Wendler 5/3/1 Program - pt 2.

Training Powerlifting
521

[quote]crankMAN wrote:
m1sf1t wrote:
Sagat wrote:
On the dead stop vs touch and go deadlifts: i cant really do touch and go deads because my grip sucks (now it sucks less because of the DB rows), i can do a few reps and then i need to pause on the floor to adjust the grip. Nobody has this problem?

I’m sorry if this response is incredibly redundant but, are you using chalk? The difference that it makes is ridiculous! I “divorced” the straps a few years ago and I haven’t had any issues since. Like Jim says, even if they don’t allow chalk in your gym, sneak it in! It’s supposedly not allowed at the gold’s I train at, but I usually clean after myself and befriended the cleaning crew, so they don’t mind THAT much at this point I don’t think…

Chalk not allowed in my gymm…

Sagat: I have the same issue on the last set…after a few reps i have to wait maybe 5 secs , so no choice to reset for at least one rep…

Steelersnations: Thanks for your answer…but im a COWBOYS fan…so guess what i think of your name!!

to all: Thanks, deload next week so i think about what i wanna do for my deadlift but so far …reset on all reps is ahead!!

[/quote]

Hey they make a liquid chalk of sorts. Try looking on Titan’s or Inzer’s website. I am not sure who else might carry it. I have tried it and it is ok in a pinch – rather have the real stuff, but when you can’t use it or don’t have any this is a good alternative.

522

[quote]crankMAN wrote:
m1sf1t wrote:
Sagat wrote:
On the dead stop vs touch and go deadlifts: i cant really do touch and go deads because my grip sucks (now it sucks less because of the DB rows), i can do a few reps and then i need to pause on the floor to adjust the grip. Nobody has this problem?

I’m sorry if this response is incredibly redundant but, are you using chalk? The difference that it makes is ridiculous! I “divorced” the straps a few years ago and I haven’t had any issues since. Like Jim says, even if they don’t allow chalk in your gym, sneak it in! It’s supposedly not allowed at the gold’s I train at, but I usually clean after myself and befriended the cleaning crew, so they don’t mind THAT much at this point I don’t think…

Chalk not allowed in my gymm…

Sagat: I have the same issue on the last set…after a few reps i have to wait maybe 5 secs , so no choice to reset for at least one rep…

Steelersnations: Thanks for your answer…but im a COWBOYS fan…so guess what i think of your name!!

to all: Thanks, deload next week so i think about what i wanna do for my deadlift but so far …reset on all reps is ahead!!

[/quote]

Yeah Chalk is not allowed in my gym either. And I have only been to one spot were it was allowed out in Hawaii. You either have to sneak it in Put it in a plastic shoping bag (which has handles that you can loop over something chalk up inside the bag clap lift and when your done Take a towel and clean the bar. Most times if the trainers see your respecting there equipment they are cool. OR if you have someone aproach you ask the manager or head trainer. Let them know what your doing and why and they can be really cool with it, not always but its worth it. Chalk will save your hands and IT MAKES ONE HELL OF A DIFFRENCE

523

[quote]Firebug9 wrote:
crankMAN wrote:
m1sf1t wrote:
Sagat wrote:
On the dead stop vs touch and go deadlifts: i cant really do touch and go deads because my grip sucks (now it sucks less because of the DB rows), i can do a few reps and then i need to pause on the floor to adjust the grip. Nobody has this problem?

I’m sorry if this response is incredibly redundant but, are you using chalk? The difference that it makes is ridiculous! I “divorced” the straps a few years ago and I haven’t had any issues since. Like Jim says, even if they don’t allow chalk in your gym, sneak it in! It’s supposedly not allowed at the gold’s I train at, but I usually clean after myself and befriended the cleaning crew, so they don’t mind THAT much at this point I don’t think…

Chalk not allowed in my gymm…

Sagat: I have the same issue on the last set…after a few reps i have to wait maybe 5 secs , so no choice to reset for at least one rep…

Steelersnations: Thanks for your answer…but im a COWBOYS fan…so guess what i think of your name!!

to all: Thanks, deload next week so i think about what i wanna do for my deadlift but so far …reset on all reps is ahead!!

