Why Do Men Get Married These Days?

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481

[quote]EmilyQ wrote:

[quote]orion wrote:

Alright, point taken.

However, please not only notice but also understand the point I was making above.

That is neither a small nor a trivial thing.

Indeed, its dead serious! [/quote]

I disagree with your point, is the thing. We’re back to the whole different species of animal thing. You suggest that women are incapable of loyalty and yet there are millions of them wedded to batterers or writing to men in prison or steadfastly hanging in waiting for their beloved to get a job and stop making passes at other women. I think these women are idiots, of course, but they are certainly not merciless.

Your theories don’t past the sniff test.[/quote]

Taking one more pass at this, let me offer a hypothetical. “Womankind” is looking for a mate. They encounter, variously, Professor X, LoRez, and the guy tracking his girlfriend with the GPS. If I’m not mistaken that guy also started posts about his wife’s breasts, his wife talking too much, and then after that divorce, various issues with the new woman including the GPS one.

What would womankind come away with?

I don’t believe X will be successful in a relationship UNLESS it’s about his earning power. He’s incapable of seeing points of view not his own and has zero ability to compromise. Any woman who accepts a second date with him will have her sights set on his mini-mansion tract house. My personal feeling is that even the gold diggers will find him too difficult to talk to and will eventually abandon the project, but who knows.

LoRez seems loyal, considerate, and growth-seeking - my assumption is that if he has a failed relationship it will not be because he is not up to maintaining one. I predict success for him in the long run.

Adamhum will, IMO, continue going from one stupid long term relationship to another because he externalizes blame to whatever woman he’s with rather than making changes in himself. He seems to enjoy chaos. I predict for him the outcome MRA fear most because he chases poor character with big breasts. (HE is the one telling you MRAs how the world works once it all goes to shit.)

So will womankind determine that while NAMALT, most are not worth having?

482

[quote]orion wrote:

[quote]Mr. Walkway wrote:

[quote]Broncoandy wrote:
BTW for what it’s worth OP, as someone who’s had to deal with all of the consequences of an unsuccessful marriage (alimoney, child support, division of assets, paying for HER lawyer (multiple times now), etc…), and who unlike you does identify as an MRA, I will tell you right now I’ll get married again. There’s plenty I’ll do different, but there it is.

Sure it’s a dumb thing to do. Fun fact: all the best things in life are. Cruising down the highway on your motorcycle with a beautiful woman clinging to you for dear life is absolute lunacy. At any second a deer could come running out of the bush, or a car could swerve over and take you straight to Hades. Doesn’t mean there’s anything better to do. Sex?! Holy shit bro. AIDS. I’ll take a hot latina over a good book any day. Squats? You could pass out and get crushed under the bar. Better toss another plate on for good measure. The beach? Holy shit. You could drown. Undertow grab you and you’ll never be seen again. Start a business? Lose your house. Get a puppy? They’ll chew your shoes. Have some kids? Grilled cheese in your nintendo. Skiing? Break your legs. Camping? BEARS MOTHER FUCKER !

Can’t live in fear man. Gotta leave your basement some time.[/quote]

that is nonsense…

absolute nonsense [/quote]

I agree and here is why:

This risking everything for true love and whatnot is a uniquely male fantasy.

You are the moth, the “special one” is the flame.

A woman will never see a man that way, she is utterly unable to, you are a commodity, you are a utility and a disposable and replaceable one at that.

Of course you can be proud that your earning power or rock solid abs or your 10 inch dick makes you a little bit less replaceable, but that just delays the inevitable.

I am not saying that all women are ruthless, mercenary goldiggers, but I am saying that the female genetic programming is utterly mercyless.

You either play your role or you are gone.

Its not that women do this on purpose, it is just that if their internal computations decide that you are no longer worth the trouble, her feelings will change, her feelings are always true and you are gone.

Given that, what is a womans attention actually worth?[/quote]

There have been threads on here, relatively recently, where several men have justified cheating on their wife or SO because she isn’t living up to her end of the deal, aka sex. So the point you’re trying to make is a moot one at best.

This part especially:

"A woman will never see a man that way, she is utterly unable to, you are a commodity, you are a utility and a disposable and replaceable one at that. "

Is just absurd.

483

[quote]alpha_mike wrote:
Marry the right chick.

My wife is my best friend. She’s one of the coolest people I’ve ever met. She’s made me a better person and gave me two wonderful children. My life would suck without her/them.

Again, find the right person.[/quote]

  1. Most men say this before things go down hill.
  2. She could still be the coolest person, make you a better person and give you 2 children even if you weren’t married?

