[quote]FightinIrish26 wrote:
lumbernac wrote:
So Ghandi should have thankd the british for their occupation instead of slandering them. Not very nice of ol Ghandi.
You are a retard. plain and simple.[/quote]
Dude dont insult me think about the people of India. I mean im trying to be broad thinking in dealing w/ you. If the british never took control they wouldnt be where they are today. India kind of like China is about to be another great world power. Although i think india will reach this status much slower than China they have been no doubt helped in this by the British. Im trying to reach you with facts - you are just slinging trash in return
[quote]lumbernac wrote:
FightinIrish26 wrote:
lumbernac wrote:
Ok thats great X. Regardless of all this, the whites have accomplished much much more. Even now Africa is a horrible continet. Its ruled by dictators, has famines horrible wars won by machetes and hutus killing and raping their brothers. Look at Europe, people like visiting there , its a civilized place if you dont count the recent terrorism. I do agree that blacks have accomplished less in America but that is from our country’s horrible racial practices of slavery and jim crow.
However i did like that one about the open heart surgury - thats quite a feat!
You need an education. You need to read history books, and take third grade spelling over.
Regardless of you trying to insult me the facts remain. Africa is a poor country charecterized by revolutions, dictatorial regimes, and developing economies. History books will pretty much say the same thing that i have about africa dude. [/quote]
First of all, Africa is a fucking continent, not a country. Second of all, as X said, Africa has been raped not only by slavery for the Americas, but was used as colonies for the Europeans.
You know what. I just thought this over, and you are absolutely not worth my time on this thread. You have taken an interesting conversation and driven it into the ground, and I refuse to participate in this idiotic game of call and answer with your rediculous “facts” about Africa.
The only history book that might say the same things that you are saying are the ones written by David Duke. Have fun reveling in your own ignorance. I am done with this thread.
[quote]GhostOfYourMind wrote:
I dunno why I’m getting involved in this (boredom…heh), but…
Lumbernac- What are you basing this “white people have accomplished more than black people” crap on?[/quote]
I’ll separate it by continent.
Africa VS Europe - do i really have to go through and compare these?
America - White people versus Blacks. Here, blacks have been enslaved wrongly and so forth. They haven’t accomplished much b/c of discrimination put on them.
I mean if i was wrong somehow Irish wouldnt be pissed but he is. I guess he’s feeling angry for blacks i dunno. Facts are facts man either im correct or not. In both continents , the caucasians have done more.
[quote]FightinIrish26 wrote:
lumbernac wrote:
FightinIrish26 wrote:
lumbernac wrote:
Ok thats great X. Regardless of all this, the whites have accomplished much much more. Even now Africa is a horrible continet. Its ruled by dictators, has famines horrible wars won by machetes and hutus killing and raping their brothers. Look at Europe, people like visiting there , its a civilized place if you dont count the recent terrorism. I do agree that blacks have accomplished less in America but that is from our country’s horrible racial practices of slavery and jim crow.
However i did like that one about the open heart surgury - thats quite a feat!
You need an education. You need to read history books, and take third grade spelling over.
Regardless of you trying to insult me the facts remain. Africa is a poor country charecterized by revolutions, dictatorial regimes, and developing economies. History books will pretty much say the same thing that i have about africa dude.
First of all, Africa is a fucking continent, not a country. Second of all, as X said, Africa has been raped not only by slavery for the Americas, but was used as colonies for the Europeans.
You know what. I just thought this over, and you are absolutely not worth my time on this thread. You have taken an interesting conversation and driven it into the ground, and I refuse to participate in this idiotic game of call and answer with your rediculous “facts” about Africa.
