Why Won't Romney Release His Tax Returns?

Off Topic Politics & World Issues
121

[quote]countingbeans wrote:
Things brought to you by Greed:

Cars
internet
cell phones
medical equipment that saves lives
a place to live
facebook
pension funding
cameras
movies
America

should I go on?[/quote]

Can you provide proof that greed motivated the creation of those things? Jonas Salk never patented the polio vaccine. Newton, Einstein, Fermi, Curie, Beethoven,Socrates, Michelangelo, Dante, Joyce, Pasteur, Darwin, Aristotle, Ariosto, Galileo, Ptolemy, Kepler, Blake, Coltrane, Archimedes, the guy who “invented” fire, the guy who invented gunpowder, the guy who first rode a horse, Audie Murphy, Sgt. York, Shakespeare, Milton, Machiavelli, Cervantes, Da Vinci, Pascal, the list is incredibly long, all were motivated by greed and not an inner need, a drive, to search, to learn, to know, to help, to heal, just for the sake of searching, learning, knowing, helping and healing with the ultimate goal being to make the world a better place for everyone? Unremarkable people, people who don’t create anything, can’t understand what motivates those who are remarkable and creative and thus, try to apply to them something which they can relate to such as greed. Greed doesn’t create anything, people do. Rand was wrong about its significance. Using her logic we should have asked Audie Murphy what was in it for him because he couldn’t have risked his life to save his friends without some promise of reward. And all those researches working on a cure for cancer probably couldn’t care less about the lives they will save but are more concerned with the money they’ll make.

122

[quote]Severiano wrote:

Greed, is when you have record profits but decide to go ahead and close the shop in the U.S. for the sake of saving/netting some small amount of money to make yourself look better to your shareholders, you send the customer service department to India, and the manufacturing to China and don’t give two craps about the people who are left without work as a result.
[/quote]

No, that is good business.

And you know what?

Indians are people too, for realz.

Socialism is not enough for you, you insist on national socialism.

That “greed” that you describe has lifted hundreds of millions of Chinese and Indians out of absolute poverty.

Admittedly, some Americans needed to find another job, maybe, horribile dictu, even a less well paid one.

The thing is, for his misfortune 2-3 Indians got lucky, but you dont care, do you, because they do not matter?

What you want is less of a wealth gap in a specific and rather arbitrary geographic location in the name of “fairness”, the rest of the world be damned, right?

Do you expect anyone with half a brain to take that seriously?

I mean, do you really?

123

[quote]zecarlo wrote:
And all those researches working on a cure for cancer probably couldn’t care less about the lives they will save but are more concerned with the money they’ll make. [/quote]

You can bet that the people financing their resources are very concerned with profit and if they are not they will be replaced with people that are.

For every example you gave, and some were flat out wrong, there are hundreds of thousands of people who only get their butt of the couch if there is something in it for them.

If that were any other way East Germany would have drowned us in consumer goods, alas, the best they could do was the Wartburg, whereas West Germany had BMW and Mercedes and Porsche and Volkswagen and Opel and even the shittiest car those companies ever produced was heads and shoulders above what workers freed from “greed” could or would produce.

124

[quote]countingbeans wrote:

“You should forgive my student loans because no one is just handing me a job. the economy is like tough right now, man.” Fuck those people, and everyone that asks for their loans to be forgiven is the worst kind of leach. Here they are taking away personal attention from another student that is going to actually put some effort into life, only to sit around and complain that the shit they felt ENTITLED to, they are not actually entitled to? Forget those people. Leaches, that are doing nothing but eroding the system and slowing us down.

[/quote]

The single biggest drain on our nation is the entitlement generation…I DON’T WANNA WORK…GIVE ME MY FREE SHIT!!!

/hope and change’d

125

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]orion wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]Headhunter wrote:
Are you gentlemen serious? The Presidency has been owned by the banks since Andrew Jackson and his battles with Nicholas Biddle.

After WWII, the intelligence services horned in and now the banks and the services run everything. The president is just a puppet.

I thought this was common knowledge (srs).[/quote]

I believe money runs this country and probably always has
[/quote]

Sure, but there was a time when they stuck to railroad fraud, ripping off Indians and supplying the army with shitty stuff.

Now they have their greedy paws everywhere and its because people invited them to do so. [/quote]

IMO it is the Government controlling the winners . Via Tax Code . When one mans dollar is worth
$.70 and another’s is worth $.86 . The man with the dollar worth $.86 is at a %16 advantage
[/quote]

Maybe?

But then I cannot bother to muster any outrage when some people are allowed to live solely, or even partly, off of other peoples work.

