Thibs New Training Questions #3

Training
61

Thibs,

I’ve been front squatting for 3 months and recently started switching to back squats. However, I find that I have problems keeping my heels down and my knees drift too far forward. I’m thinking about switching to a powerlifting low bar squat, so my questions are:

  1. Is it smart to cycle regular powerlifting (or even high bar olympic) squats and box squats every 2-3 weeks so I won’t lose my stretch reflex? Do you like touch and go or paused box squats?

  2. I really like front squats, am I missing out on anything if I don’t do back squats?

  3. For the low bar position, is the bar suppose to be resting on the rear delts? Because when I rest them on my rear delts and point my elbow downwards, the bar feels like it is going to slip.

Thank you.

62

Hi CT,

I had a question about how to use isometrics to address a squatting strength imbalance between my two legs. My right leg is WAY stronger than my left at the bottom part of the range of motion. I didn’t get answer before and I guess I asked too generally.

My question now is about the actual plan I’m thinking about. It is a use of isometrics based on your ratchet activation technique. I would love to get your criticism:

I’d be doing one-legged squats (weighted pistols) to correct the imbalance.

For activation purposes, between warm-up sets, I’ll do one isometric hold just before my butt touches my calves, for 10 seconds. Then, I’ll immediately do an isometric hold just below parallel for 10 seconds.

About 3-5 minutes after this pre-exercise activation, I’ll do my work sets like rachets â?¦

weak side: 1 rep, with a 5-sec isometric hold at bottom of the concentric phase
strong side: 1 regular rep

weak side: 3 reps, the first 2 are regular reps and the final 1 has a 10-second isometric hold at bottom of the eccentric phase
strong side: 3 regular reps

Repeat the rachet 2 more times.

After this, I’ll do regular step-ups – no isometrics – for 3x6 reps for each leg.

On another day of the week, I’ll do regular barbell back squats. Do you think this could be an effective approach to improve my left-right imbalance? Would you recommend changes or something totally different?

Any advice you have would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks,
Brian

63

[quote]Brian Smith wrote:
Hi CT,

I had a question about how to use isometrics to address a squatting strength imbalance between my two legs. My right leg is WAY stronger than my left at the bottom part of the range of motion. I didn’t get answer before and I guess I asked too generally.

My question now is about the actual plan I’m thinking about. It is a use of isometrics based on your ratchet activation technique. I would love to get your criticism:

I’d be doing one-legged squats (weighted pistols) to correct the imbalance.

For activation purposes, between warm-up sets, I’ll do one isometric hold just before my butt touches my calves, for 10 seconds. Then, I’ll immediately do an isometric hold just below parallel for 10 seconds.

About 3-5 minutes after this pre-exercise activation, I’ll do my work sets like rachets â?¦

weak side: 1 rep, with a 5-sec isometric hold at bottom of the concentric phase
strong side: 1 regular rep

weak side: 3 reps, the first 2 are regular reps and the final 1 has a 10-second isometric hold at bottom of the eccentric phase
strong side: 3 regular reps

Repeat the rachet 2 more times.

After this, I’ll do regular step-ups – no isometrics – for 3x6 reps for each leg.

On another day of the week, I’ll do regular barbell back squats. Do you think this could be an effective approach to improve my left-right imbalance? Would you recommend changes or something totally different?

Any advice you have would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks,
Brian[/quote]

Some general comments…

  1. I do not like isometric HOLDS for activation purposes. I find that they don’t transfer well to concentric (or lifting) strength. First of all because neurologically speaking they are basically a VERY VERY VERY slow eccentric action and eccentric actions have a different recruitment pattern than concentric ones.

Second, they are submaximal by nature and devoid of acceleration. To be “activating” a movement needs either a high level of force/muscular tension production (a near maximal effort) or a high level of acceleration. Isometric holds have neither.

  1. The strength imbalance might be technique-related. And even if technique is not the CAUSE of the imbalance, over time you probably changed your motor pattern to accommodate the imbalance. So correcting the imbalance itself is not likely to be enough to solve the problem. You will basically learn to squat again from scratch.

  2. Look at your everyday posture an actions as they may be among the causes for our problem. For example, if you have a natural tendency to stand with more weight on one leg then the CNS might become more efficient at utilizing this leg. Not to mention that it might lead to a deviation or the hips which might transfer to your squatting form.

64

[quote]Mondy wrote:
Thibs,

I’ve been front squatting for 3 months and recently started switching to back squats. However, I find that I have problems keeping my heels down and my knees drift too far forward. I’m thinking about switching to a powerlifting low bar squat, so my questions are:

  1. Is it smart to cycle regular powerlifting (or even high bar olympic) squats and box squats every 2-3 weeks so I won’t lose my stretch reflex? Do you like touch and go or paused box squats?

