The Abortion Thread

[countingbeans]

[quote]BrianHanson wrote:
so who pays for the kids?[/quote]

The parents? We can start there…

I pay for my kids.

I am not forcing anyone to do something that comes with an 18 year price tag.

Wow…

So… Much… Of… This… Statment… Is… Fucked… Up… I… Don’t… Know… Where… To… Start…

Your veiw of children aside: So if Person A murders Person B, and 300,000 eye witness and a camera confirm Person A is guilty, Person A shouldn’t have to do prison time?

If you are against abortion fine, but trying to legislate its end means that you are adding a financial burden to society, not having a plan to deal with that burden is just a bullshit way to make yourselves feel better when you sleep at night, while other people go to bed hungry.

Governemnt mandated birth control for those that don’t qualify as “able to support another human” in the wage department?

Is that a good alternative?

[quote]
So you think that everyone that had a marriage and a mortgage is still financially solvent? [/quote]

Um, no. Not even remotely close to what I said.

I was speaking in terms of “make people meet certain financial benchmarks before they can marry, or engage in any sort of human relationship recognized by law.”

There is no way to guarantee people don’t become poor, no matter what sort of plan you come up with. You cannot breed out poor because poor isn’t always a situation you are born into.

So poor is sometimes a consequence of people’s actions that they must live with and deal with?

hm… Sounds familiar.

Also, breeding out poor doesn’t mean eliminating it. It means raising the floor, slowly.

Seriously, read the whole fucking quote. I didn’t say luck is the reason for success, I said it is a component, if you don’t think it is then I suppose neither I nor business professors from a host of MBA programs can change your mind (Cornell, Stanford, and my professors from SU),

First off, I have more than enough letters after my name, and well over 12,000 of real life experience in my field to know that you thinking luck is a big enough contributing factor into peoples’ success to include it in your list means you are full of shit.

Luck isn’t even real. It is some bullshit people tell themselves to make themselves feel better when they compare themselves to others.

luck is a component in everything from being promoted out of the mailroom

No, just no.

Quantifiable goals are associated with success, not having goals is associated with lower income levels. I have no idea how you got what you said out of my post.

Not having goals = being lazy. Not having goals is a personal problem that is very very fixable if people stop being lazy shits.

You attribute success more to what others give you, rather than what you earn. Your use of luck and twisted sense of goals prove that. Success comes from what you earn, not from what you are given.

Blacks make up 13% of the population, but not 13% of the representation in congress, the senate or past presidents, they don’t make up 13% of the richest Americans, 13% of CEO’s etc. I wonder why that is?

I would imagine it has something to do with the institions you are mentioning being around for quite awhile before Blacks were afforded equal rights under law.

It has been what, a generation, and a black man was voted to the highest position in the world?

Change takes time, and the “good 'ol Boys” still run shit homie, don’t fool yourself.

Yes anyone can achieve, not that you think they can really,

Correct, I don’t think they can, I know they can.

Maybe you are looking for wealth redistribution?

Not even close. No.

I’m talking about raising the floor, if it was clear.

Just because you have less than your neighbor doesn’t make you poor.

[quote]
Goods are scarce, and everything is limited, then wealth must be limited also. There is only so much gold in the world, and one person cannot own 120% of all the gold on the earth, because 100% is the biggest share anyone could acquire. Wealth is finite because the accumulation of goods has a limit. Hell at a certain point you even run out of intangible goods. Not everyone can have everything. [/quote]

First off, you have to evaluate what people consider wealth and understand that it changes over time.

Second, how on Earth would you run out of intangible goods? You know what intangible means right?

[BrianHanson]

Beans,

"The parents? We can start there…

I pay for my kids."

Great fucking answer, I can only assume you wanted your kids. Who pays for the ones nobody wants, who pays for the kids when the parents can’t even pay for themselves? Your answer sucks, but I assume you already know that. We don’t live in a 3rd world country (yet) so the social safety net provides for minors, are you saying we should get rid of abortion and the social programs that protect impoverished children?

