Been on 5-3-1 for three years with fantastic results. The other day on my 5’s week (doing powerlifting style: 3’s, 5’s, 5/3/1) I tweaked my back locking out on the fifth rep of the third set. I have done this many times in the past (low back injuries are not infrequent for me) but with improved focus and experience I have mostly been able to avoid them the last few years. No pain today, and I have pushed the prowler, benched, etc. It is a little stiff however. I was wondering if anyone had switched to sumo and then back to conventional? (as it is a lot more back friendly…at least for me) I have heard there is not much carryover but i just want to keep going without too much of a gap. i am pretty sure I could handle the next cycle sumo (weight wise anyway… though my conventional is considerably more)
[quote]ultralars wrote:
How do you guys eat? like long between meals or only like 2-3 hours?
has anyone in here been able to loose fat while getting stronger with 5/3/1?[/quote]
As Clint Darden suggests, I eat with a spoon (see his youtube QNA for May 31, 2011).
I eat about 1-2 lbs of meat each day, and a bunch of other stuff, generally one meal with 1 lb of meat, other food as desired/convenient. Surge Recovery around workouts. When dieting down, I tend to go fairly strict paleo, mostly just meat and veggies, and tend to eat just a few meals a day all bunched together in the afternoon and early evening.
Over a very long time I was able to gain a tiny amount of strength while losing fat on 5/3/1, but first all of my lifts took a big hit when the diet started and I slowly worked back to the old strength and then a little beyond.
Jim,
Thanks for the simple and effective program. I love it. The e-book is a great read, and I plan on picking up (well, ordering and downloading) the powerlifting edition tomorrow.
I’m currently in my 4th cycle, and I recently developed some golfer’s elbow during a deadlift 1 rep max, and it’s left me unable to perform any sort of pull without pain. So I’m completely removing deadlifts, rows, chins, etc… from training until it heals.
Until my elbow/forearm heals, I plan on substituting squats on deadlift day, essentially doing squats twice a week, with whatever set/rep scheme is due that week. What are your thoughts?
Thanks
[quote]moshcamp wrote:
Jim,
Thanks for the simple and effective program. I love it. The e-book is a great read, and I plan on picking up (well, ordering and downloading) the powerlifting edition tomorrow.
I’m currently in my 4th cycle, and I recently developed some golfer’s elbow during a deadlift 1 rep max, and it’s left me unable to perform any sort of pull without pain. So I’m completely removing deadlifts, rows, chins, etc… from training until it heals.
Until my elbow/forearm heals, I plan on substituting squats on deadlift day, essentially doing squats twice a week, with whatever set/rep scheme is due that week. What are your thoughts?
Thanks[/quote]
I don’t see why not. I myself would tailor the accessory work to be very p-chain focused so that you don’t miss out on that development while not dead lifting. Also maybe do a different squat variation on the 2nd day.
[quote]tmay11 wrote:
[quote]moshcamp wrote:
Jim,
Thanks for the simple and effective program. I love it. The e-book is a great read, and I plan on picking up (well, ordering and downloading) the powerlifting edition tomorrow.
I’m currently in my 4th cycle, and I recently developed some golfer’s elbow during a deadlift 1 rep max, and it’s left me unable to perform any sort of pull without pain. So I’m completely removing deadlifts, rows, chins, etc… from training until it heals.
Until my elbow/forearm heals, I plan on substituting squats on deadlift day, essentially doing squats twice a week, with whatever set/rep scheme is due that week. What are your thoughts?
Thanks[/quote]
I don’t see why not. I myself would tailor the accessory work to be very p-chain focused so that you don’t miss out on that development while not dead lifting. Also maybe do a different squat variation on the 2nd day.
[/quote]
How about front squats, stiff-legged deadlifts w/ straps? Just suggestions, but only you know what you’re capable of doing. Sometimes only training what works is the best path.
[quote]ultralars wrote:
How do you guys eat? like long between meals or only like 2-3 hours?[/quote]
Different strategies for different people. I can eat what most people diet on, and still not lose weight.
It’s possible, but not likely. Go for one goal, all-out. I think Jim talked a little about this in a recent LiveSpill.
[quote]ultralars wrote:
How do you guys eat? like long between meals or only like 2-3 hours?
has anyone in here been able to loose fat while getting stronger with 5/3/1?[/quote]
Regardless of the program (so long as it’s not retarded), I can make strength gains while losing weight so long as I lose the weight slowly like half a pound to a pound a week. Granted, strength gains are not nearly as fast if I were gaining weight and are about the same if I was maintaining. That may or may not work for you.
