But what’s the point of circuit if you’re looking for strength? All those movements are heavy and the circuit fashion would take away your focus if anything. Besides, it wouldn’t let me go as heavy on the 2nd and 3rd movement with such little rest. For example, push press for 3 reps @ 80-85% and rest 15-30 secs automatically makes the subsequent bench press of 80-88% feel like 90%+.
[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
[quote]precedent wrote:
[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
[quote]precedent wrote:
Hey CT
I did a ramping session on Chest yesterday and went from (3 reps) 60% 1RM right through and actually pushed Pb on my 10th set (300lb). Straight after I went to Incline DB Press and pushed a PB again (100lb DB’s) 6 reps. I hit Fly’s then weighted dips as well and felt stronger than I have in a long time, then I kinda got confused… I felt like I could do a drop set to finish, back on bench, but after reading so much on here and hearing about CNS optimization etc, I didn’t want to over-do it.
Is it simply a ‘feeling’ thing as to whether I push a drop-set out? Or should I just hit it once a month or so? I’m getting growth and obvious increases in strength and i’ve only been running these methods for 3 weeks. It’s the first time i’ve felt like doing a drop-set. Help required Down Under!
Thank you in advance
Marcus[/quote]
I personally do not like drop set. It is probably one of the worst method to increase overall mechanical loading. It is very stressful on the nervous system. A max reps circuit of 4-5 exercises would be a better choice to complete the workout.[/quote]
Glad I didn’t then! Can you suggest an effective circuit to finish with? I really enjoy plyometrics, not sure if they fit in though.
Marcus
[/quote]
Not in a max reps circuit.
Here are the different types of circuits that I use:
NEURAL CHARGE CIRCUIT: The goal of these sessions is to prime the nervous system prior to a later workout (e.g. am circuit for a pm session) or during an ‘‘off’’ day to promote neural recovery.
These include 2-5 exercises normally targeting the whole body or close to it, focused on explosive exercises (OL variations, plyo, med ball throws, jumps, etc.) the sets should be non-fatiguing, you keep the reps between 3 and 5 and you should actually feel energized after the session. If you are not, you did too much or pushed to close to your limit. Never allow a non-explosive rep.
STRENGTH CIRCUIT: Normally 3 exercises for a similar movement pattern or muscle group. Performed for heavy sets of 3 (compound) to 5 (isolation) reps. There is roughly 15-30 seconds of rest betwen exercises. You go heavy, but always in good form. If form breaks down, it’s too heavy. You can gradually ramp up the weight on these OR fluctuate the weight each cirucit… e.g.
SET 1
Push press 200lbs x 3 reps
Bench press 300lbs x 3 reps
Dips 45lbs x 3 reps
SET 2
Push press 180lbs x 3 reps
Bench press 320lbs x 3 reps
Dips 45lbs x 3 reps
SET 3
Push press 220lbs x 3 reps
Bench press 280lbs x 3 reps
Dips 45lbs x 3 reps
SET 4
Push press 200lbs x 3 reps
Bench press 280lbs x 3 reps
Dips 65lbs x 3 reps
MAX REPS CIRCUIT: Normally performed at the end of a normal session to increase volume. Can either use isolation or compount exercises and works best if you utilize different types of contraction or force curves (e.g. normal, elastic, eccentric-less, blast straps). You never count the reps, only do as many as possible in good form on all exercises but the reps should normally fall between 6 and 12 per exercise.
Here is an example for chest:
A1. Machine chest press
A2. Blast straps push ups
A3. Cable cross-over
A4. Chest press with the sled
If you want to make it into a pure isolation circuit without using multiple contraction types you can do:
A1. Pec Deck machine
A2. Cable cross-over
A3. DB flies with elbows 135 degrees
A4. DB flies with elbows 90 degrees (can even turn into a DB press as fatigue sets in)
You do the MAX REPS circuit only once. The strength circuit can be done 4-6 times but it is performed at the beginning of a workout and the neural charge circuit is done as many time as possible within a 20 minutes time frame.
[/quote]
You mentioned the strength circuit is to be done before a workout. On which day would you recommend this or how many times per week could it be used? Or would that depend on auto-regulation and how the individual feels on a particular day?
If you did the strength circuit as outlined above (pressing workout), how would the rest of the workout look? Sorry for the questions. Love the new info and training ideas and just trying to figure out how to incorporate them into my own training.
