Would You Go Into Debt For Your Job?

Off Topic
61

[quote]RageInspired wrote:
Lets take the spartan approach and weed out the trash.

The kid who just bubbles in the answers without reading the question is automatically sentenced to death unless said bubbling is due to lack of time. In which case if said student cannot complete a second test in time with passing grade he or she may be executed on the spot and made an example of.

Oh and all the kids who can’t come up with an original thought or who can’t read a book to save their life yet pride themselves on it. Lets get rid of them too.

Well I thought about what I wrote before I hit submit. I change all my responses… leave the stupid people the hell alone. I need them to work for me for minimum wage one day. I understand you as a teacher have to put up with it but thats your job.

There’s always a disciplinary system (which my teachers were afraid to use) and if it was ever used properly this shit wouldnt happen or these kids would be out of the school before the end of highschool. [/quote]

LOL! Yeah, I had this idealised view when I was younger and, sadly, still have a lot of it. I do want to make a better world. Killing idiots is probably not an option. Made me chuckle.

I do want to clear something up: I teach in a private high school. The pay is a lot lower than publics. A teacher has to choose whether to go for better pay, or better working conditions.

The ideal is where some schools give the teacher + family a home to live in. THAT’S a much better deal.

62

[quote]nephorm wrote:
Gambit_Lost wrote:
Oh, and you want better quality teachers in the classroom? Pay them more. Period. Money will attract more people and allow more selectivity. And maybe we won’t have so many good teachers getting completely burned out and leaving within 3 years.

I’m willing to pay more for teachers when we simultaneously agree to fire the crappy ones.[/quote]

Sounds like a plan. Now on to combat the Union and find an appropriate way to “rate” teachers.

63

[quote]Bauer97 wrote:
Polish Rifle wrote:

You’ve been teaching 28 years and you make $32,000? Quit fucking lying. My girlfriend just signed her 1st contract to teach 3rd grade next year for $36,500. I would gather to say you’re making around $80K.

Keep in mind, teacher salaries vary drastically depending on State and district.

My wife started at $42k, and the pay scale, after 13 years, tops out at $109k.

However, my Aunt, who has been teaching in Florida for well over 20 years, makes about $30k.[/quote]

In FL, teachers need their Masters to make more than 30K - Really.

64

[quote]Geminspector wrote:
Bauer97 wrote:
Polish Rifle wrote:

You’ve been teaching 28 years and you make $32,000? Quit fucking lying. My girlfriend just signed her 1st contract to teach 3rd grade next year for $36,500. I would gather to say you’re making around $80K.

Keep in mind, teacher salaries vary drastically depending on State and district.

My wife started at $42k, and the pay scale, after 13 years, tops out at $109k.

However, my Aunt, who has been teaching in Florida for well over 20 years, makes about $30k.

In FL, teachers need their Masters to make more than 30K - Really.
[/quote]

What a slap in the face. Although… is the cost of living fairly low in florida?

Teachers here with their masters (or 6+ years of university) will make upwards of 80K, not to mention becoming a department head or coordinator which adds another 10K onto that.

65

It’s strange. My wife became a teacher because she truly cares about kids and wanted to make a difference.

She quit teaching because most of the teachers are worse than the students. In fact, they are older wiser and much better at being backstabbing, cut-throat, blame anybody but me dickwads.

Fortunately she used her communication and language skills to enter sales. She makes a lot more, works independently, and can satisfy her need to help kids through various community outreach programs.

HH, If you are that broken up about your job, you should do yourself and everybody that you are supposed to be teaching a favor and quit.

66

[quote]nephorm wrote:
rsg wrote:
Huge as in muscle or fat?

I went to high school with sophomores that were 6’4" and solid muscle. I would have liked to see someone try to “physically discipline” them.

The schools that most require discipline are probably also the ones in which students are more likely to be involved in gangs or to bring guns to school.
[/quote]

Well first off you beat them while young. Then when they are older and bigger they won’t be such a problem.

67

Teaching may be a shitty job but if you know what you’re getting into there isn’t much of a reason to complain.

I really can’t see it being all that bad simply because teaching at a high school level at least is not hard to do. You don’t actually have to teach much if you don’t want to. You can give kids plenty of work to keep them busy or just let them fool around as long as they don’t cause you any trouble.

