Weight Gain Slump

Training Bodybuilding
21

[quote]Synth1 wrote:
1 of the diet plans that i was given was to only eat 3300 calories per day and this was from a licensed kinesiologist(sp?). I noticed that wasn’t working and decided to eat more (4000 calories) and still no gains. I’ve been working out for over a year and prior to these few weeks my diet has been POOR! Yesterday, most of my comments were rushed and weren’t as specific as I would have liked them to be. My diet throughout my training has been poor. I’d go on and off with eating a lot of calories but never the right amount of protein or carb intake. However, my workout routines have been fine.

An interesting article that I read “Training for Newbies, Part 1” mentioned rep-ranges and how many reps were needed for what type of gains I was looking for. It seemed pretty accurate relative to what I was trying to accomplish. the 6 - 8 rep range apparently is supposed to be strength and size gians and of equal progression. 9-12 would be size and strength (but more size then strength) and 13-15 would be seize gains with a little muscular endurance gains. This couldn’t be more correct as far as I’m concerned. I would always do 3 set of 6 - 10 reps and gaining quite a bit of strength with slight size gains (until the strength gains stopped and then i’d be pretty much at a plateau as far as both size and strength).

I will boost my calorie intake to 4000 - 4500 (which btw because the licensed kinesiologist(sp?)told me 3300 calories a day, i’ve eaten within 3300 and 4000 a day)and move my rep range up to 12 - 15.

Ty for all the help so far. It’s much appreciated.[/quote]

stop telling us how good your diet is and post it already so people who know what they are talking about can evaluate it !

22

Read this thread and follow the program: http://www.T-Nation.com/tmagnum/readTopic.do?id=1222456

23

As far as what I eat…

Breakfast: oatmeal, a banana, raisins, cereal, protein shake.

after workout meal: protein shake and egg sandwaches (whole weat bread), smoked salmon and tomatoes or Subway steak and cheese or tuna.

A lot of yogurt and fruit throughout the day, fish, pita bread, eggs, meat, chicken, vegitables, Chinese noodles, pasta with Alfredo sauce, Subway, salads, protein shakes, whole wheat bread, that’s pretty much it. As far as specific meals, It varies.

24

[quote]JBMan wrote:
Read this thread and follow the program: http://www.T-Nation.com/tmagnum/readTopic.do?id=1222456
[/quote]

Almost similar to a workout I did before. Wasn’t really beneficial.

Workout ethic is the key to building mass, not what order or certain exercises but reps and the ability to be creative in your workouts. Or from what i’m reading at least. Pure strength has done nothing for me in the past besides during my first gains.

25

…Eat more? If you aren’t gaining any weight eat more. Very simple, it doesn’t matter if a Isaac Newton and Albert Einstein came from the grave to tell you that 3000 calories is enough for you. If you aren’t gaining any weight you aren’t eating enough. If you start eating more you will gain fat (and if you train at all… muscle). Then you just find a # of calories where the fat gain is minimal and the muscle gain is at its highest. Why is this not common sense?

26

Ok then, please post the following:

Bench Numbers
BB Pressing Numbers
Squat Numbers
Deadlift Number

We can then determine if you have actually placed enough emphasis on strength, which for tall guys like you and I = MASS

Of course I am probably falling on deaf ears here.

27

Damn dude, you really are a hardgainer. You obviously have tried everything and nothing works and nothing anybody says will help you. You should just quit.

28

[quote]Phatshady912 wrote:
…Eat more? If you aren’t gaining any weight eat more. Very simple, it doesn’t matter if a Isaac Newton and Albert Einstein came from the grave to tell you that 3000 calories is enough for you. If you aren’t gaining any weight you aren’t eating enough. If you start eating more you will gain fat (and if you train at all… muscle). Then you just find a # of calories where the fat gain is minimal and the muscle gain is at its highest. Why is this not common sense?[/quote]

It is common sense, which is why I have been eating more then what the kinesiologist(sp?)told me.

It’s funny how i feel like i’m repeating myself here.

29

[quote]JBMan wrote:
Ok then, please post the following:

Bench Numbers
BB Pressing Numbers
Squat Numbers
Deadlift Number

We can then determine if you have actually placed enough emphasis on strength, which for tall guys like you and I = MASS

Of course I am probably falling on deaf ears here. [/quote]

No need. For the majority of my time working out I have emphasized on strength. I have gained size, but not as much as “I should have”.

deadlift number: about 215pounds (but the form sucks)
with good form…about 175.

