Why Do Men Get Married These Days?

Off Topic
121

[quote]Mr. Walkway wrote:
so again i ask, what does a man gain from marriage besides tax benefits? someone answer me that… give me ONE good answer. “love”, “acceptance by society”, “traditionalism” are not good answers… [/quote]

Some aspects of estate planning are easier. Some benefits only convey to a legal spouse, such as health care coverage and pensions if the pensioner dies. Some legal aspects are easier if you are combining finances. Contrary to what you may think, when a couple makes roughly equal incomes you might be better off getting divorced than just breaking up, depending on how complicated your finances get.

122

[quote]Mr. Walkway wrote:

[quote]comus3 wrote:
In argument for - if you find someone sane, compatible and who you are attracted to it works. You can raise kids with some stability if that is what you want and generally with two people you will be better off financially.

Against - you could find that sane, compatible, sexy person and they could leave you because you drink too much and are a general asshole or after that you could find another person and think they are sane, sexy, compatible and they turn out to be just a really great set of tits attached to a level of drama, dysfunction and insanity that you weren’t smart enough to recognize. The outcome here could be really bad financially either way.
[/quote]

lol… so if it goes wrong, it’s because of the man’s choices huh?

are you implying that women aren’t selfish and deceitful? [/quote]

You began this thread saying you were not criticizing women but the institution of marriage in its current legal form. You go on to say that women are selfish, deceitful, conniving and unreliable and that 85% of those in your circle are studying bullshit and partying their way to a useless degree. How is his not criticism? Just because you believe it to be a statement of fact doesn’t negate the inherently critical nature of such a statement. I’m not even trying to change your mind, but own your opinion for what it is, an indictment of females as a “species”.

You go on to claim to want to stimulate dialogue. Yet in your responses to others you are unwilling or unable to consider any of the positions put forward other than insofar as it reinforces your own existing position. Nothing is gained from that type of “dialogue”.

FTR, I don’t even think you’re 100% wrong. There are significant inequities in family law that make marriage an unattractive prospect in many regards. Marriage, even a “good” one, can be a huge pain in the ass. So can raising kids. Doesn’t mean it’s a worthless undertaking. Doesn’t mean it’s worth it for everyone either.

As for just not saying “I do”, that’s no real protection either. If you cohabit and have kids the law will treat the disolution of your common law union like a divorce anyway in most places. So no, you can’t have everything you get from being married without the risk. You can opt out of the whole proposition, but you can’t pick and choose.

123

[quote]Mr. Walkway wrote:

[quote]comus3 wrote:
In argument for - if you find someone sane, compatible and who you are attracted to it works. You can raise kids with some stability if that is what you want and generally with two people you will be better off financially.

Against - you could find that sane, compatible, sexy person and they could leave you because you drink too much and are a general asshole or after that you could find another person and think they are sane, sexy, compatible and they turn out to be just a really great set of tits attached to a level of drama, dysfunction and insanity that you weren’t smart enough to recognize. The outcome here could be really bad financially either way.
[/quote]

lol… so if it goes wrong, it’s because of the man’s choices huh?

are you implying that women aren’t selfish and deceitful? [/quote]

I choose to believe that whenever things go wrong in my life it is generally in large part a result of my choices. I refuse to cast myself as a victim of circumstance or the machinations of others.

124

[quote]Mr. Walkway wrote:

yes… I just referred to marriage as a trap… lol. Once your wife balloons up to 275 pounds at 5’1, everyone here will start to see what I mean. [/quote]

Is your mom fat?

125

When you compare any kind of “non-official” long term relationship to marriage, the only advantages are legal and, from a conservative POV, moral, maybe also romantic. Whether or not these count depends on your world view. So yes OP, someone with your way of seeing things probably won’t see the point. And that’s OK as far as I’m concerned. To each his own.

126

[quote]zephead4747 wrote:
Opie, Usually men who get blindsided by problems in relationships are the ones who have not dated a lot prior to settling down and not learned the warning signs and symptoms because they have not experienced them before. Reconsider your life philosophy. Even if you aren’t sexually active, dating while you are young isn’t just about finding a potential wife, or getting laid. It’s about developing yourself as a future partner and learning how to grow a healthy relationship.[/quote]
Doesn’t answer his question, but a very very good point.

127

[quote]Mr. Walkway wrote:

[quote]comus3 wrote:
In argument for - if you find someone sane, compatible and who you are attracted to it works. You can raise kids with some stability if that is what you want and generally with two people you will be better off financially.

