[quote]carter12 wrote:
Yea, the announcers often exagerate their numbers.
Yesterday during the LSU/Alabama game, the announcer said LSU’s running back could bench press 600.
Like JMB said, use common sense.[/quote]
He was talking about the fullback Kevin Steltz, and yes he can. In high school he benched a sick 530.
Just like when I played ball, all the players lifts are mostly BS. 1/4 500lb squats, bounce presses,etc, etc.
Try using your arms next time you squat to pull you up, you could add 200lbs.
I want my trainer to be a fat guy who has never been in the shape I wanna be in. Hooray.
[quote]Viking69 wrote:
Just like when I played ball, all the players lifts are mostly BS. 1/4 500lb squats, bounce presses,etc, etc.
Try using your arms next time you squat to pull you up, you could add 200lbs.
I want my trainer to be a fat guy who has never been in the shape I wanna be in. Hooray.[/quote]
He’s a football player, not a weightlifter or powerlifter. Honestly it doesn’t matter which lifts he does or doesn’t do as long as his performance improves. Deny he isn’t having one of his better seasons yet.
BTW-his trainer is a former powerlifting champ and strongman competitor so yeah, he may not be the pretty boys that most here are so fond of, but I am sure he knows a tad bit more about strength development than most of the internet superstars here. Think a pretty physique matters in football? Look at David “wonderboy” Boston, man, being all jacked and shredded certainly helped him! Oh wait, does he still play? Well, at least he has abs!
Gimme a break…
The only thing good I see is the snatch grip DLs, but he’s using 315 which is probably much more indicative of his actual strength.
If you look closer, you will notice the two inner plates are 100s, the outer plate is 45. 535 DL anyone?
The fact remains, at the end of the day…its more than I can fucking squat. And he’s rich!
[quote]Sonny S wrote:
You may all stop hating on Tiki now. [/quote]
But wait, I don’t think his choice in training apparel has been critiqued yet…and by Gawd if that haircut isn’t so last year.
[quote]Scott Shetler wrote:
Viking69 wrote:
Just like when I played ball, all the players lifts are mostly BS. 1/4 500lb squats, bounce presses,etc, etc.
Try using your arms next time you squat to pull you up, you could add 200lbs.
I want my trainer to be a fat guy who has never been in the shape I wanna be in. Hooray.
He’s a football player, not a weightlifter or powerlifter. Honestly it doesn’t matter which lifts he does or doesn’t do as long as his performance improves. Deny he isn’t having one of his better seasons yet.
BTW-his trainer is a former powerlifting champ and strongman competitor so yeah, he may not be the pretty boys that most here are so fond of, but I am sure he knows a tad bit more about strength development than most of the internet superstars here. Think a pretty physique matters in football? Look at David “wonderboy” Boston, man, being all jacked and shredded certainly helped him! Oh wait, does he still play? Well, at least he has abs!
Gimme a break…
[/quote]
So who is his trainer?
[quote]Professor X wrote:
Sonny S wrote:
You may all stop hating on Tiki now.
But wait, I don’t think his choice in training apparel has been critiqued yet…and by Gawd if that haircut isn’t so last year.[/quote]
…and did you see the AIR they were breathing? I bet they pump oxygen in there to imrpove their performance. I bet he squats like, a buck twenty.
[quote]boatguy wrote:
The only thing good I see is the snatch grip DLs, but he’s using 315 which is probably much more indicative of his actual strength.
If you look closer, you will notice the two inner plates are 100s, the outer plate is 45. 535 DL anyone? [/quote]
Nice observation. Plus he is standing on a small platform.
Joe Carini, a New Jersey native, is well known around the powerlifting community as one of its finest members. Mr. Carini has over 25 years of experience, and has designed exercise programs for both professional and recreational athletes alike.
Joe Carini?s powerlifting career is filled with several firsts, including being the first man EVER to officially squat 800 lbs, and was the first man in New Jersey to bench press over 600 lbs. Mr. Carini captured the New Jersey?s Strongest Man title for 6 years in a row (1981-1987). In addition, Mr. Carini won three New Jersey state powerlifting championships. In 2000, Mr. Carini was the head coach of the New Jersey Powerlifting Team.If you want to get results, there?s only one man to call. Let Joe?s experience work for YOU!
1st man in NJ Powerlifting to total 2,100 lbs
1st man to official squat 800 lbs.
1st man in NJ to officially bench press 600 lbs
6 time NJ Strongest man winner
Seated Military press 470 lbs.
Deadlift 810 lbs.
All-Time best squat: 905 lbs.
