Would be curious to know your experience and dose. Defy is very conservative from my experience. I had to submit 20 years of orthopedic medical records, been a patient for two years, try other compounds first ( TRT / IPM) and evening then the dose was 80 mg with a 12 week limit. I know other clinics will give Deca straight away to clients upwards of 200 mg / wk. perhaps your experience was dose related?