I don’t use the bench press anymore. It hasn’t worked well for me in the past, so I mainly stick with free weights and hammer strength. Hammer strength: 180 for about 8 (with a spot = 2 sets) and then 1 set of 160 (8 - 9 reps with a spot). Of course when doing what the kinesiologist told me I was doing 4 sets of 8 reps with 140 pounds. With free weights I have been doing 65 each side, or 50 depending on whether I was limiting my sets or increasing. 105 squats.

you say tall guys like us, 5feet 11 inches imo doesn’t define “tall” but i guess each his own. I have given my diet, and now my tally for strength exercises. I don;t know what BB Pressing numbers means.

I just got back from the gym and worked on back. I incorporated deadlifts for the first time in a while and then did 3 different exercises doing 3 - 4 sets of 13 reps. I felt like passing out during the workout so I know I pushed myself to the max. I hope with these rep ranges (12 - 15) i can build some size.

30

[quote]Synth1 wrote:
Phatshady912 wrote:
…Eat more? If you aren’t gaining any weight eat more. Very simple, it doesn’t matter if a Isaac Newton and Albert Einstein came from the grave to tell you that 3000 calories is enough for you. If you aren’t gaining any weight you aren’t eating enough. If you start eating more you will gain fat (and if you train at all… muscle). Then you just find a # of calories where the fat gain is minimal and the muscle gain is at its highest. Why is this not common sense?

It is common sense, which is why I have been eating more then what the kinesiologist(sp?)told me.

It’s funny how i feel like i’m repeating myself here.

[/quote]

I’ll throw something new in the mix. Your diet, looks stellar, better then mine. Have you tried low rep max effort yet? You can gain significant size from it if you have never done it before. Try doing the big 4 lifts squat, deadlift, bench press (if it doesn’t work your form sucks), weighted pullups. Do 15 reps of each broken into sets that are no more then 4 reps(because you can’t do more). Pick one other flavor of the day exercise of your choice (crunches, bar curl, hammer curls, incline press ect). Do these 4 lifts at high weight low reps every other day for 2 weeks. Eat higher density foods pre-workout try half a pound of pasta 30 minutes before you work out, if your metabolism is as intense as you say that should be nothing. Take your zinc and your magnesium, it can be Biotest brand ZMA or meijer brand, just get them in you they are critically important to strength and mass gains.

Read these links.
Bench press
http://www.T-Nation.com/readArticle.do?id=459844
Squats
http://www.T-Nation.com/readArticle.do?id=459389
Deadlift
http://www.T-Nation.com/readArticle.do?id=1588392

Final notes:
1)Give up your machines they suck and they are holding you back.
2)Drink milk, its tasty full of nutrients and calories.

31

Everyone here has already given you the answers you were seeking.

The problem isn’t solely your training, although obviously that is seriously screwed up.

Your key problem is that you aren’t eating enough calories. You can SAY you are, but if you aren’t gaining scale weight, no, you just aren’t. Don’t make excuses for it, just accept that you haven’t put the time in at the dinner table.

And as far as your training goes, come on man. 105lb squats… 215lb deadlifts…

I would expect more than that from an UNTRAINED PERSON at your height and weight. You have serious flaws in both your diet and training, and you need to just go back to the basics.

32

TY! Hunterkiller.

I’m going to try what i’m doing for the time being and see if it will help. I have been reading and i also using more free weights.

33

I have been going back to the basics starting today. I figured if you guys say deadlifts and squats will work then I shall incorporate them into my workout.

Does my workout have flaws? Most definitely. Do I know what they are? Hell no!

How many exercises should I do for biceps? triceps? should I stick with free weights and barbells if I want to gain size? Should I incorporate some strength exercises into the mix? If so, do I do the strength before or after my size gaining sets? If I do incorporate strength sets to my workout then how many should I do and how many reps? Do I do 4 back exercises or 5, 6, etc? How many for chest.

These are the questions that I need answerd more then anything and I figured, since you people SHOULD be able to tell me it would save me much time rather then searching an entire website to find this information.

It’s great that people have offered advice and have told me that deadlifts, pull-ups, chin-ups, squats are key workouts, but it’s the other stuff like biceps, triceps, back (in general, chest (in general, shoulders (in general) that has been causing me confusion and trouble for most of my time working out.

I don’t want to come across as being some young punk who doesn’t want to listen to advice. I’m a very patient person, but when you took advice in the past and it never worked, tried yourself to make things work and still failed you start to question whether anything will.

Again, ty for the help. It’s much appreciated.

