The Westside Method Thread

Training Powerlifting
721

[quote]louiek wrote:
Should I be keeping a specific cycle of ME movements? Or can I just pick whatever-the-hell-ME-lift I want each week?[/quote]

Some very broad sweeping examples exist as following for ME work:

Weak Bottom portion: dead bench, pause bench; both can be used with bands/chains

Weak Mid-point: floor press, 1-3 board, again can use bands/chains

Weak Top-end: 4-5 board, lots of band/chain

There’s also weaknesses that aren’t so obvious like maybe you just can’t get the lift because you’re not stable enough, not because the prime-movers aren’t strong enough. Many can overcome bench plateaus by getting their back and/or lats stronger.

Granted, depending on how you’re shaped and what your strengths are, what might be good for one portion of the lift for one lifter might be different for others. For me, floor press is good for mid-point and lockout work, but for others it’s best for the bottom position because of how thick their chest is and how short their arms are.

This is where trial and error come in. And remember that the supps and assistance help build weaknesses too.

So you don’t have to pre-plan what kind of ME work you do, you should have an idea of what kind of ME work to do. Just be sure to record so you can know if progress in one lift correlates to progress on one or more of the big 3.

722

[quote]Razamataz wrote:
A couple questions arose in my mind during today?s training session. First of, should the bar speed be the same for all three days of the speed-strength wave? I realize that it should always be explosive, but should the bar be moving the same speed all three days?

Also, when should I be breathing during a set of box squats? I?m pretty new to box squats, but when I did free squats I always took a big breath before unracking the bar and then another after getting into position then held that until I finished the rep. Now I?ve been taking another breath while sitting on the box and I?m thinking this might be a mistake.
[/quote]

I’ve cuaght myself breathing like that also . I dont know the answer , but I’m hoping somebody chimes in on this .

723

How do you guys rotate between a deadlift, squat and GM on ME squat/deadlift?

Currently I’m rotating between a squat and a deadlift. From what Dave Tate (I think) said, it’s better not to use GM for ME lift until you get a bit more intermediate/advanced.

Is this how others do it? I saw a video from Wild Iron Gym and they said something like this. Made sense so I’ve kept it that way.

724

[quote]michael_xyz wrote:
How do you guys rotate between a deadlift, squat and GM on ME squat/deadlift?

Currently I’m rotating between a squat and a deadlift. From what Dave Tate (I think) said, it’s better not to use GM for ME lift until you get a bit more intermediate/advanced.

Is this how others do it? I saw a video from Wild Iron Gym and they said something like this. Made sense so I’ve kept it that way.[/quote]

In a 20 week cycle I’ll do Squat/GM’s about 90% of the time, and maybe deadlift once or twice. I’ve found it’s easier to build a deadlift not deadlifting whereas squatting I need to get more work under the bar, not necessarily with a straight bar (usually not) but just under the bar.

725

[quote]LoveSquatting wrote:

[quote]StormTheBeach wrote:

[quote]LoveSquatting wrote:
Hey guys, just a quickie about the incline bench - never done this thing before (literally). Tried it today, probably won’t be able to hit 8 reps at 1 plate (200 max atm). If I give it 3 weeks of heavy inclines on ME days, would it transfer good to the regular bench ? [/quote]

If you are really that concerned about it, try something like an incline for ME work week 1, do some other bench variation week 2 then do incline DB presses for a 50 rep max, then week 3, do a close grip incline for ME work. Just vary it up but still train the movement pattern.
[/quote]
Sounds good, but do you think it will transfer to my regular bench ?
[/quote]

Give it a shot and see if it does. I don’t get a whole lot out of working my incline. I get nothing out of working any kind of shoulder press as well. I’ve pretty much ditched them both and am still making pretty solid progress, especially lately, on my bench. Every one has different weaknesses. The only way to tell if something is going to help is to work the shit out of it and then compete.