[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
[quote]Mutsanah wrote:
[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
[quote]Thy. wrote:
What is the purpose of strength circuit? Do you use around 80% there? [/quote]
Roughly between 80 and 88%, although I never use actual percentage, I make sure that all reps are challenging and solid.
It is mostly used to build functional hypertrophy (size and strength to match).[/quote]
Thib:
What if the goal is ONLY strength and not size? I.E. moving your bench from 350 to 400 without gaining substantial size?
Thanks,
M[/quote]
You could use a 3-2-1 approach. In each strength superset one exercise is performed for 1 rep (roughly 95-97%), one exercise is performed for 2 reps (roughly 90-92%) and one exercise is performed for 3 reps (roughly 85-88%).
Assuming a 350lbs bench, 250lbs push press and 315 incline press it could look like:
SET 1
Bench 335lbs x 1
Push press 225lbs x 2
Incline press 265lbs x 3
SET 2
Push press 240lbs x 1
Incline press 285lbs x 2
Bench 310lbs x 3
SET 3
Incline press 300lbs x 1
Bench 320lbs x 2
Push press 220lbs x 3
Then start a second “wave” ideally using 5-10lbs more per set. So something like this:
SET 4
Bench 345lbs x 1
Push press 235lbs x 2
Incline press 275lbs x 3
SET 5
Push press 245lbs x 1
Incline press 305lbs x 2
Bench 320lbs x 3
SET 6
Incline press 310lbs x 1
Bench 330lbs x 2
Push press 230lbs x 3
I would recommend performing ramping on at least one of those movements before starting the circuit so that you are activated and ready to go.[/quote]
Nice! Thanks, Coach. Right now I am going to do 4 weeks of the WO you gave on Livespill last week. Push from pins above head, military press to push press then bench at end 3-2-1 wave. I am going to shoot for my current 1RM but at the end of the WO. Moving last wave up 10 lbs / week. Finished at 305x1 for last wave of close grip bench last week and it was easy.
Then I will move on to the strength circuit you have just laid out. Thanks! M
[quote]Thy. wrote:
But what’s the point of circuit if you’re looking for strength? All those movements are heavy and the circuit fashion would take away your focus if anything. Besides, it wouldn’t let me go as heavy on the 2nd and 3rd movement with such little rest. For example, push press for 3 reps @ 80-85% and rest 15-30 secs automatically makes the subsequent bench press of 80-88% feel like 90%+.[/quote]
You know so much, which is why you are SO strong… right 
Listen, when I first started to use this circuit I WAS using less weight than if I were to do the movements by themselves. But after 2 weeks of doing two such workouts per week I was strong on all three movements during a circuit than I was 2 weeks earlier doing them by themselves.
The goal here is to be able to eventually be as strong on the movements even after doing the preceding work as if you did it by itself. By then it means that your movements will be stronger when performed alone.
If getting strong was as simple as always using as much weight as you can, then YOU would be super strong because that is what you have been doing for a long time, yet I train female lifters that are stronger than you at a lighter body weight.
[quote]BiP wrote:
[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
I would recommend performing ramping on at least one of those movements before starting the circuit so that you are activated and ready to go.[/quote]
Would clusters from pins before the ramping be ok, or would it be too much?[/quote]
Once a week it would be fine. I did it myself and it is doable. But don’t abuse it.
[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
[quote]BiP wrote:
[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
I would recommend performing ramping on at least one of those movements before starting the circuit so that you are activated and ready to go.[/quote]
Would clusters from pins before the ramping be ok, or would it be too much?[/quote]
Once a week it would be fine. I did it myself and it is doable. But don’t abuse it.[/quote]
Thanks.
[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
I personally do not like drop set. It is probably one of the worst method to increase overall mechanical loading. It is very stressful on the nervous system. A max reps circuit of 4-5 exercises would be a better choice to complete the workout.[/quote]
Why is this CT? It is the same movement pattern so it isn’t as taxing on CNS as it would be if you kept switching movement patterns. You do have a short rest period with drop sets but you would too with the circuit. And with both methods your using ‘a lot’ of weight and reping it out.
Thanks!