The only history book that might say the same things that you are saying are the ones written by David Duke. Have fun reveling in your own ignorance. I am done with this thread. [/quote]
Ok i meant continent big mistake ( do you really think i didnt know it was a continent? look at my other replies dude.) but you have to agree that Africa is the most politically unstable continent in the world. I am not a nazi and dont agree w/ their crap. You are just trying to sling insults yet again wheras i am trying to reach you w/ facts in this discussion. I dont have to give reasons why i thik that black people have done just as much for PC reasons. Like I said facts are facts deal with it. Later.
And no Africa has not been raped by slavery as the Americans and Europeans have done to them. We simply purchased a few slaves and that was that.
Secondly, we had a great civilizing influence on the countries but apparantly not enough. Although some exploitation has occured, if Africa was so great it would largely have pulled itself up by now. A good movie to watch to give an example of the instability that i am mentioning is " Hotel Rwanda " . With this kind of thing happening, you cant have anything resembling civilization. Sorry. Again I am trying to reach you w/ facts and not insult which is what the majority of your arguement is based off of.
[quote]lumbernac wrote:
GhostOfYourMind wrote:
I dunno why I’m getting involved in this (boredom…heh), but…
Lumbernac- What are you basing this “white people have accomplished more than black people” crap on?
I’ll separate it by continent.
Africa VS Europe - do i really have to go through and compare these?
America - White people versus Blacks. Here, blacks have been enslaved wrongly and so forth. They haven’t accomplished much b/c of discrimination put on them.
I mean if i was wrong somehow Irish wouldnt be pissed but he is. I guess he’s feeling angry for blacks i dunno. Facts are facts man either im correct or not. In both continents , the caucasians have done more. [/quote]
So black people gaining civil rights and freedom from slavery isn’t a major accomplishment eh? Black people have done a lot of things, and professor X has given you a SHORT list. And because of discrimination against them, I think black people have accomplished more than a lot of other people ever will.
They’ve had to fight tooth and nail for a lot of things in America. And to me, a problem with your argument is that it seems to be subjective. What one person things is a huge accomplishment, may not seem so big to another, but that could just be how I’m looking at this.
I would be interested if you could back up what you think with solid sources, like history books, official documents, blah blah blah. Ya know, the usual crap that a history teacher would get on your ass for not citing.
I’m not arguing (maybe stating my opinion), just trying to get actual facts straight from a credible source. But anyways, weird topic to discuss eh?
[quote]lumbernac wrote:
And no Africa has not been raped by slavery as the Americans and Europeans have done to them. We simply purchased a few slaves and that was that. [/quote]
Lumbernac, it is not a question of whether you are right or not in your evaluation of the state of things, it is however a question of whether or not you are able to grasp the social context around you, which seems to be answereable by NO in your case.
Should you be intelligent, you would have realized that some things cannot be said, whether or not they are right or true.
For example, someone who believes blacks or African-Americans are inferior in some way just can’t say it for fear of seeing what just happened here, everybody ganging up on him.
Case in point, a very controversial psychiatrist on the radio here in Quebec recently mentionned a study on IQ which indicated that African-Americans had on average lower IQs by 15 points than whites. Evidently this lead to a province-wide cry of outrage leading to TV shows and so on. Two days ago it was announced that this very profitable radio personality had been fired.
Now you might want to critize the study, but point is, in what pertains the racial matters: STFU!
Look, i have never said that whites are superior mentally and cant claim that. I’ve had black bosses before and they are really some of the best i’ve ever had and they are a heck of a lot more practical than the caucasians it seems IMHO.
I’ve just talked about the bottom line, about why i think i should be proud of my own group and everybody else wanted to argue w/ me. Look i dont give up easy and Prof X gave up a long time ago then fightinirish did he lapsed into a sputtering array of insults because he couldnt back himself up.
Dude the truth and logic rule whether you like it or not. Some groups may be shown under a better light than others, some will be more accomplished than others. Thats life.
[quote]Professor X wrote:
… Our names were stolen. I doubt most blacks in this country whose families were brought here in the past through slavery (in spite of cultural mixing) could trace their families back more than 4 or 5 generations. …[/quote]
This is a great point. This is one of the reasons we are now getting much more diverse names in the black community. They want some connection with Africa and they want to lose their “slave names.”
