Thoughts about Obama

Off Topic Politics & World Issues
81

[quote]UtahLama wrote:

[quote]TDub301 wrote:

[quote]ZEB wrote:

[quote]TDub301 wrote:

[quote]ZEB wrote:
the top 1% pay 37% of all taxes (those evil rich sure do pay a lot huh?).[/quote]

But shouldn’t they pay a lot? Aren’t they in possession of more than 37% of this countries wealth?[/quote]

You have the typical liberal take on it. They’re in “possession” of wealth so therefore the top 10% should pay 70% of all income taxes? If a good fairy flew down and dropped bags of mony on their heads perhaps you’d have a point. But most of the top 10% worked their asses off to start a business (which helps the economy by creating jobs) and their reward is paying over 60% in Federal state, property (and many other) taxes? How does that reward success? It punishes success and that’s what’s wrong!

One quick example of why a progressive tax system harms the economy.

If you owned a business and you implemented a plan where the top 10 sales people got a lower commission than the bottom 10 sales people what would be their incentive?

Don’t feel too bad though Obama doesn’t get it either - That’s why we need someone who actually functioned in the real world as our next President.

[/quote]

I feel like if the top whatever percent has 70% of the income, then they should pay 70% of the taxes. I don’t care if it’s a single person who makes 70%, that guy is rich as fuck and got that way by taking advantage of the way this country is set up. Giving up a specific percentage of his income, like everyone else, is a good way to give back to that country. But since he has more income, his percentage is higher.

[/quote]

Well then there is much less motivation for anybody to start a business.

Why work your ass off your whole life, employee many, many people…just so the government can take most of your shit and give it to people to lazy to work?

Jesus man, are you serious?
[/quote]

Most of these guys only know what they hear the main stream liberal media espouse–Sad.

82

I don’t get this ‘the lower 48% income earners don’t pay any taxes’. Last time I checked, when I did part time min. wage jobs in college, I was getting taxed.

83

[quote]Fletch1986 wrote:
I don’t get this ‘the lower 48% income earners don’t pay any taxes’. Last time I checked, when I did part time min. wage jobs in college, I was getting taxed.[/quote]

Well you better check again!

84

[quote]Fletch1986 wrote:
I don’t get this ‘the lower 48% income earners don’t pay any taxes’. Last time I checked, when I did part time min. wage jobs in college, I was getting taxed.[/quote]

Were you claiming yourself or were your parents claiming you?

You were being withheld on, which your employer is required to do, but if you claimed yourself, I would be surprised if you weren’t getting most if not all back.

And you most certainly paid into Social Security and Medicare. Everyone pays into Medicare, everyone. (Unless all your income is investment, in which case you paid into the first time you were taxed on that money.) Everyone pays into SS up to the 109k or whatever the limit is in the particular year in question.

edit: were v where

85

I claimed myself. I double checked. I did get it all back. Zeb was right. Doesn’t mean I have to like it! :stuck_out_tongue:

86

ZEB,

“That is what the people of Mass wanted on a state wide basis. as they are more liberal than the general population. And keep in mind they could opt out there were no penalties if they didn’t want it. Quite a bit different than Obamacare, either join or go to jail! Nice. More freedom from the democrats.”

-Just so you are aware, there are no criminal penalties for refusing to buy into the healthcare program (it says so on the waivers page) and there are no IRS penalties or criminal penalties for not paying the $300 fine for not enrolling in it either. Your right wing hyperbole is a little exhausting.

87

Currently in Mass, if you don’t have insurance for a 4 month or more period you pay an additional tax, prorated on how many months you didn’t have insurance.

Going from memory:

Year one - no penalty for not having insurance
Year two - $500 fine
Year Three - loss of personal exemption, or a portion thereof
Year four and ever more - additional tax, IE: a fine

(I may be mistaken here, I am going from memory.)

88

Beans,

I was actually talking about Obamacare, I probably didn’t make it clear. Zeb has just been saying over and over you go to jail if you don’t sign up, so he is either uninformed and listening to Rush Limbaugh too often, or he is full of shit, either one works.

89

[quote]BrianHanson wrote:
ZEB,

“That is what the people of Mass wanted on a state wide basis. as they are more liberal than the general population. And keep in mind they could opt out there were no penalties if they didn’t want it. Quite a bit different than Obamacare, either join or go to jail! Nice. More freedom from the democrats.”

-Just so you are aware, there are no criminal penalties for refusing to buy into the healthcare program (it says so on the waivers page) and there are no IRS penalties or criminal penalties for not paying the $300 fine for not enrolling in it either. Your right wing hyperbole is a little exhausting. [/quote]

And your ignorance is usually inexcusable. But if there were ever an excuse for your ignorance it would be that you didn’t read this 2,300 page bill. But most who voted on it didn’t even read it. Does this make you any less of an idiot for posting when you have no idea of what you’re talking about? No.

