Jeff…
They gave you steroids?
Our public education system is a fucking joke.
[quote]Brother Chris wrote:
Maybe they should learn to stop wanting the greener grass. Look at it this way, most people in America go to school for at least 12 years and can pass without knowing a thing. And, then tons of people wonder through undergrad without knowing what they want to actually do in undergrad.
Why not allow them to work until they decide what they want, let the fire set in.[/quote]
If education was set-up properly and produced intelligent students, that have experienced a variety of different skills, then they wouldn’t waste time and money getting a dead-end degree or wasting time in a job that isn’t going to get them anything but a paycheque.
What you’re saying is you’d rather HS be wasted. I’d rather it not be.
[quote]MattyG35 wrote:
I’ve never taken out a student loan, so you’re probably correct with it being deferred. The numbers are still true, but you would have more time to work without uni getting in the way.
They would also change a lot if you had a child at a young age. There are many other variables that could be included or changed.
I was trying to create an example of what 40 hrs/wk @ minimum wage would look like with average bills. Think of it as a template that can be adjusted, ie making 12, 15 dollars/hr, not having the gym membership, car insurance, etc.[/quote]
Yeah, having a child at a young age would make things difficult. Especially while making near minimum wage. Fortunately there’s an easy solution. Don’t have kids if you can’t afford them.
There’s really nothing else to say about it. If you don’t have the money to care for a child, then don’t have one. And if you aren’t ready to have a child, then don’t engage in activities that may result in one. Yeah, we all have urges and desires. Hell, everybody wants to fuck. But if it wasn’t so damn accepted in society, then maybe young, unprepared people would be, at the very least, a little more cautious.
And before someone starts throwing teen pregnancy stats at me, that’s not what I’m talking about (although that’s part of the problem, too). I’m talking about how acceptable it is to “accidentally” get pregnant even if you can’t afford it. Our country says this is OK by offering WIC, AFDC, insurance programs, and all other kinds of assistance. There’s no discouragement. There’s no frowning by society. This lack of discouragement leads to these same irresponsible and ill-prepared parents popping out a second and a third baby.
I get it. Unwanted pregnancies are going to happen sometimes. But, instead of being glamorized, if raising a child was shown to be difficult – and made to be difficult by severely limiting any assistance – it would limit those second and third kids and other unwanted pregnancies.
And, to get to my point of this rant, if people avoided having kids when they couldn’t afford it, there wouldn’t (shouldn’t) be any crying about getting by on minimum wage. There’s very few acceptable reasons as to why a healthy, capable individual can’t make ends meet.
[quote]malonetd wrote:
[quote]firespinner93 wrote:
Really? If it’s so simple, why isn’t it already working that way? Unemployment is at an all time high, but the fast-food joint around the corner is always hiring.[/quote]
Why isn’t what working what way? I thought we were talking about NOBODY taking a job? All the fast food places around me have SOMEBODY working there.[/quote]
Yeah, and who are those somebodies? Why are they there?
In my state, welfare recipients are required to work. A full time job at minimum wage is not enough to pay the bills around here, and it would disqualify one for assistance. But a part time job at minimum wage qualifies for assistance, and allows this person to receive benefits such as child care, medicaid, and food stamps and other means to take care of their family, means that a minimum wage job would not provide. It’s a great boon for big business, and taxpayers get to foot the bill. Doesn’t it make a little more sense to pay a few extra bucks for your McMeal and pay the workers decent wages? I mean, we are paying for it one way or another, right? I’d rather see it paid in wages than in welfare. And when you take away that population of low-paid workers, who is left?
That’s not true. Most fast food places offer semi-annual or annual raises and promotion opportunities.[/quote]
The last time I personally knew someone who was employed at a fast food restaurant, the minimum wage was something like $5.25 and hour. The person I knew worked at a McDonald’s. He had been there for five years and his latest raise had brought him up to seven dollars an hour for a management position. Some opportunity.
