Wendler 5/3/1 Program - pt 2.

Training Powerlifting
321

Jim,

I just completed my first wave of 5/3/1 and need to say it’s a great program; something I’m really excited about. I’m going to be giving this a good honest go for a while and see what happens. Not to mention the book is my new favorite literature of choice to read and re-read while sittting on the porcelain throne.

Anyways, when I got to the deload week, I wasn’t sure if I was supposed to reduce the volume of my assistance exercises (I did BBB 5x10 for all assistance)? What’s a man supposed to do?

Thanks once again

322

I just got the book and read it. I plan on starting up the 5/3/1 in a couple days. I have a question though, I think anybody that has started this program can answer it.

When it says add 10 (or 5 in the case of upper body) pounds at the end of each cycle to your 1RM, does it mean your true 1 RM or the one you started the program with (1 RM - 10%). So if your true 1 RM was 200, your 90 % would be 180. Do you add the 10 pounds to the 200 and re-figure your 90% every cycle or do you just add 10 pounds to 180? Hopefully this wasn’t too confusing.

EDIT: I guess it doesn’t matter too much, I just typed a bunch of numbers into a calculator, whichever way I do it it comes out pretty much the same. Sorry about that.

323

[quote]ole7 wrote:
Jim,

I just completed my first wave of 5/3/1 and need to say it’s a great program; something I’m really excited about. I’m going to be giving this a good honest go for a while and see what happens. Not to mention the book is my new favorite literature of choice to read and re-read while sittting on the porcelain throne.

Anyways, when I got to the deload week, I wasn’t sure if I was supposed to reduce the volume of my assistance exercises (I did BBB 5x10 for all assistance)? What’s a man supposed to do?

Thanks once again[/quote]

When you take your next dump, you need to re-read the FAQ. Your question about assistance exercises during deload week is answered there. :wink:

324

Jim,

Just bought the ebook this morning. I had a pretty good handle on the program already from reading about it online, but the ebook “filled in all the cracks.” It’s a great product, and thanks for taking the time to answer all of our idiotic questions about it.

Hopefully all of the guys asking you to give them free info on here have shelled out the measly 20 bones for it. We’ll know who didn’t by the questions they ask.

My question (sorry if this was covered in the ebook or in the other thread, I must have missed it): when are you going to step out from under the shadow of Tate and start The Wendler Academy of Metal, Tattoos, and Strength?

As we all know, the world can never have enough Wendler.

325

[quote]bABoon wrote:
Jim, I have the program, & I know you said to do conditioning (Prowler, hills) 3-4 days per week to keep in the Northern hemisphere of Vag. I was just wondering if doing stadium stairs on Monday and Thursday after the SQ and DL, and ladders on Tuesday and Friday after the BP and MP, with a couple of 2 mile recovery runs on Wednesday and Saturday is too much. I was making progress on everything for 4 cycles, but on this latest cycle I have hit weights 5 lb. heavier than the previous cycle, but for 3-4 fewer reps.

Stadium Stairs:
4 sets of 9 flights (45 bleachers in a flight at Wallace Wade Stadium)

Ladders:
8 sets:
20 down & back (rest period is walking back to end line)
40 down & back
60 down & back
(90 sec. b/n sets)[/quote]

Here is where things get tricky. Your training, from my perspective, is geared towards increasing your conditioning level. This is not bad but because of the extra conditoning work, your progress in the weight room is not going to be 100%. You are going to have to realize that.

BUT…

that doesn’t mean you can’t make progress. It’s just going to be slower. My advice is to do 3-4 cycles, then back off (start at the 2nd cycle) and go forward 3-4 cycles…and then back off again…etc.

326

[quote]Steel Nation wrote:
Jim,

Just bought the ebook this morning. I had a pretty good handle on the program already from reading about it online, but the ebook “filled in all the cracks.” It’s a great product, and thanks for taking the time to answer all of our idiotic questions about it.

Hopefully all of the guys asking you to give them free info on here have shelled out the measly 20 bones for it. We’ll know who didn’t by the questions they ask.

