Today:
platform DL w/ chains
225+chains x3
275+chains x3
315+chains x3
365+chains x1
385+chains x1 PR
365+chains x1
315+chains x5
Cable row
134x10
180x8
suitcase DL:
135x12 each arm
DB row:
100x15 each arm, just going for the lat stretch at the bottom
good morning:
barx5
95x5
135x5
185x3
Cable curls
90x10
110x10
140x5
decent session. Gonna go party now, I’ll be on tomorow.
FS, you mentioned the manta ray squat a few pages back. I read something about it being good for strengthening yourself to stay upright during the squat. Any follow ups on this? Should I use it for a ME movement or instead of the frontsquats. On a box ort without? chains?
After floor pressing, I’ll be doing bench pressing with aerobics boxes on both sides. (like a pin press, but I don’t have a cage). Like the way marlboroman does them. Then I’m going to retest my bench, identify where I’m weak, if it’s at the bottom, more paused pin presses and etc, if at the top I’ll start the new cycle with chain floor presses.
Here’s something for fighting scott:
concept:
won’t be switching back to a four way soon, but I might think about it again when I lose a lot of the stress I’m in right now, and just eat all day.
This is all too much volume. Doing a Max Effort Squat Exercise and a Max Effort Deadlift Exercise on the same day every week will destroy you.
Doing Full Cleans on Dynamic Effort Squat Day is probably going to be to much as well. In place of Full Cleans you can do either Standing Broad Jumps or Box Jumps. Think about it for 2 seconds. These movements are the EXACT same movements as a full squat clean. First you Jump. Second you tuck. But it’s not nearly as stressful to the body. Do these before Dyanmic Effort Squats. 4 sets of 4 is a good place to start. Every jump does not have to be a PR.
You’re doing a lot of chest isolation / pec fly work on your repetition upper body day. The pecs don’t have dick to do with pressing. Whether it’s Military Pressing, Incline Pressing, or Flat Bench Pressing, the Triceps are always the prime mover.
In order to make sure your light upper body day stays light you have one of 3 options as I see it
(1) Use the Dynamic Method
(2) Use the Westside For Skinny Bastards version of the repetition method. This does not mean working up to a heavy set of 7 on Dumbbell Bench Press. This means doing reps between 20 and 75 with simple exercises such as barbell push-ups, bodyweight dips, or light dumbbell benching.
(3) Just don’t do any pressing. Dedicate this day to your lats, upper back, and biceps.
All your max effort movements are very similar. You need to choose max effort movements that are relativly different from one another in order to keep the CNS from fatiguing. If someone’s max effort bench press exercise cycle consisted of Flat Benching, Close-Grip Flat Benching, 1-Board Benching, and Close-Grip 1-Board Benching they would surely start to get weaker because they’d be doing basically the exact same exercise with only minute changes. The difference needs to be somewhat dramatic.
EliteFTS has plenty of articles with sample max effort exercise cycles that will allow you to understand what I’m getting at if you don’t right now. If you have chains and you have some boards then you really shouldn’t have any problem coming up with a variety different max effort exercises.
2-Board Close-Grip Bench Press w/Chains
Incline Bench Press
Low Pin Press 2" From Chest
Flat Barbell Bench Press
Likewise, if you have a power rack and a barbell, you shouldn’t have any trouble coming up with max effort exercises that are vastly different from each other.
Zercher Squat off Pins w/ Chains
Sumo Low Rack Pull
Front Squat
Platform Deadlift w/ Chains
Parallel Box Squat
Conventional Deadlift
Remember, you can use boxes of varying height. You can sumo, snatch-grip, or conventional. You can pull from deficits, from the floor, or from pins. You can squat off pins. You can use chains. You can use a Front, Low-Bar, High-Bar, or Hack Squat, or Zercher Squat position. You really have quite a lot of different possibilities at your disposal.
No matter what your max effort exercise is, you must make at least 4 lifts over 90% of your max. No more than 10. 7 is optimal.