I’ve been there myself and luckily got out without being ripped off. I’ve had several girlfriends since then, and one thing is for sure: I will never get married again. I simply don’t see the benefit that a non-marriage relationship can’t offer.

484

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485

[quote]ModernMonk wrote:

[quote]alpha_mike wrote:
Marry the right chick.

My wife is my best friend. She’s one of the coolest people I’ve ever met. She’s made me a better person and gave me two wonderful children. My life would suck without her/them.

Again, find the right person.[/quote]

  1. Most men say this before things go down hill.
  2. She could still be the coolest person, make you a better person and give you 2 children even if you weren’t married?

I’ve been there myself and luckily got out without being ripped off. I’ve had several girlfriends since then, and one thing is for sure: I will never get married again. I simply don’t see the benefit that a non-marriage relationship can’t offer.[/quote]
Just because it happened to you in no way means it will happen to everyone else.

I said the same thing after my divorce 18 years ago but I got over my hurt and realized I was being selfish.

486

[quote]AliveAgain36 wrote:

I’ve always wondered about chicken and egg with these studies.

487

[quote]AliveAgain36 wrote:

High T men are less likely to get married, if they do, they are more likely to divorce and overall have higher partner counts.

A man’s T levels dip when he gets married, again when he has kids, then increases when he divorces

Edit: So perhaps it isn’t marriage, rather lower T types are more cautious and careful of their health. High T men engage in more risk taking behaviour

488

[quote]EmilyQ wrote:
Taking one more pass at this, let me offer a hypothetical. “Womankind” is looking for a mate. They encounter, variously, Professor X, LoRez, and the guy tracking his girlfriend with the GPS. If I’m not mistaken that guy also started posts about his wife’s breasts, his wife talking too much, and then after that divorce, various issues with the new woman including the GPS one.

What would womankind come away with?

I don’t believe X will be successful in a relationship UNLESS it’s about his earning power. He’s incapable of seeing points of view not his own and has zero ability to compromise. Any woman who accepts a second date with him will have her sights set on his mini-mansion tract house. My personal feeling is that even the gold diggers will find him too difficult to talk to and will eventually abandon the project, but who knows.

LoRez seems loyal, considerate, and growth-seeking - my assumption is that if he has a failed relationship it will not be because he is not up to maintaining one. I predict success for him in the long run.

Adamhum will, IMO, continue going from one stupid long term relationship to another because he externalizes blame to whatever woman he’s with rather than making changes in himself. He seems to enjoy chaos. I predict for him the outcome MRA fear most because he chases poor character with big breasts. (HE is the one telling you MRAs how the world works once it all goes to shit.)

So will womankind determine that while NAMALT, most are not worth having?[/quote]
Let me offer up a second hypothetical. A woman is going to be trapped in an enclosed space with a pack of wild dogs. She can choose one of three men to accompany her, me, Prof X, or GPS guy.

Prof X would unfortunately succumb to his asthma and be worn down by persistent attacks. The woman would survive for a while, as the pack would feast on X for days, but ultimately she would not be saved.

GPS guy would be furiously typing into Google maps searching for a way out of the enclosure. Neither he nor his female companion would last more than a few moments.

Me on the other hand would present the lady with a 100% chance of survival due to my superior might and inexplicable overconfidence in my abilities. The pack of wild dogs would wilt before my blows until they were reduced to nothing more than a mangled ruin. I would then craft a throne from the amalgamation of flesh, teeth, and fur and sit upon it unleashing a bestial roar in some ancient Germanic tongue which would come to me instinctively. Wait, what were we talking about?

489

[quote]usmccds423 wrote:

[quote]orion wrote:

[quote]Mr. Walkway wrote:

[quote]Broncoandy wrote:
BTW for what it’s worth OP, as someone who’s had to deal with all of the consequences of an unsuccessful marriage (alimoney, child support, division of assets, paying for HER lawyer (multiple times now), etc…), and who unlike you does identify as an MRA, I will tell you right now I’ll get married again. There’s plenty I’ll do different, but there it is.

Sure it’s a dumb thing to do. Fun fact: all the best things in life are. Cruising down the highway on your motorcycle with a beautiful woman clinging to you for dear life is absolute lunacy. At any second a deer could come running out of the bush, or a car could swerve over and take you straight to Hades. Doesn’t mean there’s anything better to do. Sex?! Holy shit bro. AIDS. I’ll take a hot latina over a good book any day. Squats? You could pass out and get crushed under the bar. Better toss another plate on for good measure. The beach? Holy shit. You could drown. Undertow grab you and you’ll never be seen again. Start a business? Lose your house. Get a puppy? They’ll chew your shoes. Have some kids? Grilled cheese in your nintendo. Skiing? Break your legs. Camping? BEARS MOTHER FUCKER !