"Wow…

So… Much… Of… This… Statment… Is… Fucked… Up… I… Don’t… Know… Where… To… Start…

Your veiw of children aside: So if Person A murders Person B, and 300,000 eye witness and a camera confirm Person A is guilty, Person A shouldn’t have to do prison time"

What you said has nothing to do with my post. Congratulations. Can you actually read?

"Governemnt mandated birth control for those that don’t qualify as “able to support another human” in the wage department?

Is that a good alternative?"

That seems like a marvelous idea for China, you should market it over there.

"So poor is sometimes a consequence of people’s actions that they must live with and deal with?

hm… Sounds familiar.

Also, breeding out poor doesn’t mean eliminating it. It means raising the floor, slowly."

You say you want to raise the floor, tell me how.

"First off, I have more than enough letters after my name, and well over 12,000 of real life experience in my field to know that you thinking luck is a big enough contributing factor into peoples’ success to include it in your list means you are full of shit.

Luck isn’t even real. It is some bullshit people tell themselves to make themselves feel better when they compare themselves to others."

Clearly you have decided that you have never been lucky, who am I to disabuse you of that notion? The fact that “luck” is a word used to describe success is not an insult. Here is an example from Malcolm Gladwell in his book “Outliers” paraphrased by Cornell professor Bob Frank " a disproportionate number of pro hockey players owe their success to the accident of having been born in January, which made them the oldest, most experienced players in every youth league growing up. For that reason alone, they were more likely to make all-star teams, receive special coaching and eventually become professionals."
It is also luck that you reap the rewards of the work done to build up the country you live in, the industry you work in and the company you work for. Luck is finding a job in a depressed economy when you have the same qualifications as another candidate but you went to high school with the HR manager, luck is deciding to buy a lottery ticket, even though you never do, and winning, luck is a pitcher catching a line drive up the middle when your glove is in the perfect spot on your follow through, luck is the other guy getting in a fender bender before the interview etc, the list is long and exhaustive but none of it is an indication that you aren’t worth success, it just tells you that the flip side of each of these arguments is true of failure.

“No, just no.”

yes oh yes.

"Not having goals = being lazy. Not having goals is a personal problem that is very very fixable if people stop being lazy shits.

You attribute success more to what others give you, rather than what you earn. Your use of luck and twisted sense of goals prove that. Success comes from what you earn, not from what you are given"

Who taught you about goals, the placenta? Maybe it was your parents, maybe it was a college professor, now remove all of those things from the equation, grow up dirt poor with alcoholic parents and no role models, no “good influences” and tell me where your goals come from.
I don’t attribute my success to what others give me, I attribute my life to my choices, I wanted to retire by 45, I did it at 42, could I have made more if I stayed another 10 years? Sure. But my pension is substantial enough that I chose retirement. Luck played a part in my opportunities, but so did college and grad school, so did the military and my chosen field of endeavor, and so did luck

"First off, you have to evaluate what people consider wealth and understand that it changes over time.

Second, how on Earth would you run out of intangible goods? You know what intangible means right?"

Everything is finite, so no matter what you consider valuable eventually it will be tapped out. And yes I know what intangible goods are, I was making a joking comment about the fact that the accumulation of wealth and goods will eventually lead to there being nothing new under the sun, while music and other online items may be intangible, they will either have no value or their value will be stripped by the lack of available resources to create new items. If I own the means of production and distribution I also can determine whether or not to add anything else to what we have. It’s unlikely but possible. I am not interested in comparing service goods and intangible goods (though they may overlap like a live band singing songs that are intangible goods).

[countingbeans]

[quote]BrianHanson wrote:
Who pays for the ones nobody wants, who pays for the kids when the parents can’t even pay for themselves? [/quote]

The parents. They made the choice to have sex. Maybe it was your luck that played a part and their birth control failed, but never the less, they choose the action and have to pony up to the results.

Your answer sucks, but I assume you already know that.

You know what they say about people who assume…

We don’t live in a 3rd world country (yet) so the social safety net provides for minors, are you saying we should get rid of abortion and the social programs that protect impoverished children?

So are you are saying that abortion is an effective way to control the population and the expenses created by it?

[quote]

What you said has nothing to do with my post. [/quote]

Actually it does. Murder comes with an “18 year price tag”, you said you don’t want people to have to pay it. So, I ask again, do you feel the murderer shouldn’t have to serve jail time?