126

[quote]zecarlo wrote:
And all those researches working on a cure for cancer probably couldn’t care less about the lives they will save but are more concerned with the money they’ll make. [/quote]

No, but the people funding the research, you know the equally important part, sure care about the return.

Shit, I help people live their dreams (that Obama insulted) every day. Every day I get paid good money to do something I love. Imagine that, mixing greed with altruistic actions…

Enjoy your school books, real life is a bitch.

127

[quote]orion wrote:

[quote]Severiano wrote:

Greed, is when you have record profits but decide to go ahead and close the shop in the U.S. for the sake of saving/netting some small amount of money to make yourself look better to your shareholders, you send the customer service department to India, and the manufacturing to China and don’t give two craps about the people who are left without work as a result.
[/quote]

No, that is good business.

And you know what?

Indians are people too, for realz.

Socialism is not enough for you, you insist on national socialism.

That “greed” that you describe has lifted hundreds of millions of Chinese and Indians out of absolute poverty.

Admittedly, some Americans needed to find another job, maybe, horribile dictu, even a less well paid one.

The thing is, for his misfortune 2-3 Indians got lucky, but you dont care, do you, because they do not matter?

What you want is less of a wealth gap in a specific and rather arbitrary geographic location in the name of “fairness”, the rest of the world be damned, right?

Do you expect anyone with half a brain to take that seriously?

I mean, do you really?[/quote]

good post

128

[quote]countingbeans wrote:

[quote]mathew260 wrote:
The guy who sacrifices his family time to go to school, or work long hours to provide a means of income for others is the unselfish one, really. The guy who just wants to work the minimum and spend his time for selfish purposes, whether it be his own hobbies, his own family or what have you, is the selfish one. The guy who breaks his back so others can have a job, so others can feed their families, so others cam cruise along while they mortgage their house to keep a business open is the closest to achieving altruism.
[/quote]

Also this.

If any of you think the people making these millions every year are only working 2080 hours a year and fucking around on the weekends in their big houses, you are sadly mistaken.

99.9999% of us couldn’t do what they do, live what they live or run what they run. But we are entitled to a cut of the money they earn? Please.[/quote]

Another great point, Botanical lentil numerical tracker ; ). Most people that run businesses take either a huge financial risk, and or work 60+ hours, or did all of the above for years to get to a point where they could enjoy themselves. Not everyone but the majority. Some people have the benefit of inheritance or other means, but majority do it with blood sweat and tears. That is what is wrong with many in this country in that see someone with a Benz and think oh I work hard full time I should have that. Doesn’t work that way.

129

[quote]countingbeans wrote:

[quote]zecarlo wrote:
And all those researches working on a cure for cancer probably couldn’t care less about the lives they will save but are more concerned with the money they’ll make. [/quote]

No, but the people funding the research, you know the equally important part, sure care about the return.
[/quote]
Equally important? Who funded Plato? Newton? How about Fermi and Oppenheimer?

130

[quote]zecarlo wrote:

[quote]countingbeans wrote:

[quote]zecarlo wrote:
And all those researches working on a cure for cancer probably couldn’t care less about the lives they will save but are more concerned with the money they’ll make. [/quote]

No, but the people funding the research, you know the equally important part, sure care about the return.
[/quote]
Equally important? Who funded Plato? Newton? How about Fermi and Oppenheimer? [/quote]

Slaves, taxpayers, dunno, taxpayers.

131

[quote]orion wrote:

[quote]zecarlo wrote:

[quote]countingbeans wrote:

[quote]zecarlo wrote:
And all those researches working on a cure for cancer probably couldn’t care less about the lives they will save but are more concerned with the money they’ll make. [/quote]

No, but the people funding the research, you know the equally important part, sure care about the return.
[/quote]
Equally important? Who funded Plato? Newton? How about Fermi and Oppenheimer? [/quote]

Slaves, taxpayers, dunno, taxpayers. [/quote]
Exactly. The idea that private businesses are necessary for us to have certain advancements is wrong. I’m not saying we shouldn’t do things that way, just that it isn’t correct to say it is the only way.

And to all those who use terms like fair and real world in their arguments: you can’t have it both ways. Fair and the real world are two different things. You can’t be Plato and Machiavelli at the same time.

132

[quote]zecarlo wrote:

Exactly. The idea that private businesses are necessary for us to have certain advancements is wrong. I’m not saying we shouldn’t do things that way, just that it isn’t correct to say it is the only way. [/quote]

Who said only?

The Spark Plug, brought to you by communist Russia, oh wait.
The smart phone, North Korea’s greatest achivement, oh wait.
The MRI, saving lives since 1977, thanks Iran, oh wait.

Ya don’t say. So why should I give my hard earned money away to other people at a higher rate than they have to give away their money?