Dave
[quote]retailboy wrote:
[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
I personally do not like drop set. It is probably one of the worst method to increase overall mechanical loading. It is very stressful on the nervous system. A max reps circuit of 4-5 exercises would be a better choice to complete the workout.[/quote]
Why is this CT? It is the same movement pattern so it isn’t as taxing on CNS as it would be if you kept switching movement patterns. You do have a short rest period with drop sets but you would too with the circuit. And with both methods your using ‘a lot’ of weight and reping the max you can.
Thanks!
Dave[/quote]
With the circuit, even though you keep the same movement pattern, there are slight technical differences which takes some stress off of the nervous system. Plus, with the circuit you also try to include exercises with different force curves.
Both of these slightly (even significantly in some cases) change motor recruitment which is both more effective and less traumatic.
But if you personally like drop sets, by all mean do them. I hate them myself and do not use them anymore. But others might have different experiences.
[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
[quote]Thy. wrote:
But what’s the point of circuit if you’re looking for strength? All those movements are heavy and the circuit fashion would take away your focus if anything. Besides, it wouldn’t let me go as heavy on the 2nd and 3rd movement with such little rest. For example, push press for 3 reps @ 80-85% and rest 15-30 secs automatically makes the subsequent bench press of 80-88% feel like 90%+.[/quote]
You know so much, which is why you are SO strong… right Listen, when I first started to use this circuit I WAS using less weight than if I were to do the movements by themselves. But after 2 weeks of doing two such workouts per week I was strong on all three movements during a circuit than I was 2 weeks earlier doing them by themselves.
The goal here is to be able to eventually be as strong on the movements even after doing the preceding work as if you did it by itself. By then it means that your movements will be stronger when performed alone.
If getting strong was as simple as always using as much weight as you can, then YOU would be super strong because that is what you have been doing for a long time, yet I train female lifters that are stronger than you at a lighter body weight.[/quote]
Where did that come from?
It was only a question to understand this better, I didn’t contradict your methods.
I post in your section for a while and I never sounded like I know something, especially better than you. I come here only to learn.
What is exactly the point of mocking my strength?
So your female lifters military press more than 70kg or bench more than 110kg at bodyweight lighter than 65kg? Interesting… However it may be, keep in mind that I don’t indulge 199$ worth of cutting edge supplements a day. In fact, I don’t use any.
Seriously, this was a totally unexpected reaction from you.
[quote]
You mentioned the strength circuit is to be done before a workout. On which day would you recommend this or how many times per week could it be used? Or would that depend on auto-regulation and how the individual feels on a particular day?
If you did the strength circuit as outlined above (pressing workout), how would the rest of the workout look? Sorry for the questions. Love the new info and training ideas and just trying to figure out how to incorporate them into my own training.[/quote]
I was wondering the same thing? The videos and the way to set up these workouts seem to be all over the map. So many options etc. Thibs, how do you set these workouts up if someone was only working out once per day? Or, more of a bodypart type split?
Thibs, would the following workout below that you posted a few weeks back, work with incorporating circuits, bands, blast straps, eccentric-less and prowler exercises?
would these options work in addition to the workout below:
- adding eccentric-less exercises immediately after the workout below
- adding a band or blast strap set in between sets of regular exercises (like in the videos)
- adding pm sessions with isolations circuits and/or eccentric-less training (straps, prowler, bands, jumps)
-
Do the main exercise as a ramp for 3-5 reps starting at 50-60%
-
Pick one main assistance that you will do for 3-5 sets of 5 reps with roughly 70-75% (change the weight, up or down, on each set) *if deciding to use 6-8 reps, will have to lower percentage a bit.
-
Pick 4-5 assistance exercises for the muscle group (including some isolation work) and perform them as one ‘‘giant set’’ of max reps, shooting for anywhere between 8 and 10 per exercise.
-
Perform the circuit 1-2 times
[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
[quote]Gup wrote:
Thibs, for the popular push/pull/legs that you advocate, how can one add specialization for arms? Or shoulders? This three day per week routine is very nice but is there any room to focus on a weaker muscle group i.e. arms or shoulders�¢?�¦[/quote]
If you want to specialize on a weak body part, training three times a weak is normally not sufficient, and the push/pull/legs split is not the ideal way to divide your training either. The way I see it you could always do biceps on pulling day, triceps on pushing day and biceps/triceps on leg day (which by extension would become “limb day”).[/quote]
Thanks for the reply.