If you do not obtain health insurance under Obamacare you will be fined $1,900. And if you do not pay that fine you will be charged with a misdemeanor which means you could face up to one year in jail!

http://www.weeklystandard.com/weblogs/TWSFP/2009/09/oneyear_in_jail_or_25000_fine.asp

http://www.drudge.com/archive/125520/buy-obamacare-go-jail

For specific wording in the bill skip to :48 on this Youtube clip

Really B r i a n did you think that the US government would not follow through with penalties if people didn’t want Obamacare? Knowing that about 65% of the population has rejected this plan they had to put teeth in the bill.

I urge you to stop drinking the liberal koolaide.

90

ZEB,

It is a $95 fee if you refuse to sign up. There are no criminal penalties, look at the bill, it is in the waiver section it says that there are no criminal penalties, there are no IRS garnishments, the individual mandate is not much of a mandate, if you choose not to sign up, you can easily avoid it.

The section titled “Waiver of Criminal Prosecution” states that in the event that the taxpayer fails to pat the fine there will be no prosecution or criminal proceedings related to not paying. There is no real enforcement in place, nobody will be going to jail, the fine can increase over time but there will be no IRS garnishments for people that refuse to pay. Sorry ZEB, you right wing masters have failed you.

91

it makes me sick to be an american when i read a load of liberal/ left wing bullshit! did you liberals not grow up with fathers or grandfathers who fought for this country? or that were self made self reliant men? I do not get how america is breeding this plauge within our own borders. Prime example of LIBERAL LEFT WING ideals not working CALIFORNIA! is that how we want the whole US???

come on people use your commom sense, if you have any, and see it doesnt work… communism looks real good on paper too… until its put into action and fails miserably EVERY SINGLE TIME! Simple fact of the matter is America was created and designed to be FREE and to have safe gaurds against tyrany… compromising the constitution with anti gun laws, over taxation, and invasion of privacy is IMMORAL and ILEGAL to you if you are a TRUE AMERICAN.

Look at why the American Revolution took place… thats the reason for our Constitution, the British governments unfair laws and policies. Our government is the new Britain and individual citizens are the new Colonies. only way this Country can be where it should be is to erase our current politicians and return back to how things once were… where a man still had a job besides being a politician and take away the obserd salaries, vacation days, and lifelong benefits of SERVING for your district… id much rather provide those things to combat veterans than a politican who probably doesnt need or deserve those benefits.

and here’s something to think about… if a man is making 1 million a year and being taxed 40% the government gets $400,000, but if you reduced the taxes where that same man was able to grow and expand where he can make 10 million a year and tax him 10% you will get a million in taxes. very simple lower taxes means more incentive and more growth, and more money for the government… win win situation

92

[quote]BrianHanson wrote:
ZEB,

It is a $95 fee if you refuse to sign up. There are no criminal penalties, look at the bill, it is in the waiver section it says that there are no criminal penalties, there are no IRS garnishments, the individual mandate is not much of a mandate, if you choose not to sign up, you can easily avoid it.[/quote]

Most gigantic government programs are not totally volunteer. What you are saying in essence is that the government couldn’t are less if you sign up or not because national health care will work if 65% of the people refuse it. Tell me how that works?

No YOU have failed to understand. Tell me Einstein what happens if the person does not pay the fine? The government just walks away saying “oh well Joe Jones decided he didn’t want to pay the fine…that’s okay because we all have rose colored glasses on and we don’t need everyone’s participation because money comes from the sky.”

Obviously that’s not the case. National health care only works with virtually complete participation. That means they must FORCE you to participate!

What happens if you don’t pay the fine is P R O S E C U T I O N.

Step back from you illogical liberal stupor and think clearly for a change. If there were no prosecution why would anyone pay the fine?

I’ll give you a simple example how the government issues fines, but no jail time unless. you don’t comply. If you get a speeding ticket you are not hauled off to jail. But it is a fine for not complying with the law. But, if you ignore the ticket by not showing up in court, or don’t mail in a plea a warrant will be issued for your arrest. And that is how the government assures that you in fact pay the fine. What you’re claiming is not only NOT in the bill but also totally illogical. Why would anyone bother with a fine if there was no penalty associated with NOT paying the fine?

By the way I posted the specific language of the bill on Youtube. If you read it and still don’t understand it or if you’re joined at the hip with msnbc and refuse to acknowledge the facts that’s your problem. You can put that one with your other, more famous inconsistencies such as claiming the be a Catholic yet being pro abortion.

Now get busy and click on the links that I sent you in the previous email. And for some reason if you want to continue this nonsense start posting some back up facts if you can find any.

93

[quote]andy.steven wrote:

and here’s something to think about… if a man is making 1 million a year and being taxed 40% the government gets $400,000, but if you reduced the taxes where that same man was able to grow and expand where he can make 10 million a year and tax him 10% you will get a million in taxes. very simple lower taxes means more incentive and more growth, and more money for the government… win win situation [/quote]

What you’ve described is growing the tax base. Instead of over taxing the few you keep taxes low and those few grow larger and better yet many more join them this expands the economy and hence the tax base. Ronald Reagan proved this in the 1980’s when he lowered taxes for all Americans and increased the tax base.

