White Fear

[quote]Professor X wrote:
DS 007 wrote:

And what responsiblity do black leaders have here?

Black leaders? Like Martin Luther King Jr.? What blacks do you know of that truly consider most of the public faces jumping for media attention to be “leaders” of an entire race of people? That was your first mistake. Let’s see what others you make.

Is there any culpability for blacks in this? Profiling exists for two reasons: 1.) Racist cops who are prejudiced against blacks, 2.) Young black males commit an inoridnately high percentage of crime (especially violent crime).

Wait a second, you either want to get rid of “labels” or you don’t. Why would the color of certain criminals matter at all to someone trying to get rid of “labels”? What an odd route to go down for someone so opposed to hypersensitivity of race. My “culpability” is to MYSELF. My responsibility as an American Male is to MYSELF. Until you can stop relating my skin color to the negative actions of others, you are a freaking hypocrite claiming you no longer want such “hypersensitivity” to race.

Profiling is exactly that. You are harrassed because you fit a profile. Young. Black. Male.

Gee, thanks for pointing that out. It does nothing to explain why young black doctors are seen as no different in the public eye as young black criminals. It does nothing to explain why this type of prejudice is accepted in society as a whole but then many want to turn around and cry about the use of “black american” in a sentence. Get rid of one and the rest will follow. Stop harassing me for my skin color and the labels will no longer be useful.

As for needing to know where you’ve been to know where you are going? Don’t agree. I agree when speaking in individual terms. But not in terms of your ‘race’ or ancestors. When you think in those terms you can only limit yourself.

Bullshit. That is like a rich man claiming that he doesn’t understand why poor people are so fixated on money. If it is something you have never lost, of course it is a nonissue to you. It was never taken from you. Your identity has been ingrained in your entire family line from recipes your mothers uses to how your father has learned to deal with life from his parents. It is a cycle unbroken barring some tragedy in your ancestry. That means you don’t see the significance simply because it is something that never caused a break in the chain in your family history. The question is, are you insightful enough to give credit to it. [/quote]

X, why are you so lit on this subject JFC, family history my ass, pick a hundred random people off the street in almost any community, I would bet that less than 1/3rd could find their own heritage with a roadmap, and a tutor, Black White, Asian , WTF ever, the country YOU, live in now was multi-cultural and Multi-racial a long assed time before anyone on this board got, here, How many generations of your own family has lived here, I would bet more than a few, enough, to get over the whole ancestor search shit, one race or another has been fucked over for the duration of the world, that is the world, get over it … as for profiling, WTF, are you insane, if my town has a 70% White Majority and 60% of the crime is committed by young white males, guess who will be profiled then, Sorry dude, but every time someone on this board brings up Race esp. Black race, you always come off sounding like yoiu have lost your best friend and don’t know how to deal with it,

X ,I apologize if I sounded like an ass a bit and I am not singling you out,I appreciate your point of view, the original post and the article cited are right on, I just do not think that color of ones skin, should hold even a little water,not in this day and age, as for pathetic scared white men, how about pathetic scared men period, and I try nether to be scared nor stupid to the best of my ability

[quote]Mad Titan wrote:
Lorisco wrote:
Professor X wrote:
Lorisco wrote:
When did the American dream become the African American dream? I don’t believe that was what MLK had in mind.

“And so even though we face the difficulties of today and tomorrow, I still have a dream. It is a dream deeply rooted in the American dream.” Dr Martin Luther King

Again, stop looking at negatives in society as an association with race and that will go a long way to fixing that. T%he problem is, you don’t want to do that, and neither do many “nonminorities”. You want to continue that concept while also looking down on those who associate by race.

Again, how does this make sense to you? Either get rid of it all…or shut up about it.

Ok, if those are my choices then I choose to get rid of all labels.

So all blacks in the US are just American’s, no better and no worse than anyone else. No special privileges, no special treatment, no affirmative action choosing them over other equally or more qualified candidates, no nothing!

Sounds good to me.

sounds good to me too especially when the “no worse than anyone else” starts getting applied to us I take that over affirmative action any day of the week[/quote]

Exactly. Yet, look at how many want to pretend as if that has happened already and that anyone pointing out that it hasn’t should just “get over it”.

[quote]Splinter36 wrote:
Professor X wrote:
DS 007 wrote:

And what responsiblity do black leaders have here?

Black leaders? Like Martin Luther King Jr.? What blacks do you know of that truly consider most of the public faces jumping for media attention to be “leaders” of an entire race of people? That was your first mistake. Let’s see what others you make.

Is there any culpability for blacks in this? Profiling exists for two reasons: 1.) Racist cops who are prejudiced against blacks, 2.) Young black males commit an inoridnately high percentage of crime (especially violent crime).

Wait a second, you either want to get rid of “labels” or you don’t. Why would the color of certain criminals matter at all to someone trying to get rid of “labels”? What an odd route to go down for someone so opposed to hypersensitivity of race. My “culpability” is to MYSELF. My responsibility as an American Male is to MYSELF. Until you can stop relating my skin color to the negative actions of others, you are a freaking hypocrite claiming you no longer want such “hypersensitivity” to race.

