[quote]pushharder wrote:
Pick any age fetus you want, Andy, and then tell us what traits that fetus needs in order to avoid execution in your ideal world of “choice.”
And please answer my other questions as well.[/quote]
Whats the execution method? That might be a factor, hanging and the electric chair would be difficult in the early fetal stages.
[quote]Sloth wrote:
[quote]sufiandy wrote:
[quote]Sloth wrote:
[quote]sufiandy wrote:
The further back in time you go from birth the less people can relate to it in their own lives, like the moment after conception.[/quote]
Well sure, look at how we talk about pregnancy now. We’ve sanitized it. What if we always spoke of it as the human life that it is?
[/quote]
So we are in agreement that educating people should be the goal, not to convince them what is right and wrong.[/quote]
No, because me and you aren’t ignorant enough to not realize that an innocent, individual, human life is taken. So, we have a moral obligation.[/quote]
That’s what I was looking for.
[quote]Grneyes wrote:
[quote]Oleena wrote:
Also, in some cases, it could be phhysically dangerous for a girl to get birth control if she had an overly religious and physically abusive parent who was being notified.[/quote]
True. That’s why I said procedures, not medications. In some cases it probably is safer for the daughter to go to the doc without consent but I would hope that most parents when confronted with some kind of life-saving procedure would agree to it. [/quote]
I’m sure they would and I’m also sure that those parent’s would be willingly involved in every step of the process. The kids of those parents would feel comfortable telling them what was happening; they would trust that their parents would help them and therefore would be forthcoming with the information. Heck, when I worked at the group home, even those kids, who I definitely wasn’t a parent to, came to us of their own accord to ask questions and try to make sense of health concerns. There has to be something really wrong between parent and child for the child not to want to seek their parent’s support about their health.
[quote]pushharder wrote:
[quote]sufiandy wrote:
[quote]pushharder wrote:
Pick any age fetus you want, Andy, and then tell us what traits that fetus needs in order to avoid execution in your ideal world of “choice.”
And please answer my other questions as well.[/quote]
Whats the execution method? That might be a factor, hanging and the electric chair would be difficult in the early fetal stages.[/quote]
Google “abortion procedures” since it appears you’re ignorant of the very subject you wish to debate.[/quote]
I am aware of abortion procedures, you said execution so I assumed the fetus committed a crime of some sort which I didn’t think was possible.
To make things worse: Senate Republicans push to let any employer deny coverage for any health service on 'moral' grounds
Senate Republicans push to let any employer deny coverage for any health service on ‘moral’ grounds
[quote]pushharder wrote:
What traits does an 82 year old woman with Alzeimers have that a 24 week fetus doesn’t?[/quote]
Alzheimers.
[quote]ephrem wrote:
[quote]pat wrote:
[quote]ephrem wrote:
That’s too easy pat. If I suddenly found faith ofcourse I’ll have to make changes in my behaviour. I’d have to go to church for one. Start reading the bible and even pray.
The fact that I’m not doing those things now is hardly “wrong”, but I wouldn’t act differently from how I’m behaving now, I don’t think.
[/quote]
Really? There are those who believe in God that do none of those things.[/quote]
I’m sorry, but ever since Sloth said that someone who’s pro-choice can’t be a christian I got confused.
What kind of behaviour do you expect me [for instance] to change if I suddenly saw the light and believed?
[/quote]
I don’t know, I said ‘if’.
[quote]pat wrote:
[quote]ephrem wrote:
[quote]pat wrote:
[quote]ephrem wrote:
That’s too easy pat. If I suddenly found faith ofcourse I’ll have to make changes in my behaviour. I’d have to go to church for one. Start reading the bible and even pray.
The fact that I’m not doing those things now is hardly “wrong”, but I wouldn’t act differently from how I’m behaving now, I don’t think.
[/quote]
Really? There are those who believe in God that do none of those things.[/quote]
I’m sorry, but ever since Sloth said that someone who’s pro-choice can’t be a christian I got confused.