Hey they make a liquid chalk of sorts. Try looking on Titan’s or Inzer’s website. I am not sure who else might carry it. I have tried it and it is ok in a pinch – rather have the real stuff, but when you can’t use it or don’t have any this is a good alternative.
[/quote]

Have you come up with a working plan for your meets.

524

[quote]crankMAN wrote:
m1sf1t wrote:
Sagat wrote:
On the dead stop vs touch and go deadlifts: i cant really do touch and go deads because my grip sucks (now it sucks less because of the DB rows), i can do a few reps and then i need to pause on the floor to adjust the grip. Nobody has this problem?

I’m sorry if this response is incredibly redundant but, are you using chalk? The difference that it makes is ridiculous! I “divorced” the straps a few years ago and I haven’t had any issues since. Like Jim says, even if they don’t allow chalk in your gym, sneak it in! It’s supposedly not allowed at the gold’s I train at, but I usually clean after myself and befriended the cleaning crew, so they don’t mind THAT much at this point I don’t think…

Chalk not allowed in my gymm…

Sagat: I have the same issue on the last set…after a few reps i have to wait maybe 5 secs , so no choice to reset for at least one rep…

Steelersnations: Thanks for your answer…but im a COWBOYS fan…so guess what i think of your name!!

to all: Thanks, deload next week so i think about what i wanna do for my deadlift but so far …reset on all reps is ahead!!

[/quote]

I will bump the “liquid chalk” suggestion too. My gym is chalk friendly, but I have used the liquid chalk product to see how it works and it is pretty effective. There is no residue to clean up either. Something I will add is I use hook grip when I pull. It takes a little conditioning to get your thumbs used to it. I actually put a little tape around my thumbs to help out. I also am not against using straps when I know I’m going heavy and want to hit some higher reps. If I’m on a 3 or 5 day and I think I may get 8-10 reps with straps on I will do it. It is important for me to not use mixed grip. All that said, my grip is fine. My best pull from the floor 545 (hook grip) but I have hook griped over 600 on rack pulls.

525

[quote]four60 wrote:
Firebug9 wrote:
crankMAN wrote:
m1sf1t wrote:
Sagat wrote:
On the dead stop vs touch and go deadlifts: i cant really do touch and go deads because my grip sucks (now it sucks less because of the DB rows), i can do a few reps and then i need to pause on the floor to adjust the grip. Nobody has this problem?

I’m sorry if this response is incredibly redundant but, are you using chalk? The difference that it makes is ridiculous! I “divorced” the straps a few years ago and I haven’t had any issues since. Like Jim says, even if they don’t allow chalk in your gym, sneak it in! It’s supposedly not allowed at the gold’s I train at, but I usually clean after myself and befriended the cleaning crew, so they don’t mind THAT much at this point I don’t think…

Chalk not allowed in my gymm…

Sagat: I have the same issue on the last set…after a few reps i have to wait maybe 5 secs , so no choice to reset for at least one rep…

Steelersnations: Thanks for your answer…but im a COWBOYS fan…so guess what i think of your name!!

to all: Thanks, deload next week so i think about what i wanna do for my deadlift but so far …reset on all reps is ahead!!

Hey they make a liquid chalk of sorts. Try looking on Titan’s or Inzer’s website. I am not sure who else might carry it. I have tried it and it is ok in a pinch – rather have the real stuff, but when you can’t use it or don’t have any this is a good alternative.

Have you come up with a working plan for your meets.[/quote]

I am at the fire station today, so it is on my plans for the weekend ;-).

526

I have a dumb question. Is it ok if my upper body days are set up a bit diffrent from each other? I have been doing BBB but want to change it up a bit.

Upper Body Day One

Incline Bench 531
BBB flat CG bench
weighted dips
bodyweight chin ups

Upper Body Day Two

Flat Bench 531
BBB military press
kroc row
tri-extension

The accessory lifts are in diffrent order from one day to the next. I am having some shoulder troube from a previous injury so I cut out heavy over head press but still want to do some over head pressing. Lowerbody days are staying the same.

