONEZ217 wrote:
[quote]on edge wrote:
[quote]OklahomaHoss wrote:
I like that term “blast” set. That’s kinda what you do with Heavy Duty.
[/quote]
That was my point. Basically most people train “Heavy Duty” now, weather they know it or not.[/quote]
Most people are not spending 2 days per week in the gym. Not people taking bodybuilding seriously, at least. Yates didnt do that and Mentzer didnt build his physique doing that either. [/quote]
Actually, he did. He was trained mainly by Arthur Jones, inventor of Nautilus, who espoused brief, infrequent to-failure training.
And incidentally, Dorian Yates was trained by Mike Mentzer and developed an Olympia-winning physique.[/quote]
I don’t think that’s true. Mentzer trained under Jones for a very brief period and soon went back to more volume and frequency. Dorian Yates was trained by Mentzer on a few occasions. Yates claimed that he used Mentzer’s principles but did NOT follow a Heavy Duty routine.
Mentzer didn’t really train so different from his peers in his competition phase. I think he simply didn’t count warm up sets (or ramping sets), and gave himself a few more rest days.
I think it works as a form of strategic detraining if your body needs a break. But it never worked for me more than three weeks at a time.[/quote]
Well as I’ve said in two posts before, Dorian was not trained by Mentzer! Sharing three workouts at Gold’s isn’t personal training for someone like Dorian.
Dorian ever had a trainer or a nutritionist and did damn well for himself.
Dorian has said numerous times in interviews - including in one on here - that Mike never trained him.
Besides, does the following workout - one of Dorian’s - look like some feefy, ridiculous, abbreviated HIT routine?
LEGS
Leg extensions
Smith machine squats or leg presses
Hack squats
Leg curls
Stiff-legged deadlits
Standing leg curls
Standing calf raise
Seated calf raise
Here’s another:
CHEST AND BIS
Incline bench press
Seated HS bench press
Incline flys
Cable crossover
Incline dumbbell curls
Bar curls
Machine concentration curls
Really groundbreaking and different than the way everyone else trains, eh? So HIT style!
[/quote]
You guys are still talking about this? Anyway…
Brick, you need to back away from the coffee pot. Mopping up the thread with my original post is not cool esp. after I had already explained in a subsequent post that the intensity part of Heavy Duty is what I took away from it. I initially forgot about the extreme infrequency that Mentzer drifted to in the early 90’s. That was nearly 20 years ago, after all.
Jumping into the Yates discussion, I agree and already said Yates wasn’t trained by Mentzer. I would not agree he was training like the other bodybuilders of his time. I remember that Yates was training once a day, four or five times a week while many, if not most of his competitors were training 5 to 6 days a week with many of those days as “two a days”. I think he was also the first top bodybuilder to stick with heavy weights while cutting.[/quote]
Yeah, but the OP is “pretty comfortable betting that I make far better gains than you with my method of working out than you do with yours” and “incidentally, Dorian Yates was trained by Mike Mentzer and developed an Olympia-winning physique”…so everybody here other than him must be wrong.
[quote]on edge wrote:
[quote]Bricknyce wrote:
[quote]MytchBucanan wrote:
[quote]OklahomaHoss wrote:
[quote]BONEZ217 wrote:
[quote]on edge wrote:
[quote]OklahomaHoss wrote:
I like that term “blast” set. That’s kinda what you do with Heavy Duty.
[/quote]
That was my point. Basically most people train “Heavy Duty” now, weather they know it or not.[/quote]
Most people are not spending 2 days per week in the gym. Not people taking bodybuilding seriously, at least. Yates didnt do that and Mentzer didnt build his physique doing that either. [/quote]
Actually, he did. He was trained mainly by Arthur Jones, inventor of Nautilus, who espoused brief, infrequent to-failure training.
And incidentally, Dorian Yates was trained by Mike Mentzer and developed an Olympia-winning physique.[/quote]
I don’t think that’s true. Mentzer trained under Jones for a very brief period and soon went back to more volume and frequency. Dorian Yates was trained by Mentzer on a few occasions. Yates claimed that he used Mentzer’s principles but did NOT follow a Heavy Duty routine.
