The Dow's Climbing Higher...

Off Topic Politics & World Issues
61

[quote]jsbrook wrote:

[quote]SkyzykS wrote:

[quote]Headhunter wrote:

[quote]milktruck wrote:
Precious metals are pushing all time highs, yet stock bulls are gloating over the “long term investments” that they recently sold with the market 30%+ from the peak.

What works during the greatest credit expansion in human history may not continue to work during its unwind.

Japan isnt a Mad Max wasteland, but Im sure any japanese who have been in bonds or precious metals for the past ~25 years arent complaining, even at shitty Japanese interest rates. [/quote]

I also wonder how many of the 43 million Americans living in poverty (just saw this on the evening news) will buy stocks.

Twenty years from now, the stock market may be higher than it is now. I think watching it first drop to 6,000 and then to 1,000 is little more than I want. I’ll sell my $5000 per ounce gold then and buy in, when stock prices are one-tenth of what they are today.

Who knows? The stock I buy for two dollars and 50 cents per share might have been bought by Zeb for $25…fascinating!!!
[/quote]

You never know. I bought a bunch at $2.20 per share that had been selling a year prior at $1200-$1500.
[/quote]

Which stock exactly is that?[/quote]

AIG.

Actually, that is my cost basis. The purchases were between $1.45 and $2.17 from Dec. 08 to Mar.09.

Unfortunately, or maybe not, they pulled a 20/1 split and reduced my holding from 180 to 9 shares.

I would have got as many as I could in the time allowed, but free cash was tight due to my impending purchase of a house at the same time.

62

[quote]dnlcdstn wrote:
The DOW is at 10,794.26 as of 2:55 pm on 9/21/10. Is there hope or we just seeing the numbers we want to see in order to not cause mass panic? Also, has anyone seen the movie The Money Masters? I watched some of it before I left for work and it really pissed me off. If it’s messages are indeed true we need to do something drastic.[/quote]

Haven’t seen that movie.

I would say that there is hope, but not for a couple of years. The stuff I’m holding has a distinct sideways pattern. A little up, a little down, but over all, the 6mo. moving average is just sideways.

All of the others on my watch list have essentially been doing the same.

63

Well, we’re over 11,000. Good sign? I befriended someone who works for Wealth Masters Worldwide. Their President said on a conference call that shit was hitting the fan and Greece would be the first to fall. He went on to say that there is a “50 trillion dollar transfer of wealth” in the midst.

These guys just trying to sell financial tools or are they on to something?

64


Being only peripherally involved and admittedly just a rank beginner in investment, maybe others on this board would have more knowledge of where or how to get professional instruction on reading the markets, screening stocks and other more complex trade and transaction methods. I went to an Investools 2 day seminar about 6 years ago for basic transactions and technical analysis that cost about $750. The info was good and accurate, but I couldn’t get past the 10-20K for the advanced trades and whatnot. Since then I have started a Scottrade acct., which essentially provides the same info minus the direct instruction, but had a $500.00 minimum account start-up. With that though, the transactions are yours to keep. Whether or not they are successful depends on what you choose, but even a blind pig may occasionally find a truffle.

If you are into home based sales, this company seems like a good option, but I would be wary if I was just purchasing the services. Here is a review of the company that I found with a quick search- Wealth Masters

One thing that does make the hair on the back of my neck stand on end is when someone uses oblique terms and tries to talk about 20 feet over your head ala the “50 trillion”. That is a good device to use in a pitch for wow factor, but I don’t respond to sizzle nearly as much as I do to the steak. But pitch is pitch, and product is product, so what are you really going to get for your money?

FWIW, Greece crashed in January and 50 trillion dollars will change hands on a regular basis through various transactions in the world markets.

The dow is climbing too, but some dubious distinctions need to be made before anybody jumps for joy . Here is a 5 year snapshot-

(edited for additional content)

65

And here is one year (this year). It appears to be climbing in the 5 year, and in fact is, but as you can see in the one year, It keeps hitting resistance at just about 10.7K, then bouncing back to increasing but significantly lower support levels.

66

I figured Wealth Masters were just trying to scare people into buying their financial education products.

67

Not necessarily, but they are selling, which isn’t always a bad thing. I added to my previous post(more info and link).