[quote]moshcamp wrote:
Jim,
Thanks for the simple and effective program. I love it. The e-book is a great read, and I plan on picking up (well, ordering and downloading) the powerlifting edition tomorrow.
I’m currently in my 4th cycle, and I recently developed some golfer’s elbow during a deadlift 1 rep max, and it’s left me unable to perform any sort of pull without pain. So I’m completely removing deadlifts, rows, chins, etc… from training until it heals.
Until my elbow/forearm heals, I plan on substituting squats on deadlift day, essentially doing squats twice a week, with whatever set/rep scheme is due that week. What are your thoughts?
Thanks[/quote]
You can do that - or just use another squat variation (if possible) so you can at least have a bit more fun. The key to training with an injury is “Train what is trainable” and adapt the best you can WITHOUT re-injuring yourself or not letting it heal.
Maybe this has been asked before but I didn’t see it, I am often missing reps in the last set. And yes, I know this has been asked before but, I only miss on the 5x week. I get 4 or maybe even 3 reps on the last set. And then, I can do both the 3x week and the 5/3/1 without missing, even getting multiple reps on the set for both.
Not sure what is going on, the only thing that comes to mind is that my form just gets worse and worse so by the time I hit the 4rth rep, I am just muscling up the weight rather than lifting it properly.
Anyway, maybe I’m not the only one and someone could give me a nod in the right direction. Thanks.
[quote]MrZsasz wrote:
Maybe this has been asked before but I didn’t see it, I am often missing reps in the last set. And yes, I know this has been asked before but, I only miss on the 5x week. I get 4 or maybe even 3 reps on the last set. And then, I can do both the 3x week and the 5/3/1 without missing, even getting multiple reps on the set for both.
Not sure what is going on, the only thing that comes to mind is that my form just gets worse and worse so by the time I hit the 4rth rep, I am just muscling up the weight rather than lifting it properly.
Anyway, maybe I’m not the only one and someone could give me a nod in the right direction. Thanks.[/quote]
Every exercise? For how long? If it’s been like this for a couple cycles, then I would reset training maxes 90%.
[quote]MrZsasz wrote:
Maybe this has been asked before but I didn’t see it, I am often missing reps in the last set. And yes, I know this has been asked before but, I only miss on the 5x week. I get 4 or maybe even 3 reps on the last set. And then, I can do both the 3x week and the 5/3/1 without missing, even getting multiple reps on the set for both.
Not sure what is going on, the only thing that comes to mind is that my form just gets worse and worse so by the time I hit the 4rth rep, I am just muscling up the weight rather than lifting it properly.
Anyway, maybe I’m not the only one and someone could give me a nod in the right direction. Thanks.[/quote]
Reset your maxes. Base the percentages off of 90% of your true max. You are way too heavy. For the first week you should be getting at least 8 reps on your last set.
For anyone who questioned this program, rethink your shit. I have gained great gains in everything since starting this 12 full cycles ago, and this is what I started with.
Squat - 1RM @ 405
Deadlift - 1RM @ 385
Bench - 1RM @ 250
Press - 1RM @ 165
For being a lazy ass for 3-4 years, I was surprised I kept this much strength. I am entering my first full meet here in 2 weeks. Here are my goals.
Squat - 550
Bench - 345
Deadlift - 520
For Press, I did 195 for 7 reps 2 weeks ago. IDK about you, but I’m quite happy. This is all natural. Just blood, puke, sweat, and hard work. Nothing special except always pushing myself for 10+ reps on 3x5 week, 7+ on 3x3, and 3+ on 5/3/1 week, and using BBB template. My demon last year was to be able to feel strong again. This year the goal is to slim down with the base of strength.
If in doubt, press/pull something heavy, and eat like a horse. If you want to look pretty, find a glory hole and start sucking.
[quote]TheDudeAbides wrote:
[quote]MrZsasz wrote:
Maybe this has been asked before but I didn’t see it, I am often missing reps in the last set. And yes, I know this has been asked before but, I only miss on the 5x week. I get 4 or maybe even 3 reps on the last set. And then, I can do both the 3x week and the 5/3/1 without missing, even getting multiple reps on the set for both.
Not sure what is going on, the only thing that comes to mind is that my form just gets worse and worse so by the time I hit the 4rth rep, I am just muscling up the weight rather than lifting it properly.
Anyway, maybe I’m not the only one and someone could give me a nod in the right direction. Thanks.[/quote]
Every exercise? For how long? If it’s been like this for a couple cycles, then I would reset training maxes 90%.