One thing that always bothered me was that Cassius Clay changed his name to Muhammad Ali.
He dumped the name of an abolitionist and took the name of one of the most infamous slavers in history. I wonder if he appreciated the irony.
I know he converted to Islam, but he could have picked a less notorius name.
Africa hasn’t accomplished much in the past century for one reason and one reason alone, shithead: what white people did to it. Period.
…
[/quote]
This is completely untrue. Africa is “backwards” compared to European/Asian civilization because of geographic, agricultural and domesticated livestock reasons.
I suggest you read “Guns, Germs and Steel” by Jared Diamond.
While the European attempts to conquer/colonize Africa sure didn’t help, they did not put Africa in the position it is in. Tens of thousands of years of history did.
Skin color and genetics have nothing to do with any of it.
Why, if civilization began in Africa, was Europe able to conquer and enslave Africa so easily? When that first slave ship landed on Africa, European society was already miles ahead of African development. What kept Africa from evolving like Europe and Asia?
[quote]lumbernac wrote:
Look, i have never said that whites are superior mentally and cant claim that. I’ve had black bosses before and they are really some of the best i’ve ever had and they are a heck of a lot more practical than the caucasians it seems IMHO.
I’ve just talked about the bottom line, about why i think i should be proud of my own group and everybody else wanted to argue w/ me. Look i dont give up easy and Prof X gave up a long time ago then fightinirish did he lapsed into a sputtering array of insults because he couldnt back himself up.
Dude the truth and logic rule whether you like it or not. Some groups may be shown under a better light than others, some will be more accomplished than others. Thats life. [/quote]
Ignoring you in hopes you’ll go away isn’t the same as backing down. To quote Cool Hand Luke, some men you just can’t reach. You’re one of them. Have fun (literally) seeing the world in black and white while adding zero to a real or meaningful discussion.
[quote]Kuz wrote:
lumbernac wrote:
Look, i have never said that whites are superior mentally and cant claim that. I’ve had black bosses before and they are really some of the best i’ve ever had and they are a heck of a lot more practical than the caucasians it seems IMHO.
I’ve just talked about the bottom line, about why i think i should be proud of my own group and everybody else wanted to argue w/ me. Look i dont give up easy and Prof X gave up a long time ago then fightinirish did he lapsed into a sputtering array of insults because he couldnt back himself up.
Dude the truth and logic rule whether you like it or not. Some groups may be shown under a better light than others, some will be more accomplished than others. Thats life.
Ignoring you in hopes you’ll go away isn’t the same as backing down. To quote Cool Hand Luke, some men you just can’t reach. You’re one of them. Have fun (literally) seeing the world in black and white while adding zero to a real or meaningful discussion.[/quote]
[quote]lumbernac wrote:
Look, i have never said that whites are superior mentally and cant claim that. I’ve had black bosses before and they are really some of the best i’ve ever had and they are a heck of a lot more practical than the caucasians it seems IMHO.
I’ve just talked about the bottom line, about why i think i should be proud of my own group and everybody else wanted to argue w/ me. Look i dont give up easy and Prof X gave up a long time ago then fightinirish did he lapsed into a sputtering array of insults because he couldnt back himself up.
Dude the truth and logic rule whether you like it or not. Some groups may be shown under a better light than others, some will be more accomplished than others. Thats life. [/quote]
Exhibit A: This is why we cannot be trusted with a “White Pride” month!!
LOL May I present an awkward average white guy who has no idea of how to discuss racial stuff? Insensitive, sure. Undiplomatic, definitely.
I’m sure that lumbernac has spent little to zero time around other racial cultures, and thus cannot appreciate all that the black folks (for example) have done for our American culture.
