[quote]paul bunyan wrote:
WHAT ABOUT DINOSAURS
On what day did GOD create dinosaurs and why did he destroy them? Please enlighten me someone. Death really sucks so what better way to extort people then to promise them an everlasting peaceful afterlife. [/quote]
Those DoDo birds are extinct as well. Don’t forget them.
I swear, some post just to let the ignorance drain before their head explodes. There have been many animals and species on this planet that are now extinct. The way things are going, polar bears and pandas may not be too far behind.
If you don’t believe in God, so be it. But don’t act as if you are more intelligent than those who do or as if you have stumbled upon anything that “disproves” the presence of God.
[quote]pookie wrote:
“Most of the things we do, we do for no better reason than that our fathers have done them or our neighbours do them, and the same is true of a larger part than what we suspect of what we think.”
[center]- Oliver Wendell Holmes, Jr.[/center]
[/quote]
Should this mean that we should not do things merely because our fathers or neighbours do them?
I for one am a believer, and was raised as a Catholic by my parents and family, went to a Catholic school and still consider myself a Catholic to this day.
I bear no ill will towards people who do not believe as I was taught that God gave us free will, as as such, people are not born with faith, it is a choice that people face at some stage in their lives and they act accordingly. (Or so I believe anyway).
[quote]LIFTICVSMAXIMVS wrote:
Professor X wrote:
Again, it is a ratio…a means of proportion.
Yes it is a ratio but it is not an exact number…like pi.
You cannot have an exact golden ratio rectangel becasue you cannot measure irrational numbers. You would have to chop of some of the precision. Where is the discrete (distinguishable) line that makes the rectangle “beautiful” as definded by,
1/phi = phi - 1.
the equation is the only way to represent the golden mean a number won’t do it.
EDIT–Hence mathematics generalizes the natural world and does not define it–which is what my originalpoint was.[/quote]
I had a link I wanted you to read but I will pm it to you later tonight. I think the fact that it is an “irrational number” has its own significance. I will avoid arguing that point here.
[quote]paul bunyan wrote:
WHAT ABOUT DINOSAURS
On what day did GOD create dinosaurs and why did he destroy them? Please enlighten me someone. Death really sucks so what better way to extort people then to promise them an everlasting peaceful afterlife. [/quote]
That would be the fifth day.
Genesis 1:20-23
And God said, Let the waters bring forth abundantly the moving creature that hath life, and fowl [that] may fly above the earth in the open firmament of heaven.
And God created great whales, and every living creature that moveth, which the waters brought forth abundantly, after their kind, and every winged fowl after his kind: and God saw that [it was] good.
And God blessed them, saying, Be fruitful, and multiply, and fill the waters in the seas, and let fowl multiply in the earth.
And the evening and the morning were the fifth day
Then they died out so that(Gen 1:24-25)…
And God said, Let the earth bring forth the living creature after his kind, cattle, and creeping thing, and beast of the earth after his kind: and it was so.
And God made the beast of the earth after his kind, and cattle after their kind, and every thing that creepeth upon the earth after his kind: and God saw that [it was] good.
[quote]Professor X wrote:
paul bunyan wrote:
WHAT ABOUT DINOSAURS
On what day did GOD create dinosaurs and why did he destroy them? Please enlighten me someone. Death really sucks so what better way to extort people then to promise them an everlasting peaceful afterlife.
Those DoDo birds are extinct as well. Don’t forget them.
I swear, some post just to let the ignorance drain before their head explodes. There have been many animals and species on this planet that are now extinct. The way things are going, polar bears and pandas may not be too far behind.
You are pretty smart comparing a few mammals to the dinosaurs. How could god have created the earth and man in however many days when the earth existed billions of years before man did. Face it there are so many holes in your belliefs it must be difficult to continue fooling yourself
If you don’t believe in God, so be it. But don’t act as if you are more intelligent than those who do or as if you have stumbled upon anything that “disproves” the presence of God.[/quote]
I wish i could believe in god. Because most christians are really good people. But my brain won’t allow me to become one of the sheep.
[quote]pookie wrote:
Has anyone ever noticed how everytime one of these threads starts up, the “Strong Words” of the day always seem to made to measure?[/quote]
I was waiting for someone to notice
Who chooses them anyway? I hope it’s through some random process from a long list hidden away, somewhere deep in the T-Nation cellars. Cos if that’s the case, I’m claiming it was the Flying Spaghetti Monster that made them appear “by chance”.
[quote]Joe Daley wrote:
Should this mean that we should not do things merely because our fathers or neighbours do them?[/quote]
It might simply mean that we should think about what we’re doing and not simply do it from habit or to conform.
And if you’d been born of muslim parents and attended muslim schools, you’d pray towards Mecca 5 times a day. You didn’t really choose your beliefs any more than you chose your parents.
[quote]I bear no ill will towards people who do not believe as I was taught that God gave us free will, as as such, people are not born with faith, it is a choice that people face at some stage in their lives and they act accordingly. (Or so I believe anyway).
[/quote]
Good attitude. There’s way too much ill will when it comes to these questions. It’s not like someone else’s disbelief takes anything away from your personal faith.
According to the Jews, you’d be called a “righteous gentile” (or something like that). According to them, you are perfectly fine and pleasing in the sight of God, whether you believe in God or not. You are following the basic tenets of “Noahyde Law.”
Jews thought the actions of a person were much more important than their “belief.” It was Paul who watered down religious thought, by separating it from righteous action.
“For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast.”
Sadly, most “Christians” essentially believe Pascal’s wager, relying on their “faith” to save them.
