[quote]doogie wrote:
I don’t personally know anybody who’s ever been convicted of any kind of drug crime, who’s ever been convicted of contributing to the delenquency of minors, or been accused of statutory rape. I don’t hang out with saints by any means, but I don’t hang with scuz either.
Did anyone come to Ryan Leaf’s defense back in the day on T-mag?[/quote]
Your friends are more boring than missionary sex with someone you know.
[quote]orion wrote:
I like this guy.
All he does is behaving like a normal young male that is a bit on the wild side, and when his girly coaches or university administrators can?t deal with it, he just makes his next move. [/quote]
Read the 48 Laws of Power sometime.
You’d think he could come up with a better fake name than that…
You’re a football star, the big man on campus, and all the coeds want some action.
What do you do?
I don’t know about the rest of you, but I definitely wouldn’t serve alcohol to fifteen year old girls. Even with that, you’d think the already set in life younger brother of a ridiculously wealthy athlete would choose to avoid sexual situations with girls who by age were probably freshmen in high school.
Speaking of the Vick family, I spoke with a VT drug enforcement agent during a seminar on collegiate drug use. The man stated that Ron Mexico had been involved in a very serious drug case, and that a pay-off was made and somebody else took the fall. I’ve never heard anything of this beforehand or ever again. Anybody else know anything that leads this out of bullshit hearsay?
I hope Vick ends up at another 1AAA school rather than the pro’s. He needs to mature, obviously. Maurice Clarette comes to mind when I think about guys going pro too early, and failing miserably.
How come we expect atheletes to perform well in a violent game and then to be close to perfect off the field. Not fair.
[quote]magyar wrote:
How come we expect atheletes to perform well in a violent game and then to be close to perfect off the field. Not fair.
[/quote]
Good point. I do feel, on some small level, that there is a sense of “ownership” that is applied to athletes as if they get paid to act only as we want them to even in their personal lives. Do you really expect a super rich 21 year old to act the same as someone with much more life experience? Shaquille O’Neal seems like a very down to earth guy. I wonder how long it took him to adjust or if his upbringing alone was strong enough to keep him grounded.
[quote]Professor X wrote:
magyar wrote:
How come we expect atheletes to perform well in a violent game and then to be close to perfect off the field. Not fair.
Good point. I do feel, on some small level, that there is a sense of “ownership” that is applied to athletes as if they get paid to act only as we want them to even in their personal lives. Do you really expect a super rich 21 year old to act the same as someone with much more life experience? Shaquille O’Neal seems like a very down to earth guy. I wonder how long it took him to adjust or if his upbringing alone was strong enough to keep him grounded.[/quote]
Don’t we expect them to follow the same rules everyone else in society has to follow, no matter how much money or fame they have?
magyar wrote:
How come we expect atheletes to perform well in a violent game and then to be close to perfect off the field. Not fair.
The point is not whether he’s a professional athlete - or a lawyer or a doctor or a whatever - the law and other standards of behavior should be applied equally to everybody.
Nobody (at least on this thread) has suggested that he be held to a higher standard (although that arguement can certainly be made in terms of the salary he expects to earn, ie whoever is paying him can expect that be behaves in a manner that doesn;t discredit the team and cost the team money by upsetting fans).
The big problem is that too often “we” allow star athletes to get away with behavior that would not be tolerated in others, thus “teaching” the star athlete (and kids who model their bahavior after the star) that he can get away with bad, or even criminal, behavior because people (coaches, athletic directors, university presidents, athletic boosters, fans) are more afraid of losing their star (and hence games) than they are of losing their character.
Do I expect an athlete to perform well in his sport and then be perfect off the field? You’ve created a rhetorically false arguement. First, I would hope - and expect - that anyone (athlete, car mechanic, doctor, police, etc.) would perform well - or at least make their best effort to perform well - no matter what their job.
Second, society expects (and demands - that’s what laws are for) that “off the field” (ie outside of out jobs - and even in our jobs), we all adhere to certain standards of conduct. Even on the field, athletes are held to a certain standard of conduct called rules. After seeing the replay of the Gator Bowl incident (ie the intentional stomping on the other player’s leg), it is obvious that Marcus Vick holds himself above both society’s laws and football’s rules.
[quote]doogie wrote:
Don’t we expect them to follow the same rules everyone else in society has to follow, no matter how much money or fame they have?