34

people keep saying the same thing because you keep focusing and overcomplicating the things that dont matter as much…and thats what they’re trying to tell you and you keep seemingly not get

-you dont squat consistantly, you dont deadlift consistantly, you dont seem to do heavy back (ie bent over rows) consistantly…rather than figure out how many sets of bis verses how many sets of tris to do, DO THE HEAVY STUFF 2 times per week, even just a few sets of each, each day, like a legs/arms tues friday, and a shoulder/back/chest mon thursday…

for now, just do 1 major exercise for each body part, ie, (lower/arm day, squats, deadlifts, calves, maybe a leg press, and 1 bicep curl and tricep extention (doesnt matter what you do), and some abs back)

start w/ 12 (70% of max) reps if you want to stay in that bracket X 3 sets, after say 3 weeks of that, rest up, do very little in the gym, just enough to keep the form up, and then go at 10 reps, at about 5% heavier (75%) (of your new estimated max, not the one you started with)
same thing, next month, 8 reps, then 6, and never miss a workout, and make a conscious effort to do everything right

i followed a Very similar program last winter, and it was boring, i didnt enjoy it, most of the time i wasnt able to complete all my sets (aka failure) until the 3rd week before i rested…but i grew and got stronger faster than i had all the time trying to figure out all the fancy stuff, and i strongly encourage you to dos omethign similiar, feel free to ask more questions if your ready to face the hard stuff and put a good effort in the stuff you dont want to do

35

I have a hard time understanding why you would do something just because people told you. For me, I search for the real reason why I should do something.

Why squat or deadlift?

Because they are movements allowing you to move heavy loads, involving the whole body, that emphasizes muscles with significant potential for growth, and will release muscle building hormones helping you gain mass all over your body.

Clearly your diet isn’t up to par. Berardi has some good nutrition info for this.

As for your training, again you need to educate yourself. Don’t “take advice” from random people on forums. Find sources that you perceive to be reputable.

For example, Mike Robertson is highly certified, very well read, well connected to the training community, and is experienced. When I want to know more about structural balance, I search through his articles.

As for training, I read everyone from Dave Tate, Christian Thibadeau, Chad Waterbury, Louie Simmons…etc.

My advice to you: Educate yourself more and train more. Many of the questions you have will be answered through experience by finding what works for you.

And if nothing else works, Go back to the basics. Just the main lifts, with basic whole foods diet. etc.

Good luck.

36

[quote]start w/ 12 (70% of max) reps if you want to stay in that bracket X 3 sets, after say 3 weeks of that, rest up, do very little in the gym, just enough to keep the form up, and then go at 10 reps, at about 5% heavier (75%) (of your new estimated max, not the one you started with)
same thing, next month, 8 reps, then 6, and never miss a workout, and make a conscious effort to do everything right[/quote]

Can I incorporate this routine with my regular exercises? Or do I have to follow this 1 major exercise per body part? For example, if I were to work back (which is what I worked today) start off with deadlifts 8 reps sets of 3, and then reps of 12 - 13 for the rest of my exercises (bent over rows, seated high rows, and bent over rows free weight)?

Working out today that was my routine and I felt really pumped and really tired (still do). Would this be a good routine to follow? Imo, it’s easier for me to follow.

37

As far as your training goes…

You should be picking 1 or 2 basic bodybuilding exercises (2 would typically be for legs and/or back… definitely not a small muscle group like biceps) for each muscle group, and training to increase your STRENGTH in those exercises.

Muscle doesn’t come from just going through the motions. Just because you’re doing certain exercises, with a certain amount of reps, or some percentage of your 1RM, none of this stuff means you’re going to gain muscle.

You make your muscle groups larger by forcing them to become stronger, and overeating EVERY DAY FOR MONTHS TO YEARS

You’re clearly a beginner, so I would recommend you search around this site for some basic exercises for each muscle group and pick a handful of quality ones, then make sure you learn proper form… I only say this because judging from your squat and deadlift numbers, you probably aren’t doing these exercises with good technique.

However your number one concern right now should be getting your diet together. What you have stated so far makes me think you’re eating like a DIETING person would. Just because it’s “super healthy” doesn’t mean it is meeting the calorie and protein requirements for any weight to be gained, much less muscle built.

38

GREAT post. Everything you need to know is there really. Just pick a handful of the biggest and best exercises, then get really, really strong in them over a period of YEARS whilst also making sure you eat for size.

39

I think I’m going to shed a tear, there is more than one person on this very thread giving good realisitc advice. I’m so proud.

40

Unfortunately, Scott, it didn’t look like the OP even bothered to read your post, even though it was obviously the most insightful in the thread.

Otherwise I wouldn’t have bothered to basically just restate the obvious here…

But yes more than anything the OP needs a REALITY CHECK.