Trump 2025 - Resuming The National Nightmare Of Peace And Prosperity (Part 2)

I also disagree on this. Republicans are about equality, meaning equality under the law, not equality of outcome. Republicans have been the driving force in all of the civil rights movements that sought equality under the law, Democrats against them. This has been true for over 200 years for the Democrats, a few decades less for the Republicans who haven’t been around as long.

Democrats were only briefly in the “equality” camp for a few decades in the 20th century and the early 21st. They don’t espouse “equality” at all today, they espouse “equity”, which by definition requires unequal treatment under the law.

New York City is a good demonstration of this idea, where Mayor Mamdani is pushing race-based taxation policies under the pretense of achieving “equity”.

Democrats have constantly changed policies in rather dramatic ways for their entire history as a political party. If there is one constant idea they’ve had, it is that one group is deserving of another group’s wealth and productivity. The entirety of Marxist academic social science thought serves as the pretense for this wealth extraction scam today.

You don’t need a shadowy conspiracy for bad actors who fully understand that the ideology is a massive grift to be leading a political party, and you don’t need to turn every political supporter of the party into an ideological fanatic.

Hitler’s Beneficiaries by Gotz Aly explained how German National Socialists obtained such a high level of support and/or a lack of popular resistance. There was, of course, a lot of penalties for opposing the Nazi Party, but they also operated a vast wealth extraction scam to benefit ethnic Germans. It was the same basic idea of Democrats that one group is deserving of another group’s wealth to achieve a particular conception of social justice.

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Of you meant equality of opportunity or outcome, they’re both utopias.

But in short, leftism is about equality, far end having communism as complete equality. Right wing/economic liberalism is about freedom.

It’s impossible to be as free abd as equal as possible at the same time. It’s a slider, more another is less another.

Equality under the law isn’t a utopia in the same way that equality of outcome is. You can actually enact a legal framework that ensures the government treats people with the same set of rules. Republicans have consistently achieved this in real, legislative terms.

That doesn’t necessarily stop every government agent from treating people differently due to whatever internal bias they have, but it’s as close as you can get, especially if there are penalties to using race as a criteria in things like hiring decisions, promotion decisions, prosecutorial decisions, sentencing decisions, so on and so forth.

The whole concept of “disproportionate impacts” as proof of “systemic racism” is a logical fallacy unto itself. If you take it to the extreme, you can argue that we live in an Amish supremacist society because Amish people are probably the least-prosecuted people in American society, therefore the government is discriminating against the non-Amish.

I agree that government is more of a spectrum of control compared to any sort of left/right distinction that was present during the French Revolution. Ranier Zitelman explains the spectrum you’re talking about well when he was asked “Is Trump a fascist?”. The short answer was no, but government policies generally exist on a spectrum that ranges from no state control (anarchy) to total state control (fascism and communism). American Republicans are not anarchists at all, nor do they advocate for any of the totalitarian policies or ideas that defined fascism or communism, whereas Democratic Socialists are definitely more warm to the idea of total state control over society. The promises they make to their voters requires it, which conveniently works out great for Party members, just like it did in Nazi Germany and The Soviet Union.

American Republicanism offers no such guarantees, which has always been an inherent disadvantage.

I guess it’s not same as equality of opportunities then.

This is the equality (via control) vs freedom slider I mentioned earlier.

I guess it depends on what is meant by total victory, and if we see ”woke” or conservative nationalism as unified movements.

Similar, but not the same. Equality of opportunities is a more nebulous idea, whereas equality under the law can actually be codified into law in a fairly concrete and meaningful way.

There’s no way that any government can ensure that some kid growing up in downtown Lewiston in 2026 can have the same opportunities that a kid growing up in one of Maine’s wealthy islands has. They can’t guarantee that their parents aren’t hooked on drugs, aren’t radical religious fundamentalists, have learned a valuable profession, or any of the other countless factors that combine to generate opportunities.

Two children growing up in the same household being raised by the same parents with the same resources don’t always get the same opportunities and almost never have the same life outcomes. The government can’t rectify that “inequity” and never will be able to. Even if they fully implement the entire DSA policy platform, some animals will be “more equal” than others.

As an aside, I find it unsurprising that the new Animal Farm adaptation is apparently anti-capitalist now. I haven’t seen it and probably won’t, but it sounds like a significant departure from the book’s really simple and clear message.

Republicans generally don’t even pretend to solve “ineqity”, but they do consistently advocate for public policies that end up producing more opportunities for more people.