527

[quote]m1sf1t wrote:
Sagat wrote:
On the dead stop vs touch and go deadlifts: i cant really do touch and go deads because my grip sucks (now it sucks less because of the DB rows), i can do a few reps and then i need to pause on the floor to adjust the grip. Nobody has this problem?

I’m sorry if this response is incredibly redundant but, are you using chalk? The difference that it makes is ridiculous! I “divorced” the straps a few years ago and I haven’t had any issues since. Like Jim says, even if they don’t allow chalk in your gym, sneak it in! It’s supposedly not allowed at the gold’s I train at, but I usually clean after myself and befriended the cleaning crew, so they don’t mind THAT much at this point I don’t think…

[/quote]

No, i never used chalk. Maybe i try it since i dont think there is any problem with it in my gym. But my grip is gradually improving since i started high rep DB rows, i hope that soon my grip catches up with my leg/back strength even without chalk.

528

[quote]Sagat wrote:
m1sf1t wrote:
Sagat wrote:
On the dead stop vs touch and go deadlifts: i cant really do touch and go deads because my grip sucks (now it sucks less because of the DB rows), i can do a few reps and then i need to pause on the floor to adjust the grip. Nobody has this problem?

I’m sorry if this response is incredibly redundant but, are you using chalk? The difference that it makes is ridiculous! I “divorced” the straps a few years ago and I haven’t had any issues since. Like Jim says, even if they don’t allow chalk in your gym, sneak it in! It’s supposedly not allowed at the gold’s I train at, but I usually clean after myself and befriended the cleaning crew, so they don’t mind THAT much at this point I don’t think…

No, i never used chalk. Maybe i try it since i dont think there is any problem with it in my gym. But my grip is gradually improving since i started high rep DB rows, i hope that soon my grip catches up with my leg/back strength even without chalk.[/quote]

I don’t think “it will”, in fact, your grip may very well be up to par by now. The problem with not using chalk, is that your hands get sweaty and have skin oils that make the bar slippery, that’s it. I remember I used to get really frustrated because I would get up to a certain weight and I just could not hang on to the bar for more than 1 or 2 reps, I included a bit of grip training and I would STILL not be able to have that much of a grip when doing deads and I thought I was doomed, with a baby girl’s strength in my hands. The moment I FINALLY decided to pay attention to everything I had been reading here, bought a box of chalk and SURPRISE! I haven’t had a grip issue ever since. If you think they will be cool at your gym, go to eliteFTS right NOW and get a box of chalk! Trust me, you will be a happy puller!!

529

ill echo that idea to go to elitefts.com and buy some damn chalk!

in fact, my gym IS NOT cool with it, but i keep one block at a time in a freezer size bag inside my gym bag. time for chalk, my hands go inside the ziplock, inside the gym bag, and come out chalked. i only use it on my last set of deads, and im pretty good about keeping it contained. been doing it this way for 3-4 months, so far so good.

and btw, after chalk entered my life i have not even thought about using straps for deads! my grip doesnt budge, its probably the last thing to give on my sets. ive been pausing for a count of 10 sec at the top of my last rep of last set, grip is still locked tight. chalk rules.

530

[quote]m1sf1t wrote:
Sagat wrote:
m1sf1t wrote:
Sagat wrote:
On the dead stop vs touch and go deadlifts: i cant really do touch and go deads because my grip sucks (now it sucks less because of the DB rows), i can do a few reps and then i need to pause on the floor to adjust the grip. Nobody has this problem?

I’m sorry if this response is incredibly redundant but, are you using chalk? The difference that it makes is ridiculous! I “divorced” the straps a few years ago and I haven’t had any issues since. Like Jim says, even if they don’t allow chalk in your gym, sneak it in! It’s supposedly not allowed at the gold’s I train at, but I usually clean after myself and befriended the cleaning crew, so they don’t mind THAT much at this point I don’t think…

No, i never used chalk. Maybe i try it since i dont think there is any problem with it in my gym. But my grip is gradually improving since i started high rep DB rows, i hope that soon my grip catches up with my leg/back strength even without chalk.

