I have a doctors appt next week. It’s near impossible to see a doctor these days. They are booked to the hilt. My son thought he had the covid ( he didn’t) and it took weeks to get an appointment to actually see someone in person.
Scott
I had an interesting experience with ZMA. Every time I took it before bed I would wake up in the middle of the night and would be wide awake. For that reason, I don’t take it anymore.
Scott,
My advice, for what it’s worth, is to try to stop worrying about things beyond your control, and look for the positives. You worrying about it will not change this virus. Leave that to others better paid and more qualified.
Perhaps a positive is that this virus gives you an opportunity to really focus on your training, because there is little opportunity to do much else?
I started using that ZMA sleep stuff
I had an interesting experience with ZMA. Every time I took it before bed I would wake up in the middle of the night and would be wide awake. For that reason, I don’t take it anymore.
That’s interesting because right away it makes me drowsy and I slept better for about a week and the I started waking up early again . I guess even if it doesn’t help me sleep I think it’s good for the immune system . Scott
Maybe it’s just to show how stupid I am , I don’t know , but this week I started trying to do pull-ups and dips done randomly through out the day every day. I started out trying chins , three or 4 efforts with palms facing me and dips. On dips the first day I couldn’t do one but by day 3 I got two reps. I’m going to do this a while and see what happens. I can sort of feel it in my back and pecs but it’s not bad.
Scott
So today is day 6 of doing pull-ups and dips everyday and nothing else. Day one I could barely get 3/4 way on the pull-up. Now my eyes are nearing the bar. On dips I couldn’t do one the first day ( I hadn’t done them in ages) and now I am doing maybe 4 sets of 2 or 3 with at least a half hour between sets. I can feel it in my muscles a little. I was always better at dips than pull-ups . Does this prove anything? I don’t know.
Scott
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If you’re progressing and not experiencing joint pain or other adverse effects, keep doing what you’re doing.
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I’m sure I won’t be able to do this for long before something gives out.
Scott
If you’re worried about that, take tomorrow off. Give your shoulders some love with some band pullaparts, work your extensors on your hands - something restorative. Take time off before you feel something negative. I didn’t mean just go forever, I meant if increasing frequency is working - and with pull-ups, which are a skill as much as a strength, it will work - keep your frequency decently high, keep intensity low, and focus on recovery.
Probably a good idea.
Scott
So I took off 2 days to recover from 6 days straight pull-ups ( up to eye level) and dips 2-3 sets of 3 and I thought I’d be refreshed and recovered and stronger but today I was back to my starting position pull-ups and instead of being able to do sets of 3 dips I could barely do one rep.
Scott
Honestly, your age makes me squeamish about giving any more advice here - it’s well out of my experiential bubble. For someone in their 20’s I’d just prescribe lots of pullups and dips and the body would adapt. For someone your age, it’s going to be different. I’m not saying 68 is ancient, but it’s old enough that if you tear your rotator cuff doing something, you’ll likely have a decreased quality of life for the rest of your life. You can try the higher frequency again, but you might want to just switch goals and focus on being fit - go biking, use machines at the gym, eat healthy, hike a mountain, travel - plenty of things to do other than pullups and dips.
I know at my age any injury can last forever. I’m just surprised that I didn’t come back a tad stronger after the break? I felt more energized but was weaker ? Maybe I needed to take off two weeks like I hear people doing but by then I’d be bored to death, ha ha. I do all that fitness stuff but I just wanted to see if trying something different wouldn’t up my pathetic pull up total a tiny bit. Doing it 2 or 3 times a week didn’t work and everyday didn’t work so I don’t know what to try next? Probably go back to my regular workouts and stop obsessing on stupid pull-ups . I’ve always liked high reps compared to heavy singles anyway. A chin attempt is like trying a heavy bench press I can’t do. Oh well?
