I’m not someone who reads too much into the delivery of a post since this is online communication without any body language lol. I focus more at the content.
Will reply further later.
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I have got to agree with what’s been said above. If you channelled your energy into your diet, which is terrible and inconsistent then you would be amazed at the progress you would make. Don’t mean that as a dig, sometime people underestimate the importance.
Also a change of pace in terms of your training would be worth a try. If someone is seeing great leg progress doing something completely different to you, maybe it would work for you. Let go of your training beliefs and experiment! Train and eat like a bodybuilder for a while, see what happens. We won’t think any less of you 
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Yeah, why not go train with those guys and see what they do and how they execute their reps? Ask them what cues they use for *“feeling the muscle”. *I’m not sure if 17 year olds can articulate this well since different people will interpret this differently being that it is a mental thing but just get more knowledge on how others who train much differently from you do their stuff. You’re not going to be building muscle at this point anyway since you’re cutting. Your diet is going to matter more than the training itself at this point. I think you should really starting cooking your own meals lol.
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@Benanything @dt79 Thanks for the posts people!
OK, I have been busy all day. Well, actually it feels like life generally is getting busier and busier. So I don’t have much time to read or post on here like I used to, so I only read parts of this thread.
Anyway, I am inferring from the recommendations here that perhaps, Ben, you might want to change your mentality towards training a bit. I see you are into strength training and powerlifting, and I am not passionate about either, nor am I an expert or so knowledgeable in those areas. My focus was, and perhaps again one day again, will be, bodybuilding (I am simply doing physical therapy and keeping in shape at the moment) and I will always be a batshit crazy fan.
However, I do have some knowledge on those topics and am schooled on how to build size, which, as everyone with half a brain knows, leads to greater strength. From my knowledge, many powerlifters and bench press specialists have benefited from straight-up bodybuilding training, including Kirk Karwoski, Glen Chabot, Dave Waterman, Scot Mendelson, Paul Carter, Ed Coan, and Dan Green. Actually if I recall correctly, Paul Carter recommends a phase in which the sole goal is size, bodybuilding training. If you look at Kirk Karwoski’s and Ed Coan’s routines, much of them, aside from the low rep training in the competitive lifts, are indistinguishable from bodybuilding programs. I remember in an interview that Dan Greene recognizes the importance of size building for powerlifting and he incorporates BB into his program.
Somewhere around the early 2000’s people have become literally married to constant strength training in the three main lifts for low reps, likely thanks to the release of Starting Strength, which is, although a good book, likely what started this whole debacle. Not only are they obsessed with their performance in the big lifts, they are also hooked on weight on the bar and convinced that people MUST barbell bench press, back squat, barbell overheard press, and barbell standard deadlift! They are also obsessed with exercise sequence, thinking that heaven forbid they do leg extensions or lunges before a squat or flies before a bench press, that ground will be lost in the squat or barbell bench press. This makes absolutely no sense.
My legs have always been a strong point for me, and I never had to do any whacked out shit for them, but over the course of six months, my hamstrings greatly improved with pre-exhaust, and shitcanning standard deadlifts.
Here was my routine during my transformation, and when I thoroughly shitcanned the pervasive “strength training” mindset.
Leg curls or glute ham raises
Lunges or one-legged squats
Safety bar squats
Leg extensions (started doing them towards the end, but I don’t think they did much for me PERSONALLY, but they didn’t hurt, of course)
Dumbbell RDL’s
Everything was done for 3 sets of 8 to 15 reps.
I recommend resting as little as possible. This does not mean one should rest while he’s still huffing and puffing, but to go again as soon as your breathing starts calming down.
And for size building, although one should aim to progress in reps and weight as time goes on, I think people should give up their egos and drop the obsession with impressing people or living up to some strength standard in which there needs to be back breaking weights. Unlike what some naysayers express, the mind muscle connection IS important! Although a pump is not the indicator of growth absolutely, the ability to get a pump IS important. Think of your most stubborn muscle. It’s likely the one that pumps up the least, while strong ones that grow the easiest can pump up doing mundane daily activities. I can feel a pump in my quads, glutes, and hams walking flights of stairs and a slight bicep pump just carrying heavy grocery bags or boxes.
It’s also important to pick exercises that lend to growth in desired areas. Again, this sometimes calls for a divorce from the main lifts. Even Dan Green used front squats to drive his competitive squat up. If you don’t feel your hamstrings pumped enough during RDLs, then do GHR’s or leg curls beforehand. Or try dumbbell RDL. If you don’t feel your pecs pumped from benching, then try pre-exhaust with flies and machine presses before bar or dumbbell bench press.
