Tim Hardaway Bashes Gays, Apologizes

Off Topic
101

[quote]malonetd wrote:

So…what is your point?[/quote]

No point, just trying to bolster fair and impartial beliefs. And to lay the ground work for my rant against the dumbass that says Hardaway is wrong to speak his mind and apologize (‘courage of his convictions’ and all that) and then proceeds to pronounce that he’s gay, ashamed of it, listens to Madonna (as if she’s anything other than the prototypical sellout), and uses f@g when he should use the word fag.

At least Hardaway has got a career to make him “confused”.

102

[quote]malonetd wrote:

I doubt there will be a rational answer, but then again, it wouldn’t be a phobia if it were a “rational” fear.[/quote]

As if being gay is rational to begin with.

If it’s extreme disdain, based on reason, not fear, is it still homophobia? How about homovexed?

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[quote]lucasa wrote:
As if being gay is rational to begin with.
[/quote]

What does this mean? How is it irrational?

104

Isn’t it un-PC to tell someone they don’t have the right to say something? I know it’s a technicality, but still.

I don’t like the idea of gay sex (dudes, not chicks, of course). I don’t like the idea of fat people having sex either. I don’t hate fat people, so why would I hate gays?

Homophobes always talk about homosexuality isn’t natural, but it’s been around since biblical times (and long before), and there are gay animals, too. Do wild animals decide to be gay?

There definitely seems to be a physiological basis for homosexuality. Everyone knows gay men tend to be effeminate and gay woman tend to be more masculine. I heard of a study that found that sisters of gay men had more children on average than other woman. It seems that attraction to men is a positive characteristic for reproduction, and homosexuality could be a by-product of this increased attraction to men.

105

[quote]lucasa wrote:
malonetd wrote:

I doubt there will be a rational answer, but then again, it wouldn’t be a phobia if it were a “rational” fear.

As if being gay is rational to begin with.
[/quote]

Rotfl @ your reasoning powers

106

[quote]jsbrook wrote:
Agent Frost wrote:
I can speak only for myself when i say that a lot of what gay men do annoys me. the little girly boys in their Abercrombie and their emo hair cuts with limp wrists prancing about in MAC make up and things… sure i just wanna shake them, REAL HARD, and say “Thank you… thank you for setting us homo’s back 50 years”. But they are who they are, and they deserve to be that i guess…
[/quote]

Okay now you’re being a bit harsh. I had my make up done by the bitch boy at MAC… and he did a fine job. … plus he wouldn’t be caught dead in abercrombie, that’s for closet fags. ;o)

107

[quote]A-Town Crown wrote:

Yes, your parents are at fault you salad tosser.[/quote]

Nice one, dipshit.

108

"…Admit it, Agent Frost…

…You KNOW you want me…"

LOL!

Thanks for the insights, AF!

(I would imagine that at this point in your Life, you’ve probably heard it all…but the hate is probably still hard to take…)

Hang in there!

Mufasa

109

[quote]Mufasa wrote:
"…Admit it, Agent Frost…

…You KNOW you want me…"

LOL!

Thanks for the insights, AF!

(I would imagine that at this point in your Life, you’ve probably heard it all…but the hate is probably still hard to take…)

Hang in there!

Mufasa[/quote]

Hate isnt as hard to take as, say, blatant stupidity.

I am actually good friends with the word hate. I personally say it all the time. I hate dogs… i hate winter… i hate bad parents who cant keep their bastard kids corralled while im eating out… i hate TV… i hate pizza… etc etc etc

And as far as hanging in there, thanks. Its not hard anymore, because when u are tired of hanging you can do one of two things… fall like those people who never learn and become better versions of themselves, as has been demonstrated in this thread, or you can just keep climbing to new and better heights… and be the best breeder or fag that you can be!

110

[quote]malonetd wrote:

What does this mean? How is it irrational?[/quote]

Since you’re a homosexual, you believe that for a man, given the choice of having sex with men, having sex with women, or not having sex, sex with men is most reasonable and sensible choice, right?

If you think it’s not a choice, then yes, it’s de facto irrational.

Or you could just label people who think critically about it as a homophobes (whether they’re scared or not, whether they have reasons or not) and declare that because they have a phobia, they’re irrational invalids.

