I’m going to second (or third, whatever) the suggestion for weighted chins. Heavy weighted chinups, pullups, heavy rows and presses are the key. Plus, they might even make you grow in other places.
Most people mature into their bodies. As you have gotten a lot of advice, all of it good, here is my .02 worth on cheap nutrition, buy the following weekly:
7 Gallons of whole milk $ 21
1 gallon of extra virgin olive oil $8.00
1 can of quaker old fashion oats $ 3.50
Grind up 1 cup of oats in the blender, add 2 cups of milk and 1 tablespoons of olive oil, Flavor to taste with fruit or some other flavoring and suck down 4 to 6 of these a day and eat 3 regular meals. You’ll get about 670 calories or so per shake and 800+ if you use 2 tablespoons of olive oil.
You’ll have some wicked bad gas for a week or 2 from the oats but your body will adjust.
Training wise look in the strength sports section and or search on google for Bill Starr’s 5X5 program and run it for 2 cycles 18 weeks, it’s all Squats, Bench, Dead Lifts, Chins, etc. On one the off days do a super set of BB Curls w/ a tricep exercise.
Then assess yourself at the end of the run and post your results.
College is the perfect place to gain weight. You might not be able to eat every 2 hours, but the cafeteria can provide easily enough calories in one meal. So if you can eat that then some milk and tuna in between you should be fine.
Personally I loved my college caf, I complained with everybody else, but I was there 45 minutes eating straight and it was better than my cooking. That just goes back to your whole can’t afford to eat thing.
Are you deadlifting atleast twice a week? How intense are your sets? Sometimes the problem with lets say a 3x8 program is that a person will use a weight they think allows them to do the reps versus just picking up the heaviest thing they can find and curling til they can’t do anymore.
I would do the barbell curls first. At 165 your just not chinning enough weight for 8 reps to do anything to your biceps. Unless your going to to add more sets or reps to your chins.
Quickest gains, take every 4th week off from bicep work. Your body grows in spurts not linearly, when you come back they should look either a little firmer or a little bigger. Also don’t look at them every day, you won’t notice. The changes.
[quote]bigdude wrote:
I am 21. I ran track for 4 years in high school, 2 years in college and through pre-season this last fall(3rd year). I do have a fast metabolism. Outside the gym I go to school (hence i fall under the category of a poor college student). I mess around playing ball with some friends and stuff but no regular intense exercise outside the gym. (is that what you were asking?)
Whats a good set/rep range for weighted chins?
here is the bicep workout i did on monday:
3x8 Chin-ups with legs out straight
3x30sec negative chins w/ 25, 35, 45 lbs
(3min rest between negatives)
3x8 barbell curls
I am working on my deadlift. I got up to 315 for 2 reps the other day. I know its not great but I was pretty psyched.
Airtruth wrote:
How old are you? and what are you doing outside of the gym? If you ran track I’m assuming you burn calories pretty quick, and it will take a while for you to gain “healthy” weight.
First and foremost, Milk, Eggs, Crackers, Peanut Butter and Jelly sandwiches and tuna are very cheap foods that are known to pack on muscle. You can easily match your weight in protein alone from 5 cans of tuna and 4 cups of milk. That is just for protein purposes, track people tend to have fast metabalism so peanut butter and jelly sandwiches will add some calories from carbs for you. Thats all about 35-50 dollars a week. If you eat anything else it will just be a plus.
The arm challenge looks pretty aerobic for a person like you. You may want to switch to weighted chins for reps, and heavier ez-curl.
Last but not least, relative to other muscles in the body biceps are pretty small. They are going to take a while to grow, specially if your not packing muscle on the rest of your body. Try adding some deadlifts. Heavy
[/quote]
[quote]bigdude wrote:
I think I was more like 150-155 then. The scale was off.
I didn’t get serious until 3 months after that. And didnt get really serious until 3 months after getting serious.
So i look at it more like 10-12lbs in 3months. Which is still very slow, but better than 6 in 11months.[/quote]
So youve only really been seriously training for 3 months, and youre already trying to bring up your “lagging arms”?
Just what T-Nation needs. More curl jockeys.
[quote]fightingtiger wrote:
So youve only really been seriously training for 3 months, and youre already trying to bring up your “lagging arms”?
Just what T-Nation needs. More curl jockeys.[/quote]
Let me clarify.
I have been seriously training for 6 years for something or other. I have only been seriously training for size and with any regard to aesthetics for the past 3-6months.
I have always thought of curls as a waste of time. I have also never really had the time to worry or care about how my arms looked. Now I am starting to care, and realizing that my arms are lagging compared to gains I am seeing elsewhere.