My question (sorry if this was covered in the ebook or in the other thread, I must have missed it): when are you going to step out from under the shadow of Tate and start The Wendler Academy of Metal, Tattoos, and Strength?

As we all know, the world can never have enough Wendler.[/quote]

First of all, I owe everything to Dave. I am 100% EFS and will always be. I will always bust his balls but he knows where my heart lies.

I would like to host a training weekend here sometime - meet up for lifting, hills, tattoos and a show. Not sure what the interest would be but it would be great.

This would not be a pussy filled weekend - you don’t come out of shape or in need of “technique” work or whatever. I hate that stuff. Lift, run, and jam. And have a few cocktails.

327

[quote]fisch wrote:
I just got the book and read it. I plan on starting up the 5/3/1 in a couple days. I have a question though, I think anybody that has started this program can answer it.

When it says add 10 (or 5 in the case of upper body) pounds at the end of each cycle to your 1RM, does it mean your true 1 RM or the one you started the program with (1 RM - 10%). So if your true 1 RM was 200, your 90 % would be 180. Do you add the 10 pounds to the 200 and re-figure your 90% every cycle or do you just add 10 pounds to 180? Hopefully this wasn’t too confusing.

EDIT: I guess it doesn’t matter too much, I just typed a bunch of numbers into a calculator, whichever way I do it it comes out pretty much the same. Sorry about that.[/quote]

You add it to the “working max” or the 180 lbs. After you have figured that 90% max, just consider that your “max”. Keep in mind also that the max you figure 90% of should be current, and really a training max. Don’t be tempted to use your “best lift ever” that happened 3 months ago. If you have any doubts, err on the light side. The first couple wave should be fairly easy, but that’s okay. By the time you hit 4 and 5 be ready to hit some big rep PR’s. Good luck, you have the opportunity to make some great gains.

328

[quote]Jim Wendler wrote:

I would like to host a training weekend here sometime - meet up for lifting, hills, tattoos and a show. Not sure what the interest would be but it would be great.

This would not be a pussy filled weekend - you don’t come out of shape or in need of “technique” work or whatever. I hate that stuff. Lift, run, and jam. And have a few cocktails.
[/quote]

Dood, i would so come to that if I was in shape, didn’t need technique work, and if my wife would let me!
old lardass

329

[quote]Jim Wendler wrote:
I would like to host a training weekend here sometime - meet up for lifting, hills, tattoos and a show. Not sure what the interest would be but it would be great.

This would not be a pussy filled weekend - you don’t come out of shape or in need of “technique” work or whatever. I hate that stuff. Lift, run, and jam. And have a few cocktails.
[/quote]

That sounds like a great idea. Too bad Slayer (and the rest of Mayhem) isn’t coming to Columbus, that would be a great show to see after pounding some iron and a few beers.

330

[quote]Jim Wendler wrote:
Steel Nation wrote:
Jim,

Just bought the ebook this morning. I had a pretty good handle on the program already from reading about it online, but the ebook “filled in all the cracks.” It’s a great product, and thanks for taking the time to answer all of our idiotic questions about it.

Hopefully all of the guys asking you to give them free info on here have shelled out the measly 20 bones for it. We’ll know who didn’t by the questions they ask.

My question (sorry if this was covered in the ebook or in the other thread, I must have missed it): when are you going to step out from under the shadow of Tate and start The Wendler Academy of Metal, Tattoos, and Strength?

As we all know, the world can never have enough Wendler.

First of all, I owe everything to Dave. I am 100% EFS and will always be. I will always bust his balls but he knows where my heart lies.

I would like to host a training weekend here sometime - meet up for lifting, hills, tattoos and a show. Not sure what the interest would be but it would be great.

This would not be a pussy filled weekend - you don’t come out of shape or in need of “technique” work or whatever. I hate that stuff. Lift, run, and jam. And have a few cocktails.
[/quote]

I’d be down for that. Let’s get 3 Inches of Blood booked.