  2. I really like front squats, am I missing out on anything if I don’t do back squats?

  3. For the low bar position, is the bar suppose to be resting on the rear delts? Because when I rest them on my rear delts and point my elbow downwards, the bar feels like it is going to slip.

Thank you. [/quote]

  1. Unless you are a powerlifter, competing with a squat suit, I would use box squatting as your main form of squat. You can use high box squat as an activation tool, but not as your main leg builder. I rarely use them myself or with my clients. They are tool that was developed by powerlifters for a specific reason and somehow made their way to the general training population.

  2. If you are deadlifting, probably not if you are also doing front squats. However the fact that you are having trouble performing a proper back squat tells me that you shouldn’t avoid doing them right now.

  3. Simple answer: build bigger traps and rear delts!

65

[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:

[quote]Mondy wrote:
Thibs,

I’ve been front squatting for 3 months and recently started switching to back squats. However, I find that I have problems keeping my heels down and my knees drift too far forward. I’m thinking about switching to a powerlifting low bar squat, so my questions are:

  1. Is it smart to cycle regular powerlifting (or even high bar olympic) squats and box squats every 2-3 weeks so I won’t lose my stretch reflex? Do you like touch and go or paused box squats?

  2. I really like front squats, am I missing out on anything if I don’t do back squats?

  3. For the low bar position, is the bar suppose to be resting on the rear delts? Because when I rest them on my rear delts and point my elbow downwards, the bar feels like it is going to slip.

Thank you. [/quote]

  1. Unless you are a powerlifter, competing with a squat suit, I would use box squatting as your main form of squat. You can use high box squat as an activation tool, but not as your main leg builder. I rarely use them myself or with my clients. They are tool that was developed by powerlifters for a specific reason and somehow made their way to the general training population.

  2. If you are deadlifting, probably not if you are also doing front squats. However the fact that you are having trouble performing a proper back squat tells me that you shouldn’t avoid doing them right now.

  3. Simple answer: build bigger traps and rear delts!

[/quote]

Hey Coach, what would you recommend to use for squats when focusing on deadstop work?

66

Thib, what are the pros and cons (in terms of muscle recruitment and muscle work) of switching as fast as possible from eccentric to concentric phase and, on the other hand, “dead start” drills like box squat or floor press, in which the miotatic reflex is deleted?.

Thanks in advance.

67

Hey Thib. I noticed in the I,Bodybuilder videos you tell Kevin to either shrug his back or keeps his delts retracted for back thickness can you please go into detail. Would you recommend it when pulling from the start or as a shrugging movement at the end of the lift? Thanks for your help.

68

Christian Thibaudeau wrote:

[quote]

Some general comments…

  1. I do not like isometric HOLDS for activation purposes. I find that they don’t transfer well to concentric (or lifting) strength. First of all because neurologically speaking they are basically a VERY VERY VERY slow eccentric action and eccentric actions have a different recruitment pattern than concentric ones.

Second, they are submaximal by nature and devoid of acceleration. To be “activating” a movement needs either a high level of force/muscular tension production (a near maximal effort) or a high level of acceleration. Isometric holds have neither.

  1. The strength imbalance might be technique-related. And even if technique is not the CAUSE of the imbalance, over time you probably changed your motor pattern to accommodate the imbalance. So correcting the imbalance itself is not likely to be enough to solve the problem. You will basically learn to squat again from scratch.

  2. Look at your everyday posture an actions as they may be among the causes for our problem. For example, if you have a natural tendency to stand with more weight on one leg then the CNS might become more efficient at utilizing this leg. Not to mention that it might lead to a deviation or the hips which might transfer to your squatting form.[/quote]

Thanks very much, CT. I’ll reevaluate my approach.

And I’ll avoid pre-exercise holds. Umm… Do you still recommend what you called (in HTMB) an “overcoming-isometric” and “functional isometric action” for 5 seconds as a potentiation technique?

I’m wondering if you’ll use pins for this purpose in your legs phase of I, Bodybuilder.

69

[quote]Brian Smith wrote:
Christian Thibaudeau wrote:

Yes, overcoming isometrics and functional isometrics are great. They are concentric in neural drive and thus have a positive transfer on concentric strength.

70

[quote]Addweight wrote:
Thib, what are the pros and cons (in terms of muscle recruitment and muscle work) of switching as fast as possible from eccentric to concentric phase and, on the other hand, “dead start” drills like box squat or floor press, in which the miotatic reflex is deleted?.