726

[quote]Vladamir wrote:
"Also, this is were extra workouts kick ass. I will use squatting again, say you want to work on technique, have no strength out of the hole, and something in your hips is sore. If you are training smart you can structure an extra workout that would look something like this:

The day after a ME or DE squat workout:
-Band tractions, soft tissue work, and hip mobility for 5 - 10 minutes
-Load a bar with 20-30% of ther weight you used the previous day (This is kinda the Rule of 60%, but I like to drop it lower after ME workouts). Either do a dyanmic workout, 10-20 sets of 3, or shoot for 100 reps in a short a time as possble with good form.
-Some glute/oblique work for the bottom end weakness if those are your issues"

My weakness is out the whole with squats so I plan on doing this. Is it possible to do a similiar workout like this for deadlifts? also I have been a slow fuck from the playground to the college wrestling mat so I should try these like extra dynamic lifts right. [/quote]

You can mess around and tailor extra workouts to whatever you want. Just like you mentioned, you lift slow. A more total volume of speed work throughout the year will make you faster. Two Dynamic days a week might not be enough. Use extra workouts for light speed work (20-30% of max) and do a shit load of different jumps/throws. Cleans are good for extra workouts but unless you are a competing olympic lifter, you are probably doing it all wrong (like everyone else on earth does) so stick to the basics for extra speed work. Sprints, jumps, throws, and moving light weights really really fast.

727

[quote]Razamataz wrote:
A couple questions arose in my mind during today?s training session. First of, should the bar speed be the same for all three days of the speed-strength wave? I realize that it should always be explosive, but should the bar be moving the same speed all three days?

Also, when should I be breathing during a set of box squats? I?m pretty new to box squats, but when I did free squats I always took a big breath before unracking the bar and then another after getting into position then held that until I finished the rep. Now I?ve been taking another breath while sitting on the box and I?m thinking this might be a mistake.
[/quote]

First Question: Speed will vary as you wave the weights. Off the top of my head, I think optimal is something between .8 and 1.0 meters per seconds. Unless you have a Tendo Unit Meter, in which case I am coming to train with you from now on, Just get the reps done in 3 seconds or less. As long as you stay in that three second range, you are doing it right. Don’t count the time on the box, count the eccentric and concentric time for your 2 reps.So, the actualy time under tension needs to be 3 seconds of balls to the walls squatting.

Breathing: Unrack the weight however you need, set your feet, take a breath and hold until both reps are done. Don’t breathe on the box because there is no way in hell you are keeping the same movement pattern with every rep. When you breathe out, you get loose. Firing loose off the box will make it impossible to squat with any kind of consistant technique, unless your technique is to get loose on box squats… which it shouldnt be.

Does all this make sense?

728

[quote]LiquidMercury wrote:

[quote]michael_xyz wrote:
How do you guys rotate between a deadlift, squat and GM on ME squat/deadlift?

Currently I’m rotating between a squat and a deadlift. From what Dave Tate (I think) said, it’s better not to use GM for ME lift until you get a bit more intermediate/advanced.

Is this how others do it? I saw a video from Wild Iron Gym and they said something like this. Made sense so I’ve kept it that way.[/quote]

In a 20 week cycle I’ll do Squat/GM’s about 90% of the time, and maybe deadlift once or twice. I’ve found it’s easier to build a deadlift not deadlifting whereas squatting I need to get more work under the bar, not necessarily with a straight bar (usually not) but just under the bar.[/quote]

Good answer. I agree completely.

Personally, I only deadlift for an ME movement MAYBE once a month. It is just too stressful to do it more often than that.

As far as GMs for max efforts, just be smart. Go for 3-6rms when you start doing them. Beginners DEFINITELY lack the coordination to lift a heavy good morning safely. Build up the strength first, then worry about the singles much later in training.

729

[quote]StormTheBeach wrote:

[quote]Razamataz wrote:
A couple questions arose in my mind during today?s training session. First of, should the bar speed be the same for all three days of the speed-strength wave? I realize that it should always be explosive, but should the bar be moving the same speed all three days?

Also, when should I be breathing during a set of box squats? I?m pretty new to box squats, but when I did free squats I always took a big breath before unracking the bar and then another after getting into position then held that until I finished the rep. Now I?ve been taking another breath while sitting on the box and I?m thinking this might be a mistake.
[/quote]

First Question: Speed will vary as you wave the weights. Off the top of my head, I think optimal is something between .8 and 1.0 meters per seconds. Unless you have a Tendo Unit Meter, in which case I am coming to train with you from now on, Just get the reps done in 3 seconds or less. As long as you stay in that three second range, you are doing it right. Don’t count the time on the box, count the eccentric and concentric time for your 2 reps.So, the actualy time under tension needs to be 3 seconds of balls to the walls squatting.

