[quote]TDog305 wrote:
hueyOT wrote:
i don’t think anyone can say that a great back can only be built with chin-ups/pull-ups, but i don’t think anyone can say that chin-ups and pull-ups aren’t also great tools to be used for building a great back.
i do chin-ups and pull-ups all the time. they are fundamental movements in my training programs.
My personal view, is that a BW pull-ups and chins, have very little to do with building a huge or even a large back. I have yet to see one person with what I consider a large back doing BW pulls or chins, unless it is for a warm-up. I really believe that once you can hit the 8-10 rep range with BW, that is when you start strapping on extra weight, and that is when the growing takes place.
I am not convinced that doing sets of 20 pull ups are a mass builder.[/quote]
i’m inclined to agree with that. 20 reps is not my idea of the way to get large and in charge. weighted chins are very effective as soon as one is able to attach that weight.
Pulls/chins are just like rows, in that they can be more of an arm or more of a back movement, depending on which muscles we focus on moving first. There was a time, before I knew this, that my rows were basically an arm exercise as well. Then I learned about “pulling through the elbows.” So I can’t really say one movement is better than the other for targetting the back.
But if you are 250lbs and get rep out 20 pull ups you are a solid mofo anyway and I would be willing to bet you didn’t get there doing bodyweight pull ups
As a random aside, this is actually becoming a very interesting thread. I always enjoy the threads here that go against the typical grain we hear (especially with something like chins or pull-ups which seem to be deemed sacrosanct at times).
I have not been doing many pull-ups or chins of late either, but I think my back is better than it has been in a long while. I have started to do a lot of heavier one arm DB rows as a staple and that, more than anything else, has been huge for me in adding strength and some more size in my back.
Every time I do pulls or chins, while I feel it in my back, it is usually my arms giving out well before my back does.
[quote]Dr. Stig wrote:
Kuz wrote:
Dr. Stig wrote:
Kuz wrote:
I just want to know why Stig changes his user name every 3 or 4 days…
Is it bothering you ?
Oh no, not at all. I can always tell it’s you… I was just curious. I remember you first as Victor Lustig, then just Lustig.
I only got the name as I was watching Top Gear car show and the Stig was on it, so it made me think of Victor Lustig the guy who ‘Sold’ the Eiffel tower, then I changed to Stig. The Dr. bit came in when I thought making bold statements in the Nutrition section would cut me some more slack, ha ha.[/quote]
LOL I think that can actually work. The other thing I have found is that people who use full names (wheter it is their own or not) seem to occasionally earn a touch more deference… as if they use their real name because they are some well-known expert. Kinda odd.
More’s the point, if the chin/pull was the greatest strength builder for the back, then it would at least translate into greater strength in some rowing movements which I don’t think it does.
[/quote]
You don’t think chin/pull -ing translates into greater strength for some rowing movements? Really? How about the rowing movement of pulling yourself vertically (also known as the ‘chin-up’?)
You’re saying chins should be dropped because the arms take more of the load than on other rowing exercises? Really? This is logical to you? That’s like not doing bench press because there are other pressing exercises that target the chest more directly.
More’s the point, if the chin/pull was the greatest strength builder for the back, then it would at least translate into greater strength in some rowing movements which I don’t think it does.
You don’t think chin/pull -ing translates into greater strength for some rowing movements? Really? How about the rowing movement of pulling yourself vertically (also known as the ‘chin-up’?)
You’re saying chins should be dropped because the arms take more of the load than on other rowing exercises? Really? This is logical to you? That’s like not doing bench press because there are other pressing exercises that target the chest more directly.
[/quote]
Bench press is not a bodyweight exercise though is it. There are other factors in play besides just working the back in chins.
[quote]Kuz wrote:
Dr. Stig wrote:
Kuz wrote:
Dr. Stig wrote:
Kuz wrote:
I just want to know why Stig changes his user name every 3 or 4 days…
Is it bothering you ?
Oh no, not at all. I can always tell it’s you… I was just curious. I remember you first as Victor Lustig, then just Lustig.
I only got the name as I was watching Top Gear car show and the Stig was on it, so it made me think of Victor Lustig the guy who ‘Sold’ the Eiffel tower, then I changed to Stig. The Dr. bit came in when I thought making bold statements in the Nutrition section would cut me some more slack, ha ha.
LOL I think that can actually work. The other thing I have found is that people who use full names (wheter it is their own or not) seem to occasionally earn a touch more deference… as if they use their real name because they are some well-known expert. Kinda odd.[/quote]
I kinda see where you are coming from here, I never have bothered doing loads of reps, 4-6 or so and adding weight, as with all other exercises. I am also a big fan of pullovers and bent-rows for that matter.
The guy I train with has never been a chin-up type guy, and it has not impeded his back development. To each his own, I guess.
Arnold Schwarzenneger always did 50 wide grip pull ups. if it took him 50 sets, or if it took him one, he always did 50 pull ups. If you look in his encyclopedia of bodybuilding, you will find that the chin-up was a well known excercise.
The marines looovvvveee pull ups and chin ups. I don’t want to sound rude, but I hope that some people are not justifying the fact that they cant do chin-ups by saying it doesn’t build the back very effectively. That would be like me saying that I dont squat, but thats ok because the leg press has more weight potential.