Can’t live in fear man. Gotta leave your basement some time.[/quote]

that is nonsense…

absolute nonsense [/quote]

I agree and here is why:

This risking everything for true love and whatnot is a uniquely male fantasy.

You are the moth, the “special one” is the flame.

A woman will never see a man that way, she is utterly unable to, you are a commodity, you are a utility and a disposable and replaceable one at that.

Of course you can be proud that your earning power or rock solid abs or your 10 inch dick makes you a little bit less replaceable, but that just delays the inevitable.

I am not saying that all women are ruthless, mercenary goldiggers, but I am saying that the female genetic programming is utterly mercyless.

You either play your role or you are gone.

Its not that women do this on purpose, it is just that if their internal computations decide that you are no longer worth the trouble, her feelings will change, her feelings are always true and you are gone.

Given that, what is a womans attention actually worth?[/quote]

There have been threads on here, relatively recently, where several men have justified cheating on their wife or SO because she isn’t living up to her end of the deal, aka sex. So the point you’re trying to make is a moot one at best.

This part especially:

"A woman will never see a man that way, she is utterly unable to, you are a commodity, you are a utility and a disposable and replaceable one at that. "

Is just absurd.[/quote]

Completely agree. Some people see others as disposable utilities whose primary purpose is to serve their own interests. Many people in fact. People treat each other like crap. It’s not gender-specific.

Even Walkway concedes that most of the guys he knows are selfish and deceitful, he just only worries about the women because he’s hetero. While I don’t agree with his conclusions, this is a far more reasonable view than this idea that men are hapless martyrs and women are merciless schemers incapable of loyalty.

If you want to argue that family law is inequitable from a man’s standpoint, that is a valid point worthy of discussion. If that inequity makes marriage an unattractive prospect from a legal standpoint, I still follow the logic, even if I disagree. After that it starts to go way off th rails.

490

[quote]csulli wrote:

[quote]EmilyQ wrote:
Taking one more pass at this, let me offer a hypothetical. “Womankind” is looking for a mate. They encounter, variously, Professor X, LoRez, and the guy tracking his girlfriend with the GPS. If I’m not mistaken that guy also started posts about his wife’s breasts, his wife talking too much, and then after that divorce, various issues with the new woman including the GPS one.

What would womankind come away with?

I don’t believe X will be successful in a relationship UNLESS it’s about his earning power. He’s incapable of seeing points of view not his own and has zero ability to compromise. Any woman who accepts a second date with him will have her sights set on his mini-mansion tract house. My personal feeling is that even the gold diggers will find him too difficult to talk to and will eventually abandon the project, but who knows.

LoRez seems loyal, considerate, and growth-seeking - my assumption is that if he has a failed relationship it will not be because he is not up to maintaining one. I predict success for him in the long run.

Adamhum will, IMO, continue going from one stupid long term relationship to another because he externalizes blame to whatever woman he’s with rather than making changes in himself. He seems to enjoy chaos. I predict for him the outcome MRA fear most because he chases poor character with big breasts. (HE is the one telling you MRAs how the world works once it all goes to shit.)

So will womankind determine that while NAMALT, most are not worth having?[/quote]
Let me offer up a second hypothetical. A woman is going to be trapped in an enclosed space with a pack of wild dogs. She can choose one of three men to accompany her, me, Prof X, or GPS guy.

Prof X would unfortunately succumb to his asthma and be worn down by persistent attacks. The woman would survive for a while, as the pack would feast on X for days, but ultimately she would not be saved.

GPS guy would be furiously typing into Google maps searching for a way out of the enclosure. Neither he nor his female companion would last more than a few moments.

Me on the other hand would present the lady with a 100% chance of survival due to my superior might and inexplicable overconfidence in my abilities. The pack of wild dogs would wilt before my blows until they were reduced to nothing more than a mangled ruin. I would then craft a throne from the amalgamation of flesh, teeth, and fur and sit upon it unleashing a bestial roar in some ancient Germanic tongue which would come to me instinctively. Wait, what were we talking about?[/quote]

You are wrong. You would not need to actually hit the wild dogs. They would immediately submit themselves to your awesomeness and willingly use their bodies to construct a staircase so you and the damsel in question could climb out of the enclosure. Of course you’d effortlessly carry her up the dog-stairs to her swooning bliss.