Breathing: Unrack the weight however you need, set your feet, take a breath and hold until both reps are done. Don’t breathe on the box because there is no way in hell you are keeping the same movement pattern with every rep. When you breathe out, you get loose. Firing loose off the box will make it impossible to squat with any kind of consistant technique, unless your technique is to get loose on box squats… which it shouldnt be.

Does all this make sense?[/quote]

That all makes perfect sense.

730

[quote]StormTheBeach wrote:

[quote]LiquidMercury wrote:

[quote]michael_xyz wrote:
How do you guys rotate between a deadlift, squat and GM on ME squat/deadlift?

Currently I’m rotating between a squat and a deadlift. From what Dave Tate (I think) said, it’s better not to use GM for ME lift until you get a bit more intermediate/advanced.

Is this how others do it? I saw a video from Wild Iron Gym and they said something like this. Made sense so I’ve kept it that way.[/quote]

In a 20 week cycle I’ll do Squat/GM’s about 90% of the time, and maybe deadlift once or twice. I’ve found it’s easier to build a deadlift not deadlifting whereas squatting I need to get more work under the bar, not necessarily with a straight bar (usually not) but just under the bar.[/quote]

Good answer. I agree completely.

Personally, I only deadlift for an ME movement MAYBE once a month. It is just too stressful to do it more often than that.

As far as GMs for max efforts, just be smart. Go for 3-6rms when you start doing them. Beginners DEFINITELY lack the coordination to lift a heavy good morning safely. Build up the strength first, then worry about the singles much later in training.[/quote]

When you do deadlift, which block is it in?

731

Aight, as of next week, I’m doing a month accummulation phase. First week I’ll do 50rm incline db press, 3rd week I’ll repeat that with heavier dumbbells/higher reps/faster and will maxout on the 5th week (1st of intens phase). That sounds good ?

732

[quote]Razamataz wrote:

[quote]StormTheBeach wrote:

[quote]LiquidMercury wrote:

[quote]michael_xyz wrote:
How do you guys rotate between a deadlift, squat and GM on ME squat/deadlift?

Currently I’m rotating between a squat and a deadlift. From what Dave Tate (I think) said, it’s better not to use GM for ME lift until you get a bit more intermediate/advanced.

Is this how others do it? I saw a video from Wild Iron Gym and they said something like this. Made sense so I’ve kept it that way.[/quote]

In a 20 week cycle I’ll do Squat/GM’s about 90% of the time, and maybe deadlift once or twice. I’ve found it’s easier to build a deadlift not deadlifting whereas squatting I need to get more work under the bar, not necessarily with a straight bar (usually not) but just under the bar.[/quote]

Good answer. I agree completely.

Personally, I only deadlift for an ME movement MAYBE once a month. It is just too stressful to do it more often than that.

As far as GMs for max efforts, just be smart. Go for 3-6rms when you start doing them. Beginners DEFINITELY lack the coordination to lift a heavy good morning safely. Build up the strength first, then worry about the singles much later in training.[/quote]

When you do deadlift, which block is it in?[/quote]

I havent done a regular, competition deadlift in training in like 4 years. But, for a Max Effort, I will rotate in a variation every month. Whatever block I am in will determine my rep max for it (5,3,or 1 rep max). On the weeks I don’t have a max effort deadlift, I will do deadlift variaitons for assistance work. I only use exercises that HAMMER weak points in my pull. For example, if I do a 5rm on a safety saquat bar squat for my ME work the first week of my Accumulation Block, I will then go right into high rep RDL’s… like load up 500lbs and see how many I can do before I shit myself. The following week, I would probably hit a deadlift for ME work. The third week I would do another squat or a GM variaiton for a 5rm, and then go right into SLDLs for a bunch of sets of 20.

If I were doing the same exercises in my Intensisfication Block, I would try to establish a new 10rm or a 6rm on them instead of high reps.

Make sense? This is pretty much the only time I break the “try not to use barbells on your assistance work” rule for the Accumulation Block.

Doing heavy RDL’s for a rep max makes your testicles bigger.

733

[quote]StormTheBeach wrote:
Doing heavy RDL’s for a rep max makes your testicles bigger.[/quote]

Doing this today as part of my first week of my second accumulation block. 20RM you say? wish me luck in not losing my colon. Previous to this I did 3 weeks accumulation 3 weeks intensification and 1 week transmutation leading up to my meet and put 50kg on my total!