[/quote]
Just deadlifts. Every now and then I have an off day for the others but nothing that concerns me. And as I look back, I missed 5x on this cycle, got it the last one, but missed it the one before. Hate to go back a few steps since I did that in February after being ill but it’s looking like that’s where I have to go. Thanks.
[quote]tmay11 wrote:
[quote]MrZsasz wrote:
Maybe this has been asked before but I didn’t see it, I am often missing reps in the last set. And yes, I know this has been asked before but, I only miss on the 5x week. I get 4 or maybe even 3 reps on the last set. And then, I can do both the 3x week and the 5/3/1 without missing, even getting multiple reps on the set for both.
Not sure what is going on, the only thing that comes to mind is that my form just gets worse and worse so by the time I hit the 4rth rep, I am just muscling up the weight rather than lifting it properly.
Anyway, maybe I’m not the only one and someone could give me a nod in the right direction. Thanks.[/quote]
Reset your maxes. Base the percentages off of 90% of your true max. You are way too heavy. For the first week you should be getting at least 8 reps on your last set. [/quote]
As I replied above, it’s just for deadlifts. And I don’t think I have ever pushed for more than 8 reps on them, but I agree that I probably need to go back and lower things. I have been going straight along since February when I previously took a two step back due to being sick. Thanks for the reply.
[quote]MrZsasz wrote:
[quote]tmay11 wrote:
[quote]MrZsasz wrote:
Maybe this has been asked before but I didn’t see it, I am often missing reps in the last set. And yes, I know this has been asked before but, I only miss on the 5x week. I get 4 or maybe even 3 reps on the last set. And then, I can do both the 3x week and the 5/3/1 without missing, even getting multiple reps on the set for both.
Not sure what is going on, the only thing that comes to mind is that my form just gets worse and worse so by the time I hit the 4rth rep, I am just muscling up the weight rather than lifting it properly.
Anyway, maybe I’m not the only one and someone could give me a nod in the right direction. Thanks.[/quote]
Reset your maxes. Base the percentages off of 90% of your true max. You are way too heavy. For the first week you should be getting at least 8 reps on your last set. [/quote]
As I replied above, it’s just for deadlifts. And I don’t think I have ever pushed for more than 8 reps on them, but I agree that I probably need to go back and lower things. I have been going straight along since February when I previously took a two step back due to being sick. Thanks for the reply.
[/quote]
Lets clarify: For Deadlift only, you fail to reach 5 reps on your last 5+ set, but on the 3+ week and the 1+ week, you reach or exceed? You likely need to reset your max either way, but I think there might be something else going on, too. Conditioning perhaps, I know my fat ass has a hell of a time with any deadlift set over 6 reps or so. Also you might just be stronger in the 1-4 rep range. And like you mentioned yourself, form could be an issue. I rarely see perfect form from higher rep attempts.
One other thing to note, don’t be afraid to go easy on the 5+ week. if you can still hit a good 5 reps on your 3+ week, and a good 3 on your 1+ week, that’s good enough imo.
[quote]mkral55 wrote:
[quote]MrZsasz wrote:
[quote]tmay11 wrote:
[quote]MrZsasz wrote:
Maybe this has been asked before but I didn’t see it, I am often missing reps in the last set. And yes, I know this has been asked before but, I only miss on the 5x week. I get 4 or maybe even 3 reps on the last set. And then, I can do both the 3x week and the 5/3/1 without missing, even getting multiple reps on the set for both.
Not sure what is going on, the only thing that comes to mind is that my form just gets worse and worse so by the time I hit the 4rth rep, I am just muscling up the weight rather than lifting it properly.
Anyway, maybe I’m not the only one and someone could give me a nod in the right direction. Thanks.[/quote]
Reset your maxes. Base the percentages off of 90% of your true max. You are way too heavy. For the first week you should be getting at least 8 reps on your last set. [/quote]
As I replied above, it’s just for deadlifts. And I don’t think I have ever pushed for more than 8 reps on them, but I agree that I probably need to go back and lower things. I have been going straight along since February when I previously took a two step back due to being sick. Thanks for the reply.
[/quote]
Lets clarify: For Deadlift only, you fail to reach 5 reps on your last 5+ set, but on the 3+ week and the 1+ week, you reach or exceed? You likely need to reset your max either way, but I think there might be something else going on, too. Conditioning perhaps, I know my fat ass has a hell of a time with any deadlift set over 6 reps or so. Also you might just be stronger in the 1-4 rep range. And like you mentioned yourself, form could be an issue. I rarely see perfect form from higher rep attempts.