Against - you could find that sane, compatible, sexy person and they could leave you because you drink too much and are a general asshole or after that you could find another person and think they are sane, sexy, compatible and they turn out to be just a really great set of tits attached to a level of drama, dysfunction and insanity that you weren’t smart enough to recognize. The outcome here could be really bad financially either way.
[/quote]

lol… so if it goes wrong, it’s because of the man’s choices huh?

are you implying that women aren’t selfish and deceitful? [/quote]

Re read the against. It can be the man or the woman who is a piece of shit in the relationship, or mutual, or you just didn’t click for whatever reason. But yes, you as a man make a choice, no shotgun weddings anymore, if you miss the signs of crazy or deceit then that’s on you.

128

[quote]zephead4747 wrote:
Opie, Usually men who get blindsided by problems in relationships are the ones who have not dated a lot prior to settling down and not learned the warning signs and symptoms because they have not experienced them before. Reconsider your life philosophy. Even if you aren’t sexually active, dating while you are young isn’t just about finding a potential wife, or getting laid. It’s about developing yourself as a future partner and learning how to grow a healthy relationship.[/quote]

This is both true and very depressing.

129

[quote]BrickHead wrote:

[quote]Mr. Walkway wrote:

[quote]BrickHead wrote:
If not for communications and psychology, Western Civilization wouldn’t be where it is today. [/quote]

will you please quit talking out of your ass?[/quote]

Yeah, I sure am talking out of my ass. Maybe we can go back in time to the caveman days, without communication. I’m sure it would be great with no television, radio, and film production; no journalism; no sophisticated oration or writing; no advertising; and so on.

It would sure be great without qualified mental health professionals to deal with the various mental and emotional sicknesses we see today and give us an understanding of how our mind works.

Again, I ask you for all the right moves. Enlighten all the young’uns on here. What major and profession? Who should get married? Who qualifies to have kids? Where should one live? What should one eat? What should one look like? How should one act? Let us know so they can be perfect like you.

[/quote]

you strike me as someone who studied a trade instead of going to college and learning how to think critically.

do you even know what they teach in communications ‘classes’? how many breakthroughs do you think today’s psychology majors are making?

very, very few of these people ever end up making a noticeable difference in society… maybe a few each generation lol.

130

[quote]batman730 wrote:

[quote]Mr. Walkway wrote:

[quote]comus3 wrote:
In argument for - if you find someone sane, compatible and who you are attracted to it works. You can raise kids with some stability if that is what you want and generally with two people you will be better off financially.

Against - you could find that sane, compatible, sexy person and they could leave you because you drink too much and are a general asshole or after that you could find another person and think they are sane, sexy, compatible and they turn out to be just a really great set of tits attached to a level of drama, dysfunction and insanity that you weren’t smart enough to recognize. The outcome here could be really bad financially either way.
[/quote]

lol… so if it goes wrong, it’s because of the man’s choices huh?

are you implying that women aren’t selfish and deceitful? [/quote]

You began this thread saying you were not criticizing women but the institution of marriage in its current legal form. You go on to say that women are selfish, deceitful, conniving and unreliable and that 85% of those in your circle are studying bullshit and partying their way to a useless degree. How is his not criticism? Just because you believe it to be a statement of fact doesn’t negate the inherently critical nature of such a statement. I’m not even trying to change your mind, but own your opinion for what it is, an indictment of females as a “species”…[/quote]

well men are selfish and deceitful as well, and most of the ones who I know are partying their way to a bullshit major also…

it’s just… im not attracted to men, so their life choices don’t have much potential to effect me.

[quote]CroatianRage wrote:

[quote]Mr. Walkway wrote:

yes… I just referred to marriage as a trap… lol. Once your wife balloons up to 275 pounds at 5’1, everyone here will start to see what I mean. [/quote]

Is your mom fat?[/quote]

yes… im working on her, but she has ‘fatty mentality’ - no willpower, defeatist/victim complex, delusions (organic popcorn is good for you, etc.)…

it’s rather difficult.

in so many of the middle-aged couples who I know, the wife is just a bloated mess… whereas the man looks more or less about the same he did on their wedding day.

it’s a strange combination of funny and sad.

131

[quote]Mr. Walkway wrote:

you strike me as someone who studied a trade instead of going to college and learning how to think critically.[/quote]

I majored in a field you might put into the useless category. I’m a registered dietitian with a BS and an MS, both in nutrition (exercise concentration for masters) and completed a dietetic internship. Actually a former writer on this site was one of my professors.

[quote]
do you even know what they teach in communications ‘classes’? [/quote]

I know of some of the curriculum. I know and have known some communications majors who didn’t even work in the field they studied, some that earn modestly, and some that went onto high ranking, highly paid positions.

[quote]
how many breakthroughs do you think today’s psychology majors are making? [/quote]

Almost no one makes a breakthrough, including psych majors.

[quote]

very, very few of these people ever end up making a noticeable difference in society… maybe a few each generation lol. [/quote]

Perhaps you don’t think providing healthcare for those with mental and emotional disorders or lending a hand in dealing with the rough times of life isn’t contributing, but others and I do. I benefited greatly from a psychologist. So have many others.

