T-Nation Guitar Players' Thread

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421

[quote]strangemeadow wrote:

[quote]audiogarden1 wrote:

[quote]strangemeadow wrote:
What’s most fucked up about this vid is that the dude had to make the backing tracks and then overdub it all and edit it. His time would have been better spent learning to play in a working band…I’m assuming he’s a bedroom shredder?[/quote]

Whats fucked up about this vid is that instead of appreciating a very entertaining and original video of a great guitar player emulating other great guitar players, you nit picked about whether or not hes played in a band before.

I dont care if you’re keith richards, if you cant play like this guy, then dont worry about when or how he chooses to play. [/quote]
Eh…fuck that. I’ll tell ya why it’s just not that great. There are 5 other guys who can pretty much do what he’s doing within a 100 mile radius of any of us. Yes, he’s very technical. Yes, he can play. Other people’s shit, note for note. Great. Who cares? I have know so many guys like this, they can play other people’s solos BETTER than the original. And?
Do they have any of their own material? Do they actually play with a band? It’s one thing to wank in your bedroom or studio, it’s quite another to interact with other players in a live setting.
It’s not nit picking, it’s reality. It’s boring.[/quote]

If you know so many virtuoso guitar players, then you know that guys like that are pretty much never “bedroom shredders.”

You made a stupidly bold assumption about what kind of player he is, you nit-picked at a non-existent point as if you watched the video solely for the purpose of identifying reasons that the guy’s nothing special, and now you continue to discredit him. All of this you some how managed to discern from a single video on youtube. I cant take you seriously.

Im guessing you are a “glass half-empty” kind of guy.

Can you replicate guys like Steve Vai, Greg Howe, Jason Becker and Vinnie Moore, complete with all the subtle nuances and techniques?

422

[quote]SkyNett wrote:

[quote]strangemeadow wrote:

[quote]audiogarden1 wrote:

[quote]strangemeadow wrote:
What’s most fucked up about this vid is that the dude had to make the backing tracks and then overdub it all and edit it. His time would have been better spent learning to play in a working band…I’m assuming he’s a bedroom shredder?[/quote]

Whats fucked up about this vid is that instead of appreciating a very entertaining and original video of a great guitar player emulating other great guitar players, you nit picked about whether or not hes played in a band before.

I dont care if you’re keith richards, if you cant play like this guy, then dont worry about when or how he chooses to play. [/quote]
Eh…fuck that. I’ll tell ya why it’s just not that great. There are 5 other guys who can pretty much do what he’s doing within a 100 mile radius of any of us. Yes, he’s very technical. Yes, he can play. Other people’s shit, note for note. Great. Who cares? I have know so many guys like this, they can play other people’s solos BETTER than the original. And?
Do they have any of their own material? Do they actually play with a band? It’s one thing to wank in your bedroom or studio, it’s quite another to interact with other players in a live setting.
It’s not nit picking, it’s reality. It’s boring.[/quote]

Did you even read what I posted about him - Ben Higgins, and yes, he plays in a real band.

I also have to disagree with your assessment. Number one - nothing there is note for note - he actually came up with original ideas in the style of each guitar player, without directly copping any particular solo. In other words, instead of playing the solo from Ceazy Train during the Randy section, he simply took Randy’s overall playing style into account and came up with an original idea - that’s not a RR solo, just like the Schenker licks weren’t exactly from a MS solo - just an original idea using that player’s style.

And for that, I’d say the guy is pretty clever. [/quote]

That is one of the coolest things about this video, the guy manages to emulate all these virtuoso guitar players (at least the ones im familiar with) perfectly. You could listen to any one of those licks without knowing who it was and know what he was going for.

Its one thing to be able to play what others have already laid out for you, its another thing to be able to play at that high of a technical level and compose music that actually sounds good.

423

Yeah, that “30 Shredders” vid is pretty wild. He even manages to emulate Kirk Hammett’s suck-ass phrasing and technique! Now THAT is impressive!