491

[quote]csulli wrote:

[quote]EmilyQ wrote:
Taking one more pass at this, let me offer a hypothetical. “Womankind” is looking for a mate. They encounter, variously, Professor X, LoRez, and the guy tracking his girlfriend with the GPS. If I’m not mistaken that guy also started posts about his wife’s breasts, his wife talking too much, and then after that divorce, various issues with the new woman including the GPS one.

What would womankind come away with?

I don’t believe X will be successful in a relationship UNLESS it’s about his earning power. He’s incapable of seeing points of view not his own and has zero ability to compromise. Any woman who accepts a second date with him will have her sights set on his mini-mansion tract house. My personal feeling is that even the gold diggers will find him too difficult to talk to and will eventually abandon the project, but who knows.

LoRez seems loyal, considerate, and growth-seeking - my assumption is that if he has a failed relationship it will not be because he is not up to maintaining one. I predict success for him in the long run.

Adamhum will, IMO, continue going from one stupid long term relationship to another because he externalizes blame to whatever woman he’s with rather than making changes in himself. He seems to enjoy chaos. I predict for him the outcome MRA fear most because he chases poor character with big breasts. (HE is the one telling you MRAs how the world works once it all goes to shit.)

So will womankind determine that while NAMALT, most are not worth having?[/quote]
Let me offer up a second hypothetical. A woman is going to be trapped in an enclosed space with a pack of wild dogs. She can choose one of three men to accompany her, me, Prof X, or GPS guy.

Prof X would unfortunately succumb to his asthma and be worn down by persistent attacks. The woman would survive for a while, as the pack would feast on X for days, but ultimately she would not be saved.

GPS guy would be furiously typing into Google maps searching for a way out of the enclosure. Neither he nor his female companion would last more than a few moments.

Me on the other hand would present the lady with a 100% chance of survival due to my superior might and inexplicable overconfidence in my abilities. The pack of wild dogs would wilt before my blows until they were reduced to nothing more than a mangled ruin. I would then craft a throne from the amalgamation of flesh, teeth, and fur and sit upon it unleashing a bestial roar in some ancient Germanic tongue which would come to me instinctively. Wait, what were we talking about?[/quote]

You know what? I think either of the women trapped in the enclosed space with Prof X or GPS Guy would throw themselves to the wild dogs just to make it end sooner. You, on the other hand, are nice enough that your woman might pitch in to get the two of you out of there. Maybe by dragging the vanquished dogs out of your way so you don’t trip over them.

Orion, what does your co-trapped woman do?

492

[quote]pushharder wrote:

[quote]EmilyQ wrote:
…The man I chose likes to set off through the ice and snow on miles-long hikes in the middle of the night after he’s had a couple of drinks.

[/quote]

Emily, Emily, Emily, I had to honest-to-gawd LOL after reading this because…I have done this so many times.

Wolves a-howlin’, aurora borealis shining, snow crunching, no flashlight walks at midnight to the British Columbia border from my house…
[/quote]

It’s really enjoyable to do. I regret that it didn’t occur to me sooner, though on the other hand I’d never do it by myself. I need to stop falling, though. A couple of adventures ago I sprained my wrist, or something, and then pulled him down on me a second time (icy that night). Now I get intermittent warnings that it’s winter out, and things may be slippery. I fractured my elbow last winter playing on the ice with him. I may need to get wrist guards.

TL;DR Relationships with men are dangerous!

493

[quote]batman730 wrote:

Completely agree. Some people see others as disposable utilities whose primary purpose is to serve their own interests. Many people in fact. People treat each other like crap. It’s not gender-specific.

Even Walkway concedes that most of the guys he knows are selfish and deceitful, he just only worries about the women because he’s hetero. While I don’t agree with his conclusions, this is a far more reasonable view than this idea that men are hapless martyrs and women are merciless schemers incapable of loyalty.

If you want to argue that family law is inequitable from a man’s standpoint, that is a valid point worthy of discussion. If that inequity makes marriage an unattractive prospect from a legal standpoint, I still follow the logic, even if I disagree. After that it starts to go way off the rails.[/quote]

This times a million. I wish I’d said it.

494

[quote]jjackkrash wrote:

The better, more lucrative strategy is to wait for your inheritance. [/quote]

This made me think, Jack.

If I’m lucky, my parents will still be around when I hit 60. Any inheritance I might receive can go toward my support pantyhose and comfortable shoes. Woo Hoo!!

495

[quote]therajraj wrote:

High T men are less likely to get married, if they do, they are more likely to divorce and overall have higher partner counts.

[/quote]

So that explains those unmarried losers who live in their mothers’ basements? Their test is too high?

Hopefully yeah…for the last part I mean.