Congratulations.

Thank you

Can you actually read?

Attack the man if you can’t attack the argument. Nice one, never seen that rebuttal before.

[quote]

That seems like a marvelous idea for China, you should market it over there.[/quote]

How about we just kill the kids instead then?

We don’t want to be like China.

[quote]"So poor is sometimes a consequence of people’s actions that they must live with and deal with?

hm… Sounds familiar.

Also, breeding out poor doesn’t mean eliminating it. It means raising the floor, slowly."

You say you want to raise the floor, tell me how. [/quote]

Please address the point in the text of mine you quoted you are ignoring.

And I told you how already, and clearly stated I didn’t want to, but was offering suggestions on how to.

Here is an example from Malcolm Gladwell in his book “Outliers” paraphrased by Cornell professor Bob Frank " a disproportionate number of pro hockey players owe their success to the accident of having been born in January, which made them the oldest, most experienced players in every youth league growing up. For that reason alone, they were more likely to make all-star teams, receive special coaching and eventually become professionals."

Bullshit, utter bullshit. If the fetus born in January was pre-determined by other humans as it had to be a hockey player that is true.

The fact more hockey players are born in January is a conincidence. Talent, skill, and hard work has a lot more to do with it than birth day.

Luck is finding a job in a depressed economy when you have the same qualifications as another candidate but you went to high school with the HR manager,

Maintaining a good network is not luck.

luck is deciding to buy a lottery ticket, even though you never do, and winning,

Statistical anomoly, not luck

[quote]
“No, just no.”

yes oh yes.[/quote]

Um, no. Getting promoted is the product of your effort, and you as a person. Luck isn’t a factor.

I actually help make promotion choices at my firm… We never consider luck.

grow up dirt poor with alcoholic parents and no role models, no “good influences” and tell me where your goals come from.

You won’t believe this, but I did.

I make more now than both my parents combined. It wasn’t luck. I worked my ass off to get where I am now. Luck played not a single part in what I did. I earned my place in college, earned all those grades, earned my job, and earn my wage. I did, not some super-natural luck monster.

I have plenty of fiends I grew up with that didn’t have goals. Life taught me about goals. Nice try at another personal attack though, I’m impressed.

Everything is finite,

Inertia?

Please explain how an intangible something is finite.

[KneeDragger_79]

FACT: about 90% of babies determined to have Down syndrome are aborted.

9 out of 10 children with DS are missing because they have been intentionally killed before birth. How can we call ourselves a civilized society when we deliberately slaughter those we decide will have a “bad quality” of life?

Tests can tell us a child’s condition. They CANNOT tell us what quality of life a child will have. Who are we to decide that?

-KD79- A similar story started the last thread and I know people will complain again, something about using the child. In fact the mother is proud of her son and happy to see the joy people have for him.

[BrianHanson]

" Nice try at another personal attack though, I’m impressed. "

Since I don’t know your personal story explain how that is a personal attack, it was an “example”,there is a difference.

"Actually it does. Murder comes with an “18 year price tag”, you said you don’t want people to have to pay it. So, I ask again, do you feel the murderer shouldn’t have to serve jail time? "

You actually see a correlation between what I said and what you wrote. Interesting. By the way, Murder doesn’t come with an 18 year price tag, the sentences vary depending on the degree. I said that I am not asking a mother to take care of a child for 18 years, if you are unable to read for content I guess that is not my problem.

"Um, no. Getting promoted is the product of your effort, and you as a person. Luck isn’t a factor.

I actually help make promotion choices at my firm… We never consider luck."

You never consider luck, I agree, but have you ever seen a case where a person gets promoted because their boss has a midlife crisis, and the underling gets the promotion because he/she got the chance to take over a project, shine while doing it, and get a job they would have normally waited five more years before they got a shot at it? I have, my team member at my last job went batshit, we were in the middle of a big old hospital wide assessment and I needed a replacement, we brought up a young woman on our staff, gave her the parameters she was a star, she got a permanent promotion and a 3 level pay increase waiver, that was luck and skill. I did not consider luck I considered skill, luck gave her the opportunity, hard work gave her the promotion.

