Where To After V-Diet?

Diet and Nutrition
1

Any suggestions on where to go after the velocity diet? I was considering the anabolic diet, or beginning some sort of carb cycling. The thing I would like to know is, if I should slowly work my calories up to maintenance, 3000 from the 1400-1800 I am taking on the velocity diet to reset my metabolism, or if I should just spike back up to 3000 right away. I was thinking of doing this method using the anabolic diet, then slowly reintroducing a touch of carbs back into my diet, and then either cut them back out, or try another diet you guys recommend.

I am 4-5 days away from being done with the velocity diet, currently at 189 from 210 I probably need to hit around 175 to be as lean as I’d like putting me around 7% bf. Estimated to have around 165lbs of lean body mass. I have never been that shredded always been a tubby boy, I know that to lose that last 10-15 pounds and conserve LBM will take a lot more time than what it took to get to where I am from 210.

This diet has done wonders for me as far as attaining a leaner physique. I will be going on an upperbody/lowerbody split during this transition, so when I do hit my goal, I can return to a powerlifting routine while clean bulking. Just wondering what would be the best way for me to replenish glycogen, and get my body functioning normally to continue my weight loss? Or if that is not necessary, what I should dive into right after.

I plan to still consume atleast 2 Metabolic Drive, and flax meal shakes a day, along with Flameout.These meals are just too healthy and simple for me to let go even after a month of eating nothing but them.

Also I will be approaching the 1 month mark of using HOT-ROX Extreme, can I keep using them for as long as I need to, or should I take a break and cycle it? I appreciate any help that can be offered.

2

Bump, also I am willing to do the T-dawg diet not just the anabolic diet, whatever you guys recommend.

3

Alright I have decided to go with Dr. Berardi’s Get Shredded diet. But I still need answers to my questions above.

Should I discontinue HOT-ROX till I start the Get Shredded diet, or keep on it regardless. I am doing the first week off the velocity diet at 2000 calories, I was taking 1400 on non workout days, and 1800 on workout days.

My maintenance is at 3000, should I spike up to that and maintain for a couple weeks to get my metabolism back up, then dive into JB’s plan or should I slowly work my way back up?

I just need these few questions answered so I can keep the fat off, and finish this cut properly. I have never been this lean before, and I don’t want to screw up my progress.

4

R-Ranger, I’d recommend that you take some time working your way back up to 3,000 calories. If you’re at 1500 currently, increase it to 2,000 calories per day and keep it there for a week or two. Then go up to 2500 for a week or two before going up to your old maintenance.

Reintroducing carbs back into your diet is going to result in some water weight gain, so I’d recommend that you only introduce fibrous green veggies, fruit and beans.

Make sure you optimize PWO nutrition by taking in a 2:1 ratio of starchy carbs to protein.

If you’ve been on HOT-ROX for a month, you’re good for another month or two before taking a short break. The choice, though, is yours. You’re fine either way.

Congrats on your results, by the way!!! You did well for yourself. (grin)

5

Thank you, I almost wish I could just do the diet again, but I don’t know if I can go that long… So I will do the week off at around 2000,then a week at 2500, and finally 3000. Now I can go without the carbs if need be, I don’t know if the Get Shredded diet is strictly a Ketogenic diet, so I don’t know if replenishing my glycogen and getting a little carbs in my body would be good, for when I start the new diet. Or if I would be better off to keep my body in fat burning mode without carbs any suggestions? I don’t really have any cravings except for eggs and red meat, for some reason my sweet tooth is disappearing (THANK GOD!). This diet has done a lot for me as far as changing my lifestyle and eating habits. With the flawless diet, and Thib’s pictures to inspire (I have a very similar body type as his, not quite that big…yet) I managed to make it.

Now is the part where I need to be careful and not mess it up, cause I still have a ways to go to becoming a true FFB. Gotta hit the single digits!! I am going to substitute some meals with protein and flax regardless, but I want to take in some eggs, steak, and chicken throughout the day as I get accustomed to solid foods again. So any help with my question about whether I should or shouldn’t reintroduce carbs yet would be greatly appreciated. Oh yes I have also transitioned to an upperbody/lowerbody split so I can maximize any gains, or atleast maintain during this period of climbing in calories. I appreciate all the information given so far.

6

Bueller…Bueller…

7

R-Ranger, when I’m designing diets for people, I calculate protein and fat requirements. The carbs I recommend are UNLIMITED green veggie carbs. You can’t/won’t get fat on fibrous green veggie carbs.