133

[quote]zecarlo wrote:

[quote]orion wrote:

[quote]zecarlo wrote:

[quote]countingbeans wrote:

[quote]zecarlo wrote:
And all those researches working on a cure for cancer probably couldn’t care less about the lives they will save but are more concerned with the money they’ll make. [/quote]

No, but the people funding the research, you know the equally important part, sure care about the return.
[/quote]
Equally important? Who funded Plato? Newton? How about Fermi and Oppenheimer? [/quote]

Slaves, taxpayers, dunno, taxpayers. [/quote]
Exactly. The idea that private businesses are necessary for us to have certain advancements is wrong. I’m not saying we shouldn’t do things that way, just that it isn’t correct to say it is the only way.
[/quote]

No, the only alternatives are slavery and some sort of servitude.

So, yes, technically, there are other ways.

Personally I believe them to be unbearable, but, technically, they do exist.

134

[quote]ZEB wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]thunderbolt23 wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

no that is not what I mean , most of the lies you stated are broken promises[/quote]

No, they are positions taken to get elected and move poll numbers only to be conveniently reversed when the time comes to act.[/quote]

They are promises designed to get Obama elected , I agree but they are still broken promises. He is not saying that Obama care should be law and then Obama care should not be law and then say I was never for either side . That is what I am saying[/quote]

Do you realize that you are rationalizing Obama’s lies? Both men are saying one thing and then at a later date for political purposes reversing themselves.

You like Obama more than Romney so you are rationalizing Obama’s lies to justify a vote for him.

My gosh can’t you see that?

Both men have lied.

Simple.

[/quote]

We agree both men are liars but one is more subtle the other thinks we are too stupid to spot blatant lies

watch the video , show me where Obama says he does something then he says he does not and then where he said he did neither

135

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]ZEB wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]thunderbolt23 wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

no that is not what I mean , most of the lies you stated are broken promises[/quote]

No, they are positions taken to get elected and move poll numbers only to be conveniently reversed when the time comes to act.[/quote]

They are promises designed to get Obama elected , I agree but they are still broken promises. He is not saying that Obama care should be law and then Obama care should not be law and then say I was never for either side . That is what I am saying[/quote]

Do you realize that you are rationalizing Obama’s lies? Both men are saying one thing and then at a later date for political purposes reversing themselves.

You like Obama more than Romney so you are rationalizing Obama’s lies to justify a vote for him.

My gosh can’t you see that?

Both men have lied.

Simple.

[/quote]

We agree both men are liars but one is more subtle the other thinks we are too stupid to spot blatant lies

watch the video , show me where Obama says he does something then he says he does not and then where he said he did neither[/quote]

Dont you think that are starting to grasp for straws now?

So, well, maybe one is a little bit less of a liar than the other one.

I dont believe it, but you might?

He could still be a bigger douche.

Easily.

136

[quote]orion wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]ZEB wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]thunderbolt23 wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

no that is not what I mean , most of the lies you stated are broken promises[/quote]

No, they are positions taken to get elected and move poll numbers only to be conveniently reversed when the time comes to act.[/quote]

They are promises designed to get Obama elected , I agree but they are still broken promises. He is not saying that Obama care should be law and then Obama care should not be law and then say I was never for either side . That is what I am saying[/quote]

Do you realize that you are rationalizing Obama’s lies? Both men are saying one thing and then at a later date for political purposes reversing themselves.

You like Obama more than Romney so you are rationalizing Obama’s lies to justify a vote for him.

My gosh can’t you see that?

Both men have lied.

Simple.

[/quote]

We agree both men are liars but one is more subtle the other thinks we are too stupid to spot blatant lies

watch the video , show me where Obama says he does something then he says he does not and then where he said he did neither[/quote]

Dont you think that are starting to grasp for straws now?

So, well, maybe one is a little bit less of a liar than the other one.

I dont believe it, but you might?

He could still be a bigger douche.

Easily.

[/quote]

I do not even think my point is all that subtle . It would be equivalent to the difference between manslaughter and premeditated murder . One could be an accident (NOT BEING ABLE TO KEEP PROMISE) and one was reasoned (CHANGING STORY TO WHAT EVER IS PRUDENT)

137

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]orion wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]ZEB wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]thunderbolt23 wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

no that is not what I mean , most of the lies you stated are broken promises[/quote]

No, they are positions taken to get elected and move poll numbers only to be conveniently reversed when the time comes to act.[/quote]

They are promises designed to get Obama elected , I agree but they are still broken promises. He is not saying that Obama care should be law and then Obama care should not be law and then say I was never for either side . That is what I am saying[/quote]

Do you realize that you are rationalizing Obama’s lies? Both men are saying one thing and then at a later date for political purposes reversing themselves.

