Alpine Mountain Climbing

Hey everyone -

Does anyone have any experience setting up a training program gear to fit someone making a summit run. I plan on summiting Rainer in July, and want to breeze through it.

I cant really find much out about training for it though. I assume its going to be cardiovascular and muscular endurance as well as some mental toughness.

Any thoughts?

I know Gym Jones - trains people using Twights interpretation of Crossfit.

Lots of walking a running. Thats all you need.

http://www.alpineascents.com/denali-train.asp

That’s a typical mountaineering fitness plan. Lots of cardio and pushups and crunches. I think it’s sucky.

Personally, I like following this setup to get ready for my climbing and hiking.

I’d do that and add things to off days that I think helped - like stadium climbs with my pack on, or going to the beach and doing sand runs. One of my favorite things is to go to the local dirt bike track and run laps on that.

I’m going to be doing some climbing in Alaska in early May, so maybe we should toss our training ideas back and forth to see if anything decent turns up.

I’m also going to bring some Surge Workout Fuel and FINiBARs along this year. Maybe Rhodiola too. I live like 5 feet above sea level so altitude always kicks my ass.

I live in CO, and do a couple 14ers a year. I know some guys who are really into climbing. Almost all of them do huge volume for their calves, lots of high intensity cardio mixed in with steady state stuff, and they practically run up the mountains.

D

Thanks for the input Gents.

  • Brant - id be happy to keep this thread alive and log training/bounce ideas off one another. I dont know if any of you are familiar with a trainer by the name of Stew Smith, he is a former navy seal, who now trains Candidates for BUD/S, the Green Berets, Army Rangers etc. I emailed him with the same question, to see if he had any input/experience with Alpine training. He said he indeed does, and preps guys for mountian warfare school, so I plan I bounces ideas off of him as well, and will let everyone know.

I also was thinking of bringing the SWF and FINiBARs on the trip. I have never had the FINiBARs, whats your experience with them?

This may sound stupid, but the best training I have found for alpine ascents is…you guessed it…
putting a pack on and walking/running up big ass hills.
Horses for courses I suppose.
I totally reccomend the SWF for this purpose, I make mine up in a hydration bladder then freeze it and sip on that sucker nice and cold throughout the days activities.

[quote]Cheeky_Kea wrote:
This may sound stupid, but the best training I have found for alpine ascents is…you guessed it…
putting a pack on and walking/running up big ass hills.
Horses for courses I suppose.
I totally reccomend the SWF for this purpose, I make mine up in a hydration bladder then freeze it and sip on that sucker nice and cold throughout the days activities.[/quote]

Totally Agree.

This week was my official kickoff for this prep.

Sunday did DeFrancos Built like a badass (I will continue to follow this or 531 throughout the prep) Sunday was an upperbody day with complex finisher.

Yesterday - I did a dynamic warm-up/foam roller followed by a 5mile ruck with a 40lb pack over hilly terrain. I did this is 1 hr 10mins, but had my dog with me, and he kept getting distracted haha. I would like to be able to get this down to close to a 10 min mile pace by July.

Today is lower body weights/finisher is a timed mile run, and I will either do incline walking on a treadmill or stairstepper.

I am going to also work on lower back stamina/core strength. I will be adding KB swings,band good mornings, hypers and 45 degree hypers for high reps. My lower back is my weak link so to speak. It gets fatigued before my legs or lungs. I think these will help.

I’m glad I found this thread. I’m doing McKinley in May. When I have anything beneficial to add, I’ll chime in.

Unless you’re planning on doing a truly technical route (like Liberty Ridge), starting your conditioning right now is probably overkill. The DC route, for instance, is basically just a 5000 vertical ft slog from Camp Muir to Liberty Crest with an ice ax in your hand and a pair of crampons on your feet. It shouldn’t take more than about 6 hours IIRC - hardly a long enough (or difficult enough) climb to require seven months of training. Last time I did Rainer, my entire “training program” consisted of a bagging a handful 13ers and 14ers in Colorado the week before. This was sufficient.

Even if you’re planning on a technical route with a high level of commitment, now might still be a little early to start your conditioning. It’s also worth noting that the kind of training required to prepare for a technical route is significantly different (both in scope and degree) from that required for a moderate one.

My own preparation for the summer climbing season usually doesn’t begin until mid-April, when my local ski hill closes. Then I just grab my AT gear and skin up / ski down a few thousand vertical feet once or twice a week until I can’t find any more snow. Between that, a few days out at the local crags, and a couple of early season hikes, I usually can handle a 16+ hour day with a 40 lb pack by mid-June.

[quote]Kurt Morrison wrote:
I’m glad I found this thread. I’m doing McKinley in May. When I have anything beneficial to add, I’ll chime in. [/quote]

Me Denali in July. Paying attention here.

I am going to try Rainier for my first summit run in Late August. I will be paying especially close attention to this thread.

I wanted to know if anyone has tried the ANACONDA protocol (in a hydration bladder or something) while on a run for superior recovery. If anaconda will allow CT and his trainees to workout 2 or 3x per day, I’d imagine it would do very well as part of climbing nutrition.

[quote]zImage wrote:
I am going to try Rainier for my first summit run in Late August. I will be paying especially close attention to this thread.

I wanted to know if anyone has tried the ANACONDA protocol (in a hydration bladder or something) while on a run for superior recovery. If anaconda will allow CT and his trainees to workout 2 or 3x per day, I’d imagine it would do very well as part of climbing nutrition.[/quote]

Anaconda is awesome for hypertrophy and strength work, but it’s not ideal to use during endurance work.

Surge Workout Fuel and FINiBAR are much better choices for this type of training.

[quote]Mod Brian wrote:

[quote]zImage wrote:
I am going to try Rainier for my first summit run in Late August. I will be paying especially close attention to this thread.