Take a look at www.nutritiondata.com. Look up cooked rice and cooked broccoli and see how much you have to eat to get 50g of Net Carbs. Net Carbs are Total Carbs minus Fiber Carbs.

I love the Velocity Diet for its effectiveness, for the fact that people aren’t hungry and energy levels are good and because, as you noted, a lot of people lose their cravings for sweets. But carbs are most emphatically not the devil. They provide vitamins and minerals and phytonutrients. They lower cholesterol, improve bowel function, provided sustain, slow-release, non-insulin-spiking energy. They lower cholesterol levels, protect against cancer and have, I’m sure, health benefits that haven’t even been discovered yet.

Part of becoming a FFB is adopting a LIFESTYLE, and part of making a new way of eating a LIFESTYLE is placing equal emphasis on health, energy and mood … and that means eating your GOOD carbs like beans, fibrous green veggies and fruit and avoiding your BAD/PROCESSED carbs like bakery/pastry items, chips, candy, donuts, muffins, etc.

By the way, anything below 100g of carbs per day is considered low-carb or ketogenic. You can pack in a whole lotta health-promoting, fibrous green veggie carbs in, allowing yourself 100g.

My final argument? (grin) You actually have dual body composition goals, losing as much fat as possible and losing as little muscle as possible. Including a measured amount of starchy carbs like sweet potatoes, yams, pumpkin, brown rice, oatmeal, amaranth, quinoa, barley or whole wheat pasta in your PWO meal will only result in stronger workouts, better recovery and increased/enhanced protein synthesis.

Questions? (grin)

8

[quote]Tampa-Terry wrote:
R-Ranger, when I’m designing diets for people, I calculate protein and fat requirements. The carbs I recommend are UNLIMITED green veggie carbs. You can’t/won’t get fat on fibrous green veggie carbs.

Take a look at www.nutritiondata.com. Look up cooked rice and cooked broccoli and see how much you have to eat to get 50g of Net Carbs. Net Carbs are Total Carbs minus Fiber Carbs.

I love the Velocity Diet for its effectiveness, for the fact that people aren’t hungry and energy levels are good and because, as you noted, a lot of people lose their cravings for sweets. But carbs are most emphatically not the devil. They provide vitamins and minerals and phytonutrients. They lower cholesterol, improve bowel function, provided sustain, slow-release, non-insulin-spiking energy. They lower cholesterol levels, protect against cancer and have, I’m sure, health benefits that haven’t even been discovered yet.

Part of becoming a FFB is adopting a LIFESTYLE, and part of making a new way of eating a LIFESTYLE is placing equal emphasis on health, energy and mood … and that means eating your GOOD carbs like beans, fibrous green veggies and fruit and avoiding your BAD/PROCESSED carbs like bakery/pastry items, chips, candy, donuts, muffins, etc.

By the way, anything below 100g of carbs per day is considered low-carb or ketogenic. You can pack in a whole lotta health-promoting, fibrous green veggie carbs in, allowing yourself 100g.

My final argument? (grin) You actually have dual body composition goals, losing as much fat as possible and losing as little muscle as possible. Including a measured amount of starchy carbs like sweet potatoes, yams, pumpkin, brown rice, oatmeal, amaranth, quinoa, barley or whole wheat pasta in your PWO meal will only result in stronger workouts, better recovery and increased/enhanced protein synthesis.

Questions? (grin)[/quote]

Tampa Terry you rock! I will do that then. I freaking love beans, and I don’t mind veggies at all anymore. I can actually eat salads and enjoy them now.

Usually for my postworkout I take in some gatorade powder along with my protein shake(obviously for the malto/dextrose carbs), well I actually sip the gatorade through the workout, and then pound a serving or two of Metabolic Drive. Should I ditch the gatorade and just take in some sweet potatoes or one of the above starchier carbs. Or also keep the gatorade, the gatorade is basically 35g straight sugar, I used it during the V-diet.

I can tweek it since it is powder and use less if you recommend that also. So I will try to start getting in around 100g of good healthy carbs throughout the days. For this next month as I work my way up to maintenance, before I begin phase 2 of cutting. I will still have some of the flax, protein shakes.

I am going to take my fats from healthy sources, such as fish oil, some will come from eggs, and a touch of cheeses(if that is okay), then bring on the chicken and steak for the protein. Everything else will be veggies, and salads of some sort. Thanks for all the help so far. Any other recommendations?

9

Since you’re going to be going up in your calories, adding in QUALITY carbs of the type we’ve been discussing would be an excellent move.