[/quote]
Has there ever been a society in history that applied the rules equally regardless of wealth and fame? Athletes follow the same rules that other multi-millionaires follow.
[quote]cap’nsalty wrote:
orion wrote:
I like this guy.
All he does is behaving like a normal young male that is a bit on the wild side, and when his girly coaches or university administrators can?t deal with it, he just makes his next move.
Read the 48 Laws of Power sometime. [/quote]
http://www2.tech.purdue.edu/cgt/courses/cgt411/covey/48_laws_of_power.htm
Jesus, parts of this are so uncomfortable to read, there must be something to it…
[quote]orion wrote:
I like this guy.
All he does is behaving like a normal young male that is a bit on the wild side, and when his girly coaches or university administrators can?t deal with it, he just makes his next move. [/quote]
As long as it isn’t your 15 yr old daughter he banged at a party. You would think a famous athlete wouldn’t have to get middle school students drunk to get laid.
[quote]brand wrote:
orion wrote:
I like this guy.
All he does is behaving like a normal young male that is a bit on the wild side, and when his girly coaches or university administrators can?t deal with it, he just makes his next move.
As long as it isn’t your 15 yr old daughter he banged at a party. You would think a famous athlete wouldn’t have to get middle school students drunk to get laid. [/quote]
He does not get points for that, yes…
However, 15 year old girls get drunk and banged at partys and as long as its consentual there are worse things than that.
Don?t get the impression that I admire characters like that. I do admire strenght, virility, the ability to make bold moves when necessary…
What I do not appreciate however is the apparent lack of style, grace, strategic thinking and, how shall I put it, class…
IF he aquires those attributes before he hits 30 he has a great future, if not, hello Mc Donald…
I don?t care either way, he only gets points in my book for being a man and not being inclined to apologize for it.
Not a great man. Not even a good man. Just someone whose testicles appear to be in working condition.
[quote]El_Animal wrote:
You’d think he could come up with a better fake name than that…[/quote]
When the news broke Mexico became the hottest selling name on the back of the custom jerseys. The NFL quickly banned it.
didn’t his big bro get him a driver for when his licence got suspended?
[quote]orion wrote:
I like this guy.
All he does is behaving like a normal young male that is a bit on the wild side, and when his girly coaches or university administrators can?t deal with it, he just makes his next move. [/quote]
There’s more to it than that. He has not been anywhere near a model student athlete since stepping on campus. He had the pot possession charge, he basically flunked out of his classes, numerous on-field (or sideline) antics and a general disregard for team rules.
DB
The Marcus Vick thing kills me. His stomping on some guys leg was minor.
I have done the same thing and had the same thing done countless times playing rugby.
Vick was a bad citizen constantly getting in trouble. That is why they tossed him.
All the idiot sportscaster act like it was the leg stomping thing. It was just one more straw. But it was the one that broke the camels back.
[quote]magyar wrote:
I hope Vick ends up at another 1AAA school rather than the pro’s. He needs to mature, obviously. Maurice Clarette comes to mind when I think about guys going pro too early, and failing miserably.
How come we expect atheletes to perform well in a violent game and then to be close to perfect off the field. Not fair.
[/quote]
That’s a major fucking cop-out. I expect them to act like decent, upstanding citizens “off the job” just like I expect it from anyone else. Since when is not breaking the law cause for reward???
DB
[quote]der Koning wrote:
doogie wrote:
Don’t we expect them to follow the same rules everyone else in society has to follow, no matter how much money or fame they have?
Has there ever been a society in history that applied the rules equally regardless of wealth and fame? Athletes follow the same rules that other multi-millionaires follow.[/quote]
Without citing specific examples, I do seem to recall that consistent double standards for the elite in a society typically end up in the downfall of that society (or ruling class as the case may be) where the punishment for abuse of this status is equally bad or worse than the transgressions. Ok, see the French revolution as an example. Even innocent blue bloods were put to death in some cases for guilt by association. Double standards never play out well in the long term. Just ask Kozlowsky.
DB
Come on. The kids a good kid. It’s the media’s fault! I’m sure this last stunt of flashing his gun in a McDonald’s parking lot was taken out of context.
Just arrested again on Sunday for pointing a gun at a teenager in a Mcdonald’s parking lot. What’s that flushing sound? Oh yeah, it’s the sound of his chances of getting a decent NFL contract going down the toilet.