100% RAW PL Championships

Training Powerlifting
41

Gene trains on and off at Nazareth Barbell where I have been a member and trained with the PL Team. Up until a year or two ago Gene never used steroids and benched in a poly shirt…and he did set the record (1050) in a poly shirt. I have not seen him in a year, so what his habits are now I cannot say.

You have to admit that even supporting 1000lbs is CRAZY. The whole equipped / not equipped thing is getting boring.

Do you ask Tiger Woods to use the same golf balls and clubs that Bobby Jones used in 1934? I mean you could go on and on with similar comparisons in every sport. I lift equipped and with chemical enhancement. I compete against those that do. Do I completely agree with all the gear?..no. But it is the forum in which I choose to compete. If you want to lift raw, cool…but make sure it is raw and without drugs. Drugs in my book are considered nearly as much an enhancement as lifting gear.

That is why this BS from Kazmaier is just that. Great Bill, you benched 600lbs raw…some say for reps…but the guy was a walking chemistry experiment.

42

It has never been explained why the hell the raw guys feel the need to put that in all caps.

RAWWWWW!!!

43

[quote]moonjumper wrote:
…I already have enough trophies, I need inner confidence about my TRUE strength.[/quote]

So you want to compete raw, I mean RAAWWWWWWW, just to feel better about yourself? This may be why some guys are comfortable with themselves competing in gear…they already know what they’re capable of, both in gear and out of it, and they’re just looking for the best competition they can find.

There are a lot of things I don’t like about gear, and I am free to lift any way I want, but trying to imply that lifting in gear is some kind of joke of a sport is ridiculous and disrespectful. In fact, fallacious arguments and disrespect are about all I found on the 100% RAW forum…that says a lot about the intellect and character of the people involved in that fed…

44

[quote]RickJames wrote:
moonjumper wrote:
…I already have enough trophies, I need inner confidence about my TRUE strength.

So you want to compete raw, I mean RAAWWWWWWW, just to feel better about yourself? This may be why some guys are comfortable with themselves competing in gear…they already know what they’re capable of, both in gear and out of it, and they’re just looking for the best competition they can find.

There are a lot of things I don’t like about gear, and I am free to lift any way I want, but trying to imply that lifting in gear is some kind of joke of a sport is ridiculous and disrespectful. In fact, fallacious arguments and disrespect are about all I found on the 100% RAW forum…that says a lot about the intellect and character of the people involved in that fed…[/quote]

All I have to say about this RAW stuff is YAWWWWNNNNNN. Who cares?

I have seen several RAW movements over the years and they invariably come with a roar, and leave with a whimper.

You know why? It starts out as a kind of exciting, stick it to the man concept, but ultimately, it’s not where the good lifters are lifting. Period.

Sure, like this meet, they may show up and do and compete here and there, but it is not their competitive focus.

There is a contingent of RAW benchers up here. They show up at meets with their little shirts that show the guy ripping the bench shirt in half on the back.

Two things I find amusing about this camp.

  1. They consider themselves powerlifters.

  2. They host their own little RAW meets and the standards are downright embarrassing. The last one of their meets I went to I was embarrassed to be even remotely associated with these clowns.

Heaved benches, asses a mile off the bench, uneven lockout, no rack command, feet flopping everywhere. Just sillyiness.

Oh but wait, I forgot, they are lifting RAW!!!

I told one of them I would rather see them all in double denims lifting under reasonable standards than this shit. He just stood there looking at me.

Pffffft. What a freakin’ joke.

45

[quote]apwsearch wrote:
All I have to say about this RAW stuff is YAWWWWNNNNNN. Who cares?

I have seen several RAW movements over the years and they invariably come with a roar, and leave with a whimper.

You know why? It starts out as a kind of exciting, stick it to the man concept, but ultimately, it’s not where the good lifters are lifting. Period.

Sure, like this meet, they may show up and do and compete here and there, but it is not their competitive focus.

There is a contingent of RAW benchers up here. They show up at meets with their little shirts that show the guy ripping the bench shirt in half on the back.

Two things I find amusing about this camp.