Try some fried okra. Listen to some hip-hop. Rent a Richard Pryor movie. Make a peanut butter sammich (thanks, ProfX). Use the word “bizzatch” in a sentence. Ogle photos of Beyonce’s legendary rear end while listening to Sir Mix-A-Lot (you know what song I’m talking about).
After doing the above, get on here and say that the black people haven’t done anything. I know some folks on here think you need an ass-whuppin’, but you just need to expose yourself to more than just “white” stuff. There’s a very big world out there waiting for ya. Good luck.
Hint: it gets easier to appreciate other people and their contributions when you imagine “being in their shoes”. Example: if you were black, would you want to read all the boorish and short-sighted crap you posted? You can be proud of what you are, but you made the mistake I mentioned in my other post on this thread: you took that pride and made it into something you thought made you better than someone else. Yeah, you’re white… that means you are different, not better.
And before you accuse me of putting words into your mouth, go back and read you posts.
[quote]doogie wrote:
Why, if civilization began in Africa, was Europe able to conquer and enslave Africa so easily? When that first slave ship landed on Africa, European society was already miles ahead of African development. What kept Africa from evolving like Europe and Asia?[/quote]
Your statement, “When that first slave ship landed on Africa, European society was already miles ahead of African development.” is false. The earliest records of the external slave trade go back as far as the 10th century. Chances are, the original external slave trade branched off of internal slavery within the continent of Africa and continued to grow. In other words, slaves were being gathered from Africa from before any written record can support…back to biblical time periods.
The earliest record from the 10th century involves external slave trade across the Sahara. This was the beginning of the trans-Saharan trading network. Many of these North African slaves were not used as laborers. They were servants, considered “more intelligent and prone to revolt”.
African slaves taken from West Africa were originally sold into slavery by defeat in war, given up by “victorious” African Kings. Many times, these wars were instigated by Europeans.
For more information, this is a good resource:
Your mistake was in assuming that Africa was just sitting there, “unevolved”, and then the great Europeans came along and cleared up the problem by enslaving them. That was not the case. Slavery wasn’t new in the 18th or 19th century. That country had been used from the moment one group of man considered themselves better than another.
[quote]Professor X wrote:
doogie wrote:
Why, if civilization began in Africa, was Europe able to conquer and enslave Africa so easily? When that first slave ship landed on Africa, European society was already miles ahead of African development. What kept Africa from evolving like Europe and Asia?
Your statement, “When that first slave ship landed on Africa, European society was already miles ahead of African development.” is false. The earliest records of the external slave trade go back as far as the 10th century. Chances are, the original external slave trade branched off of internal slavery within the continent of Africa and continued to grow. In other words, slaves were being gathered from Africa from before any written record can support…back to biblical time periods.
The earliest record from the 10th century involves external slave trade across the Sahara. This was the beginning of the trans-Saharan trading network. Many of these North African slaves were not used as laborers. They were servants, considered “more intelligent and prone to revolt”.
African slaves taken from West Africa were originally sold into slavery by defeat in war, given up by “victorious” African Kings. Many times, these wars were instigated by Europeans.
For more information, this is a good resource:
Your mistake was in assuming that Africa was just sitting there, “unevolved”, and then the great Europeans came along and cleared up the problem by enslaving them. That was not the case. Slavery wasn’t new in the 18th or 19th century. That country had been used from the moment one group of man considered themselves better than another.[/quote]
Thanks for setting me straight on how far back the slave trade goes. I didn’t realize it was anywhere near that old.
[quote]
“Chances are, the original external slave trade branched off of internal slavery within the continent of Africa and continued to grow.”[/quote]
So it wasn’t evil Europeans who brought the blight of slavery on Africa. Does the fact Africans had an internal slave trade indicate to you that they were more advanced than Europe?
[quote]
African slaves taken from West Africa were originally sold into slavery by defeat in war, given up by “victorious” African Kings. Many times, these wars were instigated by Europeans.[/quote]
Why were the Europeans able to instigate wars in Africa?