i keep up with mythical strength and really enjoy it
some of the people i work with were talking about proper form on various lifts
so in your experience how important is form for /beginner/intermediate/ your level
i would really like to read your thoughts on this subject
the discussion at work ended when i asked whats the proper form for standing up i was being a weenie i admit
LoRez: Much appreciated. I’ve been on vacation, operating on my phone, so I’ve been off the grid a touch. I’ll make sure to give it a look.
Cavemansam: In my opinion, “form” is not a worthwhile concept. All form details is simply how a movement LOOKS, not what is actually happening in regards to the execution of a movement. The intent of form is noble (have a movement be safe by appearing safe in execution), but the reality becomes ugly, as trainees fixate far too much on how their movement looks versus how they are executing the movement. In turn, when a form check gets posted, overzealous beginners only offer critiques based on appearance (“your back is rounded”, “your hips shoot up at the start”, etc) versus actually addressing the movement itself.
Additionally, the notion of “perfect form” is absurd to me, for lifters come in all shapes and sizes, and the ability to replicate someone’s idea of perfection is going to be limited to the construction of their body. A 5’9 trainee with a 6’8 wingspan is going to have a completely different deadlift form than a 5’9 trainee with a 5’6 wingspan, yet for each lifter it would still be the correct form. And of course, this is to say nothing about how equipment variations alter form as well.
What is of far more significance is TECHNIQUE. Instead of fixating on how a movement looks, focusing instead on how the movement is being executed. Instead of worrying about if a back is rounded, worry more about if a back is braced. Instead of worrying about if a squat is hitting depth, worry about if the squat is achieving the goals of the trainee. Things along this line.
This isn’t really a popular idea, because it’s something that’s much harder to grasp. I could just give someone an old 1920s black and white exercise poster and say “Here, this is good form” and then be “done”, but it does nothing. If I took a trainee and spent time explaining to them the value of keeping their body tense during exercise, bracing with their core, the difference between sitting back versus down, how to hinge their hips versus flex their back, etc etc, it might take much longer, but once they have a grasp on the techniques of lifting, the form will figure itself out.
This is definitely one of the big “ah hah” moments I had in my own training, and I’ve written about it a bit in my blog. If you’d like some even deeper discussion on it, check out the following posts
“THERE IS NO DEADLIFT”
“GOOD FORM AND BEING INJURY FREE IS THE PATH TO MEDIOCRITY”
“ALL ROM IS FULL ROM”
“FORMISM VS REALITY”
“THE FORM CHECK: TREATING THE SYMPTOMS AND IGNORING THE DISEASE”
“WHY ARE YOU USING FULL RANGE OF MOTION?”
“FORM IS OVERRATED”
Holy cow, I’ve written about form a LOT, haha.
thanks for the reply
I probaly read those blog post already but i have memory problems so i will go back and reread them
thanks again and please keep the info coming
No problem man. Thanks for reading!
Chins w/50lbs
26 reps total
Bench 305
5x4
Superset w/
Band pull aparts
5x20
Notes: Right shoulder got jacked up from something yesterday, not sure what. Just have pain when I move it through certain ranges of motion. Thankfully, no impact on benching. This was actually one of my more successful days. Just keep trying to get as tight as possible before lift off.
Shoulder circuit
3 rounds
DB rows 105
8x3
1x30
Notes: Kind of getting the itch to do something different for back work. Truthfully, I do these because the set-up is easy, but maybe some meadows rows need to come back into my rotation.
(14) Chain Suspended Safety Squat Bar Squats
2x445+chains
5x355+chains
Notes: I’d say hamstring is about 98% at this point. Only the slightest twinge toward the very end of both sets. Just taking it easy at this point as it’s the smart thing to do, but my strength is back. I might need to repeat this cycle of the weight just due to circumstances, but I’m getting the benefits of this movement still.
Reverse hyper 5 plates
3x10
superset w/
Standing ab wheel
1x8
2x6
Car deadlift simulator
10x7 plates
10x5 plates
Notes: This was awesome. Finally felt like I was pushing myself with this movement. Actually caused me to grunt/yell, which I never do in training. Had a pretty sick backward lean going. Hamstring was not a limiting factor at all, although I still wrapped it with a wrist wrap to be safe. At this point, just going to keep pushing to 20 reps.
Neck harness 45lbs
1x50
General notes: Best squat day workout I’ve had in a long time. I feel like I’ve been lacking some intensity in my training, and it was nice to push a little bit. I’m finally starting to see some downward progression on the scale, but I’ve had to be pretty aggressive with my nutrition to get me there. In truth, I have no idea what I’m doing in that regard, and just kind of winging it. But my belt is fitting looser, so I suppose that means I am losing some fat.