I learned to lift from an incredibly strict veteran (30+ years) track coach who specializes in decathletes and throwers and does all the strength training for the team and some programs for the other teams at the school. In the first 4months I worked under this coach I gained 20lbs of muscle. I am anything but a “curl jockey.” I did not start from nothing, and I never was “skinny-fat.” I was skinny and strong for my size.
I am assuming I will get some bullshit for this post, but I am tired of not being taken seriously here. I have always considered myself a student of my sport, whether it be track, football, wrestling, lifting etc. I am trying to learn as much as I can about lifting and getting stronger. I know the basics of lifting well and I ask specific questions - abs, arms, delts, etc. Because although I concentrate heavily on big lifts these are the areas where i feel like I am not improving (all other areas I am slowly improving).
I see the pattern of needing to eat more, and I am taking that advice to heart and am trying to eat as much as I possibly can.
I do appreciate that there are a lot of posters here looking just to get bigger arms and think they grow on trees and I assume this is where this comment comes from. I also appreciate that respect must be earned.
long post…anybody read it?
[quote]Airtruth wrote:
College is the perfect place to gain weight. You might not be able to eat every 2 hours, but the cafeteria can provide easily enough calories in one meal. So if you can eat that then some milk and tuna in between you should be fine.
Personally I loved my college caf, I complained with everybody else, but I was there 45 minutes eating straight and it was better than my cooking. That just goes back to your whole can’t afford to eat thing.
Are you deadlifting atleast twice a week? How intense are your sets? Sometimes the problem with lets say a 3x8 program is that a person will use a weight they think allows them to do the reps versus just picking up the heaviest thing they can find and curling til they can’t do anymore.
I would do the barbell curls first. At 165 your just not chinning enough weight for 8 reps to do anything to your biceps. Unless your going to to add more sets or reps to your chins.
Quickest gains, take every 4th week off from bicep work. Your body grows in spurts not linearly, when you come back they should look either a little firmer or a little bigger. Also don’t look at them every day, you won’t notice. The changes.
[/quote]
I am only deadlifting once a week. Last week I did a 1x6,5,4,3,2,2 ending at 315. The last set was suppose to be of 1 but 315 was too easy.
I havent been consistent with the sets that I do with deadlifts becuase I am not sure what will work best. Any suggestions?
I also like to throw in romanian deadlifts as an alternate (I often get knee pain from regular deads and squats). in that case i usually stick to 3x8
i am going to try the weighted chins next week (my arms are already killin me this week)
[quote]bigdude wrote:
Airtruth wrote:
College is the perfect place to gain weight. You might not be able to eat every 2 hours, but the cafeteria can provide easily enough calories in one meal. So if you can eat that then some milk and tuna in between you should be fine.
Personally I loved my college caf, I complained with everybody else, but I was there 45 minutes eating straight and it was better than my cooking. That just goes back to your whole can’t afford to eat thing.
Are you deadlifting atleast twice a week? How intense are your sets? Sometimes the problem with lets say a 3x8 program is that a person will use a weight they think allows them to do the reps versus just picking up the heaviest thing they can find and curling til they can’t do anymore.
I would do the barbell curls first. At 165 your just not chinning enough weight for 8 reps to do anything to your biceps. Unless your going to to add more sets or reps to your chins.
Quickest gains, take every 4th week off from bicep work. Your body grows in spurts not linearly, when you come back they should look either a little firmer or a little bigger. Also don’t look at them every day, you won’t notice. The changes.
I am only deadlifting once a week. Last week I did a 1x6,5,4,3,2,2 ending at 315. The last set was suppose to be of 1 but 315 was too easy.
I havent been consistent with the sets that I do with deadlifts becuase I am not sure what will work best. Any suggestions?
I also like to throw in romanian deadlifts as an alternate (I often get knee pain from regular deads and squats). in that case i usually stick to 3x8
i am going to try the weighted chins next week (my arms are already killin me this week)
[/quote]
Somehow, I didnt catch the part about you being a track athlete earlier. My bad. You were right though, my response had a lot to do with the number of 16 year old kids who post here wanting 17 inch arms and ripped abs by July and without gaining an ounce of weight.
My best advice (besides telling you to eat) is to focus on the big movements. Youve got that down from what Iv read. Keep improving on those. What is your training format like?
I would say go as heavy as you can on your back work and then after moving as much as you can on those, add in some isolation work. I tend to stick to ez bar or bb curls simply because I feel those are easier to progress on than db work.
Keep busting ass and eating like mad and youll see gains.
Did your track coach have you doing oly lifts? If you were fairly proficient with those, I think that, once you hit your learning curve, your DL weight will go up pretty fast. Try pulling sumo. I am much stronger with a wider stance than with a standard stance.
Best of luck.
If the fast metabolism people I know build muscle then do not lift that exercise again until the next week will burn it off. Your in prime age for building muscle you can go wayy more then once a week.