As far as the Manta Ray goes, I find it moves around too much. Just front squat instead. You can use chains with these if you like. Just be consistent in how you do the exercise. It’s become pretty popular to do these paused off safety pins.
Do your shrugs on Max Effort Lower Body days. Your neck can never be too jacked. If you feel like they’re too heavy and interfering with your recovery then stop using straps!
Lunges are superior to leg extensions and any press/push/dip is superior to triceps extensions. I can do all the weight stack on any leg extension I go to anywhere and it hasn’t given me super legs. But I haven’t done lunges with 165lb Dumbbells yet, so I’ll have to get back to you on the benefits of maxing out that exercise.
You don’t have pull-ups anywhere in your plan. Fix that.
Too much focus on the deadlift. Your pressing is very weak in comparison, and it looks like the only pulling movement you’re working is the DB row???
Should have asked this in advance, but what are your goals? current, mid term, long term?
If bodybuilding (eventually) is your goal, then at your age, focusing on the wrong movements will give you a lopsided build. Add weighted pullups (or heavy pulldowns at least) and work on pressing movements.
[quote]tribunaldude wrote:
Should have asked this in advance, but what are your goals? current, mid term, long term?
If bodybuilding (eventually) is your goal, then at your age, focusing on the wrong movements will give you a lopsided build. Add weighted pullups (or heavy pulldowns at least) and work on pressing movements.[/quote]
I do rack chins or lat pulldowns every time I train the squat. Been hitting PRs too. I just don’t feel regular chins like I feel either of these two movements. What do you mean by working on pressing movements? I press twice every 9 days.
Goals:
lean(sub 12%) 200 at current height(5’8.5") by summer
Squat 405x1 raw by summer or sooner
Deadlift 455 in the upcoming weeks
bench 275x1 by summer or sooner
30" thighs
16.5" arms
more cannonball to shoulders.
anything else?
[quote]tribunaldude wrote:
Too much focus on the deadlift. Your pressing is very weak in comparison, and it looks like the only pulling movement you’re working is the DB row???[/quote]
My pressing is weak because of past history of supraspinatus(sp?) tendononitis. It’s a huge priority right now.
I do cable and DB rows on the days I deadlift, and either lat pulldowns or rack chins on the days I squat. I feel this leaves me with more bgas in the tank for my bench workouts, and those are the ones that need the most work.
[quote]FightingScott wrote:
This is all too much volume. Doing a Max Effort Squat Exercise and a Max Effort Deadlift Exercise on the same day every week will destroy you.
Doing Full Cleans on Dynamic Effort Squat Day is probably going to be to much as well. In place of Full Cleans you can do either Standing Broad Jumps or Box Jumps. Think about it for 2 seconds. These movements are the EXACT same movements as a full squat clean. First you Jump. Second you tuck. But it’s not nearly as stressful to the body. Do these before Dyanmic Effort Squats. 4 sets of 4 is a good place to start. Every jump does not have to be a PR.
You’re doing a lot of chest isolation / pec fly work on your repetition upper body day. The pecs don’t have dick to do with pressing. Whether it’s Military Pressing, Incline Pressing, or Flat Bench Pressing, the Triceps are always the prime mover.
In order to make sure your light upper body day stays light you have one of 3 options as I see it
(1) Use the Dynamic Method
(2) Use the Westside For Skinny Bastards version of the repetition method. This does not mean working up to a heavy set of 7 on Dumbbell Bench Press. This means doing reps between 20 and 75 with simple exercises such as barbell push-ups, bodyweight dips, or light dumbbell benching.
(3) Just don’t do any pressing. Dedicate this day to your lats, upper back, and biceps.
All your max effort movements are very similar. You need to choose max effort movements that are relativly different from one another in order to keep the CNS from fatiguing. If someone’s max effort bench press exercise cycle consisted of Flat Benching, Close-Grip Flat Benching, 1-Board Benching, and Close-Grip 1-Board Benching they would surely start to get weaker because they’d be doing basically the exact same exercise with only minute changes. The difference needs to be somewhat dramatic.