I am trying to piece something together using your principles that you have outlined for a 3 to 4 sessions/week of a specialization program. The push/pull/legs routine I have never tried before so I was thinking to incorporate an arms specialization into it. But, like you mentioned, and the more I reason about it, it just doesnâ??t seem like a good fit.
What would you recommend for an arms (or shoulders), 3-4 sessions/week specialization routine that would incorporate your principles and would get an okay from you?
Hey CT is it possible to target each of the 3 heads of the VMO independant of one another or have one head be stimulated more than the other one?
[quote]Thy. wrote:
[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
[quote]Thy. wrote:
But what’s the point of circuit if you’re looking for strength? All those movements are heavy and the circuit fashion would take away your focus if anything. Besides, it wouldn’t let me go as heavy on the 2nd and 3rd movement with such little rest. For example, push press for 3 reps @ 80-85% and rest 15-30 secs automatically makes the subsequent bench press of 80-88% feel like 90%+.[/quote]
You know so much, which is why you are SO strong… right Listen, when I first started to use this circuit I WAS using less weight than if I were to do the movements by themselves. But after 2 weeks of doing two such workouts per week I was strong on all three movements during a circuit than I was 2 weeks earlier doing them by themselves.
The goal here is to be able to eventually be as strong on the movements even after doing the preceding work as if you did it by itself. By then it means that your movements will be stronger when performed alone.
If getting strong was as simple as always using as much weight as you can, then YOU would be super strong because that is what you have been doing for a long time, yet I train female lifters that are stronger than you at a lighter body weight.[/quote]
Where did that come from?
It was only a question to understand this better, I didn’t contradict your methods.
I post in your section for a while and I never sounded like I know something, especially better than you. I come here only to learn.
What is exactly the point of mocking my strength?
So your female lifters military press more than 70kg or bench more than 110kg at bodyweight lighter than 65kg? Interesting… However it may be, keep in mind that I don’t indulge 199$ worth of cutting edge supplements a day. In fact, I don’t use any.
Seriously, this was a totally unexpected reaction from you.[/quote]
Obviously you didn’t get my sarcasm. Sorry if you took that the wrong way. But yeah, pound for pound I did train 2 women with bigger lifts. Anyway, if you get past my sense of humor you will notice that I did answer your question.
[quote]Italiano wrote:
I mentionned that I was working on putting together an ‘‘how-to’’ list of how to use the various methods.
Personally I go by in-the-trenches analysis of what I’m seeing. For that reason the whole workout is never planned in advance. I have a goal to accomplish and the methods are layered to accomplish that goal depending on how the body is reacting. In that sense I’m much like the conductor of an orchestra. It’s hard to put my thought process, the art of training, into words. But I’ll do my best in the near future.
Hey CT, I think this got lost somewhere with all of the other threads. Regarding neural charge workouts, if someone were to workout for 2 days, have 2 off days, say monday and tuesday, and then workout another 2 days (so wednesday + thursday here) would it make more sense to have a neural charge workout on the first day off or the 2nd? I would think the 2nd because it will get the NS “charged” closer to the next workout, is that a correct assumption? On the other hand having it on the first day off could help shuttle nutrients and whatnot to the muscles worked heavier the day prior.
[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
[quote]Thy. wrote:
[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
[quote]Thy. wrote:
But what’s the point of circuit if you’re looking for strength? All those movements are heavy and the circuit fashion would take away your focus if anything. Besides, it wouldn’t let me go as heavy on the 2nd and 3rd movement with such little rest. For example, push press for 3 reps @ 80-85% and rest 15-30 secs automatically makes the subsequent bench press of 80-88% feel like 90%+.[/quote]
You know so much, which is why you are SO strong… right Listen, when I first started to use this circuit I WAS using less weight than if I were to do the movements by themselves. But after 2 weeks of doing two such workouts per week I was strong on all three movements during a circuit than I was 2 weeks earlier doing them by themselves.
The goal here is to be able to eventually be as strong on the movements even after doing the preceding work as if you did it by itself. By then it means that your movements will be stronger when performed alone.
If getting strong was as simple as always using as much weight as you can, then YOU would be super strong because that is what you have been doing for a long time, yet I train female lifters that are stronger than you at a lighter body weight.[/quote]
Where did that come from?
