To be clear, shutting down communications to provide a tactical advantage militarily is one thing. Trying to implement a sustained shutdown of the entire internet to a specific region is quite another.
[quote]ZEB wrote:
[quote]pat wrote:
[quote]ZEB wrote:
LOL…“close up the Internet”
I’m not a Trump fan at all. In fact, I wish he would pack up his dog and pony show and go home.
But…
That’s not even close to what he actually said. [/quote]
I have been trying to figure out the Trump phenomenon and I cannot figure out whether he is a genius or a moron. He says some ludicrous shit, but he says so much of it that the media cannot stay focused on just one asinine remark.[/quote]
I agree, very much like the Hillary Clinton scandals. There were and are so many that after a while people get numb to it and think…“oh well just another scandal who cares?” When they should be thinking this woman is basically a lying dishonest individual who should not become our next President.
As it is with Trump one nutty comment after another. Yet, he remains high in the national polls (although he will lose Iowa I believe). People need to take a deep breath and ask themselves, “do we really want this guy as our next President?”
[quote]If he is a genius, then what he is doing is praying on people’s emotions and that is a powerful thing. After all obama ran an emotional campaign and won.
The thing is can he switch to policy when the time comes? [/quote]
Good point my friend.
As I said to a couple of other posters when he first threw his hat in the ring. The man is indeed a very smart business man. You just don’t acquire a multi-billion dollar empire by being stupid. Yet, politics is a very different field. I have no idea if he could do the job. However, incompetency is not a stranger in the White House, after all the most incompetent President in modern history is Barack Obama.
What I do know is there are about 7 or 8 other republican candidates that I believe CAN do the job…so even if someone like’s Trump’s rhetoric they have to think long and hard not only if he could do the job and be able acquire the policy knowledge if elected. Just as importantly can he beat Hillary Clinton? Does anyone realize how bad he would look against Hillary in a one on one debate? She would eat his lunch!
He is somewhat lost among 8 or 9 other candidates on stage. But, one on one he gets crushed by any of them. He is a walking disaster waiting to happen for the republican party. I don’t want to go through a general election while holding my breath waiting for the next controversial thing to come running out of his mouth. His negatives are at around 60%. No one becomes President with negatives that high. Hillary’s by the way are also quite high, mid 50’s last time I checked. We certainly DO NOT want another four to eight years of left wing rule. Enough damage has been done by Obama in his first 7 years. So, I ask the T Nation members even if you think Trump is a genius, don’t gamble on him. The media will eat him alive. The only reason they have not done that yet is because they want him to be the republican nominee so that Hillary has an easier time of it. Trump is in far over his head.
So, I encourage those who like Trump to give one of the other 7 or 8 people who are actually qualified to become President some consideration. Even those that I don’t actually agree with such as Kasich or Christie I would welcome before Donald Trump.
Please help end this political reality show and help send Trump packing.
[/quote]
He’s not getting my vote in the primaries.
[quote]ZEB wrote:
[quote]usmccds423 wrote:
No, I’m with Paul on this one. These types of things are slippery slopes that lead to less freedom for the sake of temporary security and our rights have already been eroded to a great degree. [/quote]
Rand Paul, like libertarianism are good only in theory.
God forbid ISIS breaks into an elementary school and kills multitudes of children we will see how you feel about closing a small part of the Internet then. War time rights are different than peace time rights. Look at what FDR did. Look at what Lincoln did.
[/quote]
So what are you saying ZEB, is it okay to walk all over the Constitution because ISIS might break into an elementary school? You could use that argument regarding the 2nd as well. We should just shut down the sale of firearms because a ISIS terrorist might buy one and walk into a school and kill kids. We don’t need the 4th either, I mean, we might be able to catch an ISIS terrorist before they shoot up a school if we illegally search everyone. Data and metadata from everyone! Cell records from everyone! Facebook posts from everyone!
I understand, but we need to keep a level headed perspective here. Not that many people have been killed by terrorists here or in most of the developed world. The fight remains mostly in the Middle East. We need to shore up our borders and defeat ISIS over there. We can do that without trampling on the Bill of Rights.
We don’t need to shut down any part of the internet to win this war. We just need to actually fight it.
[quote]usmccds423 wrote:
[quote]ZEB wrote:
[quote]usmccds423 wrote:
No, I’m with Paul on this one. These types of things are slippery slopes that lead to less freedom for the sake of temporary security and our rights have already been eroded to a great degree. [/quote]
Rand Paul, like libertarianism are good only in theory.