The kids who want to do well will do well and the kids who don’t care will get low marks. What you do doesn’t make that big a difference. Most kids just copy off each other to varying degrees or cheat to get by and if they don’t and choose not to learn than oh well, tough shit.

You aren’t the one who is going to have to retake a course during the summer or something. You can encourage some kids who might otherwise fail or do poorly to do much better but most of them have already decided how much work they will put in and what grade they will get so your help will not matter to them.

Teachers can spend countless hours trying to make amazing lesson plans and imprint good morals and habits in their students or they can just do a lesson a week and tell everyone to study independently. You can buy all sorts of stuff for your classroom to decorate it or you can leave it empty and say fuck it.

I’ve seen teachers do that before and I never heard of interior decorator police cracking down on them. You can just use the same lesson plan and assignments from last year with a few changes the next and you can basically copy whatever other teachers with the same course are doing.

Teaching can be as hard or as easy as the teacher wants it to be.

68

[quote]SkyzykS wrote:
It’s strange. My wife became a teacher because she truly cares about kids and wanted to make a difference.

She quit teaching because most of the teachers are worse than the students. In fact, they are older wiser and much better at being backstabbing, cut-throat, blame anybody but me dickwads.

Fortunately she used her communication and language skills to enter sales. She makes a lot more, works independently, and can satisfy her need to help kids through various community outreach programs.

HH, If you are that broken up about your job, you should do yourself and everybody that you are supposed to be teaching a favor and quit.
[/quote]

This is a sad–and true–statement. “if you’re a teacher who really wants to make a difference, quit and do something else.”

69

[quote]SkyzykS wrote:
It’s strange. My wife became a teacher because she truly cares about kids and wanted to make a difference.

She quit teaching because most of the teachers are worse than the students. In fact, they are older wiser and much better at being backstabbing, cut-throat, blame anybody but me dickwads.

Fortunately she used her communication and language skills to enter sales. She makes a lot more, works independently, and can satisfy her need to help kids through various community outreach programs.

HH, If you are that broken up about your job, you should do yourself and everybody that you are supposed to be teaching a favor and quit.
[/quote]

The trouble is love — like the wife who loves the hubby even though the guy beats the shit out of her every once in a while.

Another trouble I have is that my high school graduates some really super kids — West Point grads, doctors (one of my former is now in ‘Doctors Without Borders’) and people like that. If I taught all cretins, it’d be easier to walk.

Call it a love-hate relationship. :smiley:

70

[quote]nothingclever wrote:
Teaching may be a shitty job but if you know what you’re getting into there isn’t much of a reason to complain.

I really can’t see it being all that bad simply because teaching at a high school level at least is not hard to do. You don’t actually have to teach much if you don’t want to. You can give kids plenty of work to keep them busy or just let them fool around as long as they don’t cause you any trouble.

The kids who want to do well will do well and the kids who don’t care will get low marks. What you do doesn’t make that big a difference. Most kids just copy off each other to varying degrees or cheat to get by and if they don’t and choose not to learn than oh well, tough shit.

You aren’t the one who is going to have to retake a course during the summer or something. You can encourage some kids who might otherwise fail or do poorly to do much better but most of them have already decided how much work they will put in and what grade they will get so your help will not matter to them.

Teachers can spend countless hours trying to make amazing lesson plans and imprint good morals and habits in their students or they can just do a lesson a week and tell everyone to study independently.

You can buy all sorts of stuff for your classroom to decorate it or you can leave it empty and say fuck it. I’ve seen teachers do that before and I never heard of interior decorator police cracking down on them. You can just use the same lesson plan and assignments from last year with a few changes the next and you can basically copy whatever other teachers with the same course are doing.

Teaching can be as hard or as easy as the teacher wants it to be.[/quote]

You’re close to the idea — I worked my way through school and thought nothing of it. That was many years ago. Now, college is so damned expensive, not many good people go into teaching.

The cost of college has skyrocketed, but teacher salaries are mired in the mud. There’s less and less reason for anyone to teach. Sure, you can do it for selfless reasons, but that doesn’t fix the car, put a new roof on, or put your own kids through college.

I know most other salaries suck too, but that won’t get better if you’re surrounded by illiterate and innumerate savages (hmmm…sounds like Cleveland… ;p).

