Where Do You Find Faith?

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141

[quote]magick wrote:

[quote]comus3 wrote:
I find faith in my confidence that I can take anything that happens to me and survive. One day this confidence will not match the result and that is the end. But until then I am alive. [/quote]

I wonder whether people who write things like this never actually faced death and/or a genuinely challenging situation (be it physical or mental), or are just actual true bad-asses.[/quote]

A true bad ass recognises that he may not survive and doesn’t care. Of course bad ass and mentally ill kind of overlap.

142

[quote]magick wrote:

[quote]comus3 wrote:
I find faith in my confidence that I can take anything that happens to me and survive. One day this confidence will not match the result and that is the end. But until then I am alive. [/quote]

I wonder whether people who write things like this never actually faced death and/or a genuinely challenging situation (be it physical or mental), or are just actual true bad-asses.[/quote]

It’s not badass. Just realization that until you are dead this is all you got

143

[quote]chillain wrote:
I’m one of those who’s constantly seeing examples of the “intelligent design” that the natural/biological world displays. From the molecular to the physiological to bird flocks migrating via sensory apparatus for magnetic fields. Etc.

So in that way, I’m constantly “finding” reminders of what grounds my personal views and faith.
[/quote]

This sums up my perspective as well.

144

I think I found faith in this thread:

145

I feel these two videos are relevant to the OPs question.

146

[quote]batman730 wrote:

When the mere topic of God/religion comes up there is an immediate knee jerk response of anger and contempt. AC, who is in my estimation a pretty bright cat, was caps lock shouting at Beans about “your God” and “your Bible” after Beans had expressly stated that he didn’t subscribe to any particular religion at all. If that isn’t an example of a passionate belief system distorting one’s views, I don’t know what is.

[/quote]

I’ll be the first to admit that my passionate disbelief distorts my views. Perhaps my second step father who used to whip the shit out of me with extension cords and put cigarettes out on my back while reciting bible verses to “cast the demons away from me” might have something to do with it.

I’ve seen first hand how religion can be used as a justification to hurt people. It’s a very powerful tool that is used to manipulate sheep into doing evil shit. So I take every opportunity I can to discredit it. But then I usually bow out of the conversation and go about my day once I’ve said my piece.

147

[quote]angry chicken wrote:
I’ll be the first to admit that my passionate disbelief distorts my views. Perhaps my second step father who used to whip the shit out of me with extension cords and put cigarettes out on my back while reciting bible verses to “cast the demons away from me” might have something to do with it.

I’ve seen first hand how religion can be used as a justification to hurt people. It’s a very powerful tool that is used to manipulate sheep into doing evil shit. So I take every opportunity I can to discredit it. But then I usually bow out of the conversation and go about my day once I’ve said my piece.
[/quote]

And I’ve seen first-hand how it saves people from incredible pain and suffering.

Because I recognize such incredible and divisive polarity exists in many issues, I can no longer buy all that deep into most things anymore. I have no idea which side has a better argument.

149

AC - There’s no excuse for that kind of mean abusive behavior. I’m so sorry.

I’ve talked about this before, but I took a detour toward the agnostic in my 30’s. Long story, but I somehow emerged with some basic faith intact. I think that’s just the way I’m made, and I’m grateful. As others have said, I see the divine in the complexities of our own human biology, and in the beauties of the natural world. I know non-believers feel some awe when they think about these things as well, but for me I see intelligence there too.

LegendaryBlaze? Hey now. Aren’t you the guy who harassed me for putting up pictures of my body building cat, calling me an attention whore? You are making all the perfectly nice non-believers look bad by association.

FYI, If you’re going to be an atheist, you want to go out of your way to not be a jerk. Of course, I’ll forgive you. Eventually. 'Cause that’s what Jesus would do.

150

[quote]angry chicken wrote:

[quote]batman730 wrote:

When the mere topic of God/religion comes up there is an immediate knee jerk response of anger and contempt. AC, who is in my estimation a pretty bright cat, was caps lock shouting at Beans about “your God” and “your Bible” after Beans had expressly stated that he didn’t subscribe to any particular religion at all. If that isn’t an example of a passionate belief system distorting one’s views, I don’t know what is.

[/quote]

I’ll be the first to admit that my passionate disbelief distorts my views. Perhaps my second step father who used to whip the shit out of me with extension cords and put cigarettes out on my back while reciting bible verses to “cast the demons away from me” might have something to do with it.

I’ve seen first hand how religion can be used as a justification to hurt people. It’s a very powerful tool that is used to manipulate sheep into doing evil shit. So I take every opportunity I can to discredit it. But then I usually bow out of the conversation and go about my day once I’ve said my piece.
[/quote]

Having never been in a home like that, I can’t imagine it. I’m sorry your step-father was pretty much the definition of evil.