All-Time best bench press: 670 lbs
there’s soem info on his fat trainer…rb
speaking of interesting, me and my friend had this debate over why strength training in America sucks compared to Europe, and he told me that some football players on the right cycle can make the switch over to strongman or powerlifting if they wanted to. I personally think that those leviathans on the World’s Strongest Man could definitely make the switch over to Football if they practiced on skill and plays. Could you imagine Zydrunas Savickas or Raimond Bergmanis as an Offensive Lineman, damn that would be a two man wrecking crew.
P.s. don’t give me that b.s. that they couldn’t handle football, they have more than enough endurance to handle the rigors of football, see them on World’s Strongest Man and you will know what i am talking about!
[quote]nolecat wrote:
I have seen some clips of ball players working out. And it is true, many of them never squat near parallel. It suprising how bad their form and technique is. None of their lifts would ever pass competition regulations. HOWEVER, there are plenty I have seen that can out-lift the best of the best! [/quote]
Does it benfit the players to squat too parelle or beyond? I cnat see how a parelle squat would be sports specific for football.
Getting off topic , I ve noticed that alot of athletes dont squat near paralle. Im guessing , is that its not sport specific.
[quote]popasquat wrote:
carter12 wrote:
Yea, the announcers often exagerate their numbers.
Yesterday during the LSU/Alabama game, the announcer said LSU’s running back could bench press 600.
Like JMB said, use common sense.
He was talking about the fullback Kevin Steltz, and yes he can. In high school he benched a sick 530.[/quote]
Why, did you see him do it? Backing up a hard to believe claim with an even harder to believe claim is not going to convince anyone.
[quote]Sonny S wrote:
You may all stop hating on Tiki now. [/quote]
It’s not about hating on Tiki, it’s about hating on people who talk about his amazing strength feats. Sure, it’s more than most people could do, but it’s not elite in any sense of the word.
It’s a little insulting to work hard for something and then have some idiot sports announcer claim that half the guys in the NFL are capable of world class strength feats. It’s not a benchpress if your partner deadlifts it off your chest, and it’s not a squat if your legs don’t break parallel.
If this style of training works for them, more power to them. But don’t try to call what they do squats, or their partner assisted benchpresses legitimate.
[quote]wesstangl wrote:
nolecat wrote:
I have seen some clips of ball players working out. And it is true, many of them never squat near parallel. It suprising how bad their form and technique is. None of their lifts would ever pass competition regulations. HOWEVER, there are plenty I have seen that can out-lift the best of the best!
Does it benfit the players to squat too parelle or beyond? I cnat see how a parelle squat would be sports specific for football.
Getting off topic , I ve noticed that alot of athletes dont squat near paralle. Im guessing , is that its not sport specific.
[/quote]
Good point. But I really don’t think squats should be looked at as being sports specific. I always felt that athletes should train full range squats to simply build overall strength. I don’t see how stopping above parallel would be beneficial. Of course, I’m no trainer so I could be wrong!
[quote]warriork wrote:
speaking of interesting, me and my friend had this debate over why strength training in America sucks compared to Europe, and he told me that some football players on the right cycle can make the switch over to strongman or powerlifting if they wanted to. I personally think that those leviathans on the World’s Strongest Man could definitely make the switch over to Football if they practiced on skill and plays.
Could you imagine Zydrunas Savickas or Raimond Bergmanis as an Offensive Lineman, damn that would be a two man wrecking crew.
P.s. don’t give me that b.s. that they couldn’t handle football, they have more than enough endurance to handle the rigors of football, see them on World’s Strongest Man and you will know what i am talking about![/quote]
The strongmen would probably tear up the league if they could ever get to the point of attack…but they cannot. The difference in the game is due to power and speed, and has nothing to do with strength…
Frankly, this thread shows two things:
A) Announcers know very little about feats of strength.
B) 99% of the people here do not understand that strength doesn’t equal power.
This thread is a perfect example of why you are jock sniffers in the first place. Sit around and argue over a point that is so unrelated to the sport. Do you all know how much Tiki weighs also, and what he eats for pregame? Dorks.
Sit around arguing over crap like this, and in a week you will be asking: Do you think CT or Ian’s or Parisi’s or Charlie Francis’s or Louie’s crap is worth it?
Well, for one, if you dropped the $40, your threads might actually be on point…
Performance matters.
Performance matters.
Performance matters.
Performance matters.
Pure strength and strength endurance, while raising the potential for more power, actually train the wrong firing pattern that is used in sport. RFD is slow, and so is the release of tension on the back end.
Both of these traits are exactly why there are thousands of guys who are very strong in the U.S… but only a handful can play in the League. These traits work against the very thing lacking in 99.999999% of the population…speed.
Squat 1000 pounds? Bench 600 pounds?
Too bad neither of these gets you to the point of attack.
So, you’re cut. Go compete on ESPN 8 (the Ocho).
Impressive? Of course…stunningly.
But to compare pure strength and strength endurance guys to Power guys is ignorant.