Guthrie is amazing stuff.

424

SkyNett- no, I didn’t read what you wrote about him. And you’re right, it wasn’t note for note at all. Honestly, I have no idea what my problem is today, I’m being a complete asshole. wtf is wrong with me? My apologies to you and audiogarden1, and any one else, including the player.
I’m not usually such a fuck head. My head must be whacked from therapy…
Sorry to all…I’ll take my lumps.

425

[quote]strangemeadow wrote:
SkyNett- no, I didn’t read what you wrote about him. And you’re right, it wasn’t note for note at all. Honestly, I have no idea what my problem is today, I’m being a complete asshole. wtf is wrong with me? My apologies to you and audiogarden1, and any one else, including the player.
I’m not usually such a fuck head. My head must be whacked from therapy…
Sorry to all…I’ll take my lumps.[/quote]

Before i look foolish… was that…sarcasm? Cause if its not, i think this would be the first time anyone on T-Nation ever relented on anything.

If it was sarcasm, then it makes sense.

Oh yeah and while everyone else is saying it, GG is pretty awesome. Not quite my style but on a technical level the guy is up there with anyone else who’s ever picked up the instrument.

426

[quote]SteelyD wrote:
Yeah, that “30 Shredders” vid is pretty wild. He even manages to emulate Kirk Hammett’s suck-ass phrasing and technique! Now THAT is impressive!

Guthrie is amazing stuff.[/quote]

LOL. Kirk is a wildly over-rated guitarist (though not over-rated to as grievous an extent as say, Jimmy Page) but i still have to admit that i love him. I enjoy playing his solos, and metallica in general (the first 4 albums) and while his technical ability is lacking for someone with as much time on the big stage as him, he had a great sense of melody and composition.

He put together some really fine solos with very basic licks. (Ride the Lightning, Dyer’s Eve, Orion, Call of the Kthulu)

427

[quote]audiogarden1 wrote:

[quote]strangemeadow wrote:
SkyNett- no, I didn’t read what you wrote about him. And you’re right, it wasn’t note for note at all. Honestly, I have no idea what my problem is today, I’m being a complete asshole. wtf is wrong with me? My apologies to you and audiogarden1, and any one else, including the player.
I’m not usually such a fuck head. My head must be whacked from therapy…
Sorry to all…I’ll take my lumps.[/quote]

Before i look foolish… was that…sarcasm? Cause if its not, i think this would be the first time anyone on T-Nation ever relented on anything.

If it was sarcasm, then it makes sense.

Oh yeah and while everyone else is saying it, GG is pretty awesome. Not quite my style but on a technical level the guy is up there with anyone else who’s ever picked up the instrument. [/quote]
I know it seems pretty crazy here on T-Nation, someone actually owning up to being wrong, but I am. I fucked up and am responsibility for being a tool. No sarcasm at all.

428

[quote]strangemeadow wrote:

[quote]audiogarden1 wrote:

[quote]strangemeadow wrote:
SkyNett- no, I didn’t read what you wrote about him. And you’re right, it wasn’t note for note at all. Honestly, I have no idea what my problem is today, I’m being a complete asshole. wtf is wrong with me? My apologies to you and audiogarden1, and any one else, including the player.
I’m not usually such a fuck head. My head must be whacked from therapy…
Sorry to all…I’ll take my lumps.[/quote]

Before i look foolish… was that…sarcasm? Cause if its not, i think this would be the first time anyone on T-Nation ever relented on anything.

If it was sarcasm, then it makes sense.

Oh yeah and while everyone else is saying it, GG is pretty awesome. Not quite my style but on a technical level the guy is up there with anyone else who’s ever picked up the instrument. [/quote]
I know it seems pretty crazy here on T-Nation, someone actually owning up to being wrong, but I am. I fucked up and am responsibility for being a tool. No sarcasm at all. [/quote]

Good shit.