EliteFTS has plenty of articles with sample max effort exercise cycles that will allow you to understand what I’m getting at if you don’t right now. If you have chains and you have some boards then you really shouldn’t have any problem coming up with a variety different max effort exercises.
2-Board Close-Grip Bench Press w/Chains
Incline Bench Press
Low Pin Press 2" From Chest
Flat Barbell Bench Press
Likewise, if you have a power rack and a barbell, you shouldn’t have any trouble coming up with max effort exercises that are vastly different from each other.
Zercher Squat off Pins w/ Chains
Sumo Low Rack Pull
Front Squat
Platform Deadlift w/ Chains
Parallel Box Squat
Conventional Deadlift
Remember, you can use boxes of varying height. You can sumo, snatch-grip, or conventional. You can pull from deficits, from the floor, or from pins. You can squat off pins. You can use chains. You can use a Front, Low-Bar, High-Bar, or Hack Squat, or Zercher Squat position. You really have quite a lot of different possibilities at your disposal.
No matter what your max effort exercise is, you must make at least 4 lifts over 90% of your max. No more than 10. 7 is optimal.
As far as the Manta Ray goes, I find it moves around too much. Just front squat instead. You can use chains with these if you like. Just be consistent in how you do the exercise. It’s become pretty popular to do these paused off safety pins.
Do your shrugs on Max Effort Lower Body days. Your neck can never be too jacked. If you feel like they’re too heavy and interfering with your recovery then stop using straps!
Lunges are superior to leg extensions and any press/push/dip is superior to triceps extensions. I can do all the weight stack on any leg extension I go to anywhere and it hasn’t given me super legs. But I haven’t done lunges with 165lb Dumbbells yet, so I’ll have to get back to you on the benefits of maxing out that exercise.
You don’t have pull-ups anywhere in your plan. Fix that.[/quote]
I don’t feel like I’m ready for alternating away from deadlifting and squatting heavy both frequently. I don’t feel like I’m moving enough poundage for me to make serious gains on my backsquat without a backsquat variation nearly weekly. I just don’t think I’m ready.
Matt Rhodes has a program on elite, where squatting and deadlifting is done in the same session and heavy as well.
http://www.elitefts.com/documents/getting_ready.htm
See what you think of that.
[quote]OooahhhCANTONA wrote:
Matt Rhodes has a program on elite, where squatting and deadlifting is done in the same session and heavy as well.
http://www.elitefts.com/documents/getting_ready.htm
See what you think of that.
[/quote]
I’ll give it a read.
I’m benching tomorrow because I’m kinda sick today. and I have to work tonight.
[quote]zephead4747 wrote:
I don’t feel like I’m ready for alternating away from deadlifting and squatting heavy both frequently. I don’t feel like I’m moving enough poundage for me to make serious gains on my backsquat without a backsquat variation nearly weekly. I just don’t think I’m ready.[/quote]
That’s why you Back Squat Every Week on Dynamic Effort Squat days.
As for the max effort exercises, pick exercises for a reason! Don’t just pick different ones all willy nilly. Choose ones that will attack your weaknesses. Your max effort rotation may look like:
Box Squat w/Chains (5RM)
Box Squat w/Chains (3RM)
Front Box Squat (5RM)
Front Box Squat (3RM)
Straight Weight Box Squat (5RM)
Straight Weight Box Squat (3RM)
[quote]FightingScott wrote:
zephead4747 wrote:
I don’t feel like I’m ready for alternating away from deadlifting and squatting heavy both frequently. I don’t feel like I’m moving enough poundage for me to make serious gains on my backsquat without a backsquat variation nearly weekly. I just don’t think I’m ready.
That’s why you Back Squat Every Week on Dynamic Effort Squat days.