So long.

132

[quote]Mr. Walkway wrote:

[quote]batman730 wrote:

[quote]Mr. Walkway wrote:

[quote]comus3 wrote:
In argument for - if you find someone sane, compatible and who you are attracted to it works. You can raise kids with some stability if that is what you want and generally with two people you will be better off financially.

Against - you could find that sane, compatible, sexy person and they could leave you because you drink too much and are a general asshole or after that you could find another person and think they are sane, sexy, compatible and they turn out to be just a really great set of tits attached to a level of drama, dysfunction and insanity that you weren’t smart enough to recognize. The outcome here could be really bad financially either way.
[/quote]

lol… so if it goes wrong, it’s because of the man’s choices huh?

are you implying that women aren’t selfish and deceitful? [/quote]

You began this thread saying you were not criticizing women but the institution of marriage in its current legal form. You go on to say that women are selfish, deceitful, conniving and unreliable and that 85% of those in your circle are studying bullshit and partying their way to a useless degree. How is his not criticism? Just because you believe it to be a statement of fact doesn’t negate the inherently critical nature of such a statement. I’m not even trying to change your mind, but own your opinion for what it is, an indictment of females as a “species”…[/quote]

well men are selfish and deceitful as well, and most of the ones who I know are partying their way to a bullshit major also…

it’s just… im not attracted to men, so their life choices don’t have much potential to effect me.

[quote]CroatianRage wrote:

[quote]Mr. Walkway wrote:

yes… I just referred to marriage as a trap… lol. Once your wife balloons up to 275 pounds at 5’1, everyone here will start to see what I mean. [/quote]

Is your mom fat?[/quote]

yes… im working on her, but she has ‘fatty mentality’ - no willpower, defeatist/victim complex, delusions (organic popcorn is good for you, etc.)…

it’s rather difficult.

in so many of the middle-aged couples who I know, the wife is just a bloated mess… whereas the man looks more or less about the same he did on their wedding day.

it’s a strange combination of funny and sad. [/quote]

So if virtually everyone, regardless of gender is deceitful, selfish and lazy why would anyone, regardless of gender, enter into any kind of relationship?

Seems like a difficult world view to work with.

133

Op. Quote,

Well men are selfish and deceitful as well, and most of the ones who I know are partying their way to a bullshit major also…

it’s just… im not attracted to men, so their life choices don’t have much potential to effect me. Quote.

That sounds like “college women don’t act like or are what I want them to be. I am mad about that”.

Well that’s reality. You can’t change reality. So do you adapt to college women or focus on middle aged women who find you disarming? I know you are looking for a marriage pro/con, why discussion but wrapped up in the question is an implicit “is it necessary for happiness?” The answer is it is not. But since you’re not into men then at some point you are either going to want some sort of relationship with women to get laid or you will adapt to living without that relationship.

134

[quote]comus3 wrote:
Op. Quote,

Well men are selfish and deceitful as well, and most of the ones who I know are partying their way to a bullshit major also…

it’s just… im not attracted to men, so their life choices don’t have much potential to effect me. Quote.

That sounds like “college women don’t act like or are what I want them to be. I am mad about that”.

Well that’s reality. You can’t change reality. So do you adapt to college women or focus on middle aged women who find you disarming? I know you are looking for a marriage pro/con, why discussion but wrapped up in the question is an implicit “is it necessary for happiness?” The answer is it is not. But since you’re not into men then at some point you are either going to want some sort of relationship with women to get laid or you will adapt to living without that relationship.

[/quote]

135

Orion, what think you of this post?

[quote]comus3 wrote:
However, the emphasis on losing everything misses the point, for me at least. You have one life to live experiences and acquire things. You can’t take them with you unless you are king tut. I look at it as you take your chances and if you lose it all you pick up and start again. That’s how life is. You open a business, it doesn’t work, go bankrupt, start again. Get a job, lose it, get another one. Marriage fails, lose some stuff, get some more stuff.

On an end note. If you are afraid of trying an institutional relationship with a woman because you fear losing your things or are worried about her potential for sanity, loyalty, friendship or propensity to gain 110 pounds, (I won’t even mention coming to the relationship as a 30 year old virgin) then women, who are in general not stupid and can read people emotionally, will pick up on your fears and world view and will stay away from you. Not necessarily because they wanted your things but because it implies to them that you, at least by current society standards, are dysfunctional and a risky bet. For them your $114,000 a year or medical degree or STEM blah blah just isn’t worth it, marriage or non marriage. (And God help you the woman who is impressed by $114,000 a year)

Then your choice is insane, dysfunctional and duplicitous partner in relationship, marriage or non-marriage, or whacking it to Internet porn. [/quote]

To me it rings completely true. Your thinking is so divergent from mine, however, I’m curious about your reaction. And let me say while I’m at it that I always appreciate your willingness to share your outlook. (Wrong-headed tho it may be!)

