A few months ago, I purchased a bottle of Pinnacle’s “Andro Poppers.” A few weeks ago, I read somewhere that taking it may cause some gyno. Has anybody either tried them or heard the same info. Any info would be appreciated.
Check the label to see what it contains.
If it contains androstenedione or norandrostenedione, yes, gyno could
result. If it contains 4-androstenediol
or 19-nor-4-androstenediol, no diones,
and no “5” compounds then there’s nothing
to worry about.
I’m not really familiar with this particular
product but I thought it was a 4-AD product,
and therefore safe with regards to gyno. But
check the label.
Bill, it is mostly a 4-AD product, however it does contain diones, 4, 5, and 19 but a very small dosage. It’s 83.3 mg of 4-AD per 3.33 mg of the diones. Why do they include this 3.33 mg of useless crap is my question and could this amount lead to estrogen conversion?
I don’t feel right speculating why other
companies may have done as they have.
My guess has no particular validity. That
said, I’d guess the diones are added because
many customers will perceive a product that has
several ingredients as having advantages over
a product that has only one ingredient. That is only a guess.
I can’t really estimate the effect of the diones here. In the usual situation – without complexing with cyclodextrins – diffusion, or delivery, is independent for each separate kind of molecule, drug or nutrient. For example, say you apply a mixture of 4-AD and nor-4-AD on the skin. Each will go through the
skin at the same rate it would if the other were not there.
If you simply used say 4-AD and androstenedione themselves sublingually, again each would diffuse independently. So the fact that the percentage androstenedione was low would be irrelevant. You’d have gross excesses of each of them, and probably the amount delivered would be about 50:50 between the two compounds (the amount of each being delivered not being limited by the amount in the mouth but by the properties of the compounds and the oral mucosa.)
HOWEVER, that’s not exactly the case here,
because with cyclodextrin complexation, the steroid is basically hidden within the cyclodextrin. So I don’t know if diffusion is still independent or not. If it is, then
basically no more than 10 mg of each can be delivered. The 4-AD is present in gross excess if there’s 100 mg, and about 10 mg might be delivered, and the dione delivery would be about 3 mg. Taken several times per day, I can see where this could cause gyno. But if the diffusion is not independent – if it’s all basically “cyclodextrin complexed with steroid” and complexed 4-AD competes with complexed diones – then only about 10 mg total would be delivered, and the fraction that was diones would be only about 3%, so that
would not be significant really.
I wish I could give a sound prediction as
to which way that ought to go, but the
cyclodextrin complexation adds a twist to
the problem that makes the result unclear
to me (whether effect is additive or competitive.)