The Westside Method Thread

Training Powerlifting
181

[quote]frankjl wrote:

[quote]GhostOD wrote:

[quote]jacob-1310 wrote:
What is everyone opinion on speed pulls? [/quote]

I do them. On top of the technique practice, it makes ( to me) to do speed work for the deadlift in particular, because you’re moving the bar from a dead stop, in one direction. This REQUIRES speed.

You don’t have to take my word for anything I have to say in here though, I’m no where near being the strongest or most knowledgeable guy on this forum ( yet…)[/quote]

I agree with everything this guy said and for what it’s worth I’m approaching a 700lb raw deadlift. I missed a deadlift for the first time in a comp ever, I think it has something to do with me not doing speed pulls and not getting the technique practice in. I gained 10-12 pounds this last meet cycle and just with that extra bodyweight, it was enough to throw my form off and I ended up falling forward on my last pull.

With the deadlift, you have no eccentric phase and therefore no stretch reflex. Speed pulls re-enforce good technique without a stretch reflex.

You ever notice how when you do a set of 2 or more on deadlifts that the first one is always the hardest one? Well, that’s a bad thing because in a meet you only do 1. So get good at the first rep.[/quote]

There is so much awesome shit in this repsonse I don’t even know where to start. 100% agreed on getting thrown forward with extra bodyweight. Saturday was my first meet as a SHW and I missed my last attempt just because my I initiated the pull like I always do and ended up in the most fucked up position imaginable.

Again, agreed with the speed pulls and the first rep being the hardest. A huge reason why speed pulls are important.

182

[quote]PlainPat wrote:
Just gonna post my plan up for accumulation and see what you think STB…

Accumulation 5 weeks:
W1-2
Max Squat/DL:
Low Box Squat 3RM
DB RDL 6x60s (My weakness)
Band GM’s 5xNear Fail (Shoot for 30+reps)
Pull down abs 5x60s

Max Bench:
Floor Press 3RM
Tate Press 6x60s
3 Last sets SS with 30secs of Pushdowns (Weakness work)
DB Front Raise 5x60s
Bent DB Rows 5xNear Fail

DE Squat:
Box Squat 15x2 50%
1 Leg Band Curl 6xNear Fail
SSB GM’s (No access to back raises or things so I included this even though its more specific) 5x45s
DB Side Bends 5xNear Fail
Backwards Prowler Drags 5x60s

DE Bench:
Bench 15x3 50%
Tricep Pushdowns 6x60s
Low Inc. DB Bench 5xNear Fail
Chins 5xNear Fail
DB Curls 5xNear Fail (Just for elbow flexion)

W3-4
Max Squat:
Change to SSB Low Box Squat 3RM

Max bench:
Low Inc. Bench 3RM

DE Squat:
Change to 55%

DE Bench:
55%

W5
Max Squat:
Deificit Pulls 3RM

Max Bench:
Low Inc. CG Bench 3RM

DE Squat and Bench —> 60%

After This I would go into Transmution for 3 weeks then deload and repeat cycle maybe changing assistance and my ME exercises up for the next cycle. I’ve got my transmution written out too but figured I’d start by asking what you thought of this.[/quote]

Looks solid to me. I would suggest switching the ME exercises EVERY week. Also, don’t plan out your assistance stuff so much. I’m sure you can get all of this done in a session but you never know how you are going to feel day to day. Having all of these specific exercises outlined will make you feel like shit if you can’t get them all done if you arent feeling 100%. Get what I mean.

Anyway, you have a plan and it looks pretty good. The Tate Presses for 6 sets with the supersetted band extensions on the last 3 sets looks pretty brutal! haha.

183

[quote]Fletch1986 wrote:
So you save your heavy band and chain resisted zercher box with foam padding squats type of ME work for the accumulation phase? And no… that’s not an ME lift I’m planning on doing soon.[/quote]

This sounds like a nightmare. Ideally, all of the heaviest band and chain work should be done in the intensification block. This is the time in training when relative training volume and intensity are at its highest. I guess this would be the ‘overloading’ part of training if you wanted to define it that way.

I am actually going to try some lighter chain work in my accumulation block this time around to see if that helps my suited work later on. Chains don’t over exaggerate the speed of gravity so they don’t increase eccentric stress like bands do. I’ll keep progress updates on my log on tnation but I will post some stuff in here periodically to let you guys know what different shit I am trying in my training.