It was only a question to understand this better, I didn’t contradict your methods.
I post in your section for a while and I never sounded like I know something, especially better than you. I come here only to learn.
What is exactly the point of mocking my strength?
So your female lifters military press more than 70kg or bench more than 110kg at bodyweight lighter than 65kg? Interesting… However it may be, keep in mind that I don’t indulge 199$ worth of cutting edge supplements a day. In fact, I don’t use any.
Seriously, this was a totally unexpected reaction from you.[/quote]
Obviously you didn’t get my sarcasm. Sorry if you took that the wrong way. But yeah, pound for pound I did train 2 women with bigger lifts. Anyway, if you get past my sense of humor you will notice that I did answer your question.
[/quote]
Luckily, I’m past the point of caring about p4p strength. But even if that’s the case, then thse 2 women are p4p stronger than a lot of people on this site (or in the world). I think there is only a handful of lifters here or anywhere that can bench much more than 1.5xbw or press more than 1xbw.
[quote]Thy. wrote:
[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
[quote]Thy. wrote:
[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
[quote]Thy. wrote:
But what’s the point of circuit if you’re looking for strength? All those movements are heavy and the circuit fashion would take away your focus if anything. Besides, it wouldn’t let me go as heavy on the 2nd and 3rd movement with such little rest. For example, push press for 3 reps @ 80-85% and rest 15-30 secs automatically makes the subsequent bench press of 80-88% feel like 90%+.[/quote]
You know so much, which is why you are SO strong… right Listen, when I first started to use this circuit I WAS using less weight than if I were to do the movements by themselves. But after 2 weeks of doing two such workouts per week I was strong on all three movements during a circuit than I was 2 weeks earlier doing them by themselves.
The goal here is to be able to eventually be as strong on the movements even after doing the preceding work as if you did it by itself. By then it means that your movements will be stronger when performed alone.
If getting strong was as simple as always using as much weight as you can, then YOU would be super strong because that is what you have been doing for a long time, yet I train female lifters that are stronger than you at a lighter body weight.[/quote]
Where did that come from?
It was only a question to understand this better, I didn’t contradict your methods.
I post in your section for a while and I never sounded like I know something, especially better than you. I come here only to learn.
What is exactly the point of mocking my strength?
So your female lifters military press more than 70kg or bench more than 110kg at bodyweight lighter than 65kg? Interesting… However it may be, keep in mind that I don’t indulge 199$ worth of cutting edge supplements a day. In fact, I don’t use any.
Seriously, this was a totally unexpected reaction from you.[/quote]
Obviously you didn’t get my sarcasm. Sorry if you took that the wrong way. But yeah, pound for pound I did train 2 women with bigger lifts. Anyway, if you get past my sense of humor you will notice that I did answer your question.
[/quote]
Luckily, I’m past the point of caring about p4p strength. But even if that’s the case, then thse 2 women are p4p stronger than a lot of people on this site (or in the world). I think there is only a handful of lifters here or anywhere that can bench much more than 1.5xbw or press more than 1xbw.
[/quote]
Wow, Thy - no offense intended, but man…you really gotta get out more.
[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
christianthibaudeau_1@hotmail.com
[/quote]
Hi CT,
I sent you an e-mail at the address above. I’d appreciate it if you could get back to me whenever you have some free time.
Thanks for all the info! This forum rules!
[quote]pumped340 wrote:
Hey CT, I think this got lost somewhere with all of the other threads. Regarding neural charge workouts, if someone were to workout for 2 days, have 2 off days, say monday and tuesday, and then workout another 2 days (so wednesday + thursday here) would it make more sense to have a neural charge workout on the first day off or the 2nd? I would think the 2nd because it will get the NS “charged” closer to the next workout, is that a correct assumption? On the other hand having it on the first day off could help shuttle nutrients and whatnot to the muscles worked heavier the day prior. [/quote]
I will be interested to see how CT answers this, but my second choice would be to do it both rest days, third choice would be to do it the second rest day only, the day before you lift heavy again.
First choice? Go to the park or the beach with your son, your wife, or a training partner, take your shoes off and play a little frisbee. Have some fun out in the sun, work up a light sweat. Do this on the first day off, or something like it, then a “neural charge” workout the second off day. That, my friends, would be optimal IMO for 2 days off.