One other thing to note, don’t be afraid to go easy on the 5+ week. if you can still hit a good 5 reps on your 3+ week, and a good 3 on your 1+ week, that’s good enough imo.[/quote]
Conditioning is a factor or maybe better put as lack of energy. Often I am pretty wiped from work and it carries over to the training. And general conditioning has never been my strong suit even though I was always the skinny boy. But, like you said, either way I should just bite the bullet and reset.
I have seen heavy singles done after prescribed reps, and I have seen the original AMRAP on last set thing done. Has anyone tried doing heavier low reps after prescribed reps but not quite singles? By that I mean on the 5/5/5 week after performing the prescribed reps, doing a few more sets of 5s with increasing weight, then doing heavy 3s on the 3/3/3 week, then singles on the 5/3/1 week.
If you were to do that, I’d suggest switching the 5 and 3 weeks and maybe doing triples instead of fives and doubles instead of triples. I only do extra heavy sets on my 3 and 1 weeks, and they’re only singles.
[quote]koubanator wrote:
For anyone who questioned this program, rethink your shit. I have gained great gains in everything since starting this 12 full cycles ago, and this is what I started with.
Squat - 1RM @ 405
Deadlift - 1RM @ 385
Bench - 1RM @ 250
Press - 1RM @ 165
For being a lazy ass for 3-4 years, I was surprised I kept this much strength. I am entering my first full meet here in 2 weeks. Here are my goals.
Squat - 550
Bench - 345
Deadlift - 520
For Press, I did 195 for 7 reps 2 weeks ago. IDK about you, but I’m quite happy. This is all natural. Just blood, puke, sweat, and hard work. Nothing special except always pushing myself for 10+ reps on 3x5 week, 7+ on 3x3, and 3+ on 5/3/1 week, and using BBB template. My demon last year was to be able to feel strong again. This year the goal is to slim down with the base of strength.
If in doubt, press/pull something heavy, and eat like a horse. If you want to look pretty, find a glory hole and start sucking.[/quote]
So everyone that bodybuild and don’t want to look like a diabetic blob of tissue should suck a dick?? what the fuck is wrong with you??
yeah you went lazy for 4-5 years, but bodybuilders are some pussies, yeah wow that makes sense.
no man needs to be above 15 percent in bodyfat percentage, and if you are, you shouldn’t eat like your trying to win a " first heart attack " contest, you should fix your shit,grow some determination and loose the useless weight.
[quote]ultralars wrote:
[quote]koubanator wrote:
For anyone who questioned this program, rethink your shit. I have gained great gains in everything since starting this 12 full cycles ago, and this is what I started with.
Squat - 1RM @ 405
Deadlift - 1RM @ 385
Bench - 1RM @ 250
Press - 1RM @ 165
For being a lazy ass for 3-4 years, I was surprised I kept this much strength. I am entering my first full meet here in 2 weeks. Here are my goals.
Squat - 550
Bench - 345
Deadlift - 520
For Press, I did 195 for 7 reps 2 weeks ago. IDK about you, but I’m quite happy. This is all natural. Just blood, puke, sweat, and hard work. Nothing special except always pushing myself for 10+ reps on 3x5 week, 7+ on 3x3, and 3+ on 5/3/1 week, and using BBB template. My demon last year was to be able to feel strong again. This year the goal is to slim down with the base of strength.
If in doubt, press/pull something heavy, and eat like a horse. If you want to look pretty, find a glory hole and start sucking.[/quote]
So everyone that bodybuild and don’t want to look like a diabetic blob of tissue should suck a dick?? what the fuck is wrong with you??
yeah you went lazy for 4-5 years, but bodybuilders are some pussies, yeah wow that makes sense.
no man needs to be above 15 percent in bodyfat percentage, and if you are, you shouldn’t eat like your trying to win a " first heart attack " contest, you should fix your shit,grow some determination and loose the useless weight.
[/quote]
hmmm… someone forgot their Wheaties today… isn’t that what the hell I said? I was so out of shape that using the program, I lost over 80 pounds with just walking. my endeavor is no one year thing. more of 2-3, doing it healthy and make sure I keep it off.
the post was not to bash bodybuilders. I have a friend who is one. sure, we butt heads on what to do for lifts, reps, food, etc. but, we have much respect for each other. why? cause we are religiously in there killing ourselves with iron. bodybuilders aren’t pretty, they are men, just like powerlifters. im talking about the asshats who go straight to curls and kickbacks, and thats it. i have a coworker who does that shit. “oh man, my arms are so sore.” yeah, fuck you, im puking my guts out here doing prowler pushes. his dick-less attitude carries over to work, and i make his life a living hell there too.