Axle Clean and Press (clean once)
12x210
5x210
3x190 (strict)
Notes: Seeing definite improvement everytime I hit time movement. Leg drive was totally on point, very crisp, no wasted movement. I actually get some of my best reps later in the set, when I’m fatigued and can’t rely on strength to move the weight. A lot of reps that just flew from chest to lockout. Had some more reps in me on the strict set, but could feel my neck tensing up and didn’t want to pinch a nerve again. Going to advance the weight to 220 next cycle.
(3) Incline DB press 105
1x10
1x8
1x5
(1) Incline DB press 105
1x5
Superset w/
GB lat pulldown 110
4x10
Superset w/
Band pull aparts
6x20
Notes: Not really moving on the DB incline press, but my pressing is improving, so I’d say it’s still working. Held back on the reactive slingshot today, but I think I’m going to keep it in rotation. It torques my elbows a touch, but I like the focus on lockout.
Axle curl dropset
25
25
20
20
10
Notes: Progression is working, and at least I’m doing some sort of curl I suppose.
Average band pushdowns
2x15
General notes: Second day in a row of bodyweight at 197, which is a positive sign. Belt is fitting looser, hopefully I can find a good spot for it by the time comp rolls around. Intention is to make today a 2 a day, with a yoke/sandbag medley during my lunchbreak. We’ll see what happens.
PM WORKOUT
75’ 550lb Yoke/ 205lb Sandbag run w/sandbag over bar
2 rounds
Notes: To explain, run the yoke 75’, run back to the starting point to grab the sandbag, run the sandbag 75’, arrive at yoke and do 1 sandbag over bar.
2 rounds was enough. After training 3 days in a row and doing a 2 a day here, I was toast. Great ass-kicker, hits a lot of different events/movements, and totally fried me. Took some video, will try to upload it later to give a visual.
Here is the video
2.6 Mile run
Time: 20:47
Notes: Wanted to see how long these were taking me. Just slightly under an 8 minute mile average. Not terrible. Still pretty much just an exercise in enduring suck, but my middle back was pretty beat up from the yoke. Hurt to breathe deep.
Dude, your neighbours must think you’re mental. I remember the looks I used to get just for doing a few hillsprints.
[quote]dagill2 wrote:
Dude, your neighbours must think you’re mental. I remember the looks I used to get just for doing a few hillsprints.[/quote]
I’m kind of a local celebrity at this point, haha. My wife and I will go to get togethers and someone will recognize me and say “Oh my god you’re the guy whose always lifting those crazy weights!”
The key is to be INCREDIBLY courteous in all dealings. I rarely play music on my stereo, instead using my earbuds, and if I DO play music, I play stuff without any profanity in it at a low volume. Always make sure to smile and wave, offer people help moving, etc. It’s real easy to be “the asshole” in these situations, so I’m trying to avoid that, haha.
Kids are cool though. In between sets of the yoke, I’ve had kids right their bikes between the uprights. Nothing phases them.
[quote]T3hPwnisher wrote:
[quote]dagill2 wrote:
Dude, your neighbours must think you’re mental. I remember the looks I used to get just for doing a few hillsprints.[/quote]
I’m kind of a local celebrity at this point, haha. My wife and I will go to get togethers and someone will recognize me and say “Oh my god you’re the guy whose always lifting those crazy weights!”
The key is to be INCREDIBLY courteous in all dealings. I rarely play music on my stereo, instead using my earbuds, and if I DO play music, I play stuff without any profanity in it at a low volume. Always make sure to smile and wave, offer people help moving, etc. It’s real easy to be “the asshole” in these situations, so I’m trying to avoid that, haha.
Kids are cool though. In between sets of the yoke, I’ve had kids right their bikes between the uprights. Nothing phases them.[/quote]
I find the music to be a real issue. I love to listen to loud, offensive music that I’d never normally listen to while I train, but I find it really hard to wear earbuds or whatever while I train. I might have to invest in some wireless headphones.
I used to do a lot of body weight stuff in the local park before I started investing in a home gym and the amount of kids that would come up and try and copy me was crazy. It’s hard to keep a straight face the third time you’re told you’re “strong like a bodybuilder”.
Something of an unconventional question, but:
Have you ever thought about using your yoke for ROM training?
Before the power rack was invented, there was a thing called the “Harvey-Maxime Bar” that didn’t really catch on. It turns out the design is pretty much the same as the modern yoke: two vertical beams, weights loaded at the bottom, and an adjustable cross member. The idea was to use it for ROM training, just like the original purpose of a power rack.
[quote]dagill2 wrote:
I find the music to be a real issue. I love to listen to loud, offensive music that I’d never normally listen to while I train, but I find it really hard to wear earbuds or whatever while I train. I might have to invest in some wireless headphones.
I used to do a lot of body weight stuff in the local park before I started investing in a home gym and the amount of kids that would come up and try and copy me was crazy. It’s hard to keep a straight face the third time you’re told you’re “strong like a bodybuilder”.[/quote]
Yeah, years of training in a commercial gym got me used to lifting with earbuds. Doesn’t even phase me. That said, I see red if they snag on a piece of equipment and get ripped out of my ears, which happens way too often, haha. If the wireless works out, let me know.