Mentzer didn’t really train so different from his peers in his competition phase. I think he simply didn’t count warm up sets (or ramping sets), and gave himself a few more rest days.
I think it works as a form of strategic detraining if your body needs a break. But it never worked for me more than three weeks at a time.[/quote]
Well as I’ve said in two posts before, Dorian was not trained by Mentzer! Sharing three workouts at Gold’s isn’t personal training for someone like Dorian.
Dorian ever had a trainer or a nutritionist and did damn well for himself.
Dorian has said numerous times in interviews - including in one on here - that Mike never trained him.
Besides, does the following workout - one of Dorian’s - look like some feefy, ridiculous, abbreviated HIT routine?
LEGS
Leg extensions
Smith machine squats or leg presses
Hack squats
Leg curls
Stiff-legged deadlits
Standing leg curls
Standing calf raise
Seated calf raise
Here’s another:
CHEST AND BIS
Incline bench press
Seated HS bench press
Incline flys
Cable crossover
Incline dumbbell curls
Bar curls
Machine concentration curls
Really groundbreaking and different than the way everyone else trains, eh? So HIT style!
[/quote]
You guys are still talking about this? Anyway…
Brick, you need to back away from the coffee pot. Mopping up the thread with my original post is not cool esp. after I had already explained in a subsequent post that the intensity part of Heavy Duty is what I took away from it. I initially forgot about the extreme infrequency that Mentzer drifted to in the early 90’s. That was nearly 20 years ago, after all.
Jumping into the Yates discussion, I agree and already said Yates wasn’t trained by Mentzer. I would not agree he was training like the other bodybuilders of his time. I remember that Yates was training once a day, four or five times a week while many, if not most of his competitors were training 5 to 6 days a week with many of those days as “two a days”. I think he was also the first top bodybuilder to stick with heavy weights while cutting.[/quote]
Dude, I’m not going after you at all - just talking. I wasn’t even thinking of your posts as I wrote, just making general comments on the “Dorian used HIT” stuff.
Yeah, but OP has also backed off and continuing to lay into him seems unnecessary.
[quote]on edge wrote:
I think he was also the first top bodybuilder to stick with heavy weights while cutting.[/quote]
Which is the sole reason for each of his major injuries and ended his career prematurely. He says it all the time that it’s his biggest regret.
People should not be trying to set PRs 2 weeks out from a show. It’s dumb.
Dorian: I met Mike Mentzer after I won my first Olympia in '92. I was at Gold’s Gym in Venice doing photo shoots and met Mike. Of course he was someone I’d admired when I started training, and we were talking about training principles and so on. He had a personal training business and felt that when he was still competing he still overtrained, even though he was doing a lot less than everybody else. He felt it was possible to do even less, in terms of volume, and get even better results.
So yes, I did a few workouts with Mike and we exchanged ideas. He did have some input in my training at that time. I tried to reduce the volume a little bit more, but it was a minor adjustment because I was already training like that. So it’s not correct to say Mike trained me. We did maybe three workouts together in Gold’s Gym.
Of course, it was good for Mike’s business to be associated with me, which I didn’t particularly mind. Great, if it was going to help him. I wouldn’t want anyone to take credit for training me 'cause it wouldn’t be correct. Even if someone was training me, there’s a whole bigger aspect to the sport than that. There’s the nutrition and pre-contest prep and everything, which would be a totally different ballgame than when Mike was competing.
[quote]BONEZ217 wrote:
[quote]on edge wrote:
I think he was also the first top bodybuilder to stick with heavy weights while cutting.[/quote]
Which is the sole reason for each of his major injuries and ended his career prematurely. He says it all the time that it’s his biggest regret.
People should not be trying to set PRs 2 weeks out from a show. It’s dumb. [/quote]
Right. His problem was that he admittedly was too stubborn to back off - even stubborn against his own advice in that department. He said he even had a mentally hard time backing off during scheduled deload weeks.