Does anybody go behind the head on your ohp? It’s avoided like the plague, but I feel it builds my upper back better than the front version.
[quote]caveman101 wrote:
hmm, not sure why the mods moved this to bodybuilding, because i wasnt asking a bodybuilding training question, just wondering why people seem to need a station/machine/gizmo to do anything these days, or to shorten the range of motion down to a few inches (not refering to actual powerlifting here). do the T-people who do seated have massive backward leans? barely bring their elbows to 90degrees?[/quote]
I somehow missed this. Why are you so worried about what people are doing? Is what you’re doing making you bigger and stronger, or whatever your goals are? If you’re pressing 225 lbs with your shoulders, whether it’s standing, sitting, in a machine, or what, you’re pressing 225 lbs.
Like Way said, doing them seated (free, or in a Smith) allows the lifter to use much higher loads, and generally focuses more on the actual movement rather than the movement + keeping balance and all that other shit.
It’s just different strokes for different folks, really.
I tried doing behind-the-neck presses over summer, and I experienced some good delt growth, but my shoulders were creaky as hell. I didnt get any pain when I stopped at about eye/ear level, so now what I do is set up pins in a power rack and do seated BTN pin presses. These are great because I can load the bar up with much much more weight than for any other shoulder pressing exercise.
I feel like people knock bodybuilders (or people whose primary goal is to increase the size of their muscles, etc) for not doing the “hardcore” lifts (standing military, cleans and presses, snatches, etc), when a lot of the time, the “bodybuilder” is the bigger guy who is a LOT stronger overall, and would be using a much higher load on the exercise, but because he got that using “bodybuilder” methods, it’s somehow inferior.
Strange, IMHO.
Great exercise, I do them as my main shoulder movement, although seated is good too. IMO:
Pros (vs seated):
-Activation of core and stabilizers
-(Hard to explain this one, but:) Allows more natural movement pattern with slight backward tilt of upper back, which makes movement more “centered” and weight less out in front of you.
And the #1 reason I prefer standing:
-Ability to grind out cheat reps past failure, AND load shoulders with weights HEAVIER than normal within prescribed rep range (via push press)
Cons:
-Generally slightly less weight than standing
-Potential for low back strain (once weight gets high)
I love them and will be doing them in less than an hour.
In my oh-so-hardcore gym (it was playing Jonie Mitchell folk music the other day) I generally only see people using fixed weight BB up to 40 Kg or machines. I don’t knock the tools but these people are not pushing their limits with exercise like they might a flat bench.
I put it down to laziness - easier to stick a pin in a machine and bang out a few reps rather than set up a squat rack, load up a barbell and go to war with some intensity.
Standing Press Variations, are my specialty. It is what I was known for in school, and what I would be known for now I am sure if I were a more ‘social’ trainee.
I was ‘raised’ on Standing Presses. My Weight Training Mentor (RIP) was an unknown great in this uh, shall we say movement, and it’s variations.
I practice many Standing Press Variation and go at it, like many do Bench Presses. Standing Presses can be said to be my Bench!?
I do not know why Standing Presses are so neglected, and if not it is executed with limited ROM, in only one Variation it seems. I suppose people are doing what they have been taught. Those that Press standing where taught that school, and those that Press seated learned that. I feel a person does what he knows, and when he knows more he will do more.
Why are people debating, the ‘necessity’ of Cleaning the BB or DBs from the floor? Things are not so black and white. This is something that one can only decide for themselves. If they are mature enough to train themselves. I was ‘raised’ to Clean from the floor, and then Press out my reps. I knew nothing else for 3 years. Most huge (body builders) do not Clean the BB or DBs then rep. I still however Clean from the floor, most of the time, but my way is not the only way. Do what is right for you, and your goals.
There is nothing wrong with leaning during a Standing Press. If you do this for a purpose, and with a consistent form. This is called a Variation, not a cheat or whatever, any more than a Push Press is a ‘cheat.’
It is unwise to stagnate in your approach. I was ‘raised’ on Standing Presses, but soon I learned allot from another guy, who practiced only Seated Presses. Take what you need from every ‘school’, and go make your own! Never follow blindly.
That being said, there is a place for all the Press Variations. Seated, DB, Standing, Clean and Press (variations), Bar (that is dips), and (Bench of course).