184

[quote]Fletch1986 wrote:
So you save your heavy band and chain resisted zercher box with foam padding squats type of ME work for the accumulation phase? And no… that’s not an ME lift I’m planning on doing soon.[/quote]

I would almost certain cause physical harm to myself if I attempted an exercise like that during the type of acc block that mike outlined in the first post

185

I see in your intensification section that you have a deload week in there. I was wondering why do you do that because in this video Louie Simmons says they max out 52 weeeks out of the year.

186

[quote]Vladamir wrote:
I see in your intensification section that you have a deload week in there. I was wondering why do you do that because in this video Louie Simmons says they max out 52 weeeks out of the year.

If you read what I posted before, the deload is just a drop in intensity but, it is still for a max. Duration can become intensity. On upper body deload days, sets of dumbbell work to failure are done and rep records are kept with different weights on the flat bench, floor, and on an incline. On lower body deloads, max box jumps, various other heavy reactive strength exercises are done for a max with weight or height, or sled dragging to near failure. Dynamic Efforts can also take the place of a Max Effort workout once in a while. There is never a time of the year where they are not smashing weights at 100% but it is not always for new 1rm on a squat, bench, or deadlift variaiton.

187

Hey STB: I have owned and used a crepisek SSB for the last year and am now thinking of adding a LiftingLarge.com front/zercher squat Harness. How much difference is there between the use of a SSB and a true front squat since both position the weight in front of a persons center of mass ? and is it worth the investment ? or would my funds be spent better elsewhere ? I already own full sets of short and long bands as well as 150# of chain.

Once again thank you for all your time…this thread ROCKS !

188

[quote]killerDIRK wrote:
Hey STB: I have owned and used a crepisek SSB for the last year and am now thinking of adding a LiftingLarge.com front/zercher squat Harness. How much difference is there between the use of a SSB and a true front squat since both position the weight in front of a persons center of mass ? and is it worth the investment ? or would my funds be spent better elsewhere ? I already own full sets of short and long bands as well as 150# of chain.

Once again thank you for all your time…this thread ROCKS ![/quote]

Ill give you one opinion on the harness…its a piece of shit!! My gym has one and I hate that mother fucker. Its easier for me to do Zerchers and Front Squats the old school way, without it. Again, just my opinion, but spend your money on something else…like a fat bar.

189

If you’re looking for something to replace front squats or zerchers, you can make a harness out of those ab straps that the crossfitters use for hanging leg raises.

190

StormtheBeach could you explain what the difference is between speed strength and explosive strength? This has always confused me. Isn’t pushing with speed the definition of being explosive?

Thanks

191

[quote]StormTheBeach wrote:

[quote]PlainPat wrote:
Just gonna post my plan up for accumulation and see what you think STB…

Accumulation 5 weeks:
W1-2
Max Squat/DL:
Low Box Squat 3RM
DB RDL 6x60s (My weakness)
Band GM’s 5xNear Fail (Shoot for 30+reps)
Pull down abs 5x60s

Max Bench:
Floor Press 3RM
Tate Press 6x60s
3 Last sets SS with 30secs of Pushdowns (Weakness work)
DB Front Raise 5x60s
Bent DB Rows 5xNear Fail

DE Squat:
Box Squat 15x2 50%
1 Leg Band Curl 6xNear Fail
SSB GM’s (No access to back raises or things so I included this even though its more specific) 5x45s
DB Side Bends 5xNear Fail
Backwards Prowler Drags 5x60s

DE Bench:
Bench 15x3 50%
Tricep Pushdowns 6x60s
Low Inc. DB Bench 5xNear Fail
Chins 5xNear Fail
DB Curls 5xNear Fail (Just for elbow flexion)

W3-4
Max Squat:
Change to SSB Low Box Squat 3RM

Max bench:
Low Inc. Bench 3RM

DE Squat:
Change to 55%

DE Bench:
55%

W5
Max Squat:
Deificit Pulls 3RM

Max Bench:
Low Inc. CG Bench 3RM

DE Squat and Bench —> 60%

After This I would go into Transmution for 3 weeks then deload and repeat cycle maybe changing assistance and my ME exercises up for the next cycle. I’ve got my transmution written out too but figured I’d start by asking what you thought of this.[/quote]

Looks solid to me. I would suggest switching the ME exercises EVERY week. Also, don’t plan out your assistance stuff so much. I’m sure you can get all of this done in a session but you never know how you are going to feel day to day. Having all of these specific exercises outlined will make you feel like shit if you can’t get them all done if you arent feeling 100%. Get what I mean.

Anyway, you have a plan and it looks pretty good. The Tate Presses for 6 sets with the supersetted band extensions on the last 3 sets looks pretty brutal! haha.[/quote]

Ok I just figured that I’d do it every couple weeks so the first week I have some time to get used to the new movement. And I understand what you mean about the assistance.