[quote] Those jobs haven’t started paying more, and their existence is far from cessation.
[/quote]
Why would they pay more when people are willing to work at the rate they are offering? I said they would pay more if NOBODY would work there.[/quote]
Because, right now, they have a captive audience of dirt poor people who don’t have a lot of other choices in front of them.
[quote]Valor wrote:
Our public education system is a fucking joke.[/quote]
Our public almost anything system is a fucking joke.
[quote]malonetd wrote:
Yeah, having a child at a young age would make things difficult. Especially while making near minimum wage. Fortunately there’s an easy solution. Don’t have kids if you can’t afford them.
There’s really nothing else to say about it. If you don’t have the money to care for a child, then don’t have one. And if you aren’t ready to have a child, then don’t engage in activities that may result in one. Yeah, we all have urges and desires. Hell, everybody wants to fuck. But if it wasn’t so damn accepted in society, then maybe young, unprepared people would be, at the very least, a little more cautious.
And before someone starts throwing teen pregnancy stats at me, that’s not what I’m talking about (although that’s part of the problem, too). I’m talking about how acceptable it is to “accidentally” get pregnant even if you can’t afford it. Our country says this is OK by offering WIC, AFDC, insurance programs, and all other kinds of assistance. There’s no discouragement. There’s no frowning by society. This lack of discouragement leads to these same irresponsible and ill-prepared parents popping out a second and a third baby.
I get it. Unwanted pregnancies are going to happen sometimes. But, instead of being glamorized, if raising a child was shown to be difficult – and made to be difficult by severely limiting any assistance – it would limit those second and third kids and other unwanted pregnancies.
And, to get to my point of this rant, if people avoided having kids when they couldn’t afford it, there wouldn’t (shouldn’t) be any crying about getting by on minimum wage. There’s very few acceptable reasons as to why a healthy, capable individual can’t make ends meet.[/quote]
While I agree with you, this isn’t how it is in reality. Ignoring those children will only make the problem worse as a majority of them will follow in their parents footsteps.
Proper education is the answer, at home and in school.
Like you said about the agencies that assist teenage parents making it acceptable, I think the whole matter could be countered with proper education. If kids weren’t so stupid and were aware of how much a child costs, and those agencies gradually became more limited in their charity(as the numbers called for), I think the teen pregnancy issue could be minimized fairly well.
[quote]malonetd wrote:
[quote]MattyG35 wrote:
[quote]malonetd wrote:
[quote]MattyG35 wrote:
[quote]malonetd wrote:
I’m late to the party here, and it may have already been addressed, but why the fuck can’t someone live off minimum wage? It’s $7.25/hour, and at 40 hours that’s close to $300 a week. Why can’t someone live off that? It won’t be comfortable, but what right do you have to be comfortable at minimum wage?
And if that’s really not enough, work more hours, work a second job. What’s wrong with working 60 hours a week, especially in your 20’s? Sixty hours at minimum wage gives you over $400/week. If you don’t like making minimum wage, find a new job or get a raise.
I don’t understand the argument.[/quote]
For where I live $9.50CAD, comes to $380/week or ~$1600/month(+2 days).
Starting @ 1600-25% tax = $120
Apartment 1200-500 = $700
Public Transportation 700-50 = $650
Food 650-200 = $450
Gym Membership $450-50 = $400
Student Loan 400-$350 = $50
Sure it’s possible, but things would be tight as fuck. I’ve stayed on the low side here for costs because someone like this would be living very thrifty, so I’m sure you can imagine when real life kicks in what the results would be.[/quote]
So these are your monthly bills? I imagine they would be different for someone getting by on minimum wage.