Fibrous green veggies are allowed any meal of the day and won’t interfere with P+F/P+C food combining. My point on the broccoli/rice comparison is that you probably can’t eat 50g of net carbs in the form of broccoli. Fibrous green veggies are self-limiting.

If you happen to be physically active one day, you’ll eat more. If the next day you happen to be physically IN-active, you’ll eat less.

The Gatorade works, but use whey protein with it because whey protein is more quickly digested. Mix the two together if possible. Another PWO drink alternative would be plain ole’ chocolate milk!!!

The way to time things is so that you have a regular meal scheduled 2 hours before your workout. Start sipping your PWO drink as soon as you start working out. Finish your workout and go home and have a PWO meal with a measured amount of starchy carbs one hour after that. Timing would look like this …

03:00 P+C or P+F Meal
05:00 Workout (Start sipping PWO drink)
06:00 Workout done
07:00 PWO Meal w/ Starchy Carbs

Working your way slowly back up to maintenance and staying there for a month before starting another cutting phase is an excellent idea. I wish more people did just that.

Cheese is okay, yes, definitely. I tend to treat it more as a garnish than as a protein source, though.

The way to calculate fat requirements is by multiplying your weight by 0.4g. Let’s use 190 pounds because it’s a nice round figure. At 190 pounds, you need 76g of fat per day.

What I’d like to see you do is divide that number equally between monounsaturated fat like macadamia nuts, olive oil or avocado, polyunsaturated fats like flaxseed, flaxseed oil or fish oil, and saturated fat like you get in the lean cuts of meat you eat, eggs, dairy, etc.

Since that’s roughly 25g of monos, 25g of polys and 25g of saturated fat, I’ll translate it into a number/requirement that people find easy to remember, in your case …

1.5 tablespoons of olive oil (21g)
1.5 tablespoons of flaxseed oil (21g)
6g of fish oil

That would leave 27g left over for saturated fat.

Your plan going forward looks solid, R-Range!!! I can see why you got such nice results on the Velocity Diet. Let me know if you have any other questions.

10

Thank you so much tampa terry. I really appreciate your help. I have started my upperbody/lowerbody split and let me tell you getting some calories in is going to help a lot. I wish I would have worked with compound movements more, and I think with the proper nutrition here I will hopefully atleast maintain or, lean out a bit more over this next month of resetting my metabolism.

Now I was just sitting and pondering today, would there be any reason why I couldn’t do the velocity diet again after resetting my metabolism? I responded very well to the diet, I lost a lot of weight, unfortunately I was very tubby and probably have to lose atleast another 15-20 pounds of straight fat while conserving all my lean body mass.

I figured I have been on HOT-ROX for a month, one more month to reset my metabolism, and then how bout another 28 days on the V-diet? It was very easy for me, everything was calculated out, and I have the opportunity to try to build a little mass, and work hard while I reset my metabolism. Is that doable?

I really like Berardi’s Get Shredded plan but it seemed simlar to the V-diet, basically a calorie limiting, and muscle maintaing diet. Velocity diet kinda takes all the guess work out though. Whaddya think?

11

I’d be a little more inclined to see 3 months in between rounds of the Velocity Diet, which works out to 3 times a year.

In the meantime, though, along with focusing on your workouts and PWO nutrition, there are two types of cardio I like for its fat burning benefits. The first is the walking you did in the morning in a semi-/quasi-fasted state; i.e., get up have some coffee and whey protein and go for a 45 minute to 1 hour walk outside. I like it because it doesn’t use up glycogen stored in the muscles, and the body mobilizes stored body fat to meet energy requirements. The other type of cardio I like is HIIT (High Intensity Interval Training). It’s only 20 minutes, short but not very sweet. (grin) HIIT is a real fat stripper, though. If you’re doing resistance training 4 times a week, you can do up to 2 HIIT sessions. If you’re doing resistance training 3 times a week, you can do up to 3 HIIT sessions. Always allow yourself a day off every week.

You’ll make some more progress between now and when you do the Velocity Diet again. And in the meantime, if you need any help with the structure of your current diet, let me know.