111

[quote]lucasa wrote:
malonetd wrote:

What does this mean? How is it irrational?

Since you’re a homosexual, you believe that for a man, given the choice of having sex with men, having sex with women, or not having sex, sex with men is most reasonable and sensible choice, right?

If you think it’s not a choice, then yes, it’s de facto irrational.[/quote]

First, are you asking me or telling me that I’m homosexual? I can’t tell.

For some it may be a choice, for others it may be a matter of preference that can’t be helped. But I don’t see where you’re going with this since the same logic applies to heterosexuals, too. Heterosexuality is either rational because can choose their sexual preference or it’s irrational because there is no choice. Again, I don’t see your point.

[quote]
Or you could just label people who think critically about it as a homophobes (whether they’re scared or not, whether they have reasons or not) and declare that because they have a phobia, they’re irrational invalids.[/quote]

I never called anyone a homophobe; the other poster labeled himself that. I just questioned his self-proclaimed phobia. And a phobia, by definition, is an irrational fear.

So, please show me your clever, critical thinking skills in this matter and explain to me what you come up with. For all I can see it’s just a lifestyle, whether it’s consciously chosen or not, that has little affect on anyone else. It affects me the same way a random stranger prefers blondes over brunettes. If there’s more to it, please show me.

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[quote]malonetd wrote:

For some it may be a choice,[/quote]

You didn’t answer the question, is it the best choice given heterosexuality or abstinence?

Thus, as I said irrational. Pretty clever huh?

The same logic does not apply as one is a necessity to human survival and one isn’t. Everyone can choose not to be homosexual and the world will go on just fine, the same isn’t true for heterosexuality. And I’m sure you just conveniently forgot that or felt it wasn’t relevant to the specific context of our discussion rather than having had it beaten into your head that the two are equivalent.

I take it back, you’re right, it’s probably just harmless individuals in back alleys, lover’s lanes and the privacy of their own homes and isn’t having any effect on anyone.

113

[quote]lucasa wrote:
malonetd wrote:

For some it may be a choice,

You didn’t answer the question, is it the best choice given heterosexuality or abstinence?[/quote]

Best choice in what situation? Human creation? Maximum pleasure?

[quote]
for others it may be a matter of preference that can’t be helped.

Thus, as I said irrational. Pretty clever huh?[/quote]
And I didn’t argue that…

[quote]
But I don’t see where you’re going with this since the same logic applies to heterosexuals, too. Heterosexuality is either rational because can choose their sexual preference or it’s irrational because there is no choice. Again, I don’t see your point.

The same logic does not apply as one is a necessity to human survival and one isn’t. Everyone can choose not to be homosexual and the world will go on just fine, the same isn’t true for heterosexuality. And I’m sure you just conveniently forgot that or felt it wasn’t relevant to the specific context of our discussion rather than having had it beaten into your head that the two are equivalent.[/quote]

How does reproduction apply to choosing or not having a choice? That’s what was being discussed, remember? You either chose your sexuality, and make a rational decision, or it’s pre-programmed, and it’s irrational. Even if you claim heterosexuality is instinctual, it’s still irrational by your definition. So please, tell me where you are going with this.

[quote]
I take it back, you’re right, it’s probably just harmless individuals in back alleys, lover’s lanes and the privacy of their own homes and isn’t having any effect on anyone.[/quote]

I can’t read sarcasm so I’ll just assume that you agree with me.

114

[quote]malonetd wrote:

Best choice in what situation? Human creation? Maximum pleasure?[/quote]

Best lifestyle choice. I’m sure your being aloof bodes well with the PC police, but you’ve got a life, you’ve already made this decision, what’s the answer? How can you be so indecisive? Is it because you’re scared to give an answer that you believe in or that people might not like? I’m not trying to bully you, just showing that you’re rather enthusiastically crossing your i’s and dotting your t’s so that you don’t offend anyone.

Meanwhile Agent Frost is co-opting images of soldiers at wartime (gay or not) and arguably desecrating an American icon to serve his ideology.

Would it help to crystallize my annoyance and irrationality if Agent Frost’s picture had a Phillip Morris flag (odds are all the soldiers erecting the flag smoked)? An NRA flag (they all carried rifles)? How about a CIA flag? What if all the guys were wearing Che Guevara t-shirts?