Haha, I love me some triceps pumps.

192

Should I exhaust the use of straight weight for DE or ME work before adding bands and chains, or should I add in bands and chains were possible if I already have access to them (sort of like how John Meadows recommends against beginners using intensifying techniques like forced reps and drop sets)?

193

[quote]Chicksan wrote:

[quote]killerDIRK wrote:
Hey STB: I have owned and used a crepisek SSB for the last year and am now thinking of adding a LiftingLarge.com front/zercher squat Harness. How much difference is there between the use of a SSB and a true front squat since both position the weight in front of a persons center of mass ? and is it worth the investment ? or would my funds be spent better elsewhere ? I already own full sets of short and long bands as well as 150# of chain.

Once again thank you for all your time…this thread ROCKS ![/quote]

Ill give you one opinion on the harness…its a piece of shit!! My gym has one and I hate that mother fucker. Its easier for me to do Zerchers and Front Squats the old school way, without it. Again, just my opinion, but spend your money on something else…like a fat bar. [/quote]

I’d say look into getting a 14inch cambered bar or a fat bar or something else instead as well. I have a very expensive front squat harness… and it fucking sucks.

194

[quote]Ghost16 wrote:
StormtheBeach could you explain what the difference is between speed strength and explosive strength? This has always confused me. Isn’t pushing with speed the definition of being explosive?

Thanks [/quote]

I knew this question was coming from somebody. It is very hard to define because of how similar the skills are. In the case of powerlifting, Speed Strength can be considered learning to move a moderate weight at full speed, thus at full force. Like a speed squat. Pure Explosive Strength is the ability to develop maximal force in the shortest time possible. Like a jump. Without going into more complicated explanation and making it confusing as shit, these are very basic definitions. You do develop one when training the other but if one area is lagging, then that must be trained seperately as well.

195

[quote]Razamataz wrote:
Should I exhaust the use of straight weight for DE or ME work before adding bands and chains, or should I add in bands and chains were possible if I already have access to them (sort of like how John Meadows recommends against beginners using intensifying techniques like forced reps and drop sets)?[/quote]

You shouldnt ever exhaust any method. That will mean accommodation at some point. In other words, you won’t get stronger. Use the bands and chains, just don’t go overboard on the band tensions until you get to the end of the intensification block. Honestly, if your aim is strength, don’t ever use forced reps. There is plenty of research out there that proves they don’t do anything good for you… plus they feel like shit and that time could be better spent working on technique with weights you are capabale of doing.

196

thank you Storm for your and chicksans full frontal attack on the harness. I will be looking into a cambered bar and some fat ones as well. Also, how about some more DEATH TO FITNESS ! Although the way this thread is going I really will not complain as I am learning a whole lot…you are doing a fine job here, THANKS !

197

[quote]killerDIRK wrote:
thank you Storm for your and chicksans full frontal attack on the harness. I will be looking into a cambered bar and some fat ones as well. Also, how about some more DEATH TO FITNESS ! Although the way this thread is going I really will not complain as I am learning a whole lot…you are doing a fine job here, THANKS ! [/quote]

I’ve got some ideas for posts but I have been busy with other things lately… things that actually get me some money. haha. It would be nice to make some Google cash off my blog but I don’t talk enough bullshit to get people to read it I guess.

198

Eh I dunno Storm - after that massive bashing you gave P90X, I’m sure you can get a couple of thousand hits from the “ripped” corporate douchebags that brag about the pump it gives them. Surely, you can capitalize on all those views…

199

When it comes to dynamic effort lower body do you do speed squats and speed deads the same day or do you rotate them? In this link Westside Barbell Basic Template Wendler just states you do dynamic squats. I saw some Louie Simmons videos on youtube and he talks about speed pulls. How can I work both of them in?

200

[quote]Vladamir wrote:
When it comes to dynamic effort lower body do you do speed squats and speed deads the same day or do you rotate them? In this link Westside Barbell Basic Template Wendler just states you do dynamic squats. I saw some Louie Simmons videos on youtube and he talks about speed pulls. How can I work both of them in? [/quote]

Yes you do them in the same workout. I dont care how much I move on ME day, it doesnt hold a candle to how tough i make my Lower DE day. You will do your speed squats and then do 6-8 singles of speed pulls with roughly 50% of your one rep max with about 30 seconds rest. When it comes to speed pulls, remember that form and speed are crucial. If you are using shit form and pulling slow, you arent doing yourself any good. Hope this helps

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