Whenever I perform any isolation exercises for the lats my triceps really start to fatigue just before my lats do.
This happens with straight arm cable/bar pulldowns.
Any ideas on isolation stuff for the lats that don’t use the triceps much?
Try a pair of hanging ab straps on the cable machine instead of the regular handles? Have them cradling your elbows, thus essentially taking your triceps out.
You’re an Aussie too, so here’s a link:
http://www.worldfitness.com.au/product_info.php?cPath=8&products_id=944
238 had a great piece of advice.
I’d also add that it may not be your triceps that are fatiguing, but your teres major. It inserts on the humerus just underneath the triceps and it assists the lats with drawing the humerus downward and backward. After a day of lat pullovers, these will be very sore on me and it feels just like my triceps.
The Long head of the triceps also assists the lats
I have the same problem try to start the movement with your lats contracting through the whole movement and push the bar against yourself at the bottom. ( i had to use little bit lighter weight though)
For general Lat training, i find rows really take the tris out (especially single handed), you can also try reverse dbell flys but have the elbows low(and keep the elbows bend) or you will train your rear delts and traps
excuse my bad english
hope this helped.
I seem to have less triceps involvement while doing straight-arm pulldowns if I use the rope attachment instead of a bar. Maybe it’s due to the hand positioning, dunno.
[quote]Mr.Jeannay wrote:
…try to start the movement with your lats contracting through the whole movement and push the bar against yourself at the bottom.[/quote]
MMC is very important here. I would say stretched and contracted.
I also prefer the ‘inverted V’ attachment to a straight bar for straight-arm pulldowns.
[quote]cueball wrote:
I seem to have less triceps involvement while doing straight-arm pulldowns if I use the rope attachment instead of a bar. Maybe it’s due to the hand positioning, dunno.
[/quote]
Same here, we have a long rope that works well to help take the tri’s out of the straight arm pulldowns.
Long head of triceps originates on your infra glenoid tubercle (scapula) and it acts as a synergist when you move your humerous in posteriorly (extension) in the saggital plane. So it would be very hard not to involve your triceps in that plane of movement.
The question is: why do they fatigue? My guess is that the culprit is not the long head working to move your arm backwards but rather the fact that you are fighting to keep your elbow in an extended position causing your middle and short head to perform an isometric contraction.
The cure is: the point of contact should be above the elbow, maybe use hanging ab straps…As i’m writing this i see they’ve already been mentioned. Another solution would be to avoid pressing motions that would pre-fatigue your triceps. Lastly, you could just build up strength in your triceps over time and fight through the fatigue which would lead to a lesser lat workout however isometric strength tends to build up pretty quickly!
maybe you should prefatigue your triceps so your lats will work harder…
sorry i couldnt resist.
[quote]Waittz wrote:
maybe you should prefatigue your triceps so your lats will work harder…
sorry i couldnt resist. [/quote]
I LOLed.
On Topic: OP, try not to grip the bar when doing pulldowns. Basically, open hand the top of the bar. This should take your arms out of the movement a bit more. CT mentioned this for back training; when you grip the bar tightly, you recruit the muscles upline (irradiation or something like that?). Thus, he recommends using straps for back training which can dramatically increase the load you are able to move since you are using a much more powerful muscle group (back) and not failing at a weaker point(arms).
[quote]Waittz wrote:
maybe you should prefatigue your triceps so your lats will work harder…
sorry i couldnt resist. [/quote]
hahaha
but how are you gonna get swole? I like to pre-fatigue my lats so i can work out my lower back when I do pull downs…
[quote]thrasher_09 wrote:
Whenever I perform any isolation exercises for the lats my triceps really start to fatigue just before my lats do.
This happens with straight arm cable/bar pulldowns.
Any ideas on isolation stuff for the lats that don’t use the triceps much?[/quote]
Machine pullovers.
[quote]BrickHead wrote:
[quote]thrasher_09 wrote:
Whenever I perform any isolation exercises for the lats my triceps really start to fatigue just before my lats do.
This happens with straight arm cable/bar pulldowns.
Any ideas on isolation stuff for the lats that don’t use the triceps much?[/quote]
Machine pullovers. [/quote]
These are rare today. I’ve never even seen one. Any suggestions for mimicking this machine? I’ve found SA pulldowns to be the closest just because you can manipulate your torso position throughout the movement. Kneeling facing away from the stack with ab straps would be awesome if the cable wasn’t in the way.