Profiling is exactly that. You are harrassed because you fit a profile. Young. Black. Male.

Gee, thanks for pointing that out. It does nothing to explain why young black doctors are seen as no different in the public eye as young black criminals. It does nothing to explain why this type of prejudice is accepted in society as a whole but then many want to turn around and cry about the use of “black american” in a sentence. Get rid of one and the rest will follow. Stop harassing me for my skin color and the labels will no longer be useful.

As for needing to know where you’ve been to know where you are going? Don’t agree. I agree when speaking in individual terms. But not in terms of your ‘race’ or ancestors. When you think in those terms you can only limit yourself.

Bullshit. That is like a rich man claiming that he doesn’t understand why poor people are so fixated on money. If it is something you have never lost, of course it is a nonissue to you. It was never taken from you. Your identity has been ingrained in your entire family line from recipes your mothers uses to how your father has learned to deal with life from his parents. It is a cycle unbroken barring some tragedy in your ancestry. That means you don’t see the significance simply because it is something that never caused a break in the chain in your family history. The question is, are you insightful enough to give credit to it.

X, why are you so lit on this subject JFC, family history my ass, pick a hundred random people off the street in almost any community, I would bet that less than 1/3rd could find their own heritage with a roadmap, and a tutor, Black White, Asian , WTF ever, the country YOU, live in now was multi-cultural and Multi-racial a long assed time before anyone on this board got, here, How many generations of your own family has lived here, I would bet more than a few, enough, to get over the whole ancestor search shit, one race or another has been fucked over for the duration of the world, that is the world, get over it … as for profiling, WTF, are you insane, if my town has a 70% White Majority and 60% of the crime is committed by young white males, guess who will be profiled then, Sorry dude, but every time someone on this board brings up Race esp. Black race, you always come off sounding like yoiu have lost your best friend and don’t know how to deal with it, [/quote]

You know what shows that YOU have an emotional attachment here? I haven’t posted in this thread in four days but that hasn’t stopped you from avoiding the topic and making your response personal towards me.

Of course, if you were the person who was the target of either racial profiling in regards to being seen as a possible criminal first or any other form of disproportionate bias on a larger scale, you clearly wouldn’t raise a voice in opposition and would even smile while it happened to you.

X, I re-read all the posts here, including my own as well as yours, and on this point with you I strongly agree, No I have never been subject to unwarranted suspicion based on the tone of my skin, so in fact i cannot truly understand that (your), perspective,

2nd I do respect you as a man and your right to your opinions, a lot of them are very similar to my own, to re-coin the phrase"can’t we all just get along", i dunno, I beleive affirmative action was over used and abused long ago,

I don’t like the fact that the same Government, that you and I both pay taxes to, would intentionally foster dependence, and punish people who just want to work and raise a family as a family, I also don’t appreciate some of the higher profile, Politicians, that claim to be looking out for their “people”, simply seem to be interested in stirring up distrust and lining their own pockets,“their people” should be all honest americans,

I wish there were another MLK, for all colors and race, but there isn’t, I don’t agree with profiling, but I don’t agree, with blaming the government or the Racial group across the street for all the problems on my side of the street, as for the ever shrinking ball sack of the White man, I could blame government quotas, or lawsuit after frivolous lawsuit,

most by those above mentioned high profile types, or i could see it as it really is that a profound sense of right and wrong combined with a full bouncy test filled Nut sack is hard to find today, maybe always, and X I really didn’t mean to offend you, or anyone for that matter, just sharing my opinion

[quote]Splinter36 wrote:
I don’t agree with profiling…[/quote]

What about profiling don’t you agree with? Maybe, like a lot of posters here, you don’t understand the difference between racial profiling and plain ol’ fitting the profile.

A large portion of my job consists of interaction with people who are born outside the US. No matter how long they have been in the US, they can’t americanize enough to cover the subtle cultural difference that point them out like a light bulb. Depending on the geographical location, that might give me enough suspicion to speak to that person. That’s profiling.

In other aspects of the job I might receive information about a crime and a partial description of a suspect. Using other cases and past experiences a “profile” will be created of the most likely suspect. If I’m looking for Osama Bin Laden, do taxpayers want me wasting time with for Grandma and Grampa Kettle? Nope. But that’s still profiling.

Two different neighborhoods, one high value the other low value. A $75K Escalade rolls through the low value neighborhood and a beat up $2K Corolla rolls through the high value neighborhood. No schooling is needed to tell me that something is out of place. I believe Sesame Street taught me that. Both those vehicles don’t fit the general “profile” of the neighborhoods vehicles. That causes suspicion and an inherent desire to investigate. Profiling? Sort of.

I believe that all three scenarios give a good general overview of what should be considered acceptable profiling.

Profiling can and should be done by race, gender, religion, age, similar trends or whatever the case/crime calls for.