One more point, when has government ever spent our money efficiently? Does anyone honestly think that paying more in taxes will go directly to paying down debt? Higher taxes which Obama has promised for January if he’s reelected will go to fund even more government programs. We have a government that is spending uncontrollably and giving them even more money is like giving an alcoholic another six pack of beer.

94

ZEB,

Unfortunately the bill itself states that you will not be criminally prosecuted for failure to join a program. It also bars the IRS from garnishing your wages to pay the unpaid bill, or withholding your tax returns. The government won’t be placing a lien on your property or business, they will in fact be doing almost nothing to enforce the mandate. You are either being purposefully dense, or you have been brainwashed by Rush and Hannity to the point where you won’t even read the information when it is available.

95

[quote]BrianHanson wrote:
ZEB,

Unfortunately the bill itself states that you will not be criminally prosecuted for failure to join a program. It also bars the IRS from garnishing your wages to pay the unpaid bill, or withholding your tax returns. The government won’t be placing a lien on your property or business, they will in fact be doing almost nothing to enforce the mandate. You are either being purposefully dense, or you have been brainwashed by Rush and Hannity to the point where you won’t even read the information when it is available.[/quote]

It seems that you are the one who has been brainwashed. Too much msnbc I’m guessing. Look, I’ve posted a part of the bill which backs up my claim. You can refute this with something of relevance if you can find anything. However, just saying “nu uh” isn’t going to do it.

So, put up (as I did) or shut up which is something that I know you find very difficult to do.

96

One more time for both the mentally challenged and the liberal droolers. B r i a n might be both.

They don’t lock you up for not signing up for Obamacare, they first fine you (for not having insurance) and if you don’t pay the fine you are then pursued by the IRS, and if payment is not made it is handled as a non-payment of taxes and you are jailed!

[quote]Americans who fail to pay the penalty for not buying insurance would face legal action from the Internal Revenue Service, according to the Joint Committee on Taxation.

The remarks Thursday from the committeeâ??s chief of staff, Thomas Barthold, seems to further weaken President Barack Obamaâ??s contention last week that the individual mandate penalty, which could go as high as $1,900, is not a tax increase.

Under questioning from Sen. John Ensign (R-Nev.), Barthold said the IRS would take you to court and undertake normal collection proceedings.

Violators could be charged with a misdemeanor and could face up to a year in jail or a $25,000 penalty, Barthold wrote on JCT letterhead. He signed it â??Sincerely, Thomas A. Barthold."[/quote]

http://patdollard.com/2009/09/dont-want-obamacare-jail-time-fines-for-those-who-oppose-new-regime/

97

Sorry guys but this is REALITY…

The country is run by a small oligarchy consisting of the Joint Chiefs, the Intell Agencies, and the Federal Reserve (big banks, rly).

When a new prez gets in, especially if he is stupid/ignorant/naive like Obama, they ask him: “Do your children enjoy their new role?” Most prezs get the hint, that the role of the kiddies is as HOSTAGES. The dude knows that none of these people give two shits about the kids. No prez has had the balls to challenge this and they go along; like how Obama didn’t do most of what he promised.

He knew that anyway because he was already a dummy candidate, most of his record being a made-up pack of lies. But holding the kids hostage is the glue to make sure the dummy doesn’t go off the rails.

The last prez with real balls, Kennedy, was a globalist but hated taking orders. Some of the patriotic stuff got into him from PT-109. He waffled and got taken out by one of the teams.

Nope…Obama or Romney…doesn’t matter. “No one man IS Caesar.”

98

ZEB,

here is one thing, there is actually an entire book but here is a snippet:

"But what many Americans don’t realize is that the individual mandate would affect fewer than two of every 100 people, according to the best estimates. When all is said and done, a few Americans might still refuse to buy insurance - and nothing much will happen to them. There are exceptions for religious objectors and people who still cannot afford a plan. And the law includes only weak fines for mandate violators - token fines the Internal Revenue Service is at this point forbidden to enforce. The mandate brouhaha is truly much ado about almost nothing.

Read more here: http://www.bradenton.com/2012/06/21/4086317/getting-past-health-cares-individual.html#storylink=cpy"

99

BRIAN
simple fact is ZEB is right… Listen to the reasoning…

If you are not punished for not paing the fine why in the FUCK would anyone pay it???
the incentive to pay any fine levied by anyone is the concequences… Do you honestly believe that our government would give you a fine year after year and NEVER collect or punish you?

The IRS may not be the enforing arm on this but does it really matter who inforces it? because we all know it will be enfored one way or another whether its with a new agency or an existing agency.

100

Andy,

There is no enforcement on the books. There is no plan for enforcement in the future. The “we all know it will be” argument only works if it seems reasonable, which it doesn’t. The mandate was never part of the original plan, in fact it was lobbied for by the…wait for it…insurance companies, who subsequently balked when they realized the enforcement plan didn’t exist. The plan without the individual mandate is closer to what Obama discussed during his campaign, the very real possibility exists that the SC might strike down the mandate and leave the rest of the plan intact, which is fine by me.