151

[quote]Powerpuff wrote:
I think that’s just the way I’m made, and I’m grateful. As others have said, I see the divine in the complexities of our own human biology, and in the beauties of the natural world. I know non-believers feel some awe when they think about these things as well, but for me I see intelligence there too. [/quote]

I would say this is true of me, too, and I was raised by agnostic, and possibly atheist, parents. I just don’t see how the exquisite systems I see at play could be the result of chaos and accident.

On the other hand, I don’t believe in a God who is deeply wrapped up in our day-to-day lives and rewards belief in Jesus with answered prayers for easy livin’. To me the corollary of that is a God who wants innocent people to suffer war and famine and enslavement. It just doesn’t make sense, this first world/third world business.

But intelligent design: yes.

152

[quote]EmilyQ wrote:

[quote]Powerpuff wrote:
I think that’s just the way I’m made, and I’m grateful. As others have said, I see the divine in the complexities of our own human biology, and in the beauties of the natural world. I know non-believers feel some awe when they think about these things as well, but for me I see intelligence there too. [/quote]

I would say this is true of me, too, and I was raised by agnostic, and possibly atheist, parents. I just don’t see how the exquisite systems I see at play could be the result of chaos and accident.

On the other hand, I don’t believe in a God who is deeply wrapped up in our day-to-day lives and rewards belief in Jesus with answered prayers for easy livin’. To me the corollary of that is a God who wants innocent people to suffer war and famine and enslavement. It just doesn’t make sense, this first world/third world business.

But intelligent design: yes.[/quote]

There is no promise of “easy living” in the Bible. Quite the contrary, the Old Testament is filled with men and women suffering to bring people to God, and the New Testament is pretty clear in its claim that people who believe in Jesus will be persecuted.

153

[quote]angry chicken wrote:

I’ve seen first hand how religion can be used as a justification to hurt people. It’s a very powerful tool that is used to manipulate sheep into doing evil shit.
[/quote]

It strikes me as odd that you can’t see how religion has also been the justification of billions and billions of acts of charity, good will, kindness, sacrifice, etc.
Not to excuse your step father who perverted the call of Christ and will have to answer for it to God Himself.

154

[quote]angry chicken wrote:

[quote]batman730 wrote:

When the mere topic of God/religion comes up there is an immediate knee jerk response of anger and contempt. AC, who is in my estimation a pretty bright cat, was caps lock shouting at Beans about “your God” and “your Bible” after Beans had expressly stated that he didn’t subscribe to any particular religion at all. If that isn’t an example of a passionate belief system distorting one’s views, I don’t know what is.

[/quote]

I’ll be the first to admit that my passionate disbelief distorts my views. Perhaps my second step father who used to whip the shit out of me with extension cords and put cigarettes out on my back while reciting bible verses to “cast the demons away from me” might have something to do with it.

I’ve seen first hand how religion can be used as a justification to hurt people. It’s a very powerful tool that is used to manipulate sheep into doing evil shit. So I take every opportunity I can to discredit it. But then I usually bow out of the conversation and go about my day once I’ve said my piece.
[/quote]

That sucks man. Makes it easier to appreciate where you’re coming from on the subject.

155

Religion is just a theology, There is something that runs much deeper then a persons belief system or values. Each person has the choice to either live in delusion and go against there true nature, or act from it and bring it forth to engage this world consciously. Thinking has nothing to do with any of it.

157

[quote]pushharder wrote:

[quote]nkklllll wrote:

[quote]EmilyQ wrote:

[quote]Powerpuff wrote:
I think that’s just the way I’m made, and I’m grateful. As others have said, I see the divine in the complexities of our own human biology, and in the beauties of the natural world. I know non-believers feel some awe when they think about these things as well, but for me I see intelligence there too. [/quote]

I would say this is true of me, too, and I was raised by agnostic, and possibly atheist, parents. I just don’t see how the exquisite systems I see at play could be the result of chaos and accident.

On the other hand, I don’t believe in a God who is deeply wrapped up in our day-to-day lives and rewards belief in Jesus with answered prayers for easy livin’. To me the corollary of that is a God who wants innocent people to suffer war and famine and enslavement. It just doesn’t make sense, this first world/third world business.

But intelligent design: yes.[/quote]

There is no promise of “easy living” in the Bible. Quite the contrary, the Old Testament is filled with men and women suffering to bring people to God, and the New Testament is pretty clear in its claim that people who believe in Jesus will be persecuted.[/quote]

I too kinda wondered where this “easy living” in the Bible came from.