[/quote]
These aren’t my bills. I eat way more than that, have a gym at home(that I paid for myself) have my own car, haven’t started school yet and live with my parents 
I feel this represents the average student fairly well, although I don’t think they would be able to work 40hrs/wk if they had a full course load. I just did some math for a student that works out, lives on their own, has a one bedroom apartment and takes the bus. The numbers represent real life averages for where I live.[/quote]
Then I don’t understand where the student loan comes in. Maybe it’s different in Canada, but here most student loans are deferred – meaning they don’t have to be repaid until after graduation. So either that expense doesn’t exist or this is a college graduate (I guess a college drop out is also plausible) that is making minimum wage.
Also, I realize this is a bodybuilding website and a gym is a “necessity” to most people here, but it’s an unnecessary luxury for someone just struggling to get by.[/quote]
Bear in mind that crap happens. Say you get in a car accident. Well, you’re too poor to have medical insurance so you have a payment plan set up. Well guess what, the only way to pay it to go without a home and/or food. This starts a cycle of debt and destroys credit. Not to mention, not every place has public transportation so that makes a car a necessity. And cars are prone to break down for one reason or another.
[quote]Fletch1986 wrote:
[quote]malonetd wrote:
[quote]MattyG35 wrote:
[quote]malonetd wrote:
[quote]MattyG35 wrote:
[quote]malonetd wrote:
I’m late to the party here, and it may have already been addressed, but why the fuck can’t someone live off minimum wage? It’s $7.25/hour, and at 40 hours that’s close to $300 a week. Why can’t someone live off that? It won’t be comfortable, but what right do you have to be comfortable at minimum wage?
And if that’s really not enough, work more hours, work a second job. What’s wrong with working 60 hours a week, especially in your 20’s? Sixty hours at minimum wage gives you over $400/week. If you don’t like making minimum wage, find a new job or get a raise.
I don’t understand the argument.[/quote]
For where I live $9.50CAD, comes to $380/week or ~$1600/month(+2 days).
Starting @ 1600-25% tax = $120
Apartment 1200-500 = $700
Public Transportation 700-50 = $650
Food 650-200 = $450
Gym Membership $450-50 = $400
Student Loan 400-$350 = $50
Sure it’s possible, but things would be tight as fuck. I’ve stayed on the low side here for costs because someone like this would be living very thrifty, so I’m sure you can imagine when real life kicks in what the results would be.[/quote]
So these are your monthly bills? I imagine they would be different for someone getting by on minimum wage.
[/quote]
These aren’t my bills. I eat way more than that, have a gym at home(that I paid for myself) have my own car, haven’t started school yet and live with my parents
I feel this represents the average student fairly well, although I don’t think they would be able to work 40hrs/wk if they had a full course load. I just did some math for a student that works out, lives on their own, has a one bedroom apartment and takes the bus. The numbers represent real life averages for where I live.[/quote]
Then I don’t understand where the student loan comes in. Maybe it’s different in Canada, but here most student loans are deferred – meaning they don’t have to be repaid until after graduation. So either that expense doesn’t exist or this is a college graduate (I guess a college drop out is also plausible) that is making minimum wage.
Also, I realize this is a bodybuilding website and a gym is a “necessity” to most people here, but it’s an unnecessary luxury for someone just struggling to get by.[/quote]
Bear in mind that crap happens. Say you get in a car accident. Well, you’re too poor to have medical insurance so you have a payment plan set up. Well guess what, the only way to pay it to go without a home and/or food. This starts a cycle of debt and destroys credit. Not to mention, not every place has public transportation so that makes a car a necessity. And cars are prone to break down for one reason or another. [/quote]
Then carry MORE…CAR…insurance.it isn’t that much… Or dont cause accidents.
You cant keep asking ME to underwrite YOUR errors. Being stupid SHOULD hurt.
In my example I’m covered by the DOD for 425K of life insurance. I didn’t think that was enough. So for a WHOPPING $20 a month, I got an extra $250K from USAA.
I’ve really had enough of making excuses for ignorance. Pull your fucking face out of porn, video games, and TMZ, and learn something about life.
There needs to be a very basic safety net which provides a road to employment. That is IT. This notion that you can do whatever you want and not really apply yourself has got to be changed.