68

[quote]dnlcdstn wrote:
Well, we’re over 11,000. Good sign? I befriended someone who works for Wealth Masters Worldwide. Their President said on a conference call that shit was hitting the fan and Greece would be the first to fall. He went on to say that there is a “50 trillion dollar transfer of wealth” in the midst.

These guys just trying to sell financial tools or are they on to something?[/quote]

Thees no way Greece is first to go. Ireland or Spain are in FAR worse shape than Greece.

69

[quote]SkyzykS wrote:
Not necessarily, but they are selling, which isn’t always a bad thing. I added to my previous post(more info and link).
[/quote]

I’ve been told that Scottrade is the way to go if you want to start investing. I would like to start however, I don’t know the first thing about investing. I’m too conceited to give my profits away as commission so I’d rather just jump in the pool and learn. Are there a set of numbers or statistics that one can follow and get an idea of how to gauge investments?

70

There is basic technical analysis, which is to look at a companies history and performance in graph form, and evaluate it based on that. Then fundamental analysis- actually digging into the meat and potatoes of a company to draw conclusions.(Neither of which I am adequately versed in to be able to explain as well as they should be)

It can be pretty tricky, but here is a good place to start looking into how. There may be other better ones too that others use, but this is probably as good a place to start as any-

There is also a left bar full of other subjects and topics within those.

71

The collapse…the collapse…almost here:

"After last week saw an insider selling to buying ratio of 1,411 to 1, this week the ratio has nearly doubled, hitting a ridiculous 2,341 to 1. And while Wall Street’s liars and CNBC’s clowns will have you throw all your money into “leading” techs like Oracle and Google, insiders in these names sold a combined $200 million in stock in the last week alone (following Oracle insider sales of $223 million in the prior week). Insiders can. not. wait. to. get. out. fast. enough. This Fed-induced rally is nothing short of a godsend for each and every corporate executive. But yes, there may be value: there was insider buying in 2 (two) companies last week: General Dynamics and Best Buy, for a whopping total of $177,064. At the same time sales were a total of $414 million: so is anyone wondering why JPMorgan is reopening its gold vault… Anyone left holding the bag on this market when the FRBNY props are taken away, will be left with the same return as all those investors who entrusted their money with Madoff. Guaranteed.

72

[quote]Headhunter wrote:
The collapse…the collapse…almost here:

"After last week saw an insider selling to buying ratio of 1,411 to 1, this week the ratio has nearly doubled, hitting a ridiculous 2,341 to 1. And while Wall Street’s liars and CNBC’s clowns will have you throw all your money into “leading” techs like Oracle and Google, insiders in these names sold a combined $200 million in stock in the last week alone (following Oracle insider sales of $223 million in the prior week). Insiders can. not. wait. to. get. out. fast. enough. This Fed-induced rally is nothing short of a godsend for each and every corporate executive. But yes, there may be value: there was insider buying in 2 (two) companies last week: General Dynamics and Best Buy, for a whopping total of $177,064. At the same time sales were a total of $414 million: so is anyone wondering why JPMorgan is reopening its gold vault… Anyone left holding the bag on this market when the FRBNY props are taken away, will be left with the same return as all those investors who entrusted their money with Madoff. Guaranteed. [/quote]

Can we make a $1000 bet. I expect the money to be sent to a paypal account of my choosing when you prove wrong.

73

[quote]ZEB wrote:

[quote]Headhunter wrote:
It doesn’t take a genius to see that the general market must dominate most investments. Even gold was dragged down by the collapsing market in 2008. Zeb, you might find the best stock in the world but you CANNOT BEAT THE MARKET. Are you Warren Buffett? No? Then you’re going to get sheared.

You really think that you can beat a market that is selling for about 4.6 times book (only the dot.com bubble was higher), a PE of 20, and a dividend yield of 2.15? Its not me that’s calling your plan BS, its the history of the market.

Just like with lottery tix, you might buy some windmill company that get a gov’t contract and makes you a fortune. That’s just dumb luck.

So I wish you luck…you’ll need it. [/quote]

Stocks purchased over a period of time have been shown to be the best investment over the past 200 years. And I know I don’t have to post a 200 year history to prove this. Or, would you like that? So you can move on your merry way singing gloom and doom and I’ll keep making money. 10 years from now I will be worth far more than I am now, and you will be sorry you listened to nut bags.