Do what is right for you. What is taking you to your destination. Seated Presses, are great but not the only way for body building. Neither are Standing Presses. Do both. It is an error to think one can lift more seated than standing. It is all a matter of Technique, Variation, and effort put in over the years. If one devotes more time and effort to Seated Presses, than Standing then his Seated Press Variation(s?) will be higher in weight and volume, and visa versa. Ultimately I believe more weight can be Pressed Standing, than Seated however.
Standing Presses do require more of the overall upper body to succeed at the lift, and lock out ( if you so desire). Standing Presses are humbling, as humbling as Dead Lifts, or Squats or Bench for the uninitiated, and or egotistical. Remember your first steps into Squating and Dead Lifting like a grown (that is ‘psychologically mature’) person? Get serious about Standing Presses at the risk of your vanity!
[quote]dnlcdstn wrote:
Does anybody go behind the head on your ohp? It’s avoided like the plague, but I feel it builds my upper back better than the front version.[/quote]
I would never do it. The risks definately outweigh the rewards. You can simply build your upper back with some better and safer alternatives, like deadlifting, shrugs, and rows.
[quote]Antares wrote:
Standing Press Variations, are my specialty. It is what I was known for in school, and what I would be known for now I am sure if I were a more ‘social’ trainee.
I was ‘raised’ on Standing Presses. My Weight Training Mentor (RIP) was an unknown great in this uh, shall we say movement, and it’s variations.
I practice many Standing Press Variation and go at it, like many do Bench Presses. Standing Presses can be said to be my Bench!?
I do not know why Standing Presses are so neglected, and if not it is executed with limited ROM, in only one Variation it seems. I suppose people are doing what they have been taught. Those that Press standing where taught that school, and those that Press seated learned that. I feel a person does what he knows, and when he knows more he will do more.
Why are people debating, the ‘necessity’ of Cleaning the BB or DBs from the floor? Things are not so black and white. This is something that one can only decide for themselves. If they are mature enough to train themselves. I was ‘raised’ to Clean from the floor, and then Press out my reps. I knew nothing else for 3 years. Most huge (body builders) do not Clean the BB or DBs then rep. I still however Clean from the floor, most of the time, but my way is not the only way. Do what is right for you, and your goals.
There is nothing wrong with leaning during a Standing Press. If you do this for a purpose, and with a consistent form. This is called a Variation, not a cheat or whatever, any more than a Push Press is a ‘cheat.’
It is unwise to stagnate in your approach. I was ‘raised’ on Standing Presses, but soon I learned allot from another guy, who practiced only Seated Presses. Take what you need from every ‘school’, and go make your own! Never follow blindly.
That being said, there is a place for all the Press Variations. Seated, DB, Standing, Clean and Press (variations), Bar (that is dips), and (Bench of course).
Do what is right for you. What is taking you to your destination. Seated Presses, are great but not the only way for body building. Neither are Standing Presses. Do both. It is an error to think one can lift more seated than standing. It is all a matter of Technique, Variation, and effort put in over the years. If one devotes more time and effort to Seated Presses, than Standing then his Seated Press Variation(s?) will be higher in weight and volume, and visa versa. Ultimately I believe more weight can be Pressed Standing, than Seated however.
Standing Presses do require more of the overall upper body to succeed at the lift, and lock out ( if you so desire). Standing Presses are humbling, as humbling as Dead Lifts, or Squats or Bench for the uninitiated, and or egotistical. Remember your first steps into Squating and Dead Lifting like a grown (that is ‘psychologically mature’) person? Get serious about Standing Presses at the risk of your vanity![/quote]
So, how much ya press?
[quote]giterdone wrote:
Antares wrote:
Standing Press Variations, are my specialty. It is what I was known for in school, and what I would be known for now I am sure if I were a more ‘social’ trainee.
I was ‘raised’ on Standing Presses. My Weight Training Mentor (RIP) was an unknown great in this uh, shall we say movement, and it’s variations.
I practice many Standing Press Variation and go at it, like many do Bench Presses. Standing Presses can be said to be my Bench!?
I do not know why Standing Presses are so neglected, and if not it is executed with limited ROM, in only one Variation it seems. I suppose people are doing what they have been taught. Those that Press standing where taught that school, and those that Press seated learned that. I feel a person does what he knows, and when he knows more he will do more.