What kind of behaviour do you expect me [for instance] to change if I suddenly saw the light and believed?
[/quote]
I don’t know, I said ‘if’.[/quote]
A rather pointless ‘if’ then.
[quote]ephrem wrote:
To make things worse: Senate Republicans push to let any employer deny coverage for any health service on 'moral' grounds
Senate Republicans push to let any employer deny coverage for any health service on ‘moral’ grounds[/quote]
Freedom. It’s never fair.
[quote]Sloth wrote:
[quote]ephrem wrote:
To make things worse: Senate Republicans push to let any employer deny coverage for any health service on 'moral' grounds
Senate Republicans push to let any employer deny coverage for any health service on ‘moral’ grounds[/quote]
Freedom. It’s never fair.
[/quote]
You want a government mandate to treat those who don’t believe like you do as secondrate citizens, just like women.
That’s your kind of freedom.
[quote]ephrem wrote:
[quote]Sloth wrote:
[quote]ephrem wrote:
To make things worse: Senate Republicans push to let any employer deny coverage for any health service on 'moral' grounds
Senate Republicans push to let any employer deny coverage for any health service on ‘moral’ grounds[/quote]
Freedom. It’s never fair.
[/quote]
You want a government mandate to treat those who don’t believe like you do as secondrate citizens, just like women.
That’s your kind of freedom.[/quote]
How about no government mandate at all? How about leave it to negotiations?
[quote]ephrem wrote:
You want a government mandate to treat those who don’t believe like you do as secondrate citizens, just like women.
[/quote]
And, no. They’re welcome to start their own associations/places of employment, and determine what they’ll offer. See? Equality.
[quote]sufiandy wrote:
For your 3 other questions size is 1 trait that is different, both body size and brain size. So if either of those falls below a minimum size requirement to be human it can be killed. Is that the kind of answer you were looking for?[/quote]AND[quote]sufiandy wrote:<< I am aware of abortion procedures, you said execution so I assumed the fetus committed a crime of some sort which I didn’t think was possible.[/quote]It’s not? It was conceived wasn’t it? That’s a capitol offense that only summary execution is the proper response to. Certainly the parents should be wholly exonerated for whatever insignificant role they may have played in this. You people are wretched corrupt purveyors of death and perversion. You women are especially heartbreaking. Blessed nurturers of new life fighting for the right to murder your own offspring. You fully deserve the sick society you’re building for yourselves. I’ll be gone. You’ll be the ones drowning in your own moral sewage.
EDIT: How selfish of me. My children will pay as well. There IS eternal comfort in the knowledge that even all this evil is orchestrated by the living God for His glory.
[quote]Sloth wrote:
[quote]ephrem wrote:
You want a government mandate to treat those who don’t believe like you do as secondrate citizens, just like women.
[/quote]
And, no. They’re welcome to start their own associations/places of employment, and determine what they’ll offer. See? Equality.
[/quote]
No, you want to be able to discriminate against people who do not believe like you do.
[quote]ephrem wrote:
[quote]Sloth wrote:
[quote]ephrem wrote:
You want a government mandate to treat those who don’t believe like you do as secondrate citizens, just like women.
[/quote]
And, no. They’re welcome to start their own associations/places of employment, and determine what they’ll offer. See? Equality.
[/quote]
No, you want to be able to discriminate against people who do not believe like you do.
[/quote]
And you don’t want people to be able to discriminate, even using force to make them go against their most treasured beliefs. When an organization that doesn’t discriminate in patients seen, mouths fed, orphans sheltered, death-row inmates consoled, sex-slaves rescued, battered women sheltered, dying hands held, etc.,…decides that it can’t bend it’s core values in OFFERING a benefits package, as part of a private negotiation, you’d use force to make them comply?
Think about that for a minute. Think over your understanding of rights and freedom. 'Cause ephrem, that up there is pure tyranny.