That’s really the end of the story.
[/quote]

Bullshit. Those statistics are not correctly inflation adjusted.

Sounds like you are pretty set in your beliefs.

The stockmarket is a suckers game, unless you have inside information. Thats how wall-street works. Get everyone to churn up as much business as possible, and make a killing when the inside info comes along.

Average joe is gambling unless you know the game.

The best way to invest is to pick safe income generating investments with a solid return and compound your profits over time.

74

[quote]SkyzykS wrote:

[quote]jsbrook wrote:

[quote]SkyzykS wrote:

[quote]Headhunter wrote:

[quote]milktruck wrote:
Precious metals are pushing all time highs, yet stock bulls are gloating over the “long term investments” that they recently sold with the market 30%+ from the peak.

What works during the greatest credit expansion in human history may not continue to work during its unwind.

Japan isnt a Mad Max wasteland, but Im sure any japanese who have been in bonds or precious metals for the past ~25 years arent complaining, even at shitty Japanese interest rates. [/quote]

I also wonder how many of the 43 million Americans living in poverty (just saw this on the evening news) will buy stocks.

Twenty years from now, the stock market may be higher than it is now. I think watching it first drop to 6,000 and then to 1,000 is little more than I want. I’ll sell my $5000 per ounce gold then and buy in, when stock prices are one-tenth of what they are today.

Who knows? The stock I buy for two dollars and 50 cents per share might have been bought by Zeb for $25…fascinating!!!
[/quote]

You never know. I bought a bunch at $2.20 per share that had been selling a year prior at $1200-$1500.
[/quote]

Which stock exactly is that?[/quote]

AIG.

Actually, that is my cost basis. The purchases were between $1.45 and $2.17 from Dec. 08 to Mar.09.

Unfortunately, or maybe not, they pulled a 20/1 split and reduced my holding from 180 to 9 shares.

I would have got as many as I could in the time allowed, but free cash was tight due to my impending purchase of a house at the same time.

[/quote]

Ah, yes. AIG. That makes sense.

75

[quote]MassiveGuns wrote:

[quote]ZEB wrote:

[quote]Headhunter wrote:
It doesn’t take a genius to see that the general market must dominate most investments. Even gold was dragged down by the collapsing market in 2008. Zeb, you might find the best stock in the world but you CANNOT BEAT THE MARKET. Are you Warren Buffett? No? Then you’re going to get sheared.

You really think that you can beat a market that is selling for about 4.6 times book (only the dot.com bubble was higher), a PE of 20, and a dividend yield of 2.15? Its not me that’s calling your plan BS, its the history of the market.

Just like with lottery tix, you might buy some windmill company that get a gov’t contract and makes you a fortune. That’s just dumb luck.

So I wish you luck…you’ll need it. [/quote]

Stocks purchased over a period of time have been shown to be the best investment over the past 200 years. And I know I don’t have to post a 200 year history to prove this. Or, would you like that? So you can move on your merry way singing gloom and doom and I’ll keep making money. 10 years from now I will be worth far more than I am now, and you will be sorry you listened to nut bags.

That’s really the end of the story.
[/quote]

Bullshit. Those statistics are not correctly inflation adjusted.

Sounds like you are pretty set in your beliefs.

The stockmarket is a suckers game, unless you have inside information. Thats how wall-street works. Get everyone to churn up as much business as possible, and make a killing when the inside info comes along.

Average joe is gambling unless you know the game.

The best way to invest is to pick safe income generating investments with a solid return and compound your profits over time.
[/quote]

You have no idea how uninformed you sound. You’re an ignoramus.

76

[quote]ZEB wrote:

[quote]MassiveGuns wrote:

[quote]ZEB wrote:

[quote]Headhunter wrote:
It doesn’t take a genius to see that the general market must dominate most investments. Even gold was dragged down by the collapsing market in 2008. Zeb, you might find the best stock in the world but you CANNOT BEAT THE MARKET. Are you Warren Buffett? No? Then you’re going to get sheared.