I can write more, but I think you get the drift.
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Hey good post, Brick!
Just want to clarify something since some of the guys here don’t have much experience with actual bodybuilding training. Hope you don’t mind and I’m sure you will agree with me.
The pump is one of the most important things because it shows that you are contracting and hitting the desired muscle hard. It is a product of good mind muscle connection and should occur naturally when you are doing this right even at lower reps.
This is not the same as doing a 30-50 rep set or endless dropsets. If you need to do this to get a pump, your mmc sucks and you should be working on it instead of doing stuff like this. This is what we call junk volume.
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Yup! Good points!
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Late to the party as always.
Ben, I really dont think your upper body is lagging.
Steroids are a cheat code. You will never beat somebody playing with cheat codes. I highly recommend you ignore everybody else in the gym. Your path is a different one and your gains are pretty awesome tbh.
Also, be very careful imitating enhanced athletes programs and diets. They work for them because everything works for the enhanced. Just taking the enhancements enhances.
This is the only formula you need for the rest of your life (feel free to tell your math professors you have completed math)
Compound exercise performed * weight moved = (strength + mass) / years lifting
I agree that from what I have seen and read Smolov and deads is working your ass off!!! For upper body mass the best exercise is Deads (back is a lot more muscle than pressing muscles). I would probably argue back and front squat are more beneficial to upper body development than pec flys.
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You are leading towards the path of the dark side, I feel the envy inside of you. I feel your anger. hahaha enough starwars, dont use PEDs for a few years (ideally ever). Your body is on enhanced levels right now as it is. Enjoy that popeyes and smolov. You will be amazed in a year with where you are.
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We are going to have to agree to disagree on this. But I don’t think it matters at this point.
Pretty much this minus any medical issues. I started training again after a 9 year layoff at age 33. It was an entirely different ballgame from when I was 16. Joints, tendons, fatigue levels, bodyfat distribution, life responsibilities etc. Get your most gains while you are young and don’t do anything that will screw up your hpta at the same time if you want to do this long term.
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Broscience memes + Star Wars memes = 
Your upper body doesn’t appear to be lagging to me really.
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@Benanything: You are deadlifting (almost) like you are doing clean pulls. Your chest is keeping the same angle below the knees, and you are staying over the bar a tad. I’d recommend changing that, in a deadlift you want to lock out both your knees and hips at the same time as quickly as possible, they move in congruence instead of like in cleans/snatches where they are a bit segmented according to what pull you are in (knees back first, then hips with knee rebend, then knees/hips once you hit the power position)
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I am still natty. 
Jk, I am not that good.
Also I gotta agree that deads/squats/front squats are good for your upper back/lats/erectors, but arms/chest? Just look at Bulgarian weightlifters, (which are known for being on fuck loads of gear) and you’d know that isn’t really true (though they will make you thick as fuck). They do squats, even more squats, then even more squats and heavy clean and jerks, and snatches multiple times a day and none of them look like they lift despite doing tons of heavy squats and pulls. Hell, my upper body isn’t as full as it was back when I was a powerlifter and I still include a good bit of upper body work when I can.
@BrickHead: Wonderful post, lots of good points, I agree 100%. Big muscles=big lifts and less injuries.
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To anyone who’s wondering, I’m not dead or anything haha. Haven’t gotten on the computer in ages hence the lack of log updates. I still view/comment stuff using my phone so yup.
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##25/3/2017
woke up at 73.1kgs
##FOOD
12:00PM - a shit ton of chinese food
7:00PM - had to attend a bbq so a lot of junk
8:00PM - large honey green tea
2800-ish calories
##Training
entered the gym 10:00AM
Incline Bench
20kgs x10
30kgs x10
42.5kgs x5
50 band tricep push downs
42.5kgs x5
5kg dumbbell flyes x7
50 band tricep push downs
42.5kgs x5
20 band tricep push downs
42.5kgs x7
friend asked me to try training more bodybuilder style so it pretty much became a incline spoto bench, pausing 1 inch off the chest and flaring my elbows out?