136

[quote]orion wrote:

[quote]comus3 wrote:
Op. Quote,

Well men are selfish and deceitful as well, and most of the ones who I know are partying their way to a bullshit major also…

it’s just… im not attracted to men, so their life choices don’t have much potential to effect me. Quote.

That sounds like “college women don’t act like or are what I want them to be. I am mad about that”.

Well that’s reality. You can’t change reality. So do you adapt to college women or focus on middle aged women who find you disarming? I know you are looking for a marriage pro/con, why discussion but wrapped up in the question is an implicit “is it necessary for happiness?” The answer is it is not. But since you’re not into men then at some point you are either going to want some sort of relationship with women to get laid or you will adapt to living without that relationship.

[/quote]

[/quote]

He adapted. It’s an option. Never said it wasn’t. But he was a Slav (which one is arguable) but those folks are weird as shit.

137

[quote]Mr. Walkway wrote:

yes… [/quote]

And yet your parents are still happily married. gasp

138

[quote]EmilyQ wrote:
Orion, what think you of this post?

[quote]comus3 wrote:
However, the emphasis on losing everything misses the point, for me at least. You have one life to live experiences and acquire things. You can’t take them with you unless you are king tut. I look at it as you take your chances and if you lose it all you pick up and start again. That’s how life is. You open a business, it doesn’t work, go bankrupt, start again. Get a job, lose it, get another one. Marriage fails, lose some stuff, get some more stuff.

On an end note. If you are afraid of trying an institutional relationship with a woman because you fear losing your things or are worried about her potential for sanity, loyalty, friendship or propensity to gain 110 pounds, (I won’t even mention coming to the relationship as a 30 year old virgin) then women, who are in general not stupid and can read people emotionally, will pick up on your fears and world view and will stay away from you. Not necessarily because they wanted your things but because it implies to them that you, at least by current society standards, are dysfunctional and a risky bet. For them your $114,000 a year or medical degree or STEM blah blah just isn’t worth it, marriage or non marriage. (And God help you the woman who is impressed by $114,000 a year)

Then your choice is insane, dysfunctional and duplicitous partner in relationship, marriage or non-marriage, or whacking it to Internet porn. [/quote]

To me it rings completely true. Your thinking is so divergent from mine, however, I’m curious about your reaction. And let me say while I’m at it that I always appreciate your willingness to share your outlook. (Wrong-headed tho it may be!)

[/quote]

Well, there seem to be two points that were made.

The first one is that “risking everything”, because its worth it, which is something that is only demanded of men because women do not “risk everything”. This seems to me to be a case of overvaluing the almighty vagina.

No.

One sided risk → fuck her!

The second point is that a woman might reject you because you see the world the way it is.

Well, fuck her then too!

The idea that a woman can be supported by the taxpayer (men) and have her choices subsidized (by men) and still demand and demand and have her feelings validated…

In the end Captain 69 has a list of the 20 best escort girls in Europe, TER might have the same for the best in the US.

So much cheaper than a divorce, so much less heartbreak than seeing your kids only every two weeks…

So sorry but women made sure that all the advantages are on their side and there is this small thing I learned in Kindergarden:

If you make sure that you win no matter what, nobody wants to play with you.

We are getting there.

139

[quote]CroatianRage wrote:

[quote]Mr. Walkway wrote:

yes… [/quote]

And yet your parents are still happily married. gasp[/quote]

well, happy in the sense that they aren’t unhappy I suppose…

finances are in good order, both children are alive and healthy… no real stress, etc.

my dad is trying to coax her into eating better and going on walks with him… but anyone with a fat wife knows exactly how that goes.

140

[quote]comus3 wrote:
That sounds like “college women don’t act like or are what I want them to be. I am mad about that”.

[/quote]

not mad at all… maybe a little concerned about the level of promiscuity… some of those diseases are untreatable you know…

and the prospect of unplanned pregnancies.

this is basically the way I see things…

-many, many women these days are very promiscuous

-research has shown a direct correlation between increased numbers of sexual partners, and an inability to pair bond in women

-women initiate ~70% of divorces

-the divorce rate is ~50% or so, in which men are taken to the cleaners, separated from their children, and subsidizing their ex’s new relationships.

therefore, it stands to reason that the drastic increase in divorces (where men lose everything) over the last several decades could be a result of how promiscuous women are and their resulting inability to pair bond (in addition to all the financial benefits they receive from their ex-husbands/the government).

this is why I have chosen to remain a virgin… I would like to find a woman who still has her dignity intact… I wouldn’t want to be a hypocrite after all, and I believe there is far less risk of her wanting a divorce due to the reasoning above.

thoughts? lol