429

[quote]strangemeadow wrote:

[quote]audiogarden1 wrote:

[quote]strangemeadow wrote:
SkyNett- no, I didn’t read what you wrote about him. And you’re right, it wasn’t note for note at all. Honestly, I have no idea what my problem is today, I’m being a complete asshole. wtf is wrong with me? My apologies to you and audiogarden1, and any one else, including the player.
I’m not usually such a fuck head. My head must be whacked from therapy…
Sorry to all…I’ll take my lumps.[/quote]

Before i look foolish… was that…sarcasm? Cause if its not, i think this would be the first time anyone on T-Nation ever relented on anything.

If it was sarcasm, then it makes sense.

Oh yeah and while everyone else is saying it, GG is pretty awesome. Not quite my style but on a technical level the guy is up there with anyone else who’s ever picked up the instrument. [/quote]
I know it seems pretty crazy here on T-Nation, someone actually owning up to being wrong, but I am. I fucked up and am responsibility for being a tool. No sarcasm at all. [/quote]

Very cool, i wouldnt say you “fucked up,” that seems harsh given the situation. We shouldnt be arguing in the first place really, this is supposed to be a thread where people can discuss their passion for a common interest.

430

Well, it’s all good. i did fuck up though, I wasn’t actually paying attention to anything and my head was up my ass. I decided a long time ago that if I was wrong about something, I’d just admit it. If I do damage, I take responsibility. Honestly it’s because I’m lazy. It seems really hard and takes so much energy to battle about something you know in your head/heart that you’re wrong about. Self reflection. Trying to better myself.
Sorry about the slice of personal philosophy…

431

[quote]SteelyD wrote:
Yeah, that “30 Shredders” vid is pretty wild. He even manages to emulate Kirk Hammett’s suck-ass phrasing and technique! Now THAT is impressive!

Guthrie is amazing stuff.[/quote]

Speaking of sloppy styles, Steely, did you ever see the Zep cover band “Get The Led Out”?

They have 2 guitarists, but the one guitarist (Jimmy Marchiano) actually picked up Page’s sticky- staccato-sloppy style! I saw them a few years ago, and expected a modern-day clean and accurate approach to Zep’s riffs and solos, but Marchiano captured all Page idiosyncrasies so well.

I approached him after the show and complimented him on getting it down. He told me it was the result of years growing up and copying Zep records note for note in his bedroom.

lol

432

[quote]strangemeadow wrote:
Well, it’s all good. i did fuck up though, I wasn’t actually paying attention to anything and my head was up my ass. I decided a long time ago that if I was wrong about something, I’d just admit it. If I do damage, I take responsibility. Honestly it’s because I’m lazy. It seems really hard and takes so much energy to battle about something you know in your head/heart that you’re wrong about. Self reflection. Trying to better myself.
Sorry about the slice of personal philosophy…[/quote]

Not to detract too far from the topic of this thread, but it’s good to read something like this and it makes me reflect on my own shit too.

Staying angry takes so much energy man, it’s good to let it go, apologize, and forgive yourself.

Now, who here has listened to the “Screaming Females?” The guitarist is a little shit named Marissa Paternoster. She shreds, and she reminds me of J Mascis from Dinosaur Jr.

433

[quote]Iron Dwarf wrote:

[quote]SteelyD wrote:
Yeah, that “30 Shredders” vid is pretty wild. He even manages to emulate Kirk Hammett’s suck-ass phrasing and technique! Now THAT is impressive!

Guthrie is amazing stuff.[/quote]

Speaking of sloppy styles, Steely, did you ever see the Zep cover band “Get The Led Out”?

They have 2 guitarists, but the one guitarist (Jimmy Marchiano) actually picked up Page’s sticky- staccato-sloppy style! I saw them a few years ago, and expected a modern-day clean and accurate approach to Zep’s riffs and solos, but Marchiano captured all Page idiosyncrasies so well.

I approached him after the show and complimented him on getting it down. He told me it was the result of years growing up and copying Zep records note for note in his bedroom.

lol[/quote]

No, haven’t seen them.