71

[quote]Revo09 wrote:

If you don’t mind me asking, what does your wife teach where she will make 109k? Or, more specifically, what level is she teaching at?[/quote]

Secondary education, in Eastern PA.

It’s on par with the cost of living here, trust me.

72

[quote]nephorm wrote:
RageInspired wrote:
When your in a non-lecture class and you have to sit in a desk for a 12 y/o you wonder where the fuck your money goes…

Gay pride parades.[/quote]

I don’t think he meant your money specifically.

73

[quote]Testy1 wrote:
nephorm wrote:
RageInspired wrote:
When your in a non-lecture class and you have to sit in a desk for a 12 y/o you wonder where the fuck your money goes…

Gay pride parades.

I don’t think he meant your money specifically.[/quote]

Well played, sir.

Well played.

74

[quote]nephorm wrote:
Testy1 wrote:
nephorm wrote:
RageInspired wrote:
When your in a non-lecture class and you have to sit in a desk for a 12 y/o you wonder where the fuck your money goes…

Gay pride parades.

I don’t think he meant your money specifically.

Well played, sir.

Well played.[/quote]

75

Most people come out of college here with a debt load of at least 50 or 60 thousand dollars. That’s if they went to a typical public university. Of course, there are exceptions and a lot of people work their way through school.

But I contend that it is irrational to expect people to go into debt like that, for a job that pays low, is very demanding in terms of pure hours worked and discipline problems, with no advancement (unless you leave the classroom). We’ve seen a dramatic fall off in quality of teachers, with the profession becoming equivalent to a K Mart clerk position.
[/quote]

Would someone like to explain how this is different for anyone else starting in any job. I came out of college with, oh. . . 50k in debt too. And guess what? I started off making 33k as well. My problem was that in order to get a raise I had to earn it.

No union to protect my ass. And again youd deal with children SO YES you should be disciplined for using the work Shit or Dick, or FUCK!! Guess what, I am disciplined for using that at work too. No disrespect to any teachers, or anyone on this site, but we all have to deal with the same thing. Same shit, different smell.

76

[quote]jnnak wrote:
Headhunter wrote:
jnnak wrote:
Sure I’d take the job for only having to work 180 or so days a year.

Okay…do you remember your hs experience? Now look at it from the teacher’s vantage point: Take 5 classes, each with 30 students. Usually about 3 have an IQ above room temperature.

Teach them, teach. Go for it.

So let’s take 5 classes for per your example. I think in highschool my classes were around 50 minutes each give or take. So on an average work day, you spend just a little more than 4 hours with your “clients”. [/quote]

You still need to make and grade tests and homework assignments for anywhere from 125-150 students (figure 25-30 per class x 5 classes), as well as prepare lesson plans for each class.

And not everybody writes neatly. the other 2-3 periods spent no in class is definitely not time for teacher to jack it in the faculty room. And that’s high school.

Elementary school, you’re with the kids all day.

77

  1. They get spring breaks, summers, winter breaks

  2. Salary is geography dependent. Fort Worth ISD is 40k and up, not to mention little bonuses here and there for any special abilities you may have. The more experience or a Master’s degree, the more you make as well. PLUS, depending on the district, you can get them to pay for your teaching cert while you’re working on it.

  3. Little to no competition, except for the all-white schools of course, and you will never be downsized or not needed.

Lastly, I think that the REAL screw job on teachers is that some universities (mine included) force you to get an internship (often unpaid), and “strongly” disagree with you getting a job while in school. And by strongly disagree, they mean do not fucking get a real job. School is your #1.

I know several girls going into the field, and it sounds like cake if you like dirty ass little kids and working half the year while making as much as people working all year at a desk.

My ex was lining up for a job at 45k a “year” with no experience, no cert, and a Bachelor’s degree. They were going to pay for her cert and she wasn’t even going to have to work with the poor kids. My dumbass sits at a desk ruining my eye balls for 41k a year, every day, all year.

78

You want to hear a bitch fest.
I am a certified auto/deisel tech
school is only 2 years but my school alone was about 60k
28k for auto extra 5 for diesel and 29 for motorcycle school.