Edit: Actually, I suppose FACING the stack with ab straps would be fine as long as you manipulate your torso position during the movement-leaning forward as your arms go up for the stretch and leaning back during the concentric to get the “pulling back” motion.
[quote]cueball wrote:
[quote]BrickHead wrote:
[quote]thrasher_09 wrote:
Whenever I perform any isolation exercises for the lats my triceps really start to fatigue just before my lats do.
This happens with straight arm cable/bar pulldowns.
Any ideas on isolation stuff for the lats that don’t use the triceps much?[/quote]
Machine pullovers. [/quote]
These are rare today. I’ve never even seen one. Any suggestions for mimicking this machine? I’ve found SA pulldowns to be the closest just because you can manipulate your torso position throughout the movement. Kneeling facing away from the stack with ab straps would be awesome if the cable wasn’t in the way.
Edit: Actually, I suppose FACING the stack with ab straps would be fine as long as you manipulate your torso position during the movement-leaning forward as your arms go up for the stretch and leaning back during the concentric to get the “pulling back” motion.[/quote]
Many Golden Age bodybuilders swore by the Nautilus pullover machine for building a powerful upper body. The pullover was as common as the bench press and the row. Sadly, most gyms these days don’t even have a pullover machine, and those that do pale in comparison to the old Nautilus machine.
Thibaudeau, a big fan of the older pullover machines, has struggled for years to replicate their effectiveness. Here’s what he came up with: the cable pullover.
Thibs explains it: "The set-up for this exercise is a bit tricky. You’ll have to set up a decline bench in front of a low pulley station with a triceps rope attached. Lie down on the bench so that the rope is above your head.
"The starting position has you in a fully extended position. You perform the exercise by executing a pullover motion (keeping the arms straight) focusing on your lats the whole time. Really emphasize a wide pullover arc â?? this will hit the lats the hardest.
You lower the weight slowly, again in a wide arc, and return to the fully stretched position. Hold the stretched position for one or two seconds to get rid of momentum and to increase hypertrophy stimulation."
[quote]super saiyan wrote:
[quote]cueball wrote:
[quote]BrickHead wrote:
[quote]thrasher_09 wrote:
Whenever I perform any isolation exercises for the lats my triceps really start to fatigue just before my lats do.
This happens with straight arm cable/bar pulldowns.
Any ideas on isolation stuff for the lats that don’t use the triceps much?[/quote]
Machine pullovers. [/quote]
These are rare today. I’ve never even seen one. Any suggestions for mimicking this machine? I’ve found SA pulldowns to be the closest just because you can manipulate your torso position throughout the movement. Kneeling facing away from the stack with ab straps would be awesome if the cable wasn’t in the way.
Edit: Actually, I suppose FACING the stack with ab straps would be fine as long as you manipulate your torso position during the movement-leaning forward as your arms go up for the stretch and leaning back during the concentric to get the “pulling back” motion.[/quote]
Many Golden Age bodybuilders swore by the Nautilus pullover machine for building a powerful upper body. The pullover was as common as the bench press and the row. Sadly, most gyms these days don’t even have a pullover machine, and those that do pale in comparison to the old Nautilus machine.
Thibaudeau, a big fan of the older pullover machines, has struggled for years to replicate their effectiveness. Here’s what he came up with: the cable pullover.
Thibs explains it: "The set-up for this exercise is a bit tricky. You’ll have to set up a decline bench in front of a low pulley station with a triceps rope attached. Lie down on the bench so that the rope is above your head.
"The starting position has you in a fully extended position. You perform the exercise by executing a pullover motion (keeping the arms straight) focusing on your lats the whole time. Really emphasize a wide pullover arc â?? this will hit the lats the hardest.
You lower the weight slowly, again in a wide arc, and return to the fully stretched position. Hold the stretched position for one or two seconds to get rid of momentum and to increase hypertrophy stimulation."[/quote]
Awesome. Will try.
Thank you for all of the responses.
Yes it is definitely my triceps, not my teres major. It isn’t the long head fatiguing from shoulder extension as the shoulder’s aren’t extending too much in a straight arm pulldown. I find that it is the isometric strength of the triceps trying to lock out the weight whilst I do the pulldown.
I will try out the straps on the lat pulldown, I remember doing these some time ago and liking them. I suppose these would be a little better than a straight arm pulldown with the ab straps on as you are getting extension as well as adduction.
Thanks again for the suggestions.
I found a solution!
Your video link doesnt work anymore, any chance you canpost a new one since i experience the same problem 