I don’t think “it will”, in fact, your grip may very well be up to par by now. The problem with not using chalk, is that your hands get sweaty and have skin oils that make the bar slippery, that’s it. I remember I used to get really frustrated because I would get up to a certain weight and I just could not hang on to the bar for more than 1 or 2 reps, I included a bit of grip training and I would STILL not be able to have that much of a grip when doing deads and I thought I was doomed, with a baby girl’s strength in my hands. The moment I FINALLY decided to pay attention to everything I had been reading here, bought a box of chalk and SURPRISE! I haven’t had a grip issue ever since. If you think they will be cool at your gym, go to eliteFTS right NOW and get a box of chalk! Trust me, you will be a happy puller!!
[/quote]

It makes sense. Actually i never bothered trying chalk because i didnt thought it made that much difference. This week i’ll look for it and see the difference for myself.
Thanks for the advice.

531

I skimmed the 5/3/1 threads and didn’t see the answer to this question, but I admit I might have missed it.

Anyway, I’m dealing with a fucked up left shoulder. I suspect its is inflammation, but won’t know for sure until I see a sports medicine doctor on Tuesday. In the meantime I’m trying to plan the next phase of my training. Originally I wanted to get back to the 5/3/1. But, in anticipation that the doc might advise taking 4-6 weeks off from benching and shoulder press, I wonder if others have made any temporary substitutes for these exercises. If so, I’d like your thoughts.

Alternatively, I’m thinking this might be a good opportunity for me to man up and try one of the Russian squat routine or Smolov, since I understand that when doing those programs one does the bare minimum for the other lifts. I’d appreciate any thoughts on this approach as well (and sorry for the slight hijack).

Thanks, everyone.

532

[quote]youngoldguy wrote:
I skimmed the 5/3/1 threads and didn’t see the answer to this question, but I admit I might have missed it.

Anyway, I’m dealing with a fucked up left shoulder. I suspect its is inflammation, but won’t know for sure until I see a sports medicine doctor on Tuesday. In the meantime I’m trying to plan the next phase of my training. Originally I wanted to get back to the 5/3/1. But, in anticipation that the doc might advise taking 4-6 weeks off from benching and shoulder press, I wonder if others have made any temporary substitutes for these exercises. If so, I’d like your thoughts.

Alternatively, I’m thinking this might be a good opportunity for me to man up and try one of the Russian squat routine or Smolov, since I understand that when doing those programs one does the bare minimum for the other lifts. I’d appreciate any thoughts on this approach as well (and sorry for the slight hijack).

Thanks, everyone.[/quote]

Depdning on what you did to your shoulder you may end up having problems squatting and deadlifting with a straight bar. Regardless, you can use rows or chins for your upper 5/3/1 exercise and maybe use the other upper body day just for assistance work that doesn’t aggravate your shoulder.

533

[quote]gsherman14 wrote:
youngoldguy wrote:
I skimmed the 5/3/1 threads and didn’t see the answer to this question, but I admit I might have missed it.

Anyway, I’m dealing with a fucked up left shoulder. I suspect its is inflammation, but won’t know for sure until I see a sports medicine doctor on Tuesday. In the meantime I’m trying to plan the next phase of my training. Originally I wanted to get back to the 5/3/1. But, in anticipation that the doc might advise taking 4-6 weeks off from benching and shoulder press, I wonder if others have made any temporary substitutes for these exercises. If so, I’d like your thoughts.

Alternatively, I’m thinking this might be a good opportunity for me to man up and try one of the Russian squat routine or Smolov, since I understand that when doing those programs one does the bare minimum for the other lifts. I’d appreciate any thoughts on this approach as well (and sorry for the slight hijack).

Thanks, everyone.