Thanks in advance.[/quote]

Going for a fast turnaround = greater use of the myotatic stretch reflex which increases force production. A rapid turnaround (switch from eccentric to concentric) is a great growth and strength stimulus as it puts a lot of force on the muscle in a stretched position. There is also evidence that over the long run this kind of muscle action leads to a more fast-twitch like profile of the muscle.

Starting from a deadstart = greater muscle tension because the myotatic stretch reflex can’t contribute as much. The body is efficient at utilizing the stretch reflex to produce the required force during the initial portion of the range of motion. As such, the nervous system can “learn” to reduce muscle force production during that initial part of the range of motion since it relies on the stretch reflex.

By using deadstart movements you are forcing the nervous system to “learn” how to produce more force via muscle contraction during the initial phase of the ROM.

This is why a combination of both is ideal for maximum strength gains.

71

Repost from prev thread…

hey there CT…need to know your thoughts…

I am 6 wks out from figure comp…diet is working and just trying to cut any other fat thats willing to come off…wanted to share my supp list and have your input…i’m small so tend to cut accordingly…

height 5’1", weight 104-108…
Monday - max upper body with 20 min of HITT(sprints-15 sec on, 45 sec rest, highest incline, increase speed each time)
Tuesday - rep lower body, abs
Weds - complexes, no wieghts just throw the bar around without letting go for 8 exercises, 8 reps, 4 times, next week will do 5 times
Thurday - rep upper body with 20 min of HITT(same as above)
Friday - max lower body, abs

*so post recovery i do 1 scoop Surge with one scoop of L=Leucine and one scoop of creatine on weight training days- is this enough considering bw? suggestions? frequency? Should I cut out all together being so close?

*i have been taking i scoop MAG-10 before bed, normally would just do shake in off season…need help with recovery right now…really sore daily from pushing it…is this effective?

supplements i take:
Metabolic Drive protein x3 to 4 per day, always add one scoop of L-Leucine to my shakes
solid meals are for sure one maybe 2, otherwise a shake
Se7en-2/day
BCAA’s-3 tabs pre and then 3 tabs post workout,…weights and cardio and also take 2 tabs before bed…ok for bw???
Flameout x4/day, 1 in am and 3 before bed
HOT-ROX only now til comp…2/day
Superfood 1/day
ZMA 2 before bed

  • should i add Beta7 for comp prep period? just don’t want to get over powered on stage, but appreciate my small frame

thanks in advance for your help…just want to go win this thing!!! love to have your thoughts!! if you have quetions let me know!!

also i want to tell you I admire the time and effort you put in to helping others…it doesn’t go without notice…i read tons of your feedback, along with others and just want to mention how grateful i am personally that you make such an effort, so kudos to you for that!! Thanks much!

72

[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:

[quote]Addweight wrote:
Thib, what are the pros and cons (in terms of muscle recruitment and muscle work) of switching as fast as possible from eccentric to concentric phase and, on the other hand, “dead start” drills like box squat or floor press, in which the miotatic reflex is deleted?.

Thanks in advance.[/quote]

Going for a fast turnaround = greater use of the myotatic stretch reflex which increases force production. A rapid turnaround (switch from eccentric to concentric) is a great growth and strength stimulus as it puts a lot of force on the muscle in a stretched position. There is also evidence that over the long run this kind of muscle action leads to a more fast-twitch like profile of the muscle.

Starting from a deadstart = greater muscle tension because the myotatic stretch reflex can’t contribute as much. The body is efficient at utilizing the stretch reflex to produce the required force during the initial portion of the range of motion. As such, the nervous system can “learn” to reduce muscle force production during that initial part of the range of motion since it relies on the stretch reflex.

By using deadstart movements you are forcing the nervous system to “learn” how to produce more force via muscle contraction during the initial phase of the ROM.

This is why a combination of both is ideal for maximum strength gains.[/quote]

So where do paused-reps fit into this?

73

[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:

[quote]Addweight wrote:
Thib, what are the pros and cons (in terms of muscle recruitment and muscle work) of switching as fast as possible from eccentric to concentric phase and, on the other hand, “dead start” drills like box squat or floor press, in which the miotatic reflex is deleted?.

Thanks in advance.[/quote]

Going for a fast turnaround = greater use of the myotatic stretch reflex which increases force production. A rapid turnaround (switch from eccentric to concentric) is a great growth and strength stimulus as it puts a lot of force on the muscle in a stretched position. There is also evidence that over the long run this kind of muscle action leads to a more fast-twitch like profile of the muscle.