12

Okay so I will shoot for some regular old cutting, and hopefully make some good progress before I hit the velocity diet again. Maybe I can try to strip off the bodyfat by changing my body composition ie: putting on muscle faster than fat, I will do everything in my power to hinder fat development. To help get me leaned out more, and then whent it’s time to hit the V-diet again, I can get super shredded as in 7% bf area hopefully. I am probably sitting somewhere around 15-16%bf right now, I am really impressed though for the first time in my life I am seeing vascularity devlop in my body, along with some V-taper. I will be supplementing with biotests, HOT-ROX, Flameout, BCAA’s, I have some straight creatine that I am also debating on using, also have powerdrive but I don’t know if I will need it, and then of course some Metabolic Drive. Right now I am working at 2000 calories, shooting for 100g good carbs on workout days. Here is what I have put together for my meals for today, I am going to try to stick to something similar each day.

Meal 1
Breakfast (after slow pace cardio or HIIT)
4 whole eggs
1 cup mushrooms
3/4 cup broccoli
1 oz Havarti Cheese
(I had this with some ketchup, don’t know if that is okay to eat though, I was out of salsa)

492 cals
33g fat
13 saturated
3 poly
9 mono
9g carbs
3g fiber
39g protein

Meal 2
5g BCAA’s
5g Fish oil
Metabolic Drive with milled Flaxseeds

14g fat
2 Saturated
6 Poly
3 Mono
12g carbs
43g protein

Meal 3
1 cup whole milk (sipped during workout)
1 serving Metabolic Drive

250 cals
10g Fat
5g Saturated
2g Mono
15g Carbs
1g Fiber
28g Protein

Meal 4
PWO Meal (Chili) (1 hour after workout)
8oz Ground Turkey
1 cup beans (Fat free refried beans, out of a can)
1 cup V8 Vegetable Juice
1 tbsp Sour Cream
5g BCAA’s

590 cals
18g fat
6g Saturated
4g Mono
5g Poly
46g carbs
14g Fiber
60g Protein

Meal 5
Metabolic Drive with milled Flaxseeds
1 Serving Flameout

14g fat
2 Saturated
6 Poly
3 Mono
12g carbs
43g protein

Meal 6
Pre-Bed Meal
Metabolic Drive with milled Flaxseeds
1 Serving Flameout
5g BCAA’s

14g fat
2 Saturated
6 Poly
3 Mono
12g carbs
43g protein

And here is the days total macros.

Total: 2102
Fat: 90 809 40%
Sat: 28 255 13%
Poly: 20 141 7%
Mono: 21 146 7%
Carbs: 99 279 14%
Fiber:29 0 0%
Protein: 233 932 46%

Tell me what you think about this layout? Calories went a little over 2000 but I am sure it will fluctuate from 1900-2100 a day. This is what my diet will look like for the most part, I will take out or add shakes with flax to adjust calories, so some days right now I will only have 5 meals. Once I do get up to 3000 though I will be having more meals. Tear it apart for me and let me know. That was my best shot at getting some carbs in, and keeping my protein intake up. I will do 2 HIIT sessions per week, I am training 4 times a week (2 upperbody/ 2 Lowerbody), and then 3 days slow pace cardio. Basically a 1 hour powerwalk. Question though? Do I need to take in coffee in the morning does that help, or is it to just give energy? If not then I don’t need it, if so I will drink it on down with the protein, I normally did my cardio on a fasted stomach. I appreciate all the help so far.

13

Ranger, this is basically what my diet is looking like right now(percentage wise) although im taking in around 2500-2800 calories. Ive been off the v-diet for a few weeks and I am still dropping about 2 pounds a week while my lifts are going up(this is currently without cardio, which I plan on adding in, in the coming weeks once the weight loss slows). This is a great diet and I hope it works well for you.

14

Very nicely done, R-Ranger! Very detailed, and I can tell you put a lot of thought into it.

The numbers will fluctuate, yes, if you’re doing PWO nutrition. That’s a good thing … running a little lower on calories on the days you don’t work out and running a little higher on the days you do.

The first thing I did was look at the totals. What I’D like to see you do is come in at 190g of protein. Bulking or cutting, male or female, I always use:

Protein = 1g x TBW (190g)
Fat = 0.4g x TBW (76g)

Take the 190g of protein and divide it between the number of meals you are eating.

Here’s how I do fat. I multiply TBW (Total Body Weight) by 0.4g. For you that’s 76g of fat per day. From there I divide that number by three because I want 1/3 of the fat to come from monounsaturated fat (like olive oil, avocado, macadamia nuts/oil), 1/3 from polyunsaturated fat (either flaxseed oil, fish oil or flax SEEDS), and 1/3 from the lean cuts of meat you will be eating. Since a third of 76g is 25g, I translate that into tablespoons for people:

1.5 tablespoons of olive oil
1.5 tablespoons of flaxseed oil
6g of fish oil

As I said, that’s how I would do it, but I really don’t have a problem with it if you want to follow the plan YOU laid out. There’s more than one way to skin a cat. (grin) Your approach is a little higher on P and F and a little lower on C. I’d have you eating more veggies, beans and fruit, except for your PWO starchy carbs, of course.