Depdning on what you did to your shoulder you may end up having problems squatting and deadlifting with a straight bar. Regardless, you can use rows or chins for your upper 5/3/1 exercise and maybe use the other upper body day just for assistance work that doesn’t aggravate your shoulder.[/quote]

Thanks. I can definitely still squat and DL, and can probably also do chins and rows, which is why I’m still entertaining the possibility of continuing with my 5/3/1 plan.

534

[quote]youngoldguy wrote:
gsherman14 wrote:
youngoldguy wrote:
I skimmed the 5/3/1 threads and didn’t see the answer to this question, but I admit I might have missed it.

Anyway, I’m dealing with a fucked up left shoulder. I suspect its is inflammation, but won’t know for sure until I see a sports medicine doctor on Tuesday. In the meantime I’m trying to plan the next phase of my training.

Originally I wanted to get back to the 5/3/1. But, in anticipation that the doc might advise taking 4-6 weeks off from benching and shoulder press, I wonder if others have made any temporary substitutes for these exercises. If so, I’d like your thoughts.

Alternatively, I’m thinking this might be a good opportunity for me to man up and try one of the Russian squat routine or Smolov, since I understand that when doing those programs one does the bare minimum for the other lifts. I’d appreciate any thoughts on this approach as well (and sorry for the slight hijack).

Thanks, everyone.

Depdning on what you did to your shoulder you may end up having problems squatting and deadlifting with a straight bar. Regardless, you can use rows or chins for your upper 5/3/1 exercise and maybe use the other upper body day just for assistance work that doesn’t aggravate your shoulder.

Thanks. I can definitely still squat and DL, and can probably also do chins and rows, which is why I’m still entertaining the possibility of continuing with my 5/3/1 plan.[/quote]

So you can do chins and rows pain free? What about MP?

I was having a ‘bum’ shoulder about 3-4 months ago. Possibly (never went to a doctor) a muscle imbalance from too much front pressing and not enough rear delt exercises. I narrowed my bench grip (movement with most noticeable pain/aggravation), added seated db cleans(Defranco cleans?), db rows, and shrugs.

Doing all of this seemed to have helped as I am now benching pain free. I also go through a decent shoulder warm-up which seems to help.

535

[quote]TheDudeAbides wrote:
youngoldguy wrote:
gsherman14 wrote:
youngoldguy wrote:
I skimmed the 5/3/1 threads and didn’t see the answer to this question, but I admit I might have missed it.

Anyway, I’m dealing with a fucked up left shoulder. I suspect its is inflammation, but won’t know for sure until I see a sports medicine doctor on Tuesday. In the meantime I’m trying to plan the next phase of my training.

Originally I wanted to get back to the 5/3/1. But, in anticipation that the doc might advise taking 4-6 weeks off from benching and shoulder press, I wonder if others have made any temporary substitutes for these exercises. If so, I’d like your thoughts.

Alternatively, I’m thinking this might be a good opportunity for me to man up and try one of the Russian squat routine or Smolov, since I understand that when doing those programs one does the bare minimum for the other lifts. I’d appreciate any thoughts on this approach as well (and sorry for the slight hijack).

Thanks, everyone.

Depdning on what you did to your shoulder you may end up having problems squatting and deadlifting with a straight bar. Regardless, you can use rows or chins for your upper 5/3/1 exercise and maybe use the other upper body day just for assistance work that doesn’t aggravate your shoulder.

Thanks. I can definitely still squat and DL, and can probably also do chins and rows, which is why I’m still entertaining the possibility of continuing with my 5/3/1 plan.

So you can do chins and rows pain free? What about MP?

I was having a ‘bum’ shoulder about 3-4 months ago. Possibly (never went to a doctor) a muscle imbalance from too much front pressing and not enough rear delt exercises. I narrowed my bench grip (movement with most noticeable pain/aggravation), added seated db cleans(Defranco cleans?), db rows, and shrugs.