331

[quote]Jim Wendler wrote:
bABoon wrote:
Jim, I have the program, & I know you said to do conditioning (Prowler, hills) 3-4 days per week to keep in the Northern hemisphere of Vag. I was just wondering if doing stadium stairs on Monday and Thursday after the SQ and DL, and ladders on Tuesday and Friday after the BP and MP, with a couple of 2 mile recovery runs on Wednesday and Saturday is too much. I was making progress on everything for 4 cycles, but on this latest cycle I have hit weights 5 lb. heavier than the previous cycle, but for 3-4 fewer reps.

Stadium Stairs:
4 sets of 9 flights (45 bleachers in a flight at Wallace Wade Stadium)

Ladders:
8 sets:
20 down & back (rest period is walking back to end line)
40 down & back
60 down & back
(90 sec. b/n sets)

Here is where things get tricky. Your training, from my perspective, is geared towards increasing your conditioning level. This is not bad but because of the extra conditoning work, your progress in the weight room is not going to be 100%. You are going to have to realize that.

BUT…

that doesn’t mean you can’t make progress. It’s just going to be slower. My advice is to do 3-4 cycles, then back off (start at the 2nd cycle) and go forward 3-4 cycles…and then back off again…etc.
[/quote]

Thanks a lot! By the way, I was serious about the Nobel Prize(s), and just told an old prof of mine to nominate you.

332

[quote]Jim Wendler wrote:

This would not be a pussy filled weekend
[/quote]

Why’s that?

333

[quote]Jim Wendler wrote:
Steel Nation wrote:
Jim,

Just bought the ebook this morning. I had a pretty good handle on the program already from reading about it online, but the ebook “filled in all the cracks.” It’s a great product, and thanks for taking the time to answer all of our idiotic questions about it.

Hopefully all of the guys asking you to give them free info on here have shelled out the measly 20 bones for it. We’ll know who didn’t by the questions they ask.

My question (sorry if this was covered in the ebook or in the other thread, I must have missed it): when are you going to step out from under the shadow of Tate and start The Wendler Academy of Metal, Tattoos, and Strength?

As we all know, the world can never have enough Wendler.

First of all, I owe everything to Dave. I am 100% EFS and will always be. I will always bust his balls but he knows where my heart lies.

I would like to host a training weekend here sometime - meet up for lifting, hills, tattoos and a show. Not sure what the interest would be but it would be great.

This would not be a pussy filled weekend - you don’t come out of shape or in need of “technique” work or whatever. I hate that stuff. Lift, run, and jam. And have a few cocktails.
[/quote]

Dudes, this (and the first one) is one of the best threads on this website! Maybe the T-Nation chiefs will give [you Jim] and us our own 5/3/1 forum! BTW, I live in Cali, but I wouldn’t mind making a group trek over there for some lifting, running, jamming and a bunch of cocktails!

334

A bit of a progress report as I’m on my fourth cycle now as i’ve been running the 5/3/1 for 3 full months

Squat 286 X 9 to 330 X 9
BP 250 X 7 to 270 X 8
Deadlift 402 X 7 to 407 X 11
MP 137.5 X 9 to 160 X 7

I just wanna say my work capacity was fucking embarrassing when I started the program and it has made steady progress as my previous maxes were alot higher than the rep calculation in the book some by as much as 30kgs so hopefully with an increase in my work load my maxes will also increase equally. I know the numbers are nothing to be shouting about but 3 months ago I was as sceptical as somebody who is reading this and just starting 5/3/1 for themselves. So do exactly as Big Jim writes and you will see results. Jims the man and as we say around this part of the world keep her lit!

335

Last cycle I did I used a 145kg training 1rm. It’s way short of my real 1rm as I hit 12 reps on the 95% day, but I was happy with the progress I was making and was going to stick to it.

Then I realised that I’ve not moved north of vag and need to start doing some running or something, especially if I intend to play any rugby this year.

Need to drop the lifting back to a maintenance level for one maybe two cycles to allow me to focus on running/cycling/heavybag, clean up the diet and drop a bit of unnecessary gut.

Would you:
a) Increase the 1rm as normal (so to 150kg) and limit yourself to the prescribed reps.
b) As a) but allow yourself a few extra reps on the final set but keep plenty back
c) Put up the 1rm to something nearer to probable 1rm (maybe 160-170kg) and hit prescribed reps only
d) Some other possibility.

