I’ve noticed that people can get very lost in historical debate when arguing the divinity of Christ, but just remember that the New Testament is only a 2000 year old document, which is not an incredibly old piece of writing (even Shakespeare’s work is hundreds of years old). And when you factor in all the different accounts and perspectives on Jesus’ teaching (from the different disciples) the idea that the New Testament may actually be a relatively accurate account of Jesus’ life and teaching becomes not all that unbelievable. What do you think? By the way, the title of this post is also the title of a very good book by Chicago Tribune writer Lee Strobel I read a few weeks ago on the subject. It approaches the messianic prophecies and accuracy of the New Testament in a methodical, logical manner based on both simple reason and archaeological evidence. The conclusion is obvious and undeniable. Any other believers out there?
Here is an interesting experiment. Get a copy of The New Testment and Highlight only the passage where Jesus taught something. Then read the dead sea scolls, the Eseen <Sp?> Bible and if you can find them there are several other historical writing by different religious writer of that period. Can you find a pattern? Also for historical purposes the work of Heriodous <again sp?, Sorry L&F> he was a Roman historian who lived and wrote at that time and read what he says about Jesus. This is one reason why I watch the BBC news, it pays to get a different perspective.
PS - Watch out for flaming retorts.
I don’t know man. It all depends on each individuals faith. I’ve heard so many sides to the bible, the times it has been changed, etc. etc etc. I’ve heard that the teachings of bible believed in reincarnation but some king in 200 bc took that out because he felt that people should get to heaven quicker instead of being reborn again and again. I’ve heard that the real Jesus Christ was some guy named Jeshua whose only teaching was to love. I’m not going to waste my time figuring out what the truth behind the bible is, or who Jesus really was. Also, I’m not going to bother people over their individual faith. But one thing I believe to be true is that Jesus was not white!
Who gives a shit?
Hasn’t the bible been translated back-and-forth between several languages over that two thousand years? Ever heard a phrase translated from english to, say, taiwanese and then back to english again? Little left of the original message. Not looking offend anyone, but I have a hard time believing the bible is an accurate representation of the times.
Thomas Paine’s THE AGE OF REASON is only a couple of hundred years old and it completely points out the pure silliness of believing in the Christian bible. I challenge you to test your faith, read THE AGE OF REASON, and then come back to the forum and counter ANY of the arguments Paine makes in the book (none of which are as goofy as “well, it’s a pretty new book so it must be true”).
Yeah, I think you mean the ESSENE BIBLE and HERODOTUS. For a second there you confused the hell out of me: try to be precise when giving information for the good of those receiving it. (Just trying to give a little constructive criticism.)
Actually, the translation arguement isn’t a good one. If you are shitty in the language, of course there would be mistranslation to the point of completely destroying the message. However, experts in the languages are used to translate. Same reason we can read Homer and feel confident that he really is telling a story of the Trojan War instead of a baking recipe. Different translators will write out the translation differently, but they should still contain the same message.
Personally I’m an athiest/pagan (pagan when I need to pray to something due to stress and what not) and I’d like to say that its aight what you believe as long as you don’t go around preaching how great it is and how everyone else is gonna go to hell, not saying that you “the fan” are this kind of a person, but those that are just plain annoying.
Obviously you do huck. After all, you responded to a post that was directed to believers. “Any other believers out there?” Just pointing out the irony.
just checking in, yep a christian, nuff said
I went to a catholic highschool and was taught that the bible is not intended to be interpreted strictly. It is instead using stories to convey a message. You know that all of those stories aren’t true. ALso the New testament was written over a 100 years after Jesus’s death, so how can it be accurate.
You’re right.
Jesus wasnt white? Was he not jewish? Arent all jews white?
Bad place to start. The bible is a document that outside of “spiritual conversion” makes no sense (other than some good moral teaching which is not it’s written intent). So anyone not claiming faith in Christ has no real motivation to approach the bible as a life guide more than let’s say the muslim scriptures…Proving to someone that bible is true will not “convert” them. A lot of well meaning Christians over the years have tried this approach and the recipient feels as if they have been attacked and it just pisses them off. (Not saying that this is what you are doing.)
The bottom line is that no one can be convinced of the truth of the bible outside of conversion.
If you enjoyed reading about the messianic prophecies and how they came true, I’d think you would also enjoy reading about the other prophecies in the bible. I’ve recently read ‘Are We Living In The End Times?’ by Tim LaHaye & Jerry B. Jenkins (the authors of the Left Behind series) and it was definitely time well spent. I’m not sure if I’m remembering the numbers correctly, but I believe it said around 30% of the Bible is prophecy, and there are twice as many prophetic writings about Christ’s second coming as his first.
I’d highly recommend learning more about the prophecies around the end-times and Christ’s return – its very interesting and truly inspiring stuff. Just remember it is important to read the bible daily as well, not to rely solely on others teachings on it (a habit I am bad for getting into!).
Take care,
Denis <><
“For as lightning that comes from the east is visible even in the west, so will be the coming of the Son of Man.” Matthew 24:27
Sorry, If my misspelling caused any problems. I had <sp?> in my first post, but I can see by reading what was posted, that they were removed. Thank you for clearing up the misspellings. Over the years a number of books have been edited out of the bible (both old and new Testment) they are available if you check around. Best of Luck.
I wasn’t suggesting that some uneducated baffoon was translating the bible. I was simply illustrating the point that “meaning” can get lost in translation… especially if it jumps from one language to another over the centuries.
Not to mention how much personal interpretation can come into play. Regardless of how educated a scholar may be, there is no way getting around his/her own views on things. In some way or another it will affect their translation, intentional or not.
Since “prophesies” and “end times” were brought up, I thought I’d enter into this one. First off, I am Christian, so if anyone reading this is thinking I’m anti-Bible or anything – not so. Any way, end times are basically an interpretation of the book “Revalation.” If you haven’t read it recently, I suggest giving it a once-over. It’s full of symbolism. But I don’t really believe it was written as symbolism, it was just written by some one who had no understanding of exactly what he ws seeing. Think about this – if you lived at the time this book was written, how would you describe a computer? How about the internet? A car? A radio? Any sufficiently advanced technology will seem like “magic” to the relatively primitive mind. Beasts with many wings? Maybe helicopters. Beast with a thuousand eyes? Maybe the internet. Trumpet blasts? I don’t think we’re talking Maynard Furgeson’s “Primal Scream” here, just some sufficiently loud noise. This guy is trying to describe things he saw in terms that the minds of the time could understand. I do believe the events of Revalation WILL come to pass, however, I don’t believe they should be studied and sought after. I remember a quote from Martin Luther (not that I think he’s the be-all end-all of Christianity) when he was asked, if he knew the world would end tomorrow, what he would do. His answer was, “I’d plant a tree.” Kind of long term thinking for some one who knows it all ends tomorrow. The idea is that it is not for us to know the time, just be ready NOW.
Bingo! Well said.