God forbid ISIS breaks into an elementary school and kills multitudes of children we will see how you feel about closing a small part of the Internet then. War time rights are different than peace time rights. Look at what FDR did. Look at what Lincoln did.
[/quote]
So what are you saying ZEB, is it okay to walk all over the Constitution because ISIS might break into an elementary school? You could use that argument regarding the 2nd as well. We should just shut down the sale of firearms because a ISIS terrorist might buy one and walk into a school and kill kids. We don’t need the 4th either, I mean, we might be able to catch an ISIS terrorist before they shoot up a school if we illegally search everyone. Data and metadata from everyone! Cell records from everyone! Facebook posts from everyone!
I understand, but we need to keep a level headed perspective here. Not that many people have been killed by terrorists here or in most of the developed world. The fight remains mostly in the Middle East. We need to shore up our borders and defeat ISIS over there. We can do that without trampling on the Bill of Rights.
We don’t need to shut down any part of the internet to win this war. We just need to actually fight it. [/quote]
Can anyone explain what would constitute a victory for the United States in its post-9/11 wars?
Edit: Usmc, I am not taking issue with what you said here, in case that needs clarification.
[quote]usmccds423 wrote:
To be clear, shutting down communications to provide a tactical advantage militarily is one thing. Trying to implement a sustained shutdown of the entire internet to a specific region is quite another. [/quote]
Twitter and Facebook can censor all sorts of shit in a heartbeat, there is no reason why they couldn’t do the same against accounts that promote Jihad.
People would not have put up with this shit in WW2, those responsible for letting this kind of bullshit would have been beaten or chased out of town.
People forget the effort people went to to fight Nazis, men went off to war and women went to the factories so the economy kept humming along. Shit, even Lucky Luciano promised that the enemy would not enter through the docks in exchange for law enforcement not interfering with his business.
[quote]MaximusB wrote:
[quote]usmccds423 wrote:
To be clear, shutting down communications to provide a tactical advantage militarily is one thing. Trying to implement a sustained shutdown of the entire internet to a specific region is quite another. [/quote]
Twitter and Facebook can censor all sorts of shit in a heartbeat, there is no reason why they couldn’t do the same against accounts that promote Jihad.
People would not have put up with this shit in WW2, those responsible for letting this kind of bullshit would have been beaten or chased out of town.
People forget the effort people went to to fight Nazis, men went off to war and women went to the factories so the economy kept humming along. Shit, even Lucky Luciano promised that the enemy would not enter through the docks in exchange for law enforcement not interfering with his business.[/quote]
Facebook and Twitter are not the internet. At any rate are we really okay with censorship via Facebook? What happens when that censorship gets expanded to key words mined from mass collected data? It’s a slippery slope. We’d be potentially censoring Americans without due process.
I don’t think the comparision between ISIS and WWII Nazi’s is all that apt.
[quote]pushharder wrote:
The new $1.1 trillion dollar budget is a perfect example of “far centrism.”[/quote]
Yeah, good thing the small government Republican party has both houses of congress. The more these assholes work together, the better Trump’s chances get. I just wonder if they even realize it.
[quote]ZEB wrote:
War time rights are different than peace time rights.
[/quote]
Well good thing we are in a state of perpetual war. Oceania will defeat Eurasia.
[quote]Alrightmiami19c wrote:
[quote]ZEB wrote:
War time rights are different than peace time rights.
[/quote]
Well good thing we are in a state of perpetual war. Oceania will defeat Eurasia.
[/quote]
I must of missed where the constitution differentiates between peacetime and wartime rights.
[quote]usmccds423 wrote:
[quote]ZEB wrote:
[quote]usmccds423 wrote:
No, I’m with Paul on this one. These types of things are slippery slopes that lead to less freedom for the sake of temporary security and our rights have already been eroded to a great degree. [/quote]
Rand Paul, like libertarianism are good only in theory.
God forbid ISIS breaks into an elementary school and kills multitudes of children we will see how you feel about closing a small part of the Internet then. War time rights are different than peace time rights. Look at what FDR did. Look at what Lincoln did.
[/quote]
So what are you saying ZEB, is it okay to walk all over the Constitution because ISIS might break into an elementary school? You could use that argument regarding the 2nd as well. We should just shut down the sale of firearms because a ISIS terrorist might buy one and walk into a school and kill kids. We don’t need the 4th either, I mean, we might be able to catch an ISIS terrorist before they shoot up a school if we illegally search everyone. Data and metadata from everyone! Cell records from everyone! Facebook posts from everyone![/quote]
Shut down certain parts of the Internet which in effect amount to about .00001% to stop ISIS from recruiting…sure I’m on board with that. And if the government wants to hunt down terrorists using the Internet I’m loving it.
