…, I think it’s better if you sit down on a bench and let your targeted muscles do the work rather than using lighter weight just so your abs get some work in. That’s what targeted ab work is for.
… [/quote]
hum… IF the OP is shoulder pressing for strength NOT bodybuilding, then I have to disagree with this point.
Since its been my experience, when I targeted my abs and shoulders at different times yes they both got stronger. BUT, when I tried to shoulder press standing (a movement where your torso needs to stabalize itself + the weight) all that “targeted training” didn’t do jack.
I recommend, if you want to shoulder press standing but ur not sure if you can handle the weight. Then, do standing shoulder presses with the heaviest weight you can handle and keep increasing the weight.
[quote]MCS wrote:
Liquid447 wrote:
coffee wrote:
80s pretty good. It would even be better if you could do that standing on your feet.
is that a seriouse statement? i can’t even imagine how i’d get them up to the start position in the first place
Like someone already said, clean them and then press. It might take you a little while to get used to the motion of cleaning two heavier dumbbells, but it’s not bad. I’m almost the exact same size as you, and I can’t get as many reps as you with 80s–more like 4-5 reps–but I can clean them well enough to start.[/quote]
True. As well as however you get them into position when your seated, do that then stand up. You also might want to work on your bi’s, if you can’t swing/Curl 80’s into position. Sounds like a slight disproportion. this is all assuming you even want to do it.
[quote]Airtruth wrote:
MCS wrote:
Liquid447 wrote:
coffee wrote:
80s pretty good. It would even be better if you could do that standing on your feet.
is that a seriouse statement? i can’t even imagine how i’d get them up to the start position in the first place
Like someone already said, clean them and then press. It might take you a little while to get used to the motion of cleaning two heavier dumbbells, but it’s not bad. I’m almost the exact same size as you, and I can’t get as many reps as you with 80s–more like 4-5 reps–but I can clean them well enough to start.
True. As well as however you get them into position when your seated, do that then stand up. You also might want to work on your bi’s, if you can’t swing/Curl 80’s into position. Sounds like a slight disproportion. this is all assuming you even want to do it.[/quote]
I agree, cleaning 80’s isn’t even necessary, if you can press them 8x I’m pretty sure you can cheat curl them, unless your biceps are really weak in comparison.
I repped out the 100’s tonight for an easy 8. My best is 120’s for 6-7 but that was awhile ago. I got about 75 pounds on you so I think what you did is pretty good, dont know about average for T-Nation or not. If your goal is size I would up the weight and keep my reps between 5-8.
And no knock on you but if you have a question mark next to your BF%, your number is probably off.
A
[quote]Liquid447 wrote:
i did 80lb seated dumbell shoulder presses today, 3 sets of 9. it that something to be happy about? or it that a norm around the tnation community? also, do i just continue to keep moving up the weight? i know the shoulders are an easy part of the body to injure, and i would like to have that not happen.
i do them with very good form, no spots, and i definatly feel that i could move up to higher weights.
Ok Yoda. I do them seated. Try running into me when I am standing up and see what happens.
[quote]coffee wrote:
Airtruth wrote:
coffee wrote:
If your direct ab work was working then you might be able to stand and press them already.
I agree with most posts though. If its bodybuilding you want and you need bigger shoulders, then as you were. But if its strength for athletics then stand up.
Would anybody disagree?
Yeah kind of.
Best way to be able to stand and do military press is to stand and do them, even starting with a lighter weight if you had to. He said he didn’t know how to get them up to start position so problem is not really ab strength just cleaning the weight up. Or he can just do a barbell and put the weight on a rack and do em.
If he can do 80lbs sitting db press, your saying if he plays a sport he will be weaker then somebody doing 65lb db press?
Maybe not weaker, but if he ever has to do some sort of a strong push while standing on his feet he might crumble instead of staying tight throughout his body.
Maybe while pushing in football or in strongman in a car flip you have to push to make sure the car goes completely over. (dont know why this example sticks out in my head)
I dont care if he can press the 150s seated. It means almost nothing if he has to press something standing. In sports you stand.
You know im gonna say it. You are only as strong as your weakest link.
Whatever happened to standing up with them while doing a dead type motion? You put them on your knees while you sit down and then kick them up one knee at the time. I can curl 80’s but why risk cheat curling 100’s let’s say if I can do it this way.
When I go above 100’s, I just pick one up with both arms and get it into position while someone else hands me the other DB. I just dont see what benifit you get out of taking any kind of risk. If your delts go, you are fucked.
A
[quote]Liquid447 wrote:
shoulder day is friday. i’ll try it standing up, maybe post a vid and someone could help me correct my form for bringing them up when i’m standing?[/quote]
[quote]NeoSpartan wrote:
…
Since its been my experience, when I targeted my abs and shoulders at different times yes they both got stronger. BUT, when I tried to shoulder press standing (a movement where your torso needs to stabalize itself + the weight) all that “targeted training” didn’t do jack.
…[/quote]
My experience has been the exact opposite.