(With option c I am more than confident I could get 95% of a 170kg training 1rm. Just not sure that this is the wisest option)

336

[quote]Iain wrote:
Last cycle I did I used a 145kg training 1rm. It’s way short of my real 1rm as I hit 12 reps on the 95% day, but I was happy with the progress I was making and was going to stick to it.

Then I realised that I’ve not moved north of vag and need to start doing some running or something, especially if I intend to play any rugby this year.

Need to drop the lifting back to a maintenance level for one maybe two cycles to allow me to focus on running/cycling/heavybag, clean up the diet and drop a bit of unnecessary gut.

Would you:
a) Increase the 1rm as normal (so to 150kg) and limit yourself to the prescribed reps.
b) As a) but allow yourself a few extra reps on the final set but keep plenty back
c) Put up the 1rm to something nearer to probable 1rm (maybe 160-170kg) and hit prescribed reps only
d) Some other possibility.

(With option c I am more than confident I could get 95% of a 170kg training 1rm. Just not sure that this is the wisest option)[/quote]

Option a) as long as “prescribed reps” means you are going to do the extra reps on third set and not hold back. You mention dropping lifting back to focus on running/cycling/heavybag. You would effectively be doing this for several cycles anyway if you truly underestimated your 1RM.

337

Jscool, I think you missed his point. If he meant doing as many reps as possible on the last set, then he wouldn’t be doing anything differently.

Lain- another option you have that would be truer to maintenance would be to just keep the weights the same and keep following the program until your conditioning gets better, then start pushing the weights up again.

I have been doing this with my bench press the last three cycles. Kept weights the same, as I moved my grip narrower and narrower. Now I’ve got it where I want it, and I will let the reps I get on 5/3/1 day decide whether I add the 5lbs for the next cycle or keep them where they are one more time.

338

[quote]dez6485 wrote:
Jscool, I think you missed his point. If he meant doing as many reps as possible on the last set, then he wouldn’t be doing anything differently.

Lain- another option you have that would be truer to maintenance would be to just keep the weights the same and keep following the program until your conditioning gets better, then start pushing the weights up again.

I have been doing this with my bench press the last three cycles. Kept weights the same, as I moved my grip narrower and narrower. Now I’ve got it where I want it, and I will let the reps I get on 5/3/1 day decide whether I add the 5lbs for the next cycle or keep them where they are one more time.
[/quote]

I never thought of the options you mentioned. I have added cardio (running) into my training 3x a week now. The change I made was I gave up BBB template as accesory and instead use body weight work, plus whatever I feel needs some extra work. It is essentially a little modification to Jim’s bodyweight template in the ebook.

I have to change my lifting to nights soon, so I might just do my running right after working out. When I run fasted, I cant run nearly as well, and when I run at night, it interferes with my morning training. Any advice on this?

339

[quote]crankMAN wrote:
hey guys…been some talk about spreadsheet of iphone apps…ok this is from another board…ironaddict and the author( madhatter) did hells of a job…a fantastic spreadsheet…

check the link:

http://www.apexlogik.net/IronAddict/Hatters%20531%20(v1.2).xls [/quote]

I am kind of a spreadsheet nerd as well. I have one someone can host/post. Just PM me your email addr.

340

[quote]dez6485 wrote:
Jscool, I think you missed his point. If he meant doing as many reps as possible on the last set, then he wouldn’t be doing anything differently.

Lain- another option you have that would be truer to maintenance would be to just keep the weights the same and keep following the program until your conditioning gets better, then start pushing the weights up again.

I have been doing this with my bench press the last three cycles. Kept weights the same, as I moved my grip narrower and narrower. Now I’ve got it where I want it, and I will let the reps I get on 5/3/1 day decide whether I add the 5lbs for the next cycle or keep them where they are one more time.
[/quote]

Great advice. I’ve done this as well and still made rep gains without the added pressure of trying to lift heavy and improve your conditioning. Jim suggested this to someone waaay back in the EliteFTS Q & A, but I don’t remember it being in either of the books.