I don’t know anyone who ever classified Page as the smoothest guitarist ever. Page can’t be overrated IMO. Whether he missed half the notes he played is irrelevant in the context of his contribution to rock music. Undeniably one of the most influential musicians to ever walk the planet.

434

[quote]SteelyD wrote:

[quote]Iron Dwarf wrote:

[quote]SteelyD wrote:
Yeah, that “30 Shredders” vid is pretty wild. He even manages to emulate Kirk Hammett’s suck-ass phrasing and technique! Now THAT is impressive!

Guthrie is amazing stuff.[/quote]

Speaking of sloppy styles, Steely, did you ever see the Zep cover band “Get The Led Out”?

They have 2 guitarists, but the one guitarist (Jimmy Marchiano) actually picked up Page’s sticky- staccato-sloppy style! I saw them a few years ago, and expected a modern-day clean and accurate approach to Zep’s riffs and solos, but Marchiano captured all Page idiosyncrasies so well.

I approached him after the show and complimented him on getting it down. He told me it was the result of years growing up and copying Zep records note for note in his bedroom.

lol[/quote]

No, haven’t seen them.

I don’t know anyone who ever classified Page as the smoothest guitarist ever. Page can’t be overrated IMO. Whether he missed half the notes he played is irrelevant in the context of his contribution to rock music. Undeniably one of the most influential musicians to ever walk the planet.
[/quote]

I have to agree.
I always point to Page in arguments to bring to point that the power of a memorable heavy riff (however played less than perfect) will always trump a flawlessly played flashy, yet soulless run.

Page still gives me goosebumps, and that says a lot.

435

[quote]SteelyD wrote:

[quote]Iron Dwarf wrote:

[quote]SteelyD wrote:
Yeah, that “30 Shredders” vid is pretty wild. He even manages to emulate Kirk Hammett’s suck-ass phrasing and technique! Now THAT is impressive!

Guthrie is amazing stuff.[/quote]

Speaking of sloppy styles, Steely, did you ever see the Zep cover band “Get The Led Out”?

They have 2 guitarists, but the one guitarist (Jimmy Marchiano) actually picked up Page’s sticky- staccato-sloppy style! I saw them a few years ago, and expected a modern-day clean and accurate approach to Zep’s riffs and solos, but Marchiano captured all Page idiosyncrasies so well.

I approached him after the show and complimented him on getting it down. He told me it was the result of years growing up and copying Zep records note for note in his bedroom.

lol[/quote]

No, haven’t seen them.

I don’t know anyone who ever classified Page as the smoothest guitarist ever. Page can’t be overrated IMO. Whether he missed half the notes he played is irrelevant in the context of his contribution to rock music. Undeniably one of the most influential musicians to ever walk the planet.
[/quote]

Ohh man I love this debate if it’s headed in the direction I think it is.

Do you think he ranged as far off the map as he did while he played because of his time a session guitarist? I’d think that if I was forced to do that day in and day out I’d get pretty loose once I broke away

436

[quote]BradTGIF wrote:

[quote]SteelyD wrote:

[quote]Iron Dwarf wrote:

[quote]SteelyD wrote:
Yeah, that “30 Shredders” vid is pretty wild. He even manages to emulate Kirk Hammett’s suck-ass phrasing and technique! Now THAT is impressive!

Guthrie is amazing stuff.[/quote]

Speaking of sloppy styles, Steely, did you ever see the Zep cover band “Get The Led Out”?

They have 2 guitarists, but the one guitarist (Jimmy Marchiano) actually picked up Page’s sticky- staccato-sloppy style! I saw them a few years ago, and expected a modern-day clean and accurate approach to Zep’s riffs and solos, but Marchiano captured all Page idiosyncrasies so well.

I approached him after the show and complimented him on getting it down. He told me it was the result of years growing up and copying Zep records note for note in his bedroom.

lol[/quote]

No, haven’t seen them.