Also, “a God who wants innocent people to suffer?” Good grief, Em, has your yellow submarine spent some time in the mind of God and granted you some research results?[/quote]

I’m talking about the people I encounter who seem to parse things this way. I see it all the time, and especially did living in the south. “Praying for you!” over a new job or whatever. Have you not encountered the Footprints in the Sand, “prayers needed!” school of faith?

I don’t suggest that God wants anyone to suffer. I suggest that some of our first world brethren seem to think that “God is good!” on a very involved day to day basis. Personally, I disagree, because to believe thusly opens me to the horror of God’s presumed involvement in less golden lives.

I’m talking about people here. Not theology. I believe in intelligent design, which I view as “God.” I’m vaguely Judaeo-Christian, and probably closer to Judaeo than Christian.

158

[quote]cstratton2 wrote:
Religion is just a theology, There is something that runs much deeper then a persons belief system or values. Each person has the choice to either live in delusion and go against there true nature, or act from it and bring it forth to engage this world consciously. Thinking has nothing to do with any of it. [/quote]

You might really like this if you haven’t read it. Buddhism Without Beliefs by Batchelor. Short little book with an emphasis on Buddhist/ Eastern ideas without the need to be a Buddhist. Coming from a Judeo-Christian background, it kind of blew my mind. I found it really enlightening. I kept it on my nightstand for years and recently got it back out.

Would highly recommend for the OP too. Lots of wisdom about dealing with tragedy or anguish, finding contentment and inner peace, freedom from negative habits and though processes that interfere with enjoying the ride.

159

[quote]pushharder wrote:

[quote]angry chicken wrote:

[quote]batman730 wrote:

When the mere topic of God/religion comes up there is an immediate knee jerk response of anger and contempt. AC, who is in my estimation a pretty bright cat, was caps lock shouting at Beans about “your God” and “your Bible” after Beans had expressly stated that he didn’t subscribe to any particular religion at all. If that isn’t an example of a passionate belief system distorting one’s views, I don’t know what is.

[/quote]

I’ll be the first to admit that my passionate disbelief distorts my views. Perhaps my second step father who used to whip the shit out of me with extension cords and put cigarettes out on my back while reciting bible verses to “cast the demons away from me” might have something to do with it.

I’ve seen first hand how religion can be used as a justification to hurt people. It’s a very powerful tool that is used to manipulate sheep into doing evil shit. So I take every opportunity I can to discredit it. But then I usually bow out of the conversation and go about my day once I’ve said my piece.
[/quote]

I had a hunch something like this was lurking in your background. Faith is not the problem; evil men with or without it are.[/quote]

Oh yeah, my mom sure could pick 'em. She was a fucking whore with a revolving door in the front of our house and the men she married we all fucked up. The first one scammed her into paying for his college and them promptly bounced, the second one was the one I referenced above - a psychotic religious nutjob. The third one was a former combat Marine who used to sit on the roof of my house with his rifle “looking for gooks”. He’s the one that use the beat the shit out of me and my mom until one day when I was 16, I won the fight - which got me promptly kicked out onto the street (and you all know how that played out).

So yeah, I’ve had plenty of “work” to do around the issues of religion and women LOL.

160

[quote]treco wrote:

[quote]angry chicken wrote:

I’ve seen first hand how religion can be used as a justification to hurt people. It’s a very powerful tool that is used to manipulate sheep into doing evil shit.
[/quote]

It strikes me as odd that you can’t see how religion has also been the justification of billions and billions of acts of charity, good will, kindness, sacrifice, etc.
Not to excuse your step father who perverted the call of Christ and will have to answer for it to God Himself.
[/quote]

Here’s what I see: I’m not religious AT ALL, and yet I’m still more “charitable” than most people I know. Fundamentally, I’m an optimist. I see the potential in everyone and I help those who I see are ready to receive that help. I’ve given away an average of over two thousand dollars a month for the past year helping various people within my circles. And I’ve been that way ever since I’ve had the means to be charitable. I’ve helped over 50 people over the years in significant ways that really made a difference in their lives - some for long periods of time, others in single time gifts.

This month, I’ve helped five people. I’m about to write a check to a young family who had an unexpected legal expense and are late on their rent (I also got the young man a job in my union a few months ago). I don’t forget where I came from and I remember how hard it was to be poor. God or Jesus isn’t telling me to do it, my conscience is. I do not believe that I’m somehow “unique” in this. People are fundamentally good when they aren’t struggling to feed themselves. Also, I recognize that I have a “debt” to society for what I did when I was young, and I pay my debts.

I believe that people would help each other WITHOUT the influence of religion, simply because it’s the right thing to do.