Starting from a deadstart = greater muscle tension because the myotatic stretch reflex can’t contribute as much. The body is efficient at utilizing the stretch reflex to produce the required force during the initial portion of the range of motion. As such, the nervous system can “learn” to reduce muscle force production during that initial part of the range of motion since it relies on the stretch reflex.

By using deadstart movements you are forcing the nervous system to “learn” how to produce more force via muscle contraction during the initial phase of the ROM.

This is why a combination of both is ideal for maximum strength gains.[/quote]

Is this contributing to why the deadlift is such a widely beneficial excersise, and most people are succesful with it? We’re forced to start from a deadstart. Compared to f.ex the benchpress where a lot of people traditionally are not starting from a deadstart nor going for the fast turn-around.

On top of that it’s an excersise where people tend to stop the set when loosing good form in order not to get injured (in essence auto-regulating?). It’s rare to see people grind too much with the deadlift week after week.

74

[quote]Hoejer wrote:

[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:

[quote]Addweight wrote:
Thib, what are the pros and cons (in terms of muscle recruitment and muscle work) of switching as fast as possible from eccentric to concentric phase and, on the other hand, “dead start” drills like box squat or floor press, in which the miotatic reflex is deleted?.

Thanks in advance.[/quote]

Going for a fast turnaround = greater use of the myotatic stretch reflex which increases force production. A rapid turnaround (switch from eccentric to concentric) is a great growth and strength stimulus as it puts a lot of force on the muscle in a stretched position. There is also evidence that over the long run this kind of muscle action leads to a more fast-twitch like profile of the muscle.

Starting from a deadstart = greater muscle tension because the myotatic stretch reflex can’t contribute as much. The body is efficient at utilizing the stretch reflex to produce the required force during the initial portion of the range of motion. As such, the nervous system can “learn” to reduce muscle force production during that initial part of the range of motion since it relies on the stretch reflex.

By using deadstart movements you are forcing the nervous system to “learn” how to produce more force via muscle contraction during the initial phase of the ROM.

This is why a combination of both is ideal for maximum strength gains.[/quote]

Is this contributing to why the deadlift is such a widely beneficial excersise, and most people are succesful with it? We’re forced to start from a deadstart. Compared to f.ex the benchpress where a lot of people traditionally are not starting from a deadstart nor going for the fast turn-around.

On top of that it’s an excersise where people tend to stop the set when loosing good form in order not to get injured (in essence auto-regulating?). It’s rare to see people grind too much with the deadlift week after week. [/quote]

All good points. And I’ll add that this is why I normally prefer to restart every deadlift rep from a deadstart; do not bounce it on the floor.

75

Hi CT

I usually wake up in the middle of the night to go to the bathroom. While I am up I drink a whey/cassein shake before i go to bed again.

Would it be better to replace this shake with a pulse?

76

Hey thib,

a few posts ago you said you don’t care for isometric holds for activation purposes. How about pushing against pins such as in the bench in a rack. What point is the most beneficial for the bench, the bottom, halfway or close to the top?

77

[quote]RawMinded wrote:
Hey thib,

a few posts ago you said you don’t care for isometric holds for activation purposes. How about pushing against pins such as in the bench in a rack. What point is the most beneficial for the bench, the bottom, halfway or close to the top? [/quote]

These are overcoming isometrics. Yes, they work well.

78

I may be wrong, I believe I read in a post of yours recently that you don’t like to take 2 days off in a row from lifting. Is there a reason for that?

79

Hi coach,

As I can only fit in 3 training sessions per week I’m doing the following, based on your previous recommendations:

  • Tuesday: Upper body
  • Wednesday: Lower body
  • Saterday: Full body

I have done already a lot of reading on this forum and am applying key principles such as perfect rep technique. When using the split above:

  1. Would you recommend working more often to max load point? The rational being that because of lower frequency, one can/should go beyond the max force point more often (lower frequency, higher intensity thus closer to failure).

  2. Any other suggestions to get as much as possible out of 3 sessions per week?

My apologies if this has been answered before and I overlooked it.

Congrats with “I, bodybuilder”, whereas some people where sceptic before the release of the programme, I think you largely exceeded the expectations of anyone!

80

hey Thib,

I’ve been experimenting with wide grip bench and wide stance squats in addition to normal grip and stance movements. I can’t go as heavy as the regular movement on these but i ramp up to a heavy 3 reps. I know that the wide grip bench stresses the shoulder alot but i still try to tuck my elbows in rather than flare them out and it has helped in not killing my shoulders. Do you see any advantage of doing wide grip and stance exercises or shall i just stick to the basics?