42.5kgs x4,7,6,6
by this point, he was partly supporting the weight, had a massive chest pump though so I guess it works
42.5kgs x5
42.5kgs x5+2
Dumbbell Flyes
5kgs x10,15,15
Incline Plate Squeeze Press
10kgs x10,10,14
Squats
20kgs x3
60kgs x3
100kgs x1
115kgs x1
127.5kgs x1
142.5kgs x1
Pull Ups
12,6
Barbell Bicep Curl
7.5kgs x50+30+20
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##26/3/2017
##FOOD
11:25AM - large honey milk tea
12:00PM - 300g of chicken
8:00PM - chinese wrap with mince pork and 4 scoops of protein with 2 bananas blended
8:30PM - burger king, ultimate angus classic bbq and fries, parents bought this for me so I ate it
2700 calories at 200 grams of protein
##Training
Canoe
Paddled from 7:30AM to 10:00AM, mainly working on balancing the boat, this is my 2nd session after all.
entered gym at 12:40PM
Push Press
20kgs x10
32.5kgs x10
45kgs x7x5
Deadlift
60kgs x3
100kgs x2
120kgs x1
140kgs x3x1, failed 2 singles after, couldn’t get it past lower mid shin, probably because I was supposed to do 5 singles with 135kgs but I rounded up so…
Weighted Pull Ups
10kgs x5x5
bodyweight x10
later at home, roughly 10:30PM
Weighted Pull Ups
10kgs x5x5
bodyweight x10
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##27/3/2017
woke up at 73kgs, all time lightest bodyweight I’ve been at in 2017
##FOOD
10:15AM - fruit drink thing
11:45AM - 300g of chicken
3:00PM - 3 siew mai
7:30PM - 16 plates of sushi
9:00PM - gummy candy
2700-ish calories
##Training
Canoe
Paddled from 7:15AM to 9:00AM. More balancing drills.
entered gym at 3:20PM
Squats
wanted to bench but there were a bunch of guys at the bench
60kgs x3
100kgs x1
115kgs x1
127.5kgs x1
142.5kgs x0
Just not in the mood, left the gym.
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##28/3/2017
woke up at 74.4kgs, must’ve been the ton of sushi
##FOOD
11:30AM - steamboat buffet so basically I had a SHIT TON of meat
4:00PM - gummy candy
7:45PM - tu tu kueh
8:00PM - yong tau fu and 4 dumplings
2200-ish calories
##Training
Canoe
Paddled from 7:15AM to 9:00AM
ran 4 rounds around some area(don’t know the distance)
60 pull ups, did them in sets of 5-7 reps
##29/3/2017
woke up at 73.5kgs
##FOOD
11:30AM - kfc, famous bowl, chicken drumlet and 7 up
2:30PM - 6 siew mai
5:00PM - gummy candy
7:00PM - laksa yong tau fu with noodles
2000-ish calories
##Training
Canoe
Paddled from 7:15AM till 9:00AM,
Did 5 minutes of balancing drill followed by a lap of the baby pool. Managed a grand total of 3 laps.
entered gym at 3:20PM
Bench
20kgs x10
40kgs x5
50kgs x5
60kgs x2x5
70kgs x3
70kgs x2, failed 3rd rep
was hella surprised I can still bench 70kgs to be honest
wasn’t really in the mood to gym, not in a bad mood or anything so I just left
1 Like
##30/3/2017
woke up at 73.5kgs
##FOOD
10:15AM - redbull
12:00PM - chicken rice with added chicken
5:35PM - 2 banana
6:00PM - 250-ish gram steak, 4 eggs. I cooked this so… I’m trying to pick up cooking hah.
7:30PM - yakult
8:30PM - banana
2250 calories
##Training
Canoe
Paddled from 7:15AM to 9:45AM, did balancing drills and land paddling to work on technique. Mobility sucks, will work on that.
Pull Ups after paddling
x4x10,8,6,6
entered the gym at 3:00PM
stretched a bunch while waiting for the squat rack
Squat
20kgs for a bunch
60kgs x9, 3 reps at varying heel heights, just got my new heel inserts
60kgs x1 front squat
80kgs x3
100kgs x3
120kgs x3
100kgs x3, knee felt a bit achy, quads were warm and semi sore
60kgs x15
70kgs x10
100kgs x5
Pull Ups
x3x7
later at home, 10:15PM
Push Ups
x3x10, 1 min rest
trying this cause eh, maybe it might work and I need to up my push up game for army PT test. starting off very easy, I assure you can I definitely do more than 3 sets of 10 push ups haha. wrists feel a bit of discomfort but I’ll live.