With the term “fishing” in mind, harassing a minority (black, white, asian, Muslim, Christian, woman) when no crime has been committed just because they fit a general “profile”, is not profiling, it’s bias.

Just my .02, and I’m open to debate.

A general hypothetical on profiling:

Say you walk in your house and discover it has been completely trashed. Your electronic goodies are gone and so are smaller valuables. You have been burglarized.

Now get a picture of a person in a mask and dark clothes doing the deed - you can’t see the ethnicity in this image, only the black getup and mask.

Are you thinking of a woman? Or a man?

[quote]thunderbolt23 wrote:
A general hypothetical on profiling:

Say you walk in your house and discover it has been completely trashed. Your electronic goodies are gone and so are smaller valuables. You have been burglarized.

Now get a picture of a person in a mask and dark clothes doing the deed - you can’t see the ethnicity in this image, only the black getup and mask.

Are you thinking of a woman? Or a man?[/quote]

Does the ski mask match the belt and shoes?

[quote]Mad Titan wrote:
Lorisco wrote:
Professor X wrote:
Lorisco wrote:
When did the American dream become the African American dream? I don’t believe that was what MLK had in mind.

“And so even though we face the difficulties of today and tomorrow, I still have a dream. It is a dream deeply rooted in the American dream.” Dr Martin Luther King

Again, stop looking at negatives in society as an association with race and that will go a long way to fixing that. T%he problem is, you don’t want to do that, and neither do many “nonminorities”. You want to continue that concept while also looking down on those who associate by race.

Again, how does this make sense to you? Either get rid of it all…or shut up about it.

Ok, if those are my choices then I choose to get rid of all labels.

So all blacks in the US are just American’s, no better and no worse than anyone else. No special privileges, no special treatment, no affirmative action choosing them over other equally or more qualified candidates, no nothing!

Sounds good to me.

sounds good to me too especially when the “no worse than anyone else” starts getting applied to us I take that over affirmative action any day of the week[/quote]

And if there were a million more of you with that same attitude we would have no, or much less, racial problems.

I believe that is what MLK was working for; a chance to be just like everyone else. A chance to be called an ass-hole instead of the N-word. A chance to be slammed for your own personal traits instead of what racial group you belong to.

[quote]pookie wrote:
thunderbolt23 wrote:
A general hypothetical on profiling:

Say you walk in your house and discover it has been completely trashed. Your electronic goodies are gone and so are smaller valuables. You have been burglarized.

Now get a picture of a person in a mask and dark clothes doing the deed - you can’t see the ethnicity in this image, only the black getup and mask.

Are you thinking of a woman? Or a man?

Does the ski mask match the belt and shoes?
[/quote]

I’m thinking of Halle Berry dressed in that black leather cat-woman outfit waiting for me on my bed!

[quote]MaloVerde wrote:
Splinter36 wrote:
I don’t agree with profiling…

What about profiling don’t you agree with? Maybe, like a lot of posters here, you don’t understand the difference between racial profiling and plain ol’ fitting the profile.

A large portion of my job consists of interaction with people who are born outside the US. No matter how long they have been in the US, they can’t americanize enough to cover the subtle cultural difference that point them out like a light bulb. Depending on the geographical location, that might give me enough suspicion to speak to that person. That’s profiling.

In other aspects of the job I might receive information about a crime and a partial description of a suspect. Using other cases and past experiences a “profile” will be created of the most likely suspect. If I’m looking for Osama Bin Laden, do taxpayers want me wasting time with for Grandma and Grampa Kettle? Nope. But that’s still profiling.

Two different neighborhoods, one high value the other low value. A $75K Escalade rolls through the low value neighborhood and a beat up $2K Corolla rolls through the high value neighborhood. No schooling is needed to tell me that something is out of place. I believe Sesame Street taught me that. Both those vehicles don’t fit the general “profile” of the neighborhoods vehicles. That causes suspicion and an inherent desire to investigate. Profiling? Sort of.

I believe that all three scenarios give a good general overview of what should be considered acceptable profiling.

Profiling can and should be done by race, gender, religion, age, similar trends or whatever the case/crime calls for.

With the term “fishing” in mind, harassing a minority (black, white, asian, Muslim, Christian, woman) when no crime has been committed just because they fit a general “profile”, is not profiling, it’s bias.

Just my .02, and I’m open to debate.

[/quote]

Your post here as well as the comments of Iscariot sum up my thoughts on the matter. “Just get over it”. Yeah…that may sound a little insensitive and may invoke feelings of being minimized. That’s not my point.

My point is that just because racial profiling, discrimination and so forth has occurred for wrong reasons DOESN’T mean that you should try to be a modern day “Robinhood” with a chip on your shoulder out to punish people “very loosely” associated with the original offenders!

To borrow a quote from Stephen King’s DARK TOWER series: “The World has Moved On.”
Deal with it or get out of “the world”.

The world doesn’t owe you SHIT(I am referring to mankind in general)and life is NOT fair!