I think saying that a certain percentage of your max is CNS intensive while a lower percentage isn’t.
Everything appears to center around conditioning. This is obvious.
I used to have issues doing sheiko. Specifically, trying to squat 80% of my max for 5 sets of 3. The first week, I couldn’t get anywhere never completing it. Now I’m doing 407 x3x5 and if I do hit 500, that will be on target w/ 80% of my max. Now I feel like I can do triples w/ 407 all day if I want.Its nothing to brag about, just CNS improvement. My body simply got used to the stress and adapted.
I have burnt out my CNS as well doing sheiko. sometimes, you just gotta give yourself a break.
Your central nervous system is slower to act and adapt than other systems in your body. I wish I could find a study or some documentation explaining it in detail, but I can’t right now.
If you look at the cell types that make up the nervous system vs muscular cells, you will that they are not designed to adapt quickly to huge amounts of stress. Muscle cells do a much better job of this. This is why over long periods of time, doing intense training can cause CNS burn out. Also remember that you emotional state and level of stress severely affects your CNS.
If I find any facts on this, I will gladly post the info. I’m curious as well how just to get around CNS burnout.
To be honest it’s not your CNS that needs the long recovery time. Atleast when it comes to plyometrics. It’s your body. Generally plyometrics apply’s forces multiple times greater than lifting weights.
You can get great gains from doing 3 days a week of plyometrics, even better than one day, but you also get injured alot more.
Lets take for example depth jumps. With a person that can max squat 315 weighs 200. Minus leg weight estimate he can squat around 420. Now you have him do depth jumps at 15 inches. This generates aproximately 3 - 5 times bodyweight of force. So his legs are getting 600 - 1000 lbs of force. This force should be transfered to the muscles when landing correctly, however even the slightest delay in muscle activation when landing or greater muscle fatigue will lead to the impact transfering to the tendons cartilage and ligaments. Ligaments take the longest to heal, so as you start going ballistic because plyometrics is so easy your ligaments get greater and greater wear to the point when you do something it can snap or strain.
CNS can take 5-6 times longer for recovery than your muscles do. CNS training involves using very high loads for minimal reps (usually less than 3) with sets varying according to volume tolerance. When fatigue comes into play, you can de-load by VOLUME, not intensity. Meaning if you were doing 5-6 sets, decrease by 1/3 the number of sets, but keep the weight the same.
[quote]Airtruth wrote:
To be honest it’s not your CNS that needs the long recovery time. Atleast when it comes to plyometrics. It’s your body. Generally plyometrics apply’s forces multiple times greater than lifting weights.
You can get great gains from doing 3 days a week of plyometrics, even better than one day, but you also get injured alot more.
Lets take for example depth jumps. With a person that can max squat 315 weighs 200. Minus leg weight estimate he can squat around 420. Now you have him do depth jumps at 15 inches. This generates aproximately 3 - 5 times bodyweight of force. So his legs are getting 600 - 1000 lbs of force. This force should be transfered to the muscles when landing correctly, however even the slightest delay in muscle activation when landing or greater muscle fatigue will lead to the impact transfering to the tendons cartilage and ligaments. Ligaments take the longest to heal, so as you start going ballistic because plyometrics is so easy your ligaments get greater and greater wear to the point when you do something it can snap or strain.
[/quote]
With plyometrics, that is certainly true. A high risk of injury is one reason not to train in that manner too frequently, but I think I’ve seen mentioned somewhere another reason. Unfortunately, I can’t remember where I’ve seen it mentioned, or the reason itself
[quote]BALBO wrote:
I dont buy into all that CNS fatigue and long CNS recovery thing.
Real world proofs-
1.table tennis elite players training hard for up to 10 hours a day…demands-fast reflexes,very good coordination,quick footwork…training every day
2.elite weightlifters doing explosive lifting close to their maximum for a few sessions a day every day
3.Famous Finnland lumberjacks competing in powerlifting deadlifting ungodly weights beacause they lift heavy shit every day for a living
CNS capacity can be built.
SAID principle=what you train is what you improve[/quote]
Table Tennis doesn’t require a lot of MU recruitment. Maximal MU recruitment is what is what rips the CNS apart.
Volume is low per session.
Lumberjacking is more of strength-endurance, not CNS intensive.
[quote]undeadlift wrote:
BALBO wrote:
I dont buy into all that CNS fatigue and long CNS recovery thing.
Real world proofs-
1.table tennis elite players training hard for up to 10 hours a day…demands-fast reflexes,very good coordination,quick footwork…training every day
2.elite weightlifters doing explosive lifting close to their maximum for a few sessions a day every day
3.Famous Finnland lumberjacks competing in powerlifting deadlifting ungodly weights beacause they lift heavy shit every day for a living
CNS capacity can be built.
SAID principle=what you train is what you improve
Table Tennis doesn’t require a lot of MU recruitment. Maximal MU recruitment is what is what rips the CNS apart.
Volume is low per session.
Lumberjacking is more of strength-endurance, not CNS intensive.[/quote]
Take one week where u train for 5 days straight. And just train your 1RM-3RM on the Clean, Front/Back Squat, Deadlift, Push Press, Bench Press. Max out on each, one per day or combination, whatever you want to do. Then talk to us on the 6th day.
The following week, or more likely the one after that Do the same thing, same workout, same reps BUT with 80% of the weight u did. And get back to us on the 6th day.
[quote]NeoSpartan wrote:
to the OP… why don’t u do your own testing?
Take one week where u train for 5 days straight. And just train your 1RM-3RM on the Clean, Front/Back Squat, Deadlift, Push Press, Bench Press. Max out on each, one per day or combination, whatever you want to do. Then talk to us on the 6th day.
The following week, or more likely the one after that Do the same thing, same workout, same reps BUT with 80% of the weight u did. And get back to us on the 6th day. [/quote]
I think you may have misunderstood my post a bit. I realize that if I train my 1-3 RM in the big lifts for 5 consecutive days, I’ll be running myself into the ground. What I want to know is WHY. What are the physiological mechanisms behind the recommendations for infrequent training for the CNS?
CNS stress= Total number of Motor Units involved (bench press 35%, squat 65%, cleanjerk 95%, sprint 100% etc.) * intensity (percentage of maximum best performance, not effort) * actual load lifted/actual force produced * time under that tension.
Thats my definition. Table tennis induces a great deal of cns fatigue, yeah right! rofl
[quote]acidhell wrote:
CNS stress= Total number of Motor Units involved (bench press 35%, squat 65%, cleanjerk 95%, sprint 100% etc.) * intensity (percentage of maximum best performance, not effort) * actual load lifted/actual force produced * time under that tension.
Thats my definition. Table tennis induces a great deal of cns fatigue, yeah right! rofl[/quote]
Do the same thing, same workout, same reps BUT with 80% of the weight u did. And get back to us on the 6th day.