  1. They consider themselves powerlifters.

  2. They host their own little RAW meets and the standards are downright embarrassing. The last one of their meets I went to I was embarrassed to be even remotely associated with these clowns.

Heaved benches, asses a mile off the bench, uneven lockout, no rack command, feet flopping everywhere. Just sillyiness.

Oh but wait, I forgot, they are lifting RAW!!!

I told one of them I would rather see them all in double denims lifting under reasonable standards than this shit. He just stood there looking at me.

Pffffft. What a freakin’ joke.[/quote]

Well, I guess we get disrespectful, ignorant comments on both sides of the field don’t we?

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And to say that there’s no competition in RAW meets is rediculous.

A guy in the 165lb class who just got a WPO record benching over 500 admited that he can’t get 350 raw.

Even in a small federation as this one, the record here is greater than what the shirted record holder in a large federation could do raw.

The competition it there, there’s just not as many people.

And saying something like “who cares about what they’re doing, nobody goes to those meets” is rediculous too. The same can be said about all powerlifting meets in general compared to most other sports. Powerlifters don’t compete because it’s the most popular sport.

47

Gear is great for those who like it and compete against others using it.
Everybody is missing the point- I like all forms of powerlifting, I just choose to use very little gear and Im drug free.
Over the last few years Ive seen gear go from nothing to incredible. I know that Tiger Woods uses different clubs and balls that 50 years ago they didnt have.

Im weird, Im also single and date loads of HOT girls, so I also care about looking good and being conditioned and very healthy, so I am not a pure powerlifter, I train hypertrophy, care about what I eat and do cardio.

My life goal is to be strong like a powerlifter, built like a bodybuilder(cause chicks dont care what ya’ bench and I dont want to sit home alone with a great bench) and conditioned like triathlete. Gear really doesnt help me except for the powerlifting, so if I had to choose: I want the HOT girls, the active lifestyle and the prolonged lifespan OVER powerlifting.
I want it all.

48

Hey Mighty Mouse, I am far from ignorant as it relates to this topic and I want to be clear that I respect RAW strength and think it is something all lifters should strive for. In fact, I know very few who do not.

That’s really my point. All this back and forth about RAW vs. equipped is exhausting because ultimately it comes down to the where you chose to compete. That’s it.

All this talk about gear and drugs ruining the sport, nanananana, is an exercise in futility.

As long as you are having fun, who cares? Powerlifting is too small of a community for this crap. People should just lift where they have the most fun and shut their pieholes about what everyone else is doing.

I have a MUCH bigger case of the ass about lax lifting standards than I do gear and drugs. That’s why I mentioned the RAW benchers up here.

IMO, they are completely missing the point. There has to be technical integrity in the lifts performed, or it is not a sport but rather strength entertainment.

Moonjumper, I got ya. Totally understand that viewpoint and actually train with a guy that, although he is married, shares the same points of view as you in regards to his overall scope, and he is a consistent top 5 at the National level.

Best of luck to you at Nats. I will be interested to hear how you do. You alluded to the scarcity of competition in the '98’s last year. Part of that was the fact that some guys moved up.

I know of a couple '98’s that if the show up will bring high 17’s low 18’s on a bad day. Should be exciting.

49

[quote]SWR-1222D wrote:
And to say that there’s no competition in RAW meets is rediculous.

A guy in the 165lb class who just got a WPO record benching over 500 admited that he can’t get 350 raw.

Even in a small federation as this one, the record here is greater than what the shirted record holder in a large federation could do raw.
[/quote]

I didn’t go back and read, but I don’t remember anyone saying there was NO competition in those feds, just limited. If the 165 bencher in the 100% raw fed can do 600 yet no guy in the 181’s to the 275’s can do 300, then that doesn’t mean a whole lot. (Obviously this is not the case; just providing an example of now n=1 really doesn’t help a damn thing here.)

I also assume you’re talking about a WPO 3 lift competitor…bench only is different. Notice that at the upcoming raw meet being put on by Seanzilla (lol @ the name) that the minimum OPENER for the bench only 165 & under guys is 405. And comparing a dude’s raw numbers who trains entirely raw for a bench only meet to a guy who trains for a 3 lift geared meet is missing the boat anyway.