As far as your reps, I meant heavy but light enough to do 6 hard reps and maybe last set 3 with the intention of more. 2 reps will have your body maximize your stength potential but unless your banging out sets, it won’t be enough to build muscle. I didn’t mention this before but since your trying to build your arms I wouldn’t use straps.
The deads are just for packing on size in general. Since your goal is arms this should still be what most of your workouts for the week focus on.
*knee pain is another issue you might want to take care of before it gets bad.
You really should stick to a lot of compound lifts in the beginning along with taking in as much calories as possible. Then when you have put on substantial muscle weight start with the isolation exercises for your arms.
Here is a good shock workout for your arms that will help get over plateaus, initiate new growth etc. You should only do it every couple of weeks or so. Any more than that and it may lead to over training.
Cable Tricep Pushdowns superset w/ Standing Curls (EZ curl bar)
Set 1: 15 reps (warm up)
Set 2: 12 reps
Set 3: 10 reps
Set 4: 10 reps
Set 5: 8 reps (drop weight and do another 8 reps)
Close Grip Bench Press superset w/Preacher Curl Machine
Close Grip Bench Press:
Set 1: 10 reps
Set 2: 10 reps
Set 3: 8 reps ( do a double drop set of 8 reps each)
Preacher Curl Machine
Set 1: 12 reps
Set 2: 12 reps
Set 3: 8 reps do a double drop set of 8 reps each)
Tricep Dip Machine: 12 reps x 3 sets
Supersetted with Seated Dumbbell Curls: 10 reps x 3 sets
Just keep eating and when not using this workout use the same basic exercises just lower the sets etc.
I have never understood why someone would instruct every single newbie to avoid all isolation exercises from the beginning. Why avoid them? Because you simply can’t do BOTH compound and isolation exercises at the same time?
I feel that a whole lot of you simply repeat this shit because you heard it from someone else once. I really doubt that most of the larger guys on this site avoided all isolation work in the beginning unless all of their training was strictly sports related.
I think if you just train as hard as you can and as frequent as time and recovery allow, while eating as much as you can and training your balls off, you will make progress on your whole body on just about any program.
When I was 5’8 165 when I started to really lift heavy and with some cojones I made faster progress in a few months than I had made in a year. I am not saying this is you, just giving an idea.
Train youre triceps twice a shard and row heavy as fuck.
Ya know I’ve never posted a question on this forum… just read the articles. ALL answers to training u will ever need are found in the articles.
[quote]Professor X wrote:
I have never understood why someone would instruct every single newbie to avoid all isolation exercises from the beginning. Why avoid them? Because you simply can’t do BOTH compound and isolation exercises at the same time?
I feel that a whole lot of you simply repeat this shit because you heard it from someone else once. I really doubt that most of the larger guys on this site avoided all isolation work in the beginning unless all of their training was strictly sports related.[/quote]
I’m not saying that you need to avoid them. I’m saying that if you’re not gaining mass in general it isn’t going to do a lot of good to constantly do isolation exercises. If you want to do isolation exercises from the beginning to get used to the lifts then that’s fine but compound movements are what you need to be doing when trying to gain size in general.
After you have gained some weight then throw in more of the isolation stuff. But, as long as you’re doing the compound exercises it won’t hurt anything to do the isolation exercises it just might not do that much good if you’re not making gains in overall mass.
[quote]IronWarrior24 wrote:
Professor X wrote:
I have never understood why someone would instruct every single newbie to avoid all isolation exercises from the beginning. Why avoid them? Because you simply can’t do BOTH compound and isolation exercises at the same time?
I feel that a whole lot of you simply repeat this shit because you heard it from someone else once. I really doubt that most of the larger guys on this site avoided all isolation work in the beginning unless all of their training was strictly sports related.
I’m not saying that you need to avoid them. I’m saying that if you’re not gaining mass in general it isn’t going to do a lot of good to constantly do isolation exercises. If you want to do isolation exercises from the beginning to get used to the lifts then that’s fine but compound movements are what you need to be doing when trying to gain size in general.
After you have gained some weight then throw in more of the isolation stuff. But, as long as you’re doing the compound exercises it won’t hurt anything to do the isolation exercises it just might not do that much good if you’re not making gains in overall mass.
[/quote]
People need to quit thinking of this as some “either or” type of bullshit. This is a recent phenomena. No one 15 years ago thought that there was anyone ONLY doing isolation movements if the goal was to actually build a solid physique. Why do so many people currently think that any bodybuilders train that way at all? DO IT ALL. That is how you build a solid physique without imbalances, not by ignoring all isolation work until some specific date in the future as if it is a rite of passage.
[quote]Professor X wrote:
IronWarrior24 wrote:
Professor X wrote:
I have never understood why someone would instruct every single newbie to avoid all isolation exercises from the beginning. Why avoid them? Because you simply can’t do BOTH compound and isolation exercises at the same time?