You really think that you can beat a market that is selling for about 4.6 times book (only the dot.com bubble was higher), a PE of 20, and a dividend yield of 2.15? Its not me that’s calling your plan BS, its the history of the market.

Just like with lottery tix, you might buy some windmill company that get a gov’t contract and makes you a fortune. That’s just dumb luck.

So I wish you luck…you’ll need it. [/quote]

Stocks purchased over a period of time have been shown to be the best investment over the past 200 years. And I know I don’t have to post a 200 year history to prove this. Or, would you like that? So you can move on your merry way singing gloom and doom and I’ll keep making money. 10 years from now I will be worth far more than I am now, and you will be sorry you listened to nut bags.

That’s really the end of the story.
[/quote]

Bullshit. Those statistics are not correctly inflation adjusted.

Sounds like you are pretty set in your beliefs.

The stockmarket is a suckers game, unless you have inside information. Thats how wall-street works. Get everyone to churn up as much business as possible, and make a killing when the inside info comes along.

Average joe is gambling unless you know the game.

The best way to invest is to pick safe income generating investments with a solid return and compound your profits over time.
[/quote]

You have no idea how uninformed you sound. You’re an ignoramus. [/quote]

Having not read the majority of this thread, allow me to ask you what your general stock investment strategy would be ZEB? Do you invest for the “long haul” or “short term”; take-over trading or momentum stocks? (and so forth)

77

[quote]dnlcdstn wrote:
The DOW is at 10,794.26 as of 2:55 pm on 9/21/10. Is there hope or we just seeing the numbers we want to see in order to not cause mass panic? Also, has anyone seen the movie The Money Masters? I watched some of it before I left for work and it really pissed me off. If it’s messages are indeed true we need to do something drastic.[/quote]

Some individuals do not appear to be too optimistic:

12 Ominous Signs For World Financial Markets

Can anyone explain the very strange behavior that we are seeing in world financial markets right now? Corporate insiders are bailing out of the U.S. stock market at a very alarming rate. Investors are moving mountains of money into gold and other commodities. In fact, there is such a rush towards gold that shortages are starting…[cont] [http://www.lewrockwell.com/rep/12-ominous-signs.html
]

78

[quote]cloakmanor wrote:

[quote]dnlcdstn wrote:
The DOW is at 10,794.26 as of 2:55 pm on 9/21/10. Is there hope or we just seeing the numbers we want to see in order to not cause mass panic? Also, has anyone seen the movie The Money Masters? I watched some of it before I left for work and it really pissed me off. If it’s messages are indeed true we need to do something drastic.[/quote]

Some individuals do not appear to be too optimistic:

12 Ominous Signs For World Financial Markets

Can anyone explain the very strange behavior that we are seeing in world financial markets right now? Corporate insiders are bailing out of the U.S. stock market at a very alarming rate. Investors are moving mountains of money into gold and other commodities. In fact, there is such a rush towards gold that shortages are starting…[cont] [http://www.lewrockwell.com/rep/12-ominous-signs.html
][/quote]

California is so close to having to default on its bonds, I’m guessing that the declaration is coming and all the rich scum are getting the inside scoop. They bail and leave the taxpayers holding the bag.

March on DC to commence soon, pitchforks and torches mandatory. :wink:

79

[quote]cloakmanor wrote:

[quote]ZEB wrote:

[quote]MassiveGuns wrote:

[quote]ZEB wrote:

[quote]Headhunter wrote:
It doesn’t take a genius to see that the general market must dominate most investments. Even gold was dragged down by the collapsing market in 2008. Zeb, you might find the best stock in the world but you CANNOT BEAT THE MARKET. Are you Warren Buffett? No? Then you’re going to get sheared.

You really think that you can beat a market that is selling for about 4.6 times book (only the dot.com bubble was higher), a PE of 20, and a dividend yield of 2.15? Its not me that’s calling your plan BS, its the history of the market.

Just like with lottery tix, you might buy some windmill company that get a gov’t contract and makes you a fortune. That’s just dumb luck.

So I wish you luck…you’ll need it. [/quote]

Stocks purchased over a period of time have been shown to be the best investment over the past 200 years. And I know I don’t have to post a 200 year history to prove this. Or, would you like that? So you can move on your merry way singing gloom and doom and I’ll keep making money. 10 years from now I will be worth far more than I am now, and you will be sorry you listened to nut bags.