Why are people debating, the ‘necessity’ of Cleaning the BB or DBs from the floor? Things are not so black and white. This is something that one can only decide for themselves. If they are mature enough to train themselves. I was ‘raised’ to Clean from the floor, and then Press out my reps. I knew nothing else for 3 years. Most huge (body builders) do not Clean the BB or DBs then rep. I still however Clean from the floor, most of the time, but my way is not the only way. Do what is right for you, and your goals.
There is nothing wrong with leaning during a Standing Press. If you do this for a purpose, and with a consistent form. This is called a Variation, not a cheat or whatever, any more than a Push Press is a ‘cheat.’
It is unwise to stagnate in your approach. I was ‘raised’ on Standing Presses, but soon I learned allot from another guy, who practiced only Seated Presses. Take what you need from every ‘school’, and go make your own! Never follow blindly.
That being said, there is a place for all the Press Variations. Seated, DB, Standing, Clean and Press (variations), Bar (that is dips), and (Bench of course).
Do what is right for you. What is taking you to your destination. Seated Presses, are great but not the only way for body building. Neither are Standing Presses. Do both. It is an error to think one can lift more seated than standing. It is all a matter of Technique, Variation, and effort put in over the years. If one devotes more time and effort to Seated Presses, than Standing then his Seated Press Variation(s?) will be higher in weight and volume, and visa versa. Ultimately I believe more weight can be Pressed Standing, than Seated however.
Standing Presses do require more of the overall upper body to succeed at the lift, and lock out ( if you so desire). Standing Presses are humbling, as humbling as Dead Lifts, or Squats or Bench for the uninitiated, and or egotistical. Remember your first steps into Squating and Dead Lifting like a grown (that is ‘psychologically mature’) person? Get serious about Standing Presses at the risk of your vanity!
So, how much ya press?[/quote]
Same question I had when reading that, in pretty much the same words. Not trying to be an asshole here, but surely you’re putting up some serious numbers by now?
[quote]giterdone wrote:
So, how much ya press?[/quote]
I rarely if ever give numbers. The numbers are not the message. Besides this is a giga-vague question…How much ya press? That’s like asking if I run.
If you are looking for ‘1 rep max’, I don’t know. I am not a PL. As such I do not train for that, and I am unaware of any formula to estimate it, let alone pin point the number. However I do train to the point where I am only doing multiple sets of singles at the end of a session.
I do know what my goals are, and what I did this week so far as Standing Presses, go. But I train many Variations of the Standing Press. I guess what you want to know is my Standing Military Press numbers? I train this but, I do so differently than others. And it is rotated in and out of my work days.
My main Standing Presses are ‘eccentric’, or ‘weird’. They are unheard of in my generation, and even those as little as 10-15 years younger than me. Except the Cleans. Well maybe there are some articles that reference my main Standing Presses. As this is an eclectic site. The first Standing Press I learned was called ‘Russian Press’, by my now past mentor. This is still my main Standing Press.
[quote]Antares wrote:
giterdone wrote:
So, how much ya press?
I rarely if ever give numbers. The numbers are not the message. Besides this is a giga-vague question…How much ya press? That’s like asking if I run.
If you are looking for ‘1 rep max’, I don’t know. I am not a PL. As such I do not train for that, and I am unaware of any formula to estimate it, let alone pin point the number. However I do train to the point where I am only doing multiple sets of singles at the end of a session.
I do know what my goals are, and what I did this week so far as Standing Presses, go. But I train many Variations of the Standing Press. I guess what you want to know is my Standing Military Press numbers? I train this but, I do so differently than others. And it is rotated in and out of my work days.
My main Standing Presses are ‘eccentric’, or ‘weird’. They are unheard of in my generation, and even those as little as 10-15 years younger than me. Except the Cleans. Well maybe there are some articles that reference my main Standing Presses. As this is an eclectic site. The first Standing Press I learned was called ‘Russian Press’, by my now past mentor. This is still my main Standing Press.
[/quote]
You are so mysterious, may I play with your penis?
[quote]Antares wrote:
giterdone wrote:
So, how much ya press?
I rarely if ever give numbers. The numbers are not the message. Besides this is a giga-vague question…How much ya press? That’s like asking if I run.
If you are looking for ‘1 rep max’, I don’t know. I am not a PL. As such I do not train for that, and I am unaware of any formula to estimate it, let alone pin point the number. However I do train to the point where I am only doing multiple sets of singles at the end of a session.