Didn’t say you did, you queried as to how it was irrational, I answered, you accused me of being clever.

Sigh, somebody somewhere has to be heterosexual some of the time, there’s no choice involved. Couldn’t do away with it even if you wanted to (not that I’m advocating doing away with homosexuality). You act as though heterosexuality and homosexuality are interchangeable wrt rationality and they’re not. You voluntarily dissociate reproduction from heterosexual sex even though there is a distinct association and even causality. Why?

Homosexuality is either based on sound reason and superior to homophobia or is irrational and on an equal plane as “homophobia”. Moreover, for some reason those who “support” homosexuality and even homosexuals themselves do and say things that in virtually any other context would be considered offensive. They even go so far as to generate a label and apply it to dissenters to establish the line of thought that there is no rational reason why people don’t like homosexuals or associated habits and choices. I’m interested as to why someone who would say that there is no rational explanation for homophobia would take adopt the view of rationality vs. irrationality (i.e. when someone labels themselves a homophobe, why do you assume it to be any more/less rational than homosexuality?)

There is no heterophobia, it’s just a fear of being raped and it’s even allowed to be rational, even prudent. No one can be convicted of a hate crime against a straight individual, it’s just a crime.

I would expect no less from a conditioned sheep.

I get homosexuality, to a degree (probably about the same degree that Agent Frost gets the concept of hate). I’m not unsympathetic to inaccurate portrayal as sexual predators or sex fiends (As if it’s hard for me to sympathize with an inappropriate portrayal predatory lesbians).

If there were a co-ed pro basketball team and suddenly one or two of the women absolutely refused to shower or be in the same locker room or on the same court as men who “chose” to have sex with women, do you think the league would be distancing itself from them, maybe even firing them? Or would it be trying to accommodate them? I agree that Hardaway went a little over the top, but you’ve got to agree that the league was no more sensible in its response. Wanting to make sure that everyone knows Hardaway doesn’t speak on behalf of the whole league? They can keep their bullshit.

115

[quote]lucasa wrote:
stuff…[/quote]

I feel like we’re arguing around each other. I’m not purposing “dotting all my i’s” to avoid offending anyone, I just honestly don’t care if someone is homosexual or not. Doesn’t bother me at all.

Also, I don’t mind the “survival of the species” argument. It makes more sense than most other arguments, especially religion-based. I just buy into homosexuality being “bad” for that reason alone.

I’d be happy to see the world population decrease for a while. And if more people were gay, we might see less teen pregnancies. Until humans are an endangered species, I think homosexuality and heterosexuality cam co-exist just fine, especially since there is homosexuals make up only a fraction of the population at the time.

And even if and when humans reach the point of homosexuality affecting reproduction and species survival, I think bisexuality would probably become the popular “choice”.

As far as the “sheep” comment, I don’t even get that. I don’t know what you think I’m blindly following.

The only reason I even jumped in this thread was to question a poster who claimed to be homophobic. I just wanted to know how and why he called himself that. The rational/irrational debate came into play because a phobia, any phobia, by definition, is based on an irrational fear.

I guess I just don’t get homophobia, but since it’s a phobia, there’s nothing to get. It’s the same as me not getting claustrophobia or acrophobia. Of course I wouldn’t understand, I don’t share the same fears.

I’ve also made the mistake in this thread of assuming homophobia is like other traditional phobias. I was wrong. Just because it has the -phobia suffix, doesn’t make it so. It’s similar to xenophobia, where it might not be “a fear of,” but a dislike, prejudice, or hatred.

As far as Hardaway’s comments, I really could care less. I think he wasn’t too smart career-wise(whatever he’s doing now) in saying them, but it’s his life and his choice. He should have known people would jump all over him and his comments.

I also think it’s incredibly ignorant to use such a blanket statement and claim to hate an entire group of people. I would assume, with him being black, he has faced that same type of ignorance sometime in his life. Maybe he has been fortunate enough not to experience it in his life, but I doubt it.

In the end, neither one of us is going to change the other one’s mind about homosexuality(or almost anything else for that matter) over the internet, so be it. I appreciate that it at least took a few posts before you decided to sling around names, and even then you only called me a sheep.