I wanted to know if anyone has tried the ANACONDA protocol (in a hydration bladder or something) while on a run for superior recovery. If anaconda will allow CT and his trainees to workout 2 or 3x per day, I’d imagine it would do very well as part of climbing nutrition.[/quote]

Anaconda is awesome for hypertrophy and strength work, but it’s not ideal to use during endurance work.

Surge Workout Fuel and FINiBAR are much better choices for this type of training.[/quote]

I totally agree and just to reiterate what I already posted above…

SWF----FTW with regards to endurance and rehydration whilst climbing.

Hey Brian and Cheeky, I’ve been pondering climb nutrition for a while, and I am totally on-board with with Surge and FINiBARs during the day, but I want to maximize recovery at night as much as possible. Is there any supplement that would help me do this? So far, Power Drive has been my fav for CNS recovery, it helps me noticeably.

The reason I brought up ANACONDA for recovery is because CT talks about pulsing to initiate anabolism; would pulsing also initiate recovery? Or am I way off base?

Also, a general question about climb nutrition, since it is an anaerobic endurance activity, I imagine you would absolutely need adequate protein (easy absorbing stuff like Surge) to preserve as much hard earned muscle on your frame as possible, but the nutrition plans at mountaineering companies include very large amounts of candy bars and non-nutritious stuff. For Rainier, I believe we have the option to bring our own food, I was wondering what people would bring?

I really want to preserve as much muscle as possible during my summit run in August, everyone’s help is much appreciated!

Laterz.

[quote]zImage wrote:
Hey Brian and Cheeky, I’ve been pondering climb nutrition for a while, and I am totally on-board with with Surge and FINiBARs during the day, but I want to maximize recovery at night as much as possible. Is there any supplement that would help me do this? So far, Power Drive has been my fav for CNS recovery, it helps me noticeably.

The reason I brought up ANACONDA for recovery is because CT talks about pulsing to initiate anabolism; would pulsing also initiate recovery? Or am I way off base?

Also, a general question about climb nutrition, since it is an anaerobic endurance activity, I imagine you would absolutely need adequate protein (easy absorbing stuff like Surge) to preserve as much hard earned muscle on your frame as possible, but the nutrition plans at mountaineering companies include very large amounts of candy bars and non-nutritious stuff. For Rainier, I believe we have the option to bring our own food, I was wondering what people would bring?

I really want to preserve as much muscle as possible during my summit run in August, everyone’s help is much appreciated!

Laterz.[/quote]

Aside from consuming adequate fluids and calories, maximizing the quality of sleep, especially at elevation, will make the biggest difference in your recovery. Minimizing the use of stimulants and alcohol helps. I consistently use ZMA and save Z-12 for those nights where a good night’s sleep is most crucial. I’ve also recently begun using Alpha-GPC prior to sleep and find that I sleep more soundly, and awake more refreshed, after using it.

As for what food you should take on Rainier, I’d go with whatever you enjoy eating that’s also easy to pack. Mountaineering is highly aerobic, which means that you’ll burn a lot of energy and will want calorically-dense foods. Don’t get hung up on trying to eat ‘clean.’ Homemade breakfast burritos are a favorite of mine when I pack solid (non-dehydrated) food. Leftover pizza is also great, as are brownies. Gorp is very common. Depending on the situation, I may also pack a can of Spike Shotgun if weight and space are not an issue.

I’d second the recommendation to take food you like to eat. I’ve found it hard to eat on long days in the mountains, so getting calories in any way that is palatable is more important to me than eating clean.

Thanks for the responses. Can you take ZMA and Alpha GPC together? I’ve taken ZMA before but not Alpha GPC, do they work synergistic ally, or should I just stick to one?

[quote]gt8006b wrote:
I’d second the recommendation to take food you like to eat. I’ve found it hard to eat on long days in the mountains, so getting calories in any way that is palatable is more important to me than eating clean.[/quote]

Why do you suppose this is??? Is it the altitude that takes your appetite away?

I don’t remember ever reading an explanation for the physiology behind it, but I’ve noticed it on days in the Sierras between 10,000 and 14,000 feet. When you read about guys doing really high altitude climbs in the Himalayas they’ll talk about having trouble forcing themselves to eat. So, there must be some physical effect.

Living in the Rockies, I am an outdoor junkie. From my trial and error I have found that prioritizing strength endurance and Lactate Threshold or Anaerobic work capacity the most beneficial.

I mountaineer and xc ski in the winter, climb some technical alpine routes in the summer and generally function as my girlfriends pack mule all summer long in the mountains.

My plan consists of heavy DL’s, Squat variations and oly lifts. This work has definitely made me strong and functional when it comes to carrying heavy loads and keeping the body aligned for efficient movement (i.e. hip alignment). I do the lifting 3-4 days per week. I also mix in 2 Tabata days. Sometimes I do workouts similar to the ones just posted on the homepage and other days I’ll do heavy rucks up a long hill Tabata style. I have even done Squats, dips, pullups & burpees with a pack in a Tabata circuit to mimic long alpine climbs. They all work great.

I usually cap it off with 1-2 long days in the mountains on the weekends. Usually these are more slogs just to be used to moving 8-12 hours straight. To be clear though I usually go 3-5 hours on a typical weekend, rest one weekend a month and maybe put together two long days back to back one weekend a month (i.e. 8 hrs on Sat, 12hrs on sunday). For the long days any mode of transport works fine, sometimes I bike, hike, run, ski, or even do all of my errands by foot with a pack.

In summation I would follow a plan similar to Gym Jones or Mountain Athlete. They both generate athletes with a high strength to weight ratio while incorporating heavy strength work.

Oh, and if you do this much volume, lots of sleep is crucial but I am sure you know that.