I do know what my goals are, and what I did this week so far as Standing Presses, go. But I train many Variations of the Standing Press. I guess what you want to know is my Standing Military Press numbers? I train this but, I do so differently than others. And it is rotated in and out of my work days.
My main Standing Presses are ‘eccentric’, or ‘weird’. They are unheard of in my generation, and even those as little as 10-15 years younger than me. Except the Cleans. Well maybe there are some articles that reference my main Standing Presses. As this is an eclectic site. The first Standing Press I learned was called ‘Russian Press’, by my now past mentor. This is still my main Standing Press.
[/quote]
Any videos? So how much do you ‘Russian Press’? Maybe you can explain the technique a bit too? Just whatever numbers you last pressed over head would be insightful.
I love doing standing OHP…usually start my shoulder routine with it. The last set however turns into more of a push press, but it gets the job done.
Hey, nothing wrong with push press, either. But my low ceiling still applies 
I really have to do something about that. Been contemplating adding another room on the house, using it as a gym, and converting the rest of the basement to storage.
ragged breath
sigh
One day…
I do these regularly. Either from the rack or I’ll clean it from the floor if the racks are being used. My goal is 1xBW as well.
Good job HolyMac, that’s a feat people have been working towards since the barbell was invented.
[quote]waylanderxx wrote:
Antares wrote:
giterdone wrote:
So, how much ya press?
I rarely if ever give numbers. The numbers are not the message. Besides this is a giga-vague question…How much ya press? That’s like asking if I run.
If you are looking for ‘1 rep max’, I don’t know. I am not a PL. As such I do not train for that, and I am unaware of any formula to estimate it, let alone pin point the number. However I do train to the point where I am only doing multiple sets of singles at the end of a session.
I do know what my goals are, and what I did this week so far as Standing Presses, go. But I train many Variations of the Standing Press. I guess what you want to know is my Standing Military Press numbers? I train this but, I do so differently than others. And it is rotated in and out of my work days.
My main Standing Presses are ‘eccentric’, or ‘weird’. They are unheard of in my generation, and even those as little as 10-15 years younger than me. Except the Cleans. Well maybe there are some articles that reference my main Standing Presses. As this is an eclectic site. The first Standing Press I learned was called ‘Russian Press’, by my now past mentor. This is still my main Standing Press.
You are so mysterious, may I play with your penis?[/quote]
Wow Waylander that caught me off gaurd shit that was fucken funny
[quote]KyleT wrote:
Good job HolyMac, that’s a feat people have been working towards since the barbell was invented.[/quote]
thanks.
however waylander has put up 300x3 on seated. haven’t tried that yet but FUCK if that’s not impressive
No one does them because it is a humbling exercise. One of the few where a bodyweight 1RM is actually good. any weakness in the shoulders core or legs and you will not be able to move much weight.
Me personally I should be close to bodyweight by Febuary im bw - 20/25 lbs for a double as my personal best at the moment.
[quote]Antares wrote:
My main Standing Presses are ‘eccentric’, or ‘weird’. They are unheard of in my generation, and even those as little as 10-15 years younger than me. Except the Cleans. Well maybe there are some articles that reference my main Standing Presses. As this is an eclectic site. The first Standing Press I learned was called ‘Russian Press’, by my now past mentor. This is still my main Standing Press.
[/quote]
I meant to write, 10-15 years older than me. Sorry for that, I am still quite young.
A ‘Russian Press’ (as I know it) is a Standing Press lowered to the around or even just below the nipple. There is a mild lean to this. One can lean back more so simultaneously as the bar is pressed, but this is not called for, unless trying to master the Tech for this that allows the most weight on the bar (or they have a really big chest). Lock out at the top, to hit the shoulders really well. Beware there is tremendous ROM in this movement (for a Press of any sort), that is unfamiliar to most trainees. Presses (unlike Pulls, or Rows) tend to have less ROM, Bench, Standing, Seated, whatever.
There is no ‘Seated Russian Press’, it can only be done standing, and with a lean.
This has been called a ‘standing bench.’ But I disagree. True ‘Russian Press’ does use much, much, more chest than other Standing Press Variations, but that is a good thing right? That means more weight on the bar over the years. Besides Flat Bench, does not strike the serratus, side shoulder, abs, and even small parts of the back, along with lower chest, front shoulder, and triceps.
I also train with ‘strict’ Standing Presses. That is heels together and no lean, or push.