I don’t know anyone who ever classified Page as the smoothest guitarist ever. Page can’t be overrated IMO. Whether he missed half the notes he played is irrelevant in the context of his contribution to rock music. Undeniably one of the most influential musicians to ever walk the planet.
[/quote]

Ohh man I love this debate if it’s headed in the direction I think it is.

Do you think he ranged as far off the map as he did while he played because of his time a session guitarist? I’d think that if I was forced to do that day in and day out I’d get pretty loose once I broke away[/quote]

Even as a session guitarist he was ‘sloppy’. He learned ‘the studio’. The man innovated mic’ing and studio techniques.

Zep was absolutely groundbreaking at the time. He was way ahead of his peers in songwriting (acknowleding LZ’s plagiarism) and style. After 50 years his music is still relevant and still a primary influence on new guitar players.

It’s pretty impressive to hear 15 year old kids say “Jimmy Page” is an influence right along with Dimebag and Alexi Laiho.

Yes, Page through tunnel vision as a ‘great guitar technician’, meh. Especially ‘post-shredder era’. But his legacy is much greater than just the notes he played (or flubbed).

437

Page is a slop master. TSRTS live is what made me want to play guitar. Not Hendrix or anybody else. It was that sloppy, going-for-broke improv that made me start playing. Soloing aside, his riffs, tone and production were hugely influential on all rock music. He’s #1 for me, followed by Yngwie, for a million different reasons. Listen to YJM’s “Inspirations” and it will change your mind about him.

438

I guess it all depends on how you are viewing “over-rated.”

If you’re talking mostly influence, then yeah, Page is not necessarily over-rated, and in that case neither is Kirk Hammett. There are a million kids sitting in their bedrooms trying to play metallica solos right now, just as there are for Zeppelin. (i know you didnt actually use the term over-rated to describe Kirk, but i got that impression. Maybe im wrong)

However, there are far better technical guitarists out there, who i believe were also far more innovative. But they never accomplished the same main-stream appeal that Zeppelin did. (Steve Vai being a perfect example)

I appreciate Page’s contribution to music and music history but his playing does nothing for me. Just my own personal preference.

439

[quote]strangemeadow wrote:
Page is a slop master. TSRTS live is what made me want to play guitar. Not Hendrix or anybody else. It was that sloppy, going-for-broke improv that made me start playing. Soloing aside, his riffs, tone and production were hugely influential on all rock music. He’s #1 for me, followed by Yngwie, for a million different reasons. Listen to YJM’s “Inspirations” and it will change your mind about him. [/quote]

Ill have to look into that, cause i love the virtuosos, and i can even get in the mood for neo-classical stuff every now and then, but all the YJM im familiar with just sounds terrible to me. Very impressive technically, but not captivating to listen to at all. Maybe im just not exposed to enough of his stuff.

Plus he always came across as a huge douche when ive seen interviews and videos of him.

440

[quote]audiogarden1 wrote:
I guess it all depends on how you are viewing “over-rated.”

If you’re talking mostly influence, then yeah, Page is not necessarily over-rated, and in that case neither is Kirk Hammett. There are a million kids sitting in their bedrooms trying to play metallica solos right now, just as there are for Zeppelin. (i know you didnt actually use the term over-rated to describe Kirk, but i got that impression. Maybe im wrong)

However, there are far better technical guitarists out there, who i believe were also far more innovative. But they never accomplished the same main-stream appeal that Zeppelin did. (Steve Vai being a perfect example)

I appreciate Page’s contribution to music and music history but his playing does nothing for me. Just my own personal preference. [/quote]

I can accept this explanation but I don’t agree with your last sentence in regards to my own taste.

When I listen to “when the levee breaks” he exudes a rythm that exemplifies his theory on “light and shade” that entertains me more than listening to Clapton go off for a period of minutes or Via rail-gunning notes within a verse. Ease in playability aside, it’s songs like that which matter most to me.

I guess in a real simple sense I understand what Page is saying, and I connect with it.