734

[quote]StormTheBeach wrote:

[quote]LiquidMercury wrote:

[quote]michael_xyz wrote:
How do you guys rotate between a deadlift, squat and GM on ME squat/deadlift?

Currently I’m rotating between a squat and a deadlift. From what Dave Tate (I think) said, it’s better not to use GM for ME lift until you get a bit more intermediate/advanced.

Is this how others do it? I saw a video from Wild Iron Gym and they said something like this. Made sense so I’ve kept it that way.[/quote]

In a 20 week cycle I’ll do Squat/GM’s about 90% of the time, and maybe deadlift once or twice. I’ve found it’s easier to build a deadlift not deadlifting whereas squatting I need to get more work under the bar, not necessarily with a straight bar (usually not) but just under the bar.[/quote]

Good answer. I agree completely.

Personally, I only deadlift for an ME movement MAYBE once a month. It is just too stressful to do it more often than that.

As far as GMs for max efforts, just be smart. Go for 3-6rms when you start doing them. Beginners DEFINITELY lack the coordination to lift a heavy good morning safely. Build up the strength first, then worry about the singles much later in training.[/quote]

What if you feel you need to get more work ‘under the bar’ deadlifting because when you dont you feel out of the groove of pulling?

735

[quote]StormTheBeach wrote:
Doing heavy RDL’s for a rep max makes your testicles bigger.[/quote]

Oh, I know it! I made the mistake of going too heavy on these during my accumulation block and it almost killed me.

736

[quote]StormTheBeach wrote:

[quote]LiquidMercury wrote:

[quote]michael_xyz wrote:
How do you guys rotate between a deadlift, squat and GM on ME squat/deadlift?

Currently I’m rotating between a squat and a deadlift. From what Dave Tate (I think) said, it’s better not to use GM for ME lift until you get a bit more intermediate/advanced.

Is this how others do it? I saw a video from Wild Iron Gym and they said something like this. Made sense so I’ve kept it that way.[/quote]

In a 20 week cycle I’ll do Squat/GM’s about 90% of the time, and maybe deadlift once or twice. I’ve found it’s easier to build a deadlift not deadlifting whereas squatting I need to get more work under the bar, not necessarily with a straight bar (usually not) but just under the bar.[/quote]

Good answer. I agree completely.

Personally, I only deadlift for an ME movement MAYBE once a month. It is just too stressful to do it more often than that.

As far as GMs for max efforts, just be smart. Go for 3-6rms when you start doing them. Beginners DEFINITELY lack the coordination to lift a heavy good morning safely. Build up the strength first, then worry about the singles much later in training.[/quote]

Okay, but bearing in mind I am a beginner, would it still be like that?

I still want to keep a good groove for squat AND deadlift. Plus, I can understand being able to deadlift 800+ may be horrible as fuck to do it every other week but, for example, I did 405x5 on 2-3" blocks today. It’s not exactly massive weight.

I do agree that if I didn’t lift for a few weeks my squat would suffer way more than deadlift. But I still feel like I need more deadlifting than just once a month - if that. I know I’m answering my own question. I appreciate the help, just want to provide more information for you really.

Also, yes, I do that too - squat ME and then high rep RDLs on Accumulation phase. Also one of the few times I break the rule that you said.

737

Plenty of deadlifting practice on DE day.

738

Could anyone help me with setting up bands?

I’ll be using them for the first time on squats next week and all I have atm due to being broke is a pair of monster minis.

I squatted 160kg on a raw meet(belt wraps) and 170kg(w/ single ply), for my strength level should I or should I not double the monster minis? I’m ~5 weeks out from a raw meet by the way so I have no room to try things out since I’m looking at a 3week speed-strength wave followed by a 2 week transformation phase.

If it helps, I’m about 5’7 so the estimated tension would be a lot less. Thanks!

739

[quote]clutz15 wrote:

[quote]StormTheBeach wrote:
Doing heavy RDL’s for a rep max makes your testicles bigger.[/quote]

Doing this today as part of my first week of my second accumulation block. 20RM you say? wish me luck in not losing my colon. Previous to this I did 3 weeks accumulation 3 weeks intensification and 1 week transmutation leading up to my meet and put 50kg on my total![/quote]

Decided to do 225x20 rep front squats instead. Needless to say it sucked. Ended up taking me 3:40 not exactly how I hoped it would turn out, atleast I got something to beat next time.

740

So your old blog is dead then, right? Will you be putting your old stuff on the new blog, so we can read it later?