I read more on cars then a doctor does on the human body.
I had to buy my own tools I am running about 18,000 in tools. I still need more tools there are jobs that require speciality tools that I cant get because of the expense.
I also go attend yearly training because technology on these things change every years almost. Because people are finding it cheaper to go into debt buying new cars then to maintain their own based on oil and gas prices and plain stupidity they are not taking cars to shops anymore.

they are instead buying new cars and trading in passing off there problems to a new customer which in turn does the same untill the car dies.

I average 35 dollars an hour but the industry tells us in a little flat rate book how many man hours a job takes.

if you ever worked on anything then you know that its not all black and white,things happen and I average about 20 hours a week logged with 40 - 60 hours worked.

parts are included in the price so I buy the parts out of pocket and try to make up for it in labor and parts mark up.

however if you mark up the parts to a point where its profitable then no one will come back to you so most times you take a loss on good quality parts, I will not use autozone bullshit in customers cars ever…ALL GOOD mechanics are expected to do this.

summer time when diesels and farm equipment is most likly to break down I make a great wage averaging about 60k in summer alone.
but paying out to run the bussiness end of it ,tools,yearly training,hospital bills for mangled hands cuts whatever,insurance,taxes on the bussiness end of it,customers parts I bring in about 25k a year.ASE certifications every few years.are also paid out of pocket but is cheap enough.

hardly enough to live on but I LOVE my job
I stil have personal debts to pay like my school loans bank loans getting the bussiness going and house food child care normal living stuff.

also I live in az and right now it is about 108 with very high humidity because its monsoon season.

I work all year summer and winter under a metal awning of sorts I have no indoor shop its outside and I have a swamp cooler cant have a furnace or heater because of safety reasons. I also do not have a vacation my vacation is not working one sunday out of the year or when I have no bussiness which I dont get paid for.
it costs me money to sit idle

I work when I have work not set hours I am done when I am done if i am not done till 3 am thats when im done however I dont get paid any more to stay late or any less to leave early.
I have lost a marriage and several prior relationships I have lost family cause of the job that I chose to do.

I chose this type of education over a traditional one so yes my grammer is horrible and my spelling is worse.

but I have the mechanical apptitude of an engineer and I have studied longer than most do. 11 years formal schooling so far and 20 informal at my home in my parents shop.yet I am seen as a simplton and just a “grease monkey”
do you realise the complex computer knowledge you must have to work on anything these days.

yes maybe you can change a part but do you really understand what is going on inside down to a molecular level doubt it cause took me 11 years in schol to half way understand this.
when I dont make enough in my shop I work in scrap yards again outside stripping cars. this is my lifes work

btw did I mention all this happened and I am 29 years old?

so all in all STOP BITCHING ABOUT YOUR CUSH JOB.
you hate it retire there are young kids that dream of being a teacher that would love to take your place without hesitation…
it is teachers like you that doom our kids
you are in a position that you hate because you feel like you are stuck and are owed.

I would like to see more teachers tha thave a passion for it that are willing to go the extra mile for my kids and do it with a smile and would gladly do it for free. if offered.

god you need a reality check.

79

^^^ Damn dude I’d like to slap someone who thinks going into debt with interest on a new car that depreciates so fucking fast is cheaper than maintaining a car. “Gas prices”. Yeah, take out a new loan and higher insurance rates for like 5-10 mpg? I’m sorry, but $20k buys a shit ton of gas.

80

[quote]msd0060 wrote:
^^^ Damn dude I’d like to slap someone who thinks going into debt with interest on a new car that depreciates so fucking fast is cheaper than maintaining a car. “Gas prices”. Yeah, take out a new loan and higher insurance rates for like 5-10 mpg? I’m sorry, but $20k buys a shit ton of gas.[/quote]

really I see it all the time
hey they have the same payments they did before so why not right? atleast you dont have to pay the 300 dollar charge for having a proper tune up and service done right i mean that stuffs expensive

who do these mechanics think they are charging 100 dollars an hour for labor?

I have known people that get a new car every 3 years because it helps there credit and they have a good car.

did you know tha tyou can keep a car running and presentable for 250k miles you will save about 20k over buying new every 3 years?
I had a 1989 honda prelude with 319k miles that my wife took with her when she left me and it was running as good as it was new
I didnt buy it new I bought it with 198k miles on it. for 1000 dollars

i put another 2 into it and it was getting mid 30s in mpg and was small but comfortable. and it looked damn sexy too

my wife took it I think it is still her daily driver after a year but not sure on her thing.