50

Is there a class for 18-19 year olds? I couldnt find info on the site about that, but would it be worth competing with a

340 lb benchpress
535 lb deadlift
500 lb squat

I weigh about 200 pounds @ 19 but I could lose ten easily and move down to 191.

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“Do you ask Tiger Woods to use the same golf balls and clubs that Bobby Jones used in 1934? I mean you could go on and on with similar comparisons in every sport. I lift equipped and with chemical enhancement.”

Comparing powerlifting to other sports that require equipment is not an analogous comparison. Inherent to the performance of golf is the use of a club. Golf is a sport where one uses how to use a club and a ball. Powerlifting is a competition of strength in the performance of 3 lifts. Is powerlifting a competition to see who can use tight fitting clothing to perform lifts? Which definition is it?

beef

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[quote]moonjumper wrote:
Mendy is the best bencher of all time, thats what I think. whether drugs, shirts or whatever, he is a great bencher.period. is he the best powerlifter? wait a second he doesnt squat or deadlift-oh yeah.
[/quote]

I don’t see the relevance to the equipment debate here but sure whatever!

Wilks yeah?

The problem is there isn’t a linear progression of strength to bodyweight as you get heavier, hence the need for formulas.

I’m not disputing how impressive a 685lb bench @ 165 is, I think it’s phenomenal.

And as regards gear and drugs, I compete both drug free and in a belt and wrist wraps ONLY.

So you think you could teach Mendy a thing or 2 yeah :wink: couldn’t resist…

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[quote]moonjumper wrote:
HALLALUYAH BROTHER, like your thinking.
Im going to do the USAPL nationals in July, right here in my backyard, the go to Orlando in August for the 100%RAW nationals, hoping for 1700+(700,445,635) at 198 then RAW hopefully 1600, congrats on the record, very impressive, remember that records and meets all depend on who shows up, if Ray Benemerito shows up at the Nationals Im screwed, last year I sat in the Audience(spine surgery) and saw a 1625 total win the Nationals for 198, great lifting BUT I know that there are lifters who can total more, they just weren’t there that day, so 1625 won the Nationals- good for him.

There aren’t many RAW competitions, so I also plan on doing USAPL RAW, they actually have that division, Im sure that some will beat me with gear on, but I already have enough trophies, I need inner confidence about my TRUE strength.
wish you the best.

[/quote]

Sorry for the hijack, but I do have to jump in here for integrity’s sake.

The winning total at 2005 USAPL NAtionals for the 198’s was 1830. Second was 1702, third was 1635.

Had Beck and Mastrean not moved up, and Brandon not bombed, a sub 1700 would probably not have even placed.

I would look to this year being much more competitive because people tend to move up when gaps like this emerge.

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[quote]Hanley wrote:
…
I don’t see the relevance to the equipment debate here but sure whatever!
[/quote]

This thread isn’t just about an equipment debate, so there’s no reason for every post on it to be relevant to an equipment debate.

55

[quote]RickJames wrote:
SWR-1222D wrote:
And to say that there’s no competition in RAW meets is rediculous.

A guy in the 165lb class who just got a WPO record benching over 500 admited that he can’t get 350 raw.

Even in a small federation as this one, the record here is greater than what the shirted record holder in a large federation could do raw.

I didn’t go back and read, but I don’t remember anyone saying there was NO competition in those feds, just limited. If the 165 bencher in the 100% raw fed can do 600 yet no guy in the 181’s to the 275’s can do 300, then that doesn’t mean a whole lot. (Obviously this is not the case; just providing an example of now n=1 really doesn’t help a damn thing here.)

I also assume you’re talking about a WPO 3 lift competitor…bench only is different. Notice that at the upcoming raw meet being put on by Seanzilla (lol @ the name) that the minimum OPENER for the bench only 165 & under guys is 405. And comparing a dude’s raw numbers who trains entirely raw for a bench only meet to a guy who trains for a 3 lift geared meet is missing the boat anyway.
[/quote]

That was just an example to show that there is some decent competition in raw meets (depending on the day), but the guy I was talking about does the majority of his training with an open back shirt (don’t know much else about his shirt other than it was expensive), but he doesn’t bench shirted exclusively.