Doing all of this seemed to have helped as I am now benching pain free. I also go through a decent shoulder warm-up which seems to help.[/quote]

Thanks for the reply. I wonder if we are suffering/have suffered from the same problem? When I bench or do dips, I get an ice-pick-like pain in my left arm, right where the delt inserts into the humerus. But only at lockout. I moved my hands in closer, but I still get the same pain when at 225 or above.

To try and correct this, I’ve tried strengthening my rotators, rhomboids, and other shoulder muscles with YTWLs, cuban presses, external rotations, etc. I’ve always done a lot of rowing, both BB and DB. It still bothers me, so I’m sucking it up and going to the doc.

In any event, I can do DB shoulder presses pain free, but military presses are complicated. I tend to favor the left shoulder, and it can be painful when I get into the heavier weights.

536

Hey, not to change the direction of the thread but what is everybody doing in terms of conditioning with this program?

It seems like many 5/3/1 users are going for fat loss judging by the training logs. I personally am going for muscle gain, so I keep the conditioning to 2-3 days consisting of a mix of sprints and steady state running? I am also looking into building or purchasing a prowler to use on lower body days for conditioning and supplement it with just a couple short steady state sessions on off days.

…just looking to see what people like and get some new ideas.

537

No money for a sled right now and in my neck of the woods, no hills in sight. I run 200m sprints 2 days a week and then 1-3 miles runs 1-2 times a week for time depending on the day if there’s time for more miles. So, at the very least 3 days a week with 4 being the norm.

538

ok – So I have devised a plan for the time between the first two meets. I will evaluate how it went and make any changes for the time frame between meet two and three – hopefully all will go right and I can just adjust the numbers and use the same template ;-).

I will have time to run through two cycles of 5/3/1 without the deload week after the first cycle, giving me a good deload at the end of the second cycle which is the week just before the meet.

So weeks 1-3 will look like this:

Deadlift on Friday
Squat on Monday
Bench on Wednesday

Cardio: Monday, elliptical; Wednesday, treadmill, Friday, pull my sled, Saturday, Bleachers(if I can find them)
As an alternate I do have a sled and will pull it

Sunday – day off, just an easy walk if I feel up to it.

Assistance with heavy weight – 10 sets of 3-5

Training Equipment to be used – loose shirt/suit and knee wraps

Squat 5/3/1

Gm
Wide stance/close stance Front squat
AB’s

Bench 5/3/1
Floor press
Incline Bench
AB’s

Deadlift 5/3/1
Off Blocks
Kroc Rows
AB’s

Weeks 4-6

Cardio – same as above, tapering off the last two weeks. Dropping the machine work first, then bleachers and sled work.

Assistance done with lighter weight than the three previous weeks-- 5 sets of 10.

Going into Competition gear.

Squat 3/2/1

Close/wide stance Back squat
Gm
AB’s

Bench 3/2/1

Floor presses
Decline Bench
AB’s

Deadlift 3/2/1

Kroc Rows
Rack Pulls

Weights will be determined based on my performance at the meet next week.

Any suggestions or comments welcome!

539

[quote]bparis wrote:
Hey, not to change the direction of the thread but what is everybody doing in terms of conditioning with this program?

It seems like many 5/3/1 users are going for fat loss judging by the training logs. I personally am going for muscle gain, so I keep the conditioning to 2-3 days consisting of a mix of sprints and steady state running? I am also looking into building or purchasing a prowler to use on lower body days for conditioning and supplement it with just a couple short steady state sessions on off days.

…just looking to see what people like and get some new ideas. [/quote]

Most of my conditioning is built around strongman events. So I will use yoke walk, farmer’s, keg carry, etc. I also do some truck pushing and sled dragging. I will sometimes sneak in some 20 min sessions at lunchtime with some interval work on cardio machines or rope jumping. I also do some longer walks 2-3 days a week for recovery.

540

I just finished my 2nd week of 5/3/1 today, so the 3/3/3 week. All has been going well until today. Last time I got 15x330 for deadlifts which I was very happy with, today I only got 5x347.5! The rest of the workout was “OK” but that part was really bad…

I’m hoping it’s just from switching to the Anabolic Diet yesterday and the short hike I did but I really don’t know.