496

[quote]nephorm wrote:
But for the man at the end of the line, he still might consider that he was not, and probably would not have been, her first choice.[/quote]

Or 2nd. Third. 5th, 10th, 25th?

497

[quote]EmilyQ wrote:

[quote]orion wrote:

Alright, point taken.

However, please not only notice but also understand the point I was making above.

That is neither a small nor a trivial thing.

Indeed, its dead serious! [/quote]

I disagree with your point, is the thing. We’re back to the whole different species of animal thing. You suggest that women are incapable of loyalty and yet there are millions of them wedded to batterers or writing to men in prison or steadfastly hanging in waiting for their beloved to get a job and stop making passes at other women. I think these women are idiots, of course, but they are certainly not merciless.

Your theories don’t past the sniff test.[/quote]

I mean just from personal experience. My wife has to put up with way more from me than I do from her. I am a public school employee (accountant) so obviously I don’t make a lot. And she puts up with it, smiles, and every night wraps her arms around my waist and sleeps with her head on my chest just because.

Another personal anecdote, all of the men in my immediate family (grandfathers, dad, and uncles) have cheated on their wives. With the exception of one uncle, all the women stayed married to their husbands. Doesn’t exactly paint the neat little picture of the merciless harpy’s waiting to take their money that you paint.

498

[quote]EmilyQ wrote:

[quote]orion wrote:

Alright, point taken.

However, please not only notice but also understand the point I was making above.

That is neither a small nor a trivial thing.

Indeed, its dead serious! [/quote]

I disagree with your point, is the thing. We’re back to the whole different species of animal thing. You suggest that women are incapable of loyalty and yet there are millions of them wedded to batterers or writing to men in prison or steadfastly hanging in waiting for their beloved to get a job and stop making passes at other women. I think these women are idiots, of course, but they are certainly not merciless.

Your theories don’t past the sniff test.[/quote]

Yeah well, you see, but then you dont.

They are not with these men despite their flaws.

Violent criminals have more children than “normal” men, serial killers get love letters, sociopaths have more sex partners than emotionally healthy men, one of the, if not the most prevalent female sexual fantasy is very rapetastic.

Women dig those men.

What you are describing are not drawbacks, those are excellent selling points.

499

[quote]orion wrote:

[quote]EmilyQ wrote:

[quote]orion wrote:

Alright, point taken.

However, please not only notice but also understand the point I was making above.

That is neither a small nor a trivial thing.

Indeed, its dead serious! [/quote]

I disagree with your point, is the thing. We’re back to the whole different species of animal thing. You suggest that women are incapable of loyalty and yet there are millions of them wedded to batterers or writing to men in prison or steadfastly hanging in waiting for their beloved to get a job and stop making passes at other women. I think these women are idiots, of course, but they are certainly not merciless.

Your theories don’t past the sniff test.[/quote]

Yeah well, you see, but then you dont.

They are not with these men despite their flaws.

Violent criminals have more children than “normal” men, serial killers get love letters, sociopaths have more sex partners than emotionally healthy men, one of the, if not the most prevalent female sexual fantasy is very rapetastic.

Women dig those men.

What you are describing are not drawbacks, those are excellent selling points. [/quote]

But to raise a point from previous threads that you made, these are not the men that they would be culturally programmed to settle down with. They do not provide security that a more stable man would provide, but the abusers, sociopaths, criminals, etc. are the men they would fuck. Still doesn’t fit the neat little boxes that you painted.

500

[quote]jbpick86 wrote:

[quote]EmilyQ wrote:

[quote]orion wrote:

Alright, point taken.

However, please not only notice but also understand the point I was making above.

That is neither a small nor a trivial thing.

Indeed, its dead serious! [/quote]

I disagree with your point, is the thing. We’re back to the whole different species of animal thing. You suggest that women are incapable of loyalty and yet there are millions of them wedded to batterers or writing to men in prison or steadfastly hanging in waiting for their beloved to get a job and stop making passes at other women. I think these women are idiots, of course, but they are certainly not merciless.

Your theories don’t past the sniff test.[/quote]

I mean just from personal experience. My wife has to put up with way more from me than I do from her. I am a public school employee (accountant) so obviously I don’t make a lot. And she puts up with it, smiles, and every night wraps her arms around my waist and sleeps with her head on my chest just because.

Another personal anecdote, all of the men in my immediate family (grandfathers, dad, and uncles) have cheated on their wives. With the exception of one uncle, all the women stayed married to their husbands. Doesn’t exactly paint the neat little picture of the merciless harpy’s waiting to take their money that you paint. [/quote]

Well, in an interesting way, you cheating only reinforces the idea that she picked the right man.

Because other women want you.