“Maintaining a good network is not luck”

HaHa!! You are grasping here, if you just happen to bump into the HR manager of a company (who you have not seen in 25 years since high school) by luck, and by luck they are hiring YOUR position, and you get the nod over equally qualified candidates, that is not luck? You are pretty full of shit right now.

"Bullshit, utter bullshit. If the fetus born in January was pre-determined by other humans as it had to be a hockey player that is true.

The fact more hockey players are born in January is a conincidence. Talent, skill, and hard work has a lot more to do with it than birth day."

Really? Are you 100% sure? Because your statement says that you accept the birth date as having some impact, just not as much as talent and hard work, and as far as the pregnancy, it is luck that the parents got together on that night and made a baby, 5 minutes earlier or later and things would be different, that Beans is “Luck”.

Holy shit I didn’t know inertia was a commodity to be bought and sold.
An intangible good isn’t technically finite, but if there is no market for that good will it continue to exist (since it isn’t physical)

[BrianHanson]

Please address the point in the text of mine you quoted you are ignoring.

And I told you how already, and clearly stated I didn’t want to, but was offering suggestions on how to.

Yeah, I wasn’t disagreeing with the post. Should I?

[KneeDragger_79]

Lethal foresight: deciding who gets to be born
by Eric Mataxas Tue Jun 26, 2012

On first hearing, it sounds like something out of science fiction: mapping the genome of a person who has not been born yet. But that’s exactly what geneticists at the University of Washington announced that they were able to do.

Their accomplishment has been called a “glance into the future.” But the question is: What kind of future?

Writing in the journal “Science Translational Medicine,” the researchers described how they reconstructed the genome of an unborn child using a blood sample from a pregnant woman and a saliva sample from the father.

According to the New York Times, they used a combination of “new high-speed DNA sequencing and some statistical and computational acrobatics.” Their accomplishment “heralds an era in which parents might find it easier to know the complete DNA blueprint of a child months before it is born.”

Now, “high-speed DNA sequencing” and “statistical and computational acrobatics” sounds impressive. But this begs the most important question: Why would parents want to know their unborn child’s complete DNA blueprint months before he or she is born?

The specter of “Gattaca” (the 1998 film about a society in which most children are made-to-order), is so visible in this story that even the New York Times warned of serious ethical considerations; considerations such as the possibility of an “increase [in] abortions for reasons that have little to do with medical issues and more to do with parental preferences for traits in children.”

Not only would fetuses with genetic diseases be aborted, as they usually are now, but the article says “it is also possible that parents may be tempted to terminate if the fetus lacked a favorable trait like athletic prowess.”

Marcy Darnovsky of the Center for Genetics and Society told the Times that this technology could “spur questions on ‘who deserves to be born.’” In a similar vein, Dr. Stephen A. Brown of the University of Vermont spoke of a move toward “positive selection” – euphemism for God-like decisions about who should be allowed to be born.

For all the talk about “better and better prenatal diagnosis,” experience teaches us to be skeptical about where this genetic foresight will lead.

For starters, there’s what happens to unborn children who are diagnosed in utero with genetic illnesses: relatively few of them are ever born. Prenatal diagnosis already functions as a kind of “weeding out” process: Adding “thousands of genetic diseases” to the list, as this new technology will make possible, simply means more dead children.

And, for the foreseeable future, this technology cannot heal anyone - it can only give prospective parents reasons to kill their unborn child. A child made in the image of God.

Anybody who thinks that parents won’t be tempted to turn to their local geneticist for the perfect baby has not been paying attention. We already live in a culture where some parents demand that doctors prescribe a Schedule II amphetamine, Adderall, just to help their kids compete against their peers. And a culture that can’t bring itself to meaningfully condemn sex-selection abortions, at home or abroad, will not stand in the way of parents who want to play God.

All of which makes this “glance into the future” the stuff of science fiction nightmares.

Reprinted from Breakpoint.org

http://www.lifesitenews.com/news/lethal-foresight-deciding-who-gets-to-be-born

[KneeDragger_79]

This is AWESOME! The Survivors of the Abortion Holocaust are hosting their annual pro-life activism camp in California this week.