And just so you know ISIS does not go by the US Constitution. So the 2nd does not really apply to them. As you know criminals get guns in an entirely different way. Which by the way is something that Obama needs to learn (among many other things) as well.
[quote]
I don’t want to see any more innocent Americans killed by these monsters. I am for doing whatever it takes to win this war. Of course that includes voting for a person who will first call it a war against radical Islam.
I understand, but we need to keep a level headed perspective here. Not that many people have been killed by terrorists here or in most of the developed world. The fight remains mostly in the Middle East. We need to shore up our borders and defeat ISIS over there. We can do that without trampling on the Bill of Rights.
We don’t need to shut down any part of the internet to win this war. We just need to actually fight it. [/quote]
I agree with much of what you said. But if they can shut down a tiny part of the Internet to stop recruitment of our brain dead 20 something’s I’m for that too.
[quote]usmccds423 wrote:
[quote]Alrightmiami19c wrote:
[quote]ZEB wrote:
War time rights are different than peace time rights.
[/quote]
Well good thing we are in a state of perpetual war. Oceania will defeat Eurasia.
[/quote]
I must of missed where the constitution differentiates between peacetime and wartime rights. [/quote]
Read some history books and you will see.
[quote]ZEB wrote:
I totally agree with you. FDR interned how many Japanese Americans? [/quote]
This right here is exactly why we should be concerned about these blanket slippery slope policies. Thousands of Americans had their rights pissed on because they could trace their ancestry to Japan. It was wrong then and it would be wrong now.
It’s a bit more complicated than that.
[quote]ZEB wrote:
[quote]usmccds423 wrote:
[quote]Alrightmiami19c wrote:
[quote]ZEB wrote:
War time rights are different than peace time rights.
[/quote]
Well good thing we are in a state of perpetual war. Oceania will defeat Eurasia.
[/quote]
I must of missed where the constitution differentiates between peacetime and wartime rights. [/quote]
Read some history books and you will see.
[/quote]
That doesn’t even make sense Zeb.
[quote]ZEB wrote:
[quote]usmccds423 wrote:
[quote]ZEB wrote:
[quote]usmccds423 wrote:
No, I’m with Paul on this one. These types of things are slippery slopes that lead to less freedom for the sake of temporary security and our rights have already been eroded to a great degree. [/quote]
Rand Paul, like libertarianism are good only in theory.
God forbid ISIS breaks into an elementary school and kills multitudes of children we will see how you feel about closing a small part of the Internet then. War time rights are different than peace time rights. Look at what FDR did. Look at what Lincoln did.
[/quote]
So what are you saying ZEB, is it okay to walk all over the Constitution because ISIS might break into an elementary school? You could use that argument regarding the 2nd as well. We should just shut down the sale of firearms because a ISIS terrorist might buy one and walk into a school and kill kids. We don’t need the 4th either, I mean, we might be able to catch an ISIS terrorist before they shoot up a school if we illegally search everyone. Data and metadata from everyone! Cell records from everyone! Facebook posts from everyone![/quote]
Shut down certain parts of the Internet which in effect amount to about .00001% to stop ISIS from recruiting…sure I’m on board with that. And if the government wants to hunt down terrorists using the Internet I’m loving it.
And just so you know ISIS does not go by the US Constitution. So the 2nd does not really apply to them. As you know criminals get guns in an entirely different way. Which by the way is something that Obama needs to learn (among many other things) as well.
I don’t even know what to say. You’ve basically just said you’re okay with the federal government infringing on american’s rights as long as it’s just a little bit and of course it’s not against you, right?
You can’t just flip a switch and cut Syria off from the internet.
[quote]usmccds423 wrote:
[quote]ZEB wrote:
[quote]usmccds423 wrote:
[quote]Alrightmiami19c wrote:
[quote]ZEB wrote:
War time rights are different than peace time rights.
[/quote]
Well good thing we are in a state of perpetual war. Oceania will defeat Eurasia.
[/quote]
I must of missed where the constitution differentiates between peacetime and wartime rights. [/quote]
Read some history books and you will see.
[/quote]
That doesn’t even make sense Zeb.[/quote]
His assertion is that since in the past executive actions during wartime have limited individual rights, it’s okay do continue doing so in the future.
[quote]usmccds423 wrote:
ZEB wrote:
I totally agree with you. FDR interned how many Japanese Americans?