I don’t mean to take away anything from equipped lifters, as I’m sure that for every story like mine, there are a few stories of equipped lifters being able to lift more raw than the raw lifter of the same weight.

I’m going to be competing both RAW and with gear in the future, but I won’t be getting the absolute best gear anytime soon, which kind of sucks because once I’m ready and can afford the best equipment, I’ll have to un-learn the shirts that I’m used to.

I love the sport of powerlifting, RAW or equipped. I just hate seeing one-sided debates that suggest one is great and the other is crap (not saying that’s what you said).

It’s fine to have a preference (right now mine is RAW/natural but that’s where I’m most competitive at this time), but I just wish everyone would recognize that there’s a lot of hard work and dedication in BOTH equipped and RAW meets, and both natural and Pro.

This is powerlifting. We should all be supporting each other no matter which rules we choose to compete with. Lord knows there aren’t enough people on the outside supporting us as it is.

56

That was just an example to show that there is some decent competition in raw meets (depending on the day), but the guy I was talking about does the majority of his training with an open back shirt (don’t know much else about his shirt other than it was expensive), but he doesn’t bench shirted exclusively.

I don’t mean to take away anything from equipped lifters, as I’m sure that for every story like mine, there are a few stories of equipped lifters being able to lift more raw than the raw lifter of the same weight.

I’m going to be competing both RAW and with gear in the future, but I won’t be getting the absolute best gear anytime soon, which kind of sucks because once I’m ready and can afford the best equipment, I’ll have to un-learn the shirts that I’m used to.

I love the sport of powerlifting, RAW or equipped. I just hate seeing one-sided debates that suggest one is great and the other is crap (not saying that’s what you said).

It’s fine to have a preference (right now mine is RAW/natural but that’s where I’m most competitive at this time), but I just wish everyone would recognize that there’s a lot of hard work and dedication in BOTH equipped and RAW meets, and both natural and Pro.

This is powerlifting. We should all be supporting each other no matter which rules we choose to compete with. Lord knows there aren’t enough people on the outside supporting us as it is.[/quote]

Agreed.

I think the vast majority of lifters would agree on the amount of work put into preparing for competition. Most of us have a lot more in common than in opposition.

Unless somebody comes busting in here with something completely asinine, I am finished.

I would now like to commence the roasting of marshmallows and singing of Kumbya.

I wish you a lot of success.

57

[quote]lazyaxus11 wrote:
Is there a class for 18-19 year olds? I couldnt find info on the site about that, but would it be worth competing with a

340 lb benchpress
535 lb deadlift
500 lb squat

I weigh about 200 pounds @ 19 but I could lose ten easily and move down to 191.[/quote]

Lazyaxus11 - there are teen sections in most powerlifting organizations, normally it goes 14-15, 16-17, 18-19. With your lifts you would be more than competitive, I had worse lifts than you at your age and was still pretty good. However the biggest problem I see with people who have never competed before is not realizing how strict the judging can be, especially on squats and to a lesser extent on benches, so try to get someone who has actually competed to watch you lift to make sure you are doing them right. But I would say go for it. Even after you are a teen there is normally a junior and/or collegiate division that is 20-23. Regarding weight classes the one you are closest to is 198, the one below that is 181, and above it is 220. There is no 191. That weight is the highest you can be so being in the 198 lb division means you compete against people weighing 182-198 lbs. Normally you want to come in at the top of your division.

Good luck, I hope you choose to compete.

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Well I competed in highschool in the 181 pounds class, so I know how the judging can be, but back when I competed squats only had to go to parallel, now I hear that you have to break the plain of parallel in order for it to count, oh well it shouldnt be much of a difference either way. I figure every federation has different rules and standards anyhow.

Are knee wraps allowed for squats? That may be a stupid question but they were in high school… a belt and knee wraps were the only things you could use tho.

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The last time I competed was in 1986. Even back then you had to break parallel for a squat to count.

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Men’s 66 pound weight class? My little brother was 80 pounds in first grade!