‘Share’ this great pro-life group’s work to bring an end to the abortion holocaust and protect every human life!

About
Survivors is a Christian, pro-life activism organization dedicated to educating and activating high school and college age individuals about abortion. Sign up for Survivor Emails here: http://www.survivors.la/get-involved.asp

Mission
Survivors is a Christian, pro-life activism organization dedicated to educating and activating high school and college age individuals.
If you were born after 1972, we challenge you to consider yourself a Survivor of the Abortion Holocaust. 1/3 of your generation has been killed by abortion in America!

The Survivors are taking an active stand on behalf of those who have already been lost, and for those who are scheduled to die through abortion. We are empowered by the truth, enabled by extensive training, and unafraid of condemning the death of innocents.
General Information
http://survivors.la/blog/

https://twitter.com/#!/thesurvivors

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Survivors of the Abortion Holocaust

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[countingbeans]

Dude, learn to quote function, this is painful…

[quote]BrianHanson wrote:

Since I don’t know your personal story explain how that is a personal attack, it was an “example”,there is a difference.[/quote]

The part where you asked, in a snide way, who taught me about goals? That was a lame atempt at an insult.

You actually see a correlation between what I said and what you wrote. Interesting.

Yes, someone owning up to the consequenses of their actions. Whether that be raising the child they made or serving the prison term they earned commiting a crime.

I said that I am not asking a mother to take care of a child for 18 years,

Right, I’m asking, based on this logic, do you demand the murderer do the time he earned in prison?

If the murderer has to pay the price of prison, why should the mother be allowed to not have fact the result of her actions?

if you are unable to read for content I guess that is not my problem.

Tired and inaccurate ad hominen. I’m trying to be an adult here, can you have this conversation without attcking me?

but have you ever seen a case where a person gets promoted because their boss has a midlife crisis, and the underling gets the promotion because he/she got the chance to take over a project, shine while doing it, and get a job they would have normally waited five more years before they got a shot at it? I have, my team member at my last job went batshit, we were in the middle of a big old hospital wide assessment and I needed a replacement, we brought up a young woman on our staff, gave her the parameters she was a star, she got a permanent promotion and a 3 level pay increase waiver, that was luck and skill. I did not consider luck I considered skill, luck gave her the opportunity, hard work gave her the promotion.

Luck gave her opportunity? Seems to me, that you gave her the opportunity, and her work earned her the promotion. I don’t see any luck at all. She reacted to her environment, and the results were positive.

Look, I don’t care if you believe in luck, I really don’t, but don’t try and pass off this bullshit that people are succesful because of it, that is bullshit.

[quote]

HaHa!! You are grasping here, [/quote]

Um, no. What do you think the major difference between people that go to Duke and people that go to Suck-City State College? The network. Who you know is just as important as what you know. Anyone in business that doesn’t get this…

You are pretty full of shit right now.

There are a million reasons one person can get a job over another. I am not full of anything in fact.

Really? Are you 100% sure? Because your statement says that you accept the birth date as having some impact,

How so? Pretty sure I called it bullshit.

it is luck that the parents got together on that night and maybe a baby, 5 minutes earlier or later and things would be different, that Beans is “Luck”.

Um, no, that is conception.

Holy shit I didn’t know inertia was a commodity to be bought and sold.

You said “everything is finite”. The word everything, when you use it, precludes you from turning around later and trying to say you actually were talking about something specific.

An intangible good isn’t technically finite

ah, progress… You can admit when you weren’t correct about something.

[countingbeans]

[quote]BrianHanson wrote:
Please address the point in the text of mine you quoted you are ignoring.

And I told you how already, and clearly stated I didn’t want to, but was offering suggestions on how to.

Yeah, I wasn’t disagreeing with the post. Should I? [/quote]

So, poor people have to face the results of their actions and live with them and deal with them?

Why don’t mothers?

[Brother_Chris]

[quote]sufiandy wrote:

[quote]Brother Chris wrote:

[quote]sufiandy wrote:

[quote]BrianHanson wrote:
Giving a shit about an unborn child is sweet, letting that child grow up in poverty and neglect because it’s “not my problem” is evil. So feel free to explain how you would change that, realistically that is, I’d love to see your answer. [/quote]

It is their problem, but they will just blame it on the liberals somehow.[/quote]

False Dichotomy.

You can’t change poverty, it is going to always be there. Christians don’t hate poverty: we love the poor, though. We give large amounts of money to ease unnecessary suffering where possible. However, we haven’t fallen in the trap of “hating” poverty because at some point when you hate poverty you come to hate the poor because it goes against your sense of pride. I grew up in poverty until rather recently, I was and still am the happiest kid on the block. So, are my friends and family that lived and live in poverty. [/quote]

Do you read what I say or just pick out keywords and assume I meant something else?[/quote]

Sorry, I forgot to delete your reply to Brian, I can’t see him and only comment on his stuff when I see he says something really dumb.

[pat]

[quote]BrianHanson wrote:
Beans,

"The parents? We can start there…

I pay for my kids."

Great fucking answer, I can only assume you wanted your kids. Who pays for the ones nobody wants, who pays for the kids when the parents can’t even pay for themselves? Your answer sucks, but I assume you already know that. We don’t live in a 3rd world country (yet) so the social safety net provides for minors, are you saying we should get rid of abortion and the social programs that protect impoverished children?

"Wow…

So… Much… Of… This… Statment… Is… Fucked… Up… I… Don’t… Know… Where… To… Start…

Your veiw of children aside: So if Person A murders Person B, and 300,000 eye witness and a camera confirm Person A is guilty, Person A shouldn’t have to do prison time"

What you said has nothing to do with my post. Congratulations. Can you actually read?

"Governemnt mandated birth control for those that don’t qualify as “able to support another human” in the wage department?

Is that a good alternative?"

That seems like a marvelous idea for China, you should market it over there.

"So poor is sometimes a consequence of people’s actions that they must live with and deal with?

hm… Sounds familiar.

Also, breeding out poor doesn’t mean eliminating it. It means raising the floor, slowly."

You say you want to raise the floor, tell me how.

"First off, I have more than enough letters after my name, and well over 12,000 of real life experience in my field to know that you thinking luck is a big enough contributing factor into peoples’ success to include it in your list means you are full of shit.

Luck isn’t even real. It is some bullshit people tell themselves to make themselves feel better when they compare themselves to others."

Clearly you have decided that you have never been lucky, who am I to disabuse you of that notion? The fact that “luck” is a word used to describe success is not an insult. Here is an example from Malcolm Gladwell in his book “Outliers” paraphrased by Cornell professor Bob Frank " a disproportionate number of pro hockey players owe their success to the accident of having been born in January, which made them the oldest, most experienced players in every youth league growing up. For that reason alone, they were more likely to make all-star teams, receive special coaching and eventually become professionals."
It is also luck that you reap the rewards of the work done to build up the country you live in, the industry you work in and the company you work for. Luck is finding a job in a depressed economy when you have the same qualifications as another candidate but you went to high school with the HR manager, luck is deciding to buy a lottery ticket, even though you never do, and winning, luck is a pitcher catching a line drive up the middle when your glove is in the perfect spot on your follow through, luck is the other guy getting in a fender bender before the interview etc, the list is long and exhaustive but none of it is an indication that you aren’t worth success, it just tells you that the flip side of each of these arguments is true of failure.

“No, just no.”

yes oh yes.

"Not having goals = being lazy. Not having goals is a personal problem that is very very fixable if people stop being lazy shits.

You attribute success more to what others give you, rather than what you earn. Your use of luck and twisted sense of goals prove that. Success comes from what you earn, not from what you are given"

Who taught you about goals, the placenta? Maybe it was your parents, maybe it was a college professor, now remove all of those things from the equation, grow up dirt poor with alcoholic parents and no role models, no “good influences” and tell me where your goals come from.
I don’t attribute my success to what others give me, I attribute my life to my choices, I wanted to retire by 45, I did it at 42, could I have made more if I stayed another 10 years? Sure. But my pension is substantial enough that I chose retirement. Luck played a part in my opportunities, but so did college and grad school, so did the military and my chosen field of endeavor, and so did luck

"First off, you have to evaluate what people consider wealth and understand that it changes over time.

Second, how on Earth would you run out of intangible goods? You know what intangible means right?"

Everything is finite, so no matter what you consider valuable eventually it will be tapped out. And yes I know what intangible goods are, I was making a joking comment about the fact that the accumulation of wealth and goods will eventually lead to there being nothing new under the sun, while music and other online items may be intangible, they will either have no value or their value will be stripped by the lack of available resources to create new items. If I own the means of production and distribution I also can determine whether or not to add anything else to what we have. It’s unlikely but possible. I am not interested in comparing service goods and intangible goods (though they may overlap like a live band singing songs that are intangible goods).

[/quote]

I think your “Really, they are better off dead” argument is failing. Well I don’t think I know. Want to know where your big logic fail is? You cannot know what a dead person’s future would have been like. Second, it’s not up to you or anyone else to kill because that person might have a shitty life.

People who have a shitty life, many times still want to live. And those who don’t may kill themselves and if they do, at least it was their decisions and not anybody else’s.

[pat]

“Kill all the poor people!” Just make sure you do it before they figure out they’re poor!

[BrianHanson]

Pat,

You guys really need to learn to read.

[countingbeans]

[quote]BrianHanson wrote:
Pat,

You guys really need to learn to read.[/quote]

Funny you keep up with the ad hominens…

I tried, for a few posts to ask questions so I could better understand WTF your point was, because more than just I read something other than you claim you intended. There comes a point when you have to ask yourself: “Is it how I wrote it, or is every other person reading what I wrote, wrong?”.

[BrianHanson]

Beans,

People tend to read more into a statement than there actually is. At no point do I state or even suggest that we should kill poor people, so putting “kill all the poor people” in quotes as an attribution to me indicates either an inability to read, or a desire to twist a statement to suit your own needs. Throughout this entire thread I have stated a single and continuous thought, a woman’s right to choose is just that a woman’s right.

I asked if people had a plan for the 1.6 million unwanted children and the answer is either crickets, clowns typing “strawman”, or a redirect to Eugenics/Hitler/The final solution. It is tiring. I would like at least one person on the anti-choice side to say “Abortion is wrong, but seriously once the baby is born it’s not my problem, why should I have to have a plan.” Because while that is a shitty answer at least you guys would be honest about the results of your plan to outlaw abortion.

edited for not giving a shit

[Tiribulus]

And I will try this with you again:

[quote]BrianHanson wrote:<<< or give me another answer, >>>[/quote]What do you figure the difference was when these problems were a rarity?

[BrianHanson]

Tribulus,

I am sorry, I don’t know what post you are referring to. If you could link the post or what I said in total I will happily answer.

[Tiribulus]

[quote]BrianHanson wrote:
Tribulus,

I am sorry, I don’t know what post you are referring to. If you could link the post or what I said in total I will happily answer.[/quote]That IS the whole post. There was a time when NONE of this was an issue. We didn’t worry about 1.6 million unwanted children a year. They didn’t exist Non issue. Why?

[countingbeans]

[quote]BrianHanson wrote:
Beans,

so putting “kill all the poor people” in quotes as an attribution to me indicates either an inability to read, or a desire to twist a statement to suit your own needs. [/quote]

Or a third option: You weren’t clear.

Again, I asked if you were refering to eugenics, you said no. So I asked further questions to try and clarify your position and logic behind it.

I asked if people had a plan for the 1.6 million unwanted children and the answer is

This is where people start to get confused with your stance.

The way you present it, makes it appear that you prefer they weren’t born, as it is a better solution. You claim that isn’t the case, and fine, you don’t think that. But you have to understand, to me, and other people, that is how this statement is read by others.

So no, it isn’t a “twist”, it is a perception.

I would like at least one person on the anti-choice side to say “Abortion is wrong, but seriously once the baby is born it’s not my problem, why should I have to have a plan.”

I say that about other people every day. Unwanted or wanted. haha. So yes, I will admit it. My position on this topic is devils advocate, and unoffical shit starter, but I will say, I am very apathetic.

[quote]
edited for not giving a shit[/quote]

as for your edit, I saw the orginal post. And I am sorry for that. You are correct if that is the way it went down.