That’s really the end of the story.
[/quote]

Bullshit. Those statistics are not correctly inflation adjusted.

Sounds like you are pretty set in your beliefs.

The stockmarket is a suckers game, unless you have inside information. Thats how wall-street works. Get everyone to churn up as much business as possible, and make a killing when the inside info comes along.

Average joe is gambling unless you know the game.

The best way to invest is to pick safe income generating investments with a solid return and compound your profits over time.
[/quote]

You have no idea how uninformed you sound. You’re an ignoramus. [/quote]

Having not read the majority of this thread, allow me to ask you what your general stock investment strategy would be ZEB? Do you invest for the “long haul” or “short term”; take-over trading or momentum stocks? (and so forth)[/quote]

Buy and hold has been the best investment strategy over the past 100+ years I don’t expect it to change now. Most people don’t understand economic cycles and they become scared. We’ve had many of these cycles from the 1800’s on. Every time I read another post of gloom and doom I simply laugh to myself.

Ever hear the term “buy when there’s blood in the streets”? Baron Rothschild said that in 1871. He bought stocks (in Paris) during the stock panic of 1871. When all the suckers who were scared began panic selling he doubled up his buying. He amassed a fortune. Remember the market moves on fear and greed. If you are smart enough to take advantage of the situation you can do very well. I am a buyer in this market, as all smart investors are.

80

[quote]ZEB wrote:

[quote]cloakmanor wrote:

[quote]ZEB wrote:

[quote]MassiveGuns wrote:

[quote]ZEB wrote:

[quote]Headhunter wrote:
It doesn’t take a genius to see that the general market must dominate most investments. Even gold was dragged down by the collapsing market in 2008. Zeb, you might find the best stock in the world but you CANNOT BEAT THE MARKET. Are you Warren Buffett? No? Then you’re going to get sheared.

You really think that you can beat a market that is selling for about 4.6 times book (only the dot.com bubble was higher), a PE of 20, and a dividend yield of 2.15? Its not me that’s calling your plan BS, its the history of the market.

Just like with lottery tix, you might buy some windmill company that get a gov’t contract and makes you a fortune. That’s just dumb luck.

So I wish you luck…you’ll need it. [/quote]

Stocks purchased over a period of time have been shown to be the best investment over the past 200 years. And I know I don’t have to post a 200 year history to prove this. Or, would you like that? So you can move on your merry way singing gloom and doom and I’ll keep making money. 10 years from now I will be worth far more than I am now, and you will be sorry you listened to nut bags.

That’s really the end of the story.
[/quote]

Bullshit. Those statistics are not correctly inflation adjusted.

Sounds like you are pretty set in your beliefs.

The stockmarket is a suckers game, unless you have inside information. Thats how wall-street works. Get everyone to churn up as much business as possible, and make a killing when the inside info comes along.

Average joe is gambling unless you know the game.

The best way to invest is to pick safe income generating investments with a solid return and compound your profits over time.
[/quote]

You have no idea how uninformed you sound. You’re an ignoramus. [/quote]

Having not read the majority of this thread, allow me to ask you what your general stock investment strategy would be ZEB? Do you invest for the “long haul” or “short term”; take-over trading or momentum stocks? (and so forth)[/quote]

Buy and hold has been the best investment strategy over the past 100+ years I don’t expect it to change now. Most people don’t understand economic cycles and they become scared. We’ve had many of these cycles from the 1800’s on. Every time I read another post of gloom and doom I simply laugh to myself.

Ever hear the term “buy when there’s blood in the streets”? Baron Rothschild said that in 1871. He bought stocks (in Paris) during the stock panic of 1871. When all the suckers who were scared began panic selling he doubled up his buying. He amassed a fortune. Remember the market moves on fear and greed. If you are smart enough to take advantage of the situation you can do very well. I am a buyer in this market, as all smart investors are.
[/quote]

The rothschilds made a lot of money, but they were the original insider traders. They made money in all kinds of situations, primarily by selling war bonds. They could only do this by being the most well informed traders at the time, with connections that no-one else had. Comparing joe jerk-off who trades at scott-trade with the rothschilds is retarded.