Now, is Louie right that most linemen in college are damned sad in terms of MaxStrength?..yes, of course. Their needs are very skewed towards the Strength and Force areas of the force curve…
But linebackers, and skill guys all reside in the Power and Pure Speed areas…
Assuming
Pure Strength - Force - Power - Speed
or
Strength - Strength-Speed - Speed Strength - Speed
So yes, in terms of putting up the numbers of an NFL guy, there are tens or hundreds of thousands of guys in the US who can…
Bench Press my wind slow strong guy. Because I just caught the toss sweep and turned the corner… back to the weightroom big boy. Quit kidding yourself…
Strength? Check.
Elastic Qualities? Nope.
Muscle and tendon conditioning to dampen inhibition? Nope.
Correct recruitment patterns? Nope.
Tendon stiffness trained to maximize spring? Nope.
Well, well.
The you aren’t going to be playing in the League any time soon…no matter what you press or squat.
Weight room hero. On the field zero.
Is Tiki strong? Fairly.
Is Tiki Powerful? Amazingly.
Can Tiki absorb extreme levels of force without triggering inhibitors (muscular and tendon)? Yes.
Does Tiki’s force display curve have a very steep slope on both sides of the curve? Yes.
Do Tiki’s plantar flexors display incredible stiffness while moving? Yes.
There are many, many aspects of performance training, and lifting weights, yes even very heavy ones (which I DO advocate, not matter what the dim who read this might infer) is only a very small piece of the puzzle.
So repeat after me 10,000 times:
Strength Training is not Performance Training.
This all being said, I would love to choke the guys who oversee the yearly SI “Look at the Kool Crap the NFL guys Do” article. At least get the jock sniffers off doing the article, and get some real coaches to actually write a piece with some analysis.
Speed Endurance does not equal speed.
Cutting in an agility ladder creates the same forces that a 10 year old girl creates during a club soccer game. Appropriate for Beginning to Intermediate athletes… does this include NFL guys?
The list goes on and on…
If you truly cared about performance, cared about what makes these players great, revered athleticism, then you would display your respect by studying why they can do what they do…
But that may mean turning off the TV. Quit sitting there dreaming of SOME DAY on the couch, and go volunteer at a local performance facility. Sack up and work through works by Siff, Zatsiorsky, and all of the men who are featured by Sportivny Press.
Why can I get 9 hours of sleep every single night? Because in the 15 I am awake, I don’t watch about living, I don’t read about living, I live.
T_Men or Jock Sniffers?
Jumanji
[quote]wesstangl wrote:
nolecat wrote:
I have seen some clips of ball players working out. And it is true, many of them never squat near parallel. It suprising how bad their form and technique is. None of their lifts would ever pass competition regulations. HOWEVER, there are plenty I have seen that can out-lift the best of the best!
Does it benfit the players to squat too parelle or beyond? I cnat see how a parelle squat would be sports specific for football.
Getting off topic , I ve noticed that alot of athletes dont squat near paralle. Im guessing , is that its not sport specific.
[/quote]
I’ve noticed that practically no one squats near parallel; athletes are not an exceptional case. The best part is M&F where their descriptions of exercises don’t match the pictures of the bbers doing them.
[quote]Scott Shetler wrote:
Viking69 wrote:
Just like when I played ball, all the players lifts are mostly BS. 1/4 500lb squats, bounce presses,etc, etc.
Try using your arms next time you squat to pull you up, you could add 200lbs.
I want my trainer to be a fat guy who has never been in the shape I wanna be in. Hooray.
He’s a football player, not a weightlifter or powerlifter. Honestly it doesn’t matter which lifts he does or doesn’t do as long as his performance improves. Deny he isn’t having one of his better seasons yet.
BTW-his trainer is a former powerlifting champ and strongman competitor so yeah, he may not be the pretty boys that most here are so fond of, but I am sure he knows a tad bit more about strength development than most of the internet superstars here. Think a pretty physique matters in football? Look at David “wonderboy” Boston, man, being all jacked and shredded certainly helped him! Oh wait, does he still play? Well, at least he has abs!
Gimme a break…
[/quote]
I did not imply that the trainer isn’t strong or intelligent. I implied that he’s a fat ass and that he needs to exercise more before he dies of a heart attack.
[quote]Jumanji wrote:
A long ass silly rant about people wasting time discussing silly things thereby causing me to waste my time reading it.
[/quote]
Good job. 
Nicely put Jumanji.
I’m sure Tiki gives a shit that he can’t squat 800. But the guy is a football player, and a great one at that. He has to worry too much about being “fast” and “agile” to worry about PR’s, I would say. And those two words are completely foreign to powerlifters.
As mentioned in the most recent article, weight room strength doesn’t always carry over to the real world. Look at Randy Moss, that skinny bastard. Or Donald Driver in that article (not a huge guy). They just got the skills…the muscle comes second.