However, this alleged faith if not accompanied by works is worthless. As James warns, “Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble. But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?”
So, according to the Jews and their thousands of years of religious thought, you are perfectly fine. And according to James, many of those who “believe” are not.
[quote]futuredave wrote:
According to the Jews, you’d be called a “righteous gentile” (or something like that). According to them, you are perfectly fine and pleasing in the sight of God, whether you believe in God or not. You are following the basic tenets of “Noahyde Law.” [/quote]
I think it’s the same with Muslim religion. Anyone care to confirm this?
[quote]reddog6376 wrote:
Perhaps with another 2000 years of learning & understanding science will in fact be able to prove the existance of God.[/quote]
You’ve inspired me to see some light:
[u]Miserere’s 1st Hypothesis[/u]
When scientists eventually prove the existence of God, the Church will declare it a fallacy.
[u]Miserere’s 2nd Hypothesis[/u]
When scientists eventually disprove the existence of God, the Church will declare it a fallacy.
[quote]pookie wrote:
Elkhntr1 wrote:
As an agnostic, I have to admit the possibility of a devine creator just like I believe in the possibility we simply cease to exist upon death. I don’t believe in religion which I feel was created by man for a variety of reasons both good and bad.
I used to say I was agnostic. The problem was that believers would say or think “Ah, he’s just a little confused, he’ll come around.” If found that dismissive and annoying.
Eventually, I read Isaac Asimov’s thought on the matter:
“…but somehow I felt it was intellectually unrespectable to say one was an atheist, because it assumed knowledge that one didn’t have. Somehow it was better to say one was a humanist or an agnostic. I finally decided that I’m a creature of emotion as well as of reason. Emotionally I am an atheist. I don’t have the evidence to prove that God doesn’t exist, but I so strongly suspect he doesn’t that I don’t want to waste my time.”
…Which very neatly resumed the way I felt. Using “atheist” instead of “agnostic” does save a lot of time and piss off a whole lot more people.[/quote]
Pookie, I hear what you are saying about the believers labeling an agnostic “wishy washy”, but I hate absolutes of any kind. For me, one definitively saying there is no God is just as annoying as one saying there is a place in the clouds called heaven.
For me it was learning to feel comfortable with not having the answers and dealing with the existance I find myself in the hear and now.
[quote]LIFTICVSMAXIMVS wrote:
I believe in a ?rubber-band? theory. It is constantly is expanding and contracting–as in harmonic motion (though deriving a ?wave equation? to explain it is beyond my intention).[/quote]
The “oscillatory model” was discounted in the 1960s, as entropy would build up from oscillation to oscillation and cause an eventual heat death of the universe.
It’s been proposed anew in String Theory (the cyclic model in Brane theory) but it’s missing a lot of the mathematics to make it work, even as a theory.
I believe in one God, the Father, the Almighty, maker of heaven and earth, of all that is seen and unseen.
I believe in one Lord, Jesus Christ, the only Son of God, eternally begotten of the Father, God from God, Light from Light, true God from true God, begotten, not made, one in being with the Father. Through Him all things were made. For us men and our salvation He came down from heaven: by the power of the Holy Spirit, He was born of the Virgin Mary , and became man. For our sake He was crucified under Pontius Pilate; He suffered, died, and was buried. On the third day He rose again in fulfillment of the scriptures: He ascended into heaven and is seated at the right hand of the Father. He will come again in glory to judge the living and the dead, and his kingdom will have no end.
I believe in the Holy Spirit, the Lord, the giver of life, who proceeds from the Father and the Son. With the Father and the Son, He is worshiped and glorified. He has spoken through the Prophets. I believe in one, holy, catholic, and apostolic Church. I acknowledge one baptism for the forgiveness of sins. I look for the resurrection of the dead, and the life of the world to come.
Scientific evidence for the existence of the Flying Spaghetti Monster (FSM)
Advanced theoritical physics are currently mainly concerned with String Theory (ST). One of ST’s base assumptions is that elementary particles, such as electrons, quarks, photons, etc. are not point-like, but instead are short, vibrating strings. The frequency of the vibrations determine the type of particles.
Now, is it just me, or does it seem that the name String Theory should be changed to Noodle Theory? The FSM, in his noodly wisdom has created the whole universe out of vibrating little pieces of pasta!
It’s incredible that the theory that might finally unify Relativity with Quantum Mechanics and explain gravity will be based on noodles!
Ha! Let’s see the other churches get such scientific support for their gods.
[quote]Elkhntr1 wrote:
Pookie, I hear what you are saying about the believers labeling an agnostic “wishy washy”, but I hate absolutes of any kind. For me, one definitively saying there is no God is just as annoying as one saying there is a place in the clouds called heaven.
For me it was learning to feel comfortable with not having the answers and dealing with the existance I find myself in the hear and now.
I like Asimov’s take.[/quote]
You’re right, agnosticism is pretty much the only defensible position (at least as far as logic goes…) Just as you can’t prove God, you can’t deny the possibility either.
I also dislike “militant atheists” and don’t want to be lumped in with that group, but the label “atheist” makes my position clear from the start and cuts down on long explanation.
For anyone who’s interested, here’s an orthodox website which explains why Jesus was a false prophet who was given supernatural powers by God as a test to the Jews, and, in fact, deserved to be put to death… according to Deuteronomy.
[quote]futuredave wrote:
For anyone who’s interested, here’s an orthodox website which explains why Jesus was a false prophet who deserved to be put to death… according to Deuteronomy.