Scott
No - every day did work. It worked very, very quickly. The SAID principle applies - Specific Adaptation to Imposed Demands. You may have the strength to do several pull-ups - your body has yet to go through the adaptation that daily pull-ups demand of it. There is a skill involved in pull-ups. If you kept doing them daily, you’d have progressed to doing a few quickly.
The problem is, there is a VERY common theme amongst people who do LOTS of pull-ups - overuse injuries. People who do lots of underhand pull-ups tend to have elbow or wrist problems, people who do lots of overhand pull-ups tend to have shoulder problems.
Now, it’s my belief that those injuries come from imbalances, weaknesses, and improper form on the pull-up, but when prescribing pull-ups on the internet, I can’t know that you’re doing everything (or anything) correctly.
The point is - you did them for 6 days and your ROM increased drastically. You stopped, the biomechanical/neurological demand halted, your body regressed. You didn’t get stronger or build any noticeable muscle in 6 days - you got better at doing pull-ups. It’s up to you to weigh the risks.
I agree with Flappinit: In 6 days, all you are doing is learning how to use the muscle you already have in a better or more efficient manner.
One way to build muscle is a lot of volume. Not the HIT approach, but hard to say it doesn’t work. It can wreck havoc on tendons as an overuse injury, and that gets to be more of a risk as you get older.
The Dan John article suggested increasing load rather than reps. However, your problem is that you can’t even get one rep, so I suspect you aren’t getting enough volume to effectively use intensity for progression. Basically, you are doing and failing at singles…
Somehow (with assitance bands, lat pull down machine, assisted pullup machine), try to get in about 5 reps in good form, slow, controlled and all the way to the top. Maybe do that 3 times a week. Try to reduce the assistance over time. Don’t know if it will work, but 15 reps total over the course of the week shouldn’t present that much of an overuse risk, especially if you avoid kipping, swinging, or explosive pulls out of the bottom. Maybe don’t go to full stretch at the bottom, to further reduce stretch on the shoulder joints.
Yea I don’t know if the risk of injuring something by continuing to push it is worth it? It’s a tough call? I may keep at it every day for a while longer and see what happens at least until I can do one damn pull-up with hands about 16 inches apart and palms facing me but if taking off two days throws me back to square one it may just be hopeless because I know something will come up to make me take off here and there? I’m pretty confident I can pretty easily get back to 5 or 6 dips even doing them 2 times a week. I was watching this YouTube video recently of this gym full of these studs competing on chins, palms facing away and doing them with 60 or more pounds hanging from their waist . Talk about feeling like a wimp! Haha!
Scott
Yea I think you’re right about volume. Each pull-up effort is like trying to do a single bench press record and that’s not a good way to train especially when your old and decrepit. I’ve always wanted an assisted chin machine and that’s one Nautilus I never found at a resonance price. I’ll have to see if I can find some kind of rubber bands or something to put under my feet to allow me to at least get a rep or two.
Scott
I’d say it’s less about volume, more that frequency drives efficiency and volume follows frequency to an extent. But semantics aside, I agree with everything you said.
I’ll throw in a vote for resistance band pull-ups - they provide the most help in the most compromising position and will allow you to work on your sticking point. Then, negative only pull-ups are great for people who can’t do them.
@entsminger tonight, I did 3 strict reps with 90# hanging from a dip belt. I have an old video on YouTube of me banging out a couple with +90 as well. And despite that, I don’t think you’re a wimp - I think you’re inspiring as hell, and I hope I’m half as concerned with fitness as you are by the time I get to my 60’s. I respect you, dude. Carry on.
Man, at 68 still be so fit…you definetly are not a wimp. I admire you. My father is 69, and even though he was pretty much active until hearth problems few years ago, today all he can do is walking. And not to much.
Respect, Scott.
I, myself, wouldn’t risk injury…it is so depressing not being able to train.
Just work on small objectives, there is a lot of it.
Scott,
Can you not lower the bar to where you are starting in a sitting position on the floor with your arms extended? That way at least you are not using all your bodyweight.