As for the max effort exercises, pick exercises for a reason! Don’t just pick different ones all willy nilly. Choose ones that will attack your weaknesses. Your max effort rotation may look like:
Box Squat w/Chains (5RM)
Box Squat w/Chains (3RM)
Front Box Squat (5RM)
Front Box Squat (3RM)
Straight Weight Box Squat (5RM)
Straight Weight Box Squat (3RM)
[/quote]
I don’t really have “weaknesses” I’m just weak. I feel that if I try this I’ll be chasing my own tail. My squat might be up but my DL might go down, and vice versa.
I trust your judgement, but right now is not my time for westside. When I actually am pulling/squatting/benching heavy weights I’ll think about it.
[quote]zephead4747 wrote:
but right now is not my time for westside. [/quote]
Then make sure you stop doing heavy singles all the time.
[quote]FightingScott wrote:
zephead4747 wrote:
but right now is not my time for westside.
Then make sure you stop doing heavy singles all the time.[/quote]
can do. I was actually planning for my next squat session to try:
315x2-3
295x3+
deadlift session:
395x1
365x5 (if I fail somewhere in there, finish it up with singles)
does that look good?
UPDATE:
snow day, idk If the gym is even open, I’ll swing by during it’s open hours and find out.
[quote]zephead4747 wrote:
FightingScott wrote:
zephead4747 wrote:
but right now is not my time for westside.
Then make sure you stop doing heavy singles all the time.
can do. I was actually planning for my next squat session to try:
315x2-3
295x3+
deadlift session:
395x1
365x5 (if I fail somewhere in there, finish it up with singles)
does that look good?
UPDATE:
snow day, idk If the gym is even open, I’ll swing by during it’s open hours and find out.[/quote]
Ummm… you’re doing 395 for 1! That’s a heavy single.
Why not try squatting 275 for 10 or more reps?
I would encourage you to create two “lower body” days, make one light, and one heavy.
You can’t keep doing the same exact lifts using weights above 90% all the time! But if you want to keep doing deadlift day and squat day consider this…
Squat Day A: Squat a 10-15 rep max
Deadlift Day A: Deadlift a 5 rep max
Squat Day B: Squat a 5 rep max
Deadlift Day B: Just do a lot of back raises with weight for high reps.
Hmm. If I went back to a 4days/week. I could rotate between
Heavy squat
heavy DL
DE lower
I would still be pulling and squatting heavy, with some frequency, and I would be getting DE work in.
I’ll go for 385 for a triple next time Instead of 395x1. I wont try any heavy singles till I’m back retesting my floor dead max.
thoughts?
What did you think of Matt Rhodes’ program?
[quote]zephead4747 wrote:
Hmm. If I went back to a 4days/week. I could rotate between
Heavy squat
heavy DL
DE lower
I would still be pulling and squatting heavy, with some frequency, and I would be getting DE work in.
I’ll go for 385 for a triple next time Instead of 395x1. I wont try any heavy singles till I’m back retesting my floor dead max.
thoughts?[/quote]
This doesn’t make any sense to me. If you are going to be training 4 days a week and using the max effort method and the dynamic effort method they why wouldn’t you use the Westside template?
I think you are using weights too close to your max too often.
[quote]FightingScott wrote:
zephead4747 wrote:
Hmm. If I went back to a 4days/week. I could rotate between
Heavy squat
heavy DL
DE lower
I would still be pulling and squatting heavy, with some frequency, and I would be getting DE work in.
I’ll go for 385 for a triple next time Instead of 395x1. I wont try any heavy singles till I’m back retesting my floor dead max.
thoughts?
This doesn’t make any sense to me. If you are going to be training 4 days a week and using the max effort method and the dynamic effort method they why wouldn’t you use the Westside template?
I think you are using weights too close to your max too often.
[/quote]
Because I think if I don’t squat AND deadlift remotely heavy frequently, I will regress.
edit: A great way to work in heavy and light sq/dl work would be to run the coan dl cycle again.
hmm