If I get my abs and back stronger by themselves, then get my shoulders stronger by themselves, my standing presses get stronger too.
Standing presses have their place, but I think it’s a waste of time to do them standing just so you can get some ab work in at the expense of lower weights for your shoulders.
I understand, you are huge. If i run into you its not gonna do much because im only 190lbs. Even though we probably are close to the same strength, size makes a difference.
You disagree that your abs would get stronger if you stood and pressed?
When I go above 100’s, I just pick one up with both arms and get it into position while someone else hands me the other DB. I just dont see what benifit you get out of taking any kind of risk. If your delts go, you are fucked.
A
[/quote]
do you set u’re hand above u’re shoulder and just have him lay the dumbell into it?
Trust me when I tell you it is not likely we are close to the same strength. Feel free to correct me if I am wrong and more props to you.
I agree that your abs are involved when you do standing military DB’s. I disagree that they are better than seated ones. I am an old school guy and train with a split. If I am training delts, I am training delts, not abs.
A
[quote]coffee wrote:
amsterdam animal
Im confused, are you agreeing with me or no?
I understand, you are huge. If i run into you its not gonna do much because im only 190lbs. Even though we probably are close to the same strength, size makes a difference.
You disagree that your abs would get stronger if you stood and pressed?[/quote]
Yes. I would only do that when I go really heavy though and cant kick them of my knees any longer.
Good luck and train hard.
A
[quote]Liquid447 wrote:
Amsterdam Animal wrote:
When I go above 100’s, I just pick one up with both arms and get it into position while someone else hands me the other DB. I just dont see what benifit you get out of taking any kind of risk. If your delts go, you are fucked.
A
do you set u’re hand above u’re shoulder and just have him lay the dumbell into it?
Sorry for the confusion. When I do not need assistance, I “dead” the DB’s up and I sit down placing the DB’s onto my knees, I then and kick them up one at a time.
I am 6 '4.5 and the kicking up from the knees gets tricky so when I go above 100’s, I sit down, pick one up with both hands and bring the DB to shoulder height. I have someone hand me the other one at shoulder level.
When I go super heavy, I will get a boost on my first rep so I can start from the top. I won’t count that rep then.
A
[quote]Liquid447 wrote:
Amsterdam Animal wrote:
Yes. I would only do that when I go really heavy though and cant kick them of my knees any longer.
Good luck and train hard.
A
ohh ok, nono, i do the exact thing for seated, i was unsure how of to get into the ‘start’ position if i was to be standing and doing it[/quote]
If I was doing standing ones, i would not go as heavy first off so prob just clean the DB’s into position. But if I want to go heavy and am targetting my delts, why bother standing? I understand std military DB’s have their value and there is nothing wrong with them. But you tell me what hits your delts harder, 100’s seated or 70’s standing?
A
[quote]Liquid447 wrote:
Amsterdam Animal wrote:
Yes. I would only do that when I go really heavy though and cant kick them of my knees any longer.
Good luck and train hard.
A
ohh ok, nono, i do the exact thing for seated, i was unsure how of to get into the ‘start’ position if i was to be standing and doing it[/quote]
[quote]Amsterdam Animal wrote:
Trust me when I tell you it is not likely we are close to the same strength. Feel free to correct me if I am wrong and more props to you.
I agree that your abs are involved when you do standing military DB’s. I disagree that they are better than seated ones. I am an old school guy and train with a split. If I am training delts, I am training delts, not abs.
A
coffee wrote:
amsterdam animal
Im confused, are you agreeing with me or no?
I understand, you are huge. If i run into you its not gonna do much because im only 190lbs. Even though we probably are close to the same strength, size makes a difference.
You disagree that your abs would get stronger if you stood and pressed?
[/quote]
In honour of this thread i will do the opposite of normal and do some seated presses today.
I really dont know how strong you are. You are very big so I would guess very. My best lifts are 440bench 635dl chin bw+160x2 dip bw+225x3.
Awesome numbers bro. Let us know how the seated presses work out for you.
A
[quote]coffee wrote:
Amsterdam Animal wrote:
Trust me when I tell you it is not likely we are close to the same strength. Feel free to correct me if I am wrong and more props to you.
I agree that your abs are involved when you do standing military DB’s. I disagree that they are better than seated ones. I am an old school guy and train with a split. If I am training delts, I am training delts, not abs.
A
coffee wrote:
amsterdam animal
Im confused, are you agreeing with me or no?
I understand, you are huge. If i run into you its not gonna do much because im only 190lbs. Even though we probably are close to the same strength, size makes a difference.
You disagree that your abs would get stronger if you stood and pressed?
In honour of this thread i will do the opposite of normal and do some seated presses today.
I really dont know how strong you are. You are very big so I would guess very. My best lifts are 440bench 635dl chin bw+160x2 dip bw+225x3.
[/quote]
I also do them seated with standing thrown in every so often.
At 172 I hit the 100’s for 3-4 and I have to disagree with the poster who said that you can cheat curl the same amount that you press. I go up to the 60-65 pounders for dumbbell curls but I don’t think I could cheat the 100’s!!