53 WEEKS of UC…mother fucker.
In 53 weeks you can teach a person to do about a million trades…
[quote]firespinner93 wrote:
[quote]malonetd wrote:
Why would they pay more when people are willing to work at the rate they are offering? I said they would pay more if NOBODY would work there.[/quote]
Because, right now, they have a captive audience of dirt poor people who don’t have a lot of other choices in front of them.
[/quote]
Isn’t the ivory tower nice?
Its the fault of the low paid worker that they are low paid. I love it.
All the workers would have to do is… oh, you know, organize a strike of a few million fucking people at once, and prevent others from taking those now vacant jobs.
Genius here doesn’t understand why it doesnt happen. Its so simple!!
[quote]CappedAndPlanIt wrote:
Its the fault of the low paid worker that they are low paid. I love it.[/quote]
Then you deny that their are people who lack skills, education, drive etc.? Otherwise, it is in fact their fault. Who else’s fault would it be?
Malonetd, if a poor person doesn’t take the minimum wage job at the fast food place, then they’re passing up a chance to work and, therefore, deserve no government assistance. They should take the job.
BUT, since they took the job, and therefore gave the fast food joint no incentive to pay more than minimum wage, it’s their own fault for being in a minimum wage job, because, according to you, “they would pay more if NOBODY would work there”
So tell me, wise one, what should that person do? They can (a) not take the job (and you can judge them as lazy and worthless), or (b) take the job (and you can judge them as stupid and responsible for the low wages).
Should they take the job or not? Can you please stop talking out both sides of your mouth?
[quote]ZEB wrote:
[quote]CappedAndPlanIt wrote:
Its the fault of the low paid worker that they are low paid. I love it.[/quote]
Then you deny that their are people who lack skills, education, drive etc.? Otherwise, it is in fact their fault. Who else’s fault would it be?
[/quote]
The business that employs them.
[quote]CappedAndPlanIt wrote:
[quote]ZEB wrote:
[quote]CappedAndPlanIt wrote:
Its the fault of the low paid worker that they are low paid. I love it.[/quote]
Then you deny that their are people who lack skills, education, drive etc.? Otherwise, it is in fact their fault. Who else’s fault would it be?
[/quote]
The business that employs them.[/quote]
Yeah sure, they should pay them MOAR, until they go out of business that is.
[quote]Valor wrote:
[quote]CappedAndPlanIt wrote:
[quote]Rockscar wrote:
[quote]CappedAndPlanIt wrote:
Also, rockscar, all your personal attacks are completely off base. But you are, after all, an idiot who thinks saying angry things and posting some douchebag picture as your avatar gives you any merit.[/quote]
Gotcha. You have no argument to logic and responsibility as evident here. If you think I wrote a personal attack then you have some very soft skin.
I’m sorry for thinking you are a lazy “the world is not fair” doucher, but your posts led me to believe that.
I can see now that is not the case. [/quote]
Yup, I’m just lazy. In 2009 I spent about 6 or 7 months working about 60 hours a week, then 40 hours when I quit the second job. Then, I was let go from my full time job in march of 2010 and, that day, went back to reapply for my old part time job. From there I took another job, which, after about a month of full time, ended up being part time as well, so I was back to working about 50 hours a week. Also, I took a couple of classes in the spring of 2010 and one in the fall of 2010, and now two more for the spring of 2011. I was lucky enough to be able to go to school for massage therapy a few years back, so I’ve kept up with a few clients with weekly/bimonthly sessions for a little extra money on the side and have been trying to get into different organizations doing on site chair massage (though the field is a bit difficult for male therapists). Toss in girlfriends, friends, and going to the gym at least a few times a week, and, yeah, I’m real fucking lazy and I sit back and wait for people to hand me jobs. [/quote]
Another sad fact liberals cant understand:
Some people are not meant to make it.