I really like your food choices. They’re excellent and the structure of your plan is good, too, so either way. The only recommendation I would make is that you have chocolate milk instead of regular milk for your PWO drink and skip the Metabolic Drive, which has casein in it. Casein is a slow-release protein. Peri-workout (meaning in and around your workout), go with whey protein or milk or Surge.

Re the ketchup question, there’s room in people’s plan for just about anything. It all depends on whether you’re having a moderate, reasonable amount or going crazy with something. The big difference between following the Velocity Diet and being OFF of the Velocity Diet is that you should allow yourself those things that add flavor and enjoyment to your meals. I’m big on what I call “flavor carbs” anyway – mustard, vinegar, lemon juice, horseradish, soy sauce, garlic, ginger, fresh & dried spices, etc.

15

Thank you for all the help so far guys. I wanted to post up my macros for my off days. Today was sunday, and my body is fried I love it. I took a day off cardio and lifting for the first time in a month.

This is what my diet will look like on days I do not lift. Please critique, on ratios if they are okay. All the carbs came from broccoli, romaine lettuce, and flax meal along with a touch of oatmeal maybe a table spoon. Does this look okay, I am restricting my carb intake to only veggies on my off days, whereas on my on days I am incorporating beans, and Surge.
Trying to keep the fiber up regardless.

Protein was a little lower than I would like today, but did my best to keep all my fats healthy from fish oil, flax, eggs, a little cheese for the saturated, and natural peanut butter.

Total: 1931
Fat: 114 1028 55%
Sat: 29 265 14%
Poly: 34 304 16%
Mono: 28 255 14%
Carbs: 50 120 6%
Fiber: 20 0 0%
Protein: 179 716 38%

16

Also still wondering about the protein and coffee precardio? Is it necessary, is the coffee necessary or is it just for energy. I always did cardio upon waking with an empty stomach, but if the coffee and the protein helps with that then I am down.

17

It looks good, Ranger! Take it for a spin and see what happens. To really evaluate how well a plan is working, you need to stick with it for at least 3 weeks.

Caffeine does help mobilize free fatty acids, along with improving energy. You don’t have to do coffee, no. If you liked it better, you could make yourself some hot or cold green tea instead.

As far as your plan goes, it helps if you plan it out in advance. That way, if you see that you’ll end up running a bit low, you can adjust your numbers.

18

Sounds good Tampa Terry. I am taking my calories up to 2500 on Friday, that will be one week after the V-diet. I am still losing weight and not gaining it despite the solid foods, I thought I would jump from the water weight from 189 to around 191, but I am now at 187.5 so down 1.5-2lbs in a week off the V-diet is not bad I do not mind at all.

I will take in Green tea before my morning cardio, I am also still on HOT-ROX for this month. Then I will take a break from the HOT-ROX until I am ready to hit the V-diet one more time. I am noticing developing vascularity, and noticing differences in the mirror still so I can’t complain.

For the first time I have veins sticking out of my arms, and even shoulders when I lift. WHOO HOO!!! HAHAHAHA!!! Just gonna stick with it. Thanks for all the help I appreciate it.I am just using BCAA’s and Surge during my workouts. Should I take the BCAA’s on my off days too? I plan to take around 20g BCAA’s a day.

19

[quote]Tampa-Terry wrote:
Working your way slowly back up to maintenance and staying there for a month before starting another cutting phase is an excellent idea. I wish more people did just that.
[/quote]
This jumped out at me while browsing threads on what to do after doing the Velocity Diet (which I’m on the 3rd week right now).

Why is it not a good idea to cut all the way down to the lowest body fat level (say 8%?), then clean-bulk for a few years? What is the reasoning to split cutting phase into stages? Is it because we’d want to give out a body a chance to be used to the new body weight and make that the set point, before going lower in weight?

20

Good question, jthsiao! When you diet, your metabolism slows down. When you bulk, you rev up your metabolism. Eating at maintenance calories for one month in between the two gives your body a chance to “reset” its metabolism.

If you’ve been dieting and then start bulking with no transition period, you’re going to put on more fat than you need to.

If you’ve been bulking and then start dieting with no transition period, you’re going to lose more muscle than you need to.

Does that help? Is there anyone out there who can give jthsiao a better answer?