This right here is exactly why we should be concerned about these blanket slippery slope policies. Thousands of Americans had their rights pissed on because they could trace their ancestry to Japan. It was wrong then and it would be wrong now. [/quote]
But did you know that they also prevented many suicide attacks at the same time by Japanese who were not so friendly to the US?
[quote]
As for his Internet remarks. If people looked at the Internet as a large City Trump is talking about closing a few streets in that City. The ones where ISIS hangs out and recruits.
It’s a bit more complicated than that.[/quote]
No not really. Certain areas where ISIS recruits are the only parts Trump is talking about. Not so complicated and most likely quite easy to do and would probably save lives.
I wonder how many more Americans have to be killed before this administration wakes up, drops the PC nonsense and actually starts defending its people…oh wait Obama is in charge that will never happen.
[quote]usmccds423 wrote:
[quote]ZEB wrote:
[quote]usmccds423 wrote:
[quote]Alrightmiami19c wrote:
[quote]ZEB wrote:
War time rights are different than peace time rights.
[/quote]
Well good thing we are in a state of perpetual war. Oceania will defeat Eurasia.
[/quote]
I must of missed where the constitution differentiates between peacetime and wartime rights. [/quote]
Read some history books and you will see.
[/quote]
That doesn’t even make sense Zeb.[/quote]
Oh it makes sense
[quote]usmccds423 wrote:
[quote]ZEB wrote:
[quote]usmccds423 wrote:
[quote]ZEB wrote:
[quote]usmccds423 wrote:
No, I’m with Paul on this one. These types of things are slippery slopes that lead to less freedom for the sake of temporary security and our rights have already been eroded to a great degree. [/quote]
Rand Paul, like libertarianism are good only in theory.
God forbid ISIS breaks into an elementary school and kills multitudes of children we will see how you feel about closing a small part of the Internet then. War time rights are different than peace time rights. Look at what FDR did. Look at what Lincoln did.
[/quote]
So what are you saying ZEB, is it okay to walk all over the Constitution because ISIS might break into an elementary school? You could use that argument regarding the 2nd as well. We should just shut down the sale of firearms because a ISIS terrorist might buy one and walk into a school and kill kids. We don’t need the 4th either, I mean, we might be able to catch an ISIS terrorist before they shoot up a school if we illegally search everyone. Data and metadata from everyone! Cell records from everyone! Facebook posts from everyone![/quote]
Shut down certain parts of the Internet which in effect amount to about .00001% to stop ISIS from recruiting…sure I’m on board with that. And if the government wants to hunt down terrorists using the Internet I’m loving it.
And just so you know ISIS does not go by the US Constitution. So the 2nd does not really apply to them. As you know criminals get guns in an entirely different way. Which by the way is something that Obama needs to learn (among many other things) as well.
I don’t even know what to say. You’ve basically just said you’re okay with the federal government infringing on american’s rights as long as it’s just a little bit and of course it’s not against you, right?
You can’t just flip a switch and cut Syria off from the internet. [/quote]
Sure can…as I said read up on some Presidential history.
[quote]Alrightmiami19c wrote:
[quote]usmccds423 wrote:
[quote]ZEB wrote:
[quote]usmccds423 wrote:
[quote]Alrightmiami19c wrote:
[quote]ZEB wrote:
War time rights are different than peace time rights.
[/quote]
Well good thing we are in a state of perpetual war. Oceania will defeat Eurasia.
[/quote]
I must of missed where the constitution differentiates between peacetime and wartime rights. [/quote]
Read some history books and you will see.
[/quote]
That doesn’t even make sense Zeb.[/quote]
His assertion is that since in the past executive actions during wartime have limited individual rights, it’s okay do continue doing so in the future.[/quote]
Yes, it’s easy to be a Rand Paul and spout off about the constitution. But when innocent Americans are getting killed by Islamic terrorists it’s time to put the hammer down. Not just abroad but on America soil as well. It has been done in the past a few times. And it has always been temporary.
[quote]smh_23 wrote:
[quote]
PS: When are you coming to Japan? ;-)[/quote]
Soon, I hope! Would you mind if I got your personal email from Varq? I’d love to be able to reach out in the event that I do indeed return to Japan soon. (Also, if, by some stroke of catastrophe, this election became Trump-Sanders, I’ll be there in a heartbeat. With all of my belongings.)[/quote]
You’d damn sure better reach out to me, too, then.
Get my email from Varq, too, buddy. I’ve been meaning to get ahold of you outside this forum for a long time, particularly as I only read it now.
Varq, Chushin and I are all hanging out at my place next week, as a matter of fact.
Push keeps making sounds like he’s going to join us on one of those forays, but we’re all still waiting on that to happen.