“I dont understand why I’m not living on easy street…I took student loans to study art for 12 years, and then I took a part time job at McDonalds and a Sunday job working at the library…
What do you mean I’m 35 with no experience, no skills, and no marketable education?”
People make bad choices and it isn’t the tax payers job to underwrite them.[/quote]
Oh the ivory tower.
And what exactly should happen to all the people without money (who, according to you, are all responsible for their own situation, seein as how you dont like to let reality get in your way)?
Maybe they should all just starve, and get no medical attention? Thats an awesome solution, I can’t see anything going wrong with that.
[quote]orion wrote:
[quote]CappedAndPlanIt wrote:
[quote]ZEB wrote:
[quote]CappedAndPlanIt wrote:
Its the fault of the low paid worker that they are low paid. I love it.[/quote]
Then you deny that their are people who lack skills, education, drive etc.? Otherwise, it is in fact their fault. Who else’s fault would it be?
[/quote]
The business that employs them.[/quote]
Yeah sure, they should pay them MOAR, until they go out of business that is.
[/quote]
Well, sure, if the company continued paying exorbitant salaries and insane bonuses to everyone “at the top”, while increasing the pay of the workers, they’d go out of business.
But lets not talk crazy talk. SOMEBODY has to have gross excess, or, uh, we’ll have no innovation!
[quote]CappedAndPlanIt wrote:
[quote]orion wrote:
[quote]CappedAndPlanIt wrote:
[quote]ZEB wrote:
[quote]CappedAndPlanIt wrote:
Its the fault of the low paid worker that they are low paid. I love it.[/quote]
Then you deny that their are people who lack skills, education, drive etc.? Otherwise, it is in fact their fault. Who else’s fault would it be?
[/quote]
The business that employs them.[/quote]
Yeah sure, they should pay them MOAR, until they go out of business that is.
[/quote]
Well, sure, if the company continued paying exorbitant salaries and insane bonuses to everyone “at the top”, while increasing the pay of the workers, they’d go out of business.
But lets not talk crazy talk. SOMEBODY has to have gross excess, or, uh, we’ll have no innovation![/quote]
Yeah, but those people getting these bonuses are pulling their weight.
I know, it is a concept that is almost inhumanly hard to understand, but leading a Fortune 500 company requires more skills than pulling a lever or sweeping floors.
So people without money should take any job they can find, but when they take low paying jobs its their fault its low paying, because, by working there, they are giving the employer no incentive to pay more. They shouldn’t take the job. but they should. But they shouldn’t. But they should.
People working low paying jobs should be responsible and save up their money. But if everyone saved most of what they made instead of spending, the economy would slow down. So going to the movies and out to sports games and buying beer is a waste of money and they shouldn’t do it. But if they dont, the movie theater, the sports venue, and the liquor store all go out of business – leaving the people who worked at those places unemployed and faced with low paying jobs that they should take, shouldnt take, should take, shouldnt take.
[quote]orion wrote:
[quote]CappedAndPlanIt wrote:
[quote]orion wrote:
[quote]CappedAndPlanIt wrote:
[quote]ZEB wrote:
[quote]CappedAndPlanIt wrote:
Its the fault of the low paid worker that they are low paid. I love it.[/quote]
Then you deny that their are people who lack skills, education, drive etc.? Otherwise, it is in fact their fault. Who else’s fault would it be?
[/quote]
The business that employs them.[/quote]
Yeah sure, they should pay them MOAR, until they go out of business that is.
[/quote]
Well, sure, if the company continued paying exorbitant salaries and insane bonuses to everyone “at the top”, while increasing the pay of the workers, they’d go out of business.
But lets not talk crazy talk. SOMEBODY has to have gross excess, or, uh, we’ll have no innovation![/quote]
Yeah, but those people getting these bonuses are pulling their weight.
I know, it is a concept that is almost inhumanly hard to understand, but leading a Fortune 500 company requires more skills than pulling a lever or sweeping floors.
[/quote]
And the people doing the work that creates all of the profit for the company aren’t pulling their weight?