You like Obama more than Romney so you are rationalizing Obama’s lies to justify a vote for him.

My gosh can’t you see that?

Both men have lied.

Simple.

[/quote]

We agree both men are liars but one is more subtle the other thinks we are too stupid to spot blatant lies

watch the video , show me where Obama says he does something then he says he does not and then where he said he did neither[/quote]

Dont you think that are starting to grasp for straws now?

So, well, maybe one is a little bit less of a liar than the other one.

I dont believe it, but you might?

He could still be a bigger douche.

Easily.

[/quote]

I do not even think my point is all that subtle . It would be equivalent to the difference between manslaughter and premeditated murder . One could be an accident (NOT BEING ABLE TO KEEP PROMISE) and one was reasoned (CHANGING STORY TO WHAT EVER IS PRUDENT)
[/quote]

Yes.

What does it matter?

One lies on purpose, the other one thinks he is Jesus´ second coming but isnt.

I like the liar better.

138

[quote]orion wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]orion wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]ZEB wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]thunderbolt23 wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

no that is not what I mean , most of the lies you stated are broken promises[/quote]

No, they are positions taken to get elected and move poll numbers only to be conveniently reversed when the time comes to act.[/quote]

They are promises designed to get Obama elected , I agree but they are still broken promises. He is not saying that Obama care should be law and then Obama care should not be law and then say I was never for either side . That is what I am saying[/quote]

Do you realize that you are rationalizing Obama’s lies? Both men are saying one thing and then at a later date for political purposes reversing themselves.

You like Obama more than Romney so you are rationalizing Obama’s lies to justify a vote for him.

My gosh can’t you see that?

Both men have lied.

Simple.

[/quote]

We agree both men are liars but one is more subtle the other thinks we are too stupid to spot blatant lies

watch the video , show me where Obama says he does something then he says he does not and then where he said he did neither[/quote]

Dont you think that are starting to grasp for straws now?

So, well, maybe one is a little bit less of a liar than the other one.

I dont believe it, but you might?

He could still be a bigger douche.

Easily.

[/quote]

I do not even think my point is all that subtle . It would be equivalent to the difference between manslaughter and premeditated murder . One could be an accident (NOT BEING ABLE TO KEEP PROMISE) and one was reasoned (CHANGING STORY TO WHAT EVER IS PRUDENT)
[/quote]

Yes.

What does it matter?

One lies on purpose, the other one thinks he is Jesus�´ second coming but isnt.

I like the liar better.[/quote]

It is your prerogative to like any one you like . And while I do like like Obama I feel it prudent to look at the facts and not the Rehetoric.

139

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]orion wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]orion wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]ZEB wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]thunderbolt23 wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

no that is not what I mean , most of the lies you stated are broken promises[/quote]

No, they are positions taken to get elected and move poll numbers only to be conveniently reversed when the time comes to act.[/quote]

They are promises designed to get Obama elected , I agree but they are still broken promises. He is not saying that Obama care should be law and then Obama care should not be law and then say I was never for either side . That is what I am saying[/quote]

Do you realize that you are rationalizing Obama’s lies? Both men are saying one thing and then at a later date for political purposes reversing themselves.

You like Obama more than Romney so you are rationalizing Obama’s lies to justify a vote for him.

My gosh can’t you see that?

Both men have lied.

Simple.

[/quote]

We agree both men are liars but one is more subtle the other thinks we are too stupid to spot blatant lies

watch the video , show me where Obama says he does something then he says he does not and then where he said he did neither[/quote]

Dont you think that are starting to grasp for straws now?

So, well, maybe one is a little bit less of a liar than the other one.

I dont believe it, but you might?

He could still be a bigger douche.

Easily.

[/quote]

I do not even think my point is all that subtle . It would be equivalent to the difference between manslaughter and premeditated murder . One could be an accident (NOT BEING ABLE TO KEEP PROMISE) and one was reasoned (CHANGING STORY TO WHAT EVER IS PRUDENT)
[/quote]

Yes.

What does it matter?

One lies on purpose, the other one thinks he is Jesus�?�´ second coming but isnt.

I like the liar better.[/quote]

It is your prerogative to like any one you like . And while I do like like Obama I feel it prudent to look at the facts and not the Rehetoric.
[/quote]

I dont care about the facts for now.

Obama promised things that he could have kept and a lot of things he could not possibly have kept.

Romney, arguably is an opportunist.

So, either a liar or a deluded madman.

This distinction seems to carry more weight for you than it should.

Why?

140

[quote]pittbulll wrote:
And while I do like like Obama I feel it prudent to look at the facts and not the Rehetoric.
[/quote]

Totally agree.

Can you point out the good Obama has done? I won’t call you names, promise. :wink: