A big problem is people seeing themselves as more important that others simply because they’re in a car.
You wouldn’t walk down the street and shove someone out of the way and scream “FUCK OFF ASSHOLE!” at them and blow an air horn that you’re carrying…but lots of people do it if they’re in a car.
Thing is the cyclists that ride on the sidewalk (assholes) then do the same Goddamned thing! They ride like they’re more important than people walking.
[quote]Nards wrote:
A big problem is people seeing themselves as more important that others simply because they’re in a car.
You wouldn’t walk down the street and shove someone out of the way and scream “FUCK OFF ASSHOLE!” at them and blow an air horn that you’re carrying…but lots of people do it if they’re in a car.
[/quote]
It’s much easier to pass someone walking slower than you on a sidewalk than it is to pass a bike on a narrow road. If that person walking forced me into the street and on coming traffic, then you’re god damn right i’d have words.
[quote]ZJStrope wrote:
I remember walking and driving around Amsterdam, cyclist ruled everything. The owner of the business I was auditing said the Dutch are born holding a bike.[/quote]
Are you sure he didn’t say Dike?
[quote]Testy1 wrote:
[quote]ZJStrope wrote:
I remember walking and driving around Amsterdam, cyclist ruled everything. The owner of the business I was auditing said the Dutch are born holding a bike.[/quote]
Are you sure he didn’t say Dike?[/quote]
Perhaps he was confused in his English 
As someone who drives a car and rides bikes a lot I think I can sum up some of the most common complaints drivers have with cyclists:
#1. “I was driving on a narrow two lane road and I had to slow down or swerve into another lane because a cyclist was riding on the road.”
If you had to slow down until there was a safe place to pass, so what? You lost a few seconds on your trip to someplace else. If there are commonly cyclists or other slow moving vehicles on the roads you travel on, then leave a bit earlier. The fact that you're in a car and can travel faster than some other vehicles doesn't make you special or have more of a right to the road than someone in a slow moving vehicle. Pay special attention to #2 From the OHIO LAW OFFICERS GUIDE TO BICYCLING LAW ENFORCEMENT:
Three fallacies about bicycle operation:
If you in fact had to swerve to avoid a cyclist or another slow moving vehicle then you were just driving too fast for the conditions and/or the abilities of yourself and your car. If you’re on a curvy narrow road and you’re approaching a blind corner then you need to be traveling at a speed that allows you to stop in case something is in the road or there’s a slower moving vehicle in your lane. I’ve seen all kinds of things on narrow roads that made me slow down: dogs, cats, dear, porcupines, logs or other cargo that fell off a truck, cyclists, Amish/Mennonite Buggy’s, slow moving trucks, etc…
It’s my responsibility as a driver to be driving at a speed that allows me stop or slow down enough before I have to swerve into another lane or off the road. Again, it may be inconvenient, but the onus is still on me to be in control.
From Massachusetts driving laws:
Driving too fast (speeding) is a main cause of motor vehicle crashes. To protect safety, speed laws in Massachusetts are strongly enforced. If you speed, there are severe penalties (see Chapter Two). When speeding, you need more distance to react and safely
stop your vehicle.
You must never travel so fast that it is not safe. That is the fundamental speed law.
Even if the speed limit is higher, your speed must be based on the following.
â?¢ Traffic conditions â?? the number of vehicles on the road and their speed
â?¢ Road conditions â?? is the road surface rough or smooth; how much water,
ice, or snow is on the road surface; and how wide is the roadway
â?¢ Weather conditions and visibility â?? situations that make it hard to see,
including rain, snow, ice, dust, and wind
â?¢ Pedestrians or bicyclists - people who are traveling along or across the
road
You must lower your speed if there are poor driving conditions or hazards. It does not
matter if the posted speed limit is higher.
http://www.massrmv.com/rmv/dmanual/chapter_4.pdf#page=26
#2. “I’ve seen cyclists disobey traffic laws regularly.”
No defense for cyclists here. They should get cited if they break the law, just like a motorist. However, one of the most common complaints about cyclists seems to be running stop signs. If anyone here who drives a car can honestly say that they ALWAYS come to a complete stop at every stop sing they come to, then you sir/madam are the best driver on the planet. I’ve never met anyone who does this. What most people do when they approach a stop sign in a car or on a bike is slow down enough to look both ways and make sure there’s no approaching traffic or hazards and then they proceed through. in a car this means your usually decelerating from 25-50 MPH to 5-10 MPH and then going through so it’s a major slowing of speed. On a bike, most riders are decelerating from 12-20 MPH to 5-10 MPH and then going through. In any event if you get busted for this in a car or bike you should just man up and pay up, no complaints.
#3. “Cyclists wear dorky clothes.”
Yes, for sure! But they are functional and way more comfortable on long rides than regular shorts. And be honest, some of you wore those clown pants to the gym right?
Having said all this, I ride my bike 5-6 thousand miles a year and I avoid roads with no bike lane. I can’t always do that, but I’d say 95% of my riding is done in a dedicated bike lane or on mountain bike trails. I do this not because it’s illegal to ride on the other roads but because I feel safer in a bike lane because of texting and aggressive drivers who feel entitled to the road. And also because if I can help it, I’d really rather not slow anyone down who’s driving a car.
As a driver I used to have an outside sales job in a the Washington DC area where I grew up when I was just out of college. I realized pretty quickly that getting mad and frustrated while driving was really easy to do and pretty counter productive so I just stopped letting myself get that way. Relax, leave early, and be nice to people on the road was the mentality I adopted. This was before I started riding a bike.
Because of gas prices more and more people are riding bikes regularly so it’s something that people will need to get used to. Hopefully there will be more and more dedicated bike lanes built to avoid as much conflict as possible.
[quote]dcb wrote:
A long-winded bunch of pro-bike bullshit.
[/quote]
Roads are built for modern transportation and commerce and not to support a faux tour-de-france peloton clogging local streets for hours every weekend like human arterial plaque clogging the arteries of the world. A lone biker using a street for transportation is one thing; a fucking pack clogging the road for hours every weekend is another. Whether its legal or not does not require me to approve of it or refrain from getting pissed off when I’m unreasonably delayed.
[quote]dcb wrote:
If you had to slow down until there was a safe place to pass, so what?
[/quote]
More like, had to slam on the brakes to avoid splattering a bike rider doing 15 in a 40.
Regular sight in MD this time of year.
dcb, that is an excellent post. I thought about typing something along that line earlier but abandoned it for actual work. Two key points that follow logically from your post:
Most motorists do not know this or, if they do know it, they do not want to accept it. The attitude referenced above by Aggv re: being “forced” into oncoming traffic when passing a cyclist is an example of this. A motorist passing a cyclist is not “forced” into oncoming traffic unless the bicyclist is capable of Jedi mind tricks. No, the motorist swerves out into the opposing lane of his own volition because he is in an all-fired hurry and that @#$% cyclist is in the way!
Yes, when I’m on a bicycle, occasionally I break a traffic law, such as rolling through a stop sign or rolling through a red light at a deserted intersection when no one is coming instead of coming to a complete stop. This makes me…no different from any motorist on the roads.
[quote]jjackkrash wrote:
[quote]dcb wrote:
A long-winded bunch of pro-bike bullshit.
[/quote]
Roads are built for modern transportation and commerce and not to support a faux tour-de-france peloton clogging local streets for hours every weekend like human arterial plaque clogging the arteries of the world. A lone biker using a street for transportation is one thing; a fucking pack clogging the road for hours every weekend is another. Whether its legal or not does not require me to approve of it or refrain from getting pissed off when I’m unreasonably delayed.
[/quote]
Agreed. Around Ann Arbor there is a winding scenic drive favored by cyclist riding three or four abreast. You can easily go a mile or more before finding a safe place to pass.
I have no problem with cyclists, because I don’t drive like an asshole.
Cyclists pay taxes and have as much right to the road as I do. We’re not talking about highways here… we’re talking about roads.
I feel the same when I drive through Amish country. Slow down and have some maturity and courtesy for others on the road.
[quote]ActivitiesGuy wrote:
My limited driving experience in Europe was generally that it sucks if you aren’t on the Autobahn.
[quote]jjackkrash wrote:
[quote]ActivitiesGuy wrote:
My limited driving experience in Europe was generally that it sucks if you aren’t on the Autobahn. [/quote]
I could just be that Europeans prefer something wedged in their ass when they travel.
If I paid $9.00 a gallon for gas I would cycle more also.
[quote]coolnatedawg wrote:
You live close enough to me that I can x2 this statement. Also, the fact they want to obey every rule of the road save the stoplight.[/quote]
College Park, MD here and I get the same thing EVERY day through the roads in the Department of Agriculture…like if you effers can’t do at least HALF the posted speed limit get the fuck off the road !
[quote]sen say wrote:
like if you effers can’t do at least HALF the posted speed limit get the fuck off the road !
[/quote]
This is a good point.
While it is true that cyclist have as much right to the road as I do, the odds are pretty good that if I was impeding the flow of traffic to the same degree in a car or truck I would be ticketed.
[quote]Testy1 wrote:
[quote]jjackkrash wrote:
[quote]ActivitiesGuy wrote:
My limited driving experience in Europe was generally that it sucks if you aren’t on the Autobahn. [/quote]
I could just be that Europeans prefer something wedged in their ass when they travel.
If I paid $9.00 a gallon for gas I would cycle more also.[/quote]
And not knowing what freaking direction you are going.
Oh, there’s a random sign that says Paris is that way ---->, Except I know I’m like 8 hours from there so I’m not sure where that way is going.
[quote]Testy1 wrote:
[quote]sen say wrote:
like if you effers can’t do at least HALF the posted speed limit get the fuck off the road !
[/quote]
This is a good point.
While it is true that cyclist have as much right to the road as I do, the odds are pretty good that if I was impeding the flow of traffic to the same degree in a car or truck I would be ticketed.
[/quote]
this is the problem. Do the speed limit, fuckin A, do within 5mph of the speed limit and it wouldnt be such a safety hazard to EVERYONE.
[quote]usmccds423 wrote:
Regular sight in MD this time of year. [/quote]
This is a good example of cyclists not respecting the rules of the road. It’s OK that they’re riding two abreast, which is legal in most places, but they should be riding as far to the right of the lane as reasonable. And then there’s the dude in the wrong lane for no apparent reason…
I can’t read what’s on there kit but they clearly ride for the same club/team. A lot of times these clubs are associated/sponsored by local bike shops. If this kind of thing occurs a lot around you I’d say something to the local cops and/or the sponsor of the club. Nobody wants people riding around with their company name on their jerseys giving them a bad name and they’d probably take steps to fix it.
usmccds423 - question for you: If they were riding as I said, single file or two abreast as far to the right as conditions allow, would you have a problem with that?
[quote]jjackkrash wrote:
Roads are built for modern transportation and commerce and not to support a faux tour-de-france peloton clogging local streets for hours every weekend like human arterial plaque clogging the arteries of the world. A lone biker using a street for transportation is one thing; a fucking pack clogging the road for hours every weekend is another. Whether its legal or not does not require me to approve of it or refrain from getting pissed off when I’m unreasonably delayed.
[/quote]
I can generally get behind what you wrote. A lot of roads that are built these days include bike lanes because bikes are part of modern transportation for a lot of people. I also agree that people riding in packs that take up too much of the road aren’t doing the right thing for anyone. As I said to usmccds423 above, if I saw this a lot I’d say something to someone about it as there’s no reason to let cyclists get away with riding that way. Most group rides are regularly scheduled and are associated with a bike shop or team so it’s pretty easy to identify who the organizers are based on what they’re kit.
How long do you have to be delayed before it’s unreasonable?
[quote]dcb wrote:
usmccds423 - question for you: If they were riding as I said, single file or two abreast as far to the right as conditions allow, would you have a problem with that?
[/quote]
are they moving within 5-10mph of the speed limit?