Kids are a trip. Totally fearless and honest. Gotta love it, and it’s great to set a positive physical example.
[quote]LoRez wrote:
Something of an unconventional question, but:
Have you ever thought about using your yoke for ROM training?
Before the power rack was invented, there was a thing called the “Harvey-Maxime Bar” that didn’t really catch on. It turns out the design is pretty much the same as the modern yoke: two vertical beams, weights loaded at the bottom, and an adjustable cross member. The idea was to use it for ROM training, just like the original purpose of a power rack.
http://www.google.com/patents/US2470815[/quote]
I’ve pitched the idea to a few folks that had yokes but no powerrack/chain set up. It’s definitely an option, and yoke squats/presses will make you a man for sure. My yoke in particular is a real pain in the ass to change the height of, so it’s not been something I’ve cared to chase, but still an option.
Cool link, much appreciated.
[quote]T3hPwnisher wrote:
[quote]dagill2 wrote:
I find the music to be a real issue. I love to listen to loud, offensive music that I’d never normally listen to while I train, but I find it really hard to wear earbuds or whatever while I train. I might have to invest in some wireless headphones.
I used to do a lot of body weight stuff in the local park before I started investing in a home gym and the amount of kids that would come up and try and copy me was crazy. It’s hard to keep a straight face the third time you’re told you’re “strong like a bodybuilder”.[/quote]
Yeah, years of training in a commercial gym got me used to lifting with earbuds. Doesn’t even phase me. That said, I see red if they snag on a piece of equipment and get ripped out of my ears, which happens way too often, haha.
[/quote]
That’s the bit that drives me crazy, it’s fine in winter when I can tuck the wires under my million shirts but in summer I’m likely to end up smashing my phone.
(5) Mat Pulls 585+chains
16 reps total
Notes: 10, then 3, then 3. Much better breathing compared to last week. Got 9 reps in the first breath. Really driving the lockout hard on these. Woke up at 197 again after my first week of what I’d call “strict eating” and had my first cheat meal before lifting: 2 beef ribs and a baked potato. If I can keep getting 10 in the first set for as long as possible, I’ll be in a good place.
DOH hold 405+chains
30 seconds
Notes: Just fried from training 5 days in a row. It was actually my back that gave out versus my grip.
Squats 335
1x20
Notes: Quads were pretty beat up. These felt shallow, but were hitting where I needed it. I’d say leg is 100% healed. It’s a recurring injury, so it’s not 100% in total, but it’s as healthy as I can get it.
Time for 2 much needed days off.
Weighted chins 50lbs
28 reps
Bench 225
5x10
superset w/
Band pull aparts
5x20
Notes: Wasn’t giving this weight enough respect on the first set and it felt terrible. Even though it’s a down week, gotta still practice good technique. Spent the rest of the workout getting tight and exploding and it went well. Paused on the last rep of all sets. 3rd time I’ve run this routine, and this is the best control I’ve ever had over weight during the down week. Either I’m getting a lot stronger or a lot better, but either way I’m happy.
Shoulder circuit
3 rounds
DB rows 105
9x3
1x30
Notes: Things were feeling good today on the DB rows. May need to start really pushing this last set for some stupid high rep PRs.
Been toying with the idea of doing another powerlifting meet at some point. I’m still loving strongman, and I wouldn’t change my training around much, but it might be fun to update my total.
Just posted a rough template of my next training block in my log. As much as I hate “critique my workout plan” threads, would love your feedback on it.
(13) Chain Suspended Safety Squat Bar Squats
3x445+chains
6x355+chains
Notes: Back to full strength. Quick recovery. Last time this happened to me, I was out for 8 months, but part of that was just plain not knowing how to rehab. May have had a few more reps in me on the deadstop set of 355, but don’t want to push myself too hard so close after recovery/so near a contest. Belt is fitting looser these days due to weight loss, may need to take it in a notch.
Reverse hyper 5 plates
3x11
superset w/
GHR sit up w/25lbs
3x8
Notes: I think pretty soon I’m going to start doing reverse hypers with a hold at the top of the rep. Gotta figure out a way to get more mileage out of the movement, as loading it up this heavy is getting stupid.
Car deadlift 7 plates
1x12
Notes: Great effort. Might’ve been able to eek out anther rep or 2, but I’m hitting limit weights here. Had to cut the workout a little short, would’ve liked to chase this with a little more work, but I’m still getting stronger. I think sometime in the future I should try this out with my deadlift suit.
General notes: Did the math and my contest week is going to fall on the exact week I would normally pull from the floor at the end of a cycle. My plan is to skip a week on my mat pulls (looking like the 3 mat week at this point), pull from the floor the week before the contest, and then take a down week the week of. It’s not the most ideal, but it actually works out pretty well in terms of taking time off, being able to pull from the floor and fitting in the contest. I’ll most likely continue with squat day as is since this cycle got a little jacked up due to the injury.