A stark visual reminder of this are all of the empty storefronts in downtown Lewiston, Portland, and other “big” cities in Maine that used to be thriving businesses. Portland is now fining landlords whose tenants closed shop, and closing businesses is very predictable when you hand out 100 needles at a time to deeply troubled drug addicts and then allow them to roam the streets where people are trying to conduct business. Nobody wants to pay $100 for a meal while a guy with a hatchet on his belt is having a psychotic break just outside the window.

This can also be indirectly observed by the lack of new businesses opening up compared to other parts of the USA. Our public schools are the worst they’ve ever been at preparing students to seize opportunities here in Maine, when only a few decades ago they were ranked among the best in the entire country (and world).

What is an opportunity, and where do they come from? Why doesn’t North Korea seem to have many, but South Korea does?

Capitalism, baby.

Says our chuby cowardly bukkake boy. :rofl:

Post up pics bukkake boy. Or have you already backed down from your own challenge?

I agree. The big question is: should this be controlled by various means, and how much.

To be fair, the book isnt pro capitalism, but anti totalitarianism and Stalinistic communism.

Orwell was a socialist

“Every line of serious work that I have written since 1936 has been written, directly or indirectly, against totalitarianism and for democratic Socialism, as I understand it”.

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Precise, this what Orwell was about.

True, but at the time of writing “democratic Socialism” was also a nebulous idea that wasn’t fleshed out in the same way it is on today’s Democratic Socialists of America policy platform, or whatever the equivalent political parties are in the UK today. He didn’t get to experience the last 75 years of socialist thought working its way around the globe, ending in disaster after disaster, all being explained away as “not REAL socialism”.

He seemed quite fond of English society, and something tells me he wouldn’t be on board with mass migration as the UK has experienced it, nor would he be on board with all of the Orwellian doublespeak that enables it.

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He was one of the first to be on team “thats not real socialism!”

Agreed.

:face_savoring_food: :face_savoring_food: :face_savoring_food:

Yeah, and it’s amazing that the “not REAL socialism” grift is still going so strong in 2026. I remember when I was in my Noam Chomsky phase about 25 years ago. He believed that the Soviet Union wasn’t “real communism”. He was very optimistic about the revolution in Iran, as well as being optimistic about the triumph of socialist thought in Venezuela, which he also criticized as “state capitalist”, aka “not REAL socialism”.

I have little doubt that American Democratic Socialism will be regarded as “not REAL socialism” in a few more decades, once the academics get around to explaining why a sudden wave of emotional stupidity and economic ignorance washed over American society in the early 21st Century.

AP US History will be a wild subject in the 2050’s.

Orwell also died in 1950, before capitalism lifted so many people out of poverty even as socialism was keeping so many trapped within it. The idea of state ownership of business and industry simply hadn’t been tried in very many places, and the idea still looked pretty good on paper with only The Soviet Union really giving it the old college try, and National Socialism being “not REAL socialism” right out of the gate.

But it’s cool!

Just a couple more dickheads that frame history through a lens fits their beliefs. Same as it ever was.

lol yep I read Howard Zinn right around the same time as Chomsky.

I thought that they were both brilliant at the time, exactly as depicted in 1997’s Good Will Hunting.

Fast forward to 2026, and some guy with a Nazi tattoo is going to be the Democrat nominee for Maine’s senate seat by simply blaming nebulous forces for the conditions in a state that Democrats have dominated since 2019 and had far more influence than Republicans for at least 30-40 years.

Maine only has one billionaire resident, so i guess it is all Susan Alfond’s fault for not paying more in taxes to further fund radical Democratic policies we have had for the last seven years.

Chomsky is quite tiresome, I agree. He’s so transparent that it’s frustrating.

Last time I did read something from him was when he said that Russian attack on Ukraine was US fault.

More data showing that tarrifs have made things more expensive for Americans.

We would have been better off if Trump did literally nothing.

https://www.cato.org/blog/one-year-after-liberation-day-heres-what-we-know-what-we-dont?utm_source=hootsuite&utm_medium=facebook&utm_term=&utm_content=&utm_campaign=&fbclid=IwT01FWARIDEhleHRuA2FlbQIxMABzcnRjBmFwcF9pZAwzNTA2ODU1MzE3MjgAAR70JWIIfUflkP2ky-YOLT2mC1BmFqC0Tjh3gedN8Vpf033H7vpPakD69fIdtg_aem_qd7Rijj3bqutiLQS5GTExA

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One of Chomsky’s central ideas has been that America has been in a decades long struggle to control the resources of Russia. It’s been a long time since I read any of his books, but blaming the USA for a Russian invasion of Ukraine (and nearly any other bad thing that happens in the world) seems pretty consistent with his writings.

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Free trade libertarian myself so I agree tariffs are ultimately a tax on consumers. However, was the stated purpose of these tariffs to lower costs? That wouldn’t make sense.

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