I feel that a whole lot of you simply repeat this shit because you heard it from someone else once. I really doubt that most of the larger guys on this site avoided all isolation work in the beginning unless all of their training was strictly sports related.
I’m not saying that you need to avoid them. I’m saying that if you’re not gaining mass in general it isn’t going to do a lot of good to constantly do isolation exercises. If you want to do isolation exercises from the beginning to get used to the lifts then that’s fine but compound movements are what you need to be doing when trying to gain size in general.
After you have gained some weight then throw in more of the isolation stuff. But, as long as you’re doing the compound exercises it won’t hurt anything to do the isolation exercises it just might not do that much good if you’re not making gains in overall mass.
People need to quit thinking of this as some “either or” type of bullshit. This is a recent phenomena. No one 15 years ago thought that there was anyone ONLY doing isolation movements if the goal was to actually build a solid physique. Why do so many people currently think that any bodybuilders train that way at all? DO IT ALL. That is how you build a solid physique without imbalances, not by ignoring all isolation work until some specific date in the future as if it is a rite of passage.[/quote]
In an Interview Chad Waterbury was asked how he would have changed the way he lifted as a beginner knowing what he knows now.
Question #4: If you knew then what you know now, how would your first couple of years of training be different?
Waterbury: "I would’ve performed nothing but multi-joint, compound lifts. Variations of deadlifts, squats, cleans, snatches, pull-ups, rows and presses. That’s it.
This reasoning is based on the fact that multi-joint exercises allow for the largest loads. It’s important to teach trainees how to recruit high threshold motor units in order to build strength and size. But even more important, the aforementioned exercises build intermuscular coordination at a significantly faster rate than single-joint, isolation exercises.
Overall, trainees’ motor skills are greatly improved with compound exercises. When trainees perform nothing but single-joint, machine-based exercises, their motor skills end up being a mess. Since compound exercises are more challenging to the central nervous system (CNS), they’re the ideal choice."
I was just showing that some experts do recommend mostly compound lifts in the beginning. Oh wait, sorry professor x, I forgot you were the only person on Earth who knows anything about lifting.
[quote]IronWarrior24 wrote:
Professor X wrote:
IronWarrior24 wrote:
Professor X wrote:
I have never understood why someone would instruct every single newbie to avoid all isolation exercises from the beginning. Why avoid them? Because you simply can’t do BOTH compound and isolation exercises at the same time?
I feel that a whole lot of you simply repeat this shit because you heard it from someone else once. I really doubt that most of the larger guys on this site avoided all isolation work in the beginning unless all of their training was strictly sports related.
I’m not saying that you need to avoid them. I’m saying that if you’re not gaining mass in general it isn’t going to do a lot of good to constantly do isolation exercises. If you want to do isolation exercises from the beginning to get used to the lifts then that’s fine but compound movements are what you need to be doing when trying to gain size in general.
After you have gained some weight then throw in more of the isolation stuff. But, as long as you’re doing the compound exercises it won’t hurt anything to do the isolation exercises it just might not do that much good if you’re not making gains in overall mass.
People need to quit thinking of this as some “either or” type of bullshit. This is a recent phenomena. No one 15 years ago thought that there was anyone ONLY doing isolation movements if the goal was to actually build a solid physique. Why do so many people currently think that any bodybuilders train that way at all? DO IT ALL. That is how you build a solid physique without imbalances, not by ignoring all isolation work until some specific date in the future as if it is a rite of passage.
In an Interview Chad Waterbury was asked how he would have changed the way he lifted as a beginner knowing what he knows now.
Question #4: If you knew then what you know now, how would your first couple of years of training be different?
Waterbury: "I would’ve performed nothing but multi-joint, compound lifts. Variations of deadlifts, squats, cleans, snatches, pull-ups, rows and presses. That’s it.
This reasoning is based on the fact that multi-joint exercises allow for the largest loads. It’s important to teach trainees how to recruit high threshold motor units in order to build strength and size. But even more important, the aforementioned exercises build intermuscular coordination at a significantly faster rate than single-joint, isolation exercises.
Overall, trainees’ motor skills are greatly improved with compound exercises. When trainees perform nothing but single-joint, machine-based exercises, their motor skills end up being a mess. Since compound exercises are more challenging to the central nervous system (CNS), they’re the ideal choice."
I was just showing that some experts do recommend mostly compound lifts in the beginning. Oh wait, sorry professor x, I forgot you were the only person on Earth who knows anything about lifting.[/quote]
I am not the only person who knows anything about lifting. However, I am someone who disagrees with Chad Waterbury on that issue…as if that is beyond comprehension. I doubt I want to look like him either.