Statistical Progression

@Andrewgen_Receptors @simo74

A few questions:

  1. Are RDLs a good sub for DL from the floor? I have only ever done RDLs seriously in a workout program.

  2. What sort of intensity are you talking about? In the past 4 workouts I have pulled over to dry heave twice. That’s my litmus test for intensity (to a degree). It can also be malnourishment and dehydration, yes, but it is a heuristic. I’m sore after every workout and I now go to failure (not sure of the difference between failure and utter failure - two failed reps perhaps?).

  3. What would an exercise split look like with the recommended full body? Or at least how would it differ from what I’m doing. I understand it would be upper and lower each workout.

Also was that second option a day 1 upper, day 2 lower/push, and day 3 pull?

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Depends on the goal. They are great for hamstrings but much less of a ‘whole body’ movement than traditional deadlifts. I believe strength for all trainees is limited in RDL compared to Deadlift.

That may be the wrong kind of ‘intense’ but I’m proud of you for pushing yourself that hard regardless. I’ve been there, and still get there on some leg days. Still, this is very mentally taxing and could be counterproductive if you start disliking your training as a result.

Intensity = proximity to rep failure (cannot complete another rep)
The closer you are to failure, the more productive the reps are.

How much rest are you giving yourself between working sets? You may want to give yourself more time if it means you could perform better.

Well, i go for utter failure. Those two failed reps are the most important and beneficial ones.

RE malnourishment… if you’re eating very poorly, that will always play a role. I’m on a very low carb budget so i move all my daily carb allowance to pre-workout. That tends to help, if you’re that dialed in but it’s also overkill for most.
Intra workout nutrition tends to help a lot. You could use Biotest Surge, which I like, but if you want to save money - just use a gatorade and some salt (doesnt have to be mixed, could also be tablets).
Just pull the carbs from another meal to facilitate.

Full Body i would still have you do a top set and backdown set, both to failure. But i would have you do less exercises. I could write this out for you if you want. This is demanding on recovery so if recovery factors arent great, this may not be a good option.

For clarity:
Full body = 3x stimulus every muscle every week (best)
Upper-Lower = 1.5x stimulus every muscle every week (runner up)
Push-Pull = 1.5x stimulus every muscle every week (runner up)
note how Upper-Lower and Push-Pull have same weekly stimulus. Either could be used with no difference in effect. it’s up to you which one you’d want to do.
PPL = 1x stimulus every muscle every week (okay)
Bro split = .75x stimulus every muscle every week (poor)

These are listed from best to worst, but just because full body is best in stimulus does not mean it is best if your recovery is not able to manage it.
I still run PPL because my sleep is trash, I’m in a harsh deficit, and I’m under a lot of stress. I trained legs on Monday and I’m supposed to train them again tomorrow, but knowing if I’m actually going to be recovered enough to perform well.

Let me know if anything here doesnt make sense, i know i put a lot in here.

I will answer seeing as you tagged me but won’t add to much detail as @Andrewgen_Receptors has already laid a lot of it out already.

  1. RDL are a good lower body exercise and a great accessory for deadlifts especially of your hamstrings are weak. They don’t really substitute deadlifts but there is no issue running them alongside or even as a substitute for a training block.

  2. When I was talking about Intensity, I was thinking about how you balance the movements through the week. For example if I squat really heavy on a Monday, this can mean any deadlifting on Wednesday is impacted as my legs are so sore. So I move the deadlift to Friday and find a different lower body movement for the Wednesday session. It also means the lower body intensity on Wednesday may need to be lower.
    Training full body doesn’t mean trashing yourself on every exercise every session.
    In terms of training intensity, anything close to failure is fine. For me the most important thing is that i am progressing.

  3. Hard to answer this without knowing what exercises and equipment you have access to and can do.

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Bench - 12x155, 8x155, 8x135
Incline - 12x125, 7x125
DB bench - 8x55, 7x55
Triceps pushdown - 12x100, 16x100
Weighted decline sit-ups - 12x25, 12x25

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DB Row - 12x95, 12x95
Lat pull down 12x155, 15x155
Barbell curl - 12x70, 12x70
BB RDL - 12x185, 12x185
Squat - 12x120, 12x120
Leg Press - 12x450, 12x450,
Leg curl - 12x150, 12x150
Calf Raises - 12x135, 15x160

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@Andrewgen_Receptors

Alright I’m ready to entertain a full body workout plan. Do you want me to create one first and run it by you so you can review/edit it or do you have a premade one you recommend?

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I have something for you, let me dig it up. Gonna be busy so dont wait for me, but I’ll get it to you asap.

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Right on.

Bench - 12x155, 12x155
Incline - 12x125, 11x125 (an inch away from the 12th rep on set 2)
DB bench - 12x55, 14x55
Triceps push down - 11x110, 8x110
Decline crunch sit-ups - 12x27.5, 10x27.5

Great day today. Got better rest this past week.

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Okay so originally I was going to recommend a slightly bastardized version of Jordan Peters training, but I think you’re in a position to get better/faster results from a linear periodization program.

I’m going to recommend you go with Phraks Greyskull LP as your main work. I would have you do this until your Bench Squat and Deadlift total are near 1,000lbs, or until your main work lifts are stalled (assuming diet/recovery/training are ruled out as contributing causes).


Day 1: Vertical/Squats

  • OHP/Chin Ups/Squats as written above.
    • Quad Extension (2x fail)
    • Calves (any version, 2x fail)
    • Hammer Curls (2x fail)
    • Lateral Deltoid Raises (2x fail)

Day 2: Horizontal/Deadlifts

  • Bench Press/Bent Rows/Deadlifts as written above.
    • Hamstring Curl (2x fail)
    • Calves (any version, 2x fail)
    • Biceps Curl (2x fail)
    • Reverse Pec Deck/Reverse Flyes, rear delt focus (2x fail)

Day 3: Repeat Day 1
Day 4: Repeat Day 2

*For everything written in Phraks above, use the Phraks progression model.

**For everything added in afterwards (the 2nd bullet point exercises, lets call them “accessory work”), you will do 2 sets to failure. Ideally this will be anything from 6-20 reps. If you can hit more than 20 reps in either set, it’s probably time to increase weight.

***Calves can go higher in rep range, because calves.

****Ideally this would be trained Every Other Day, so 3-4 times weekly.

You can swap out any of the accessory work, even to the extent of not performing accessory work. The most important thing here is that you are progressing on the Main Work of Phraks Greyskull LP.

Any questions?

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RDL - 12x210, 12x210 (smith machine)
DB row - 12x100, 12x100

Got called away mid workout.

Lay Pull down - 12x170, 16x170
Calf Raises - 12x260, 12x260
Leg Press (diff. machine) - 12x270, 15x270
Leg extension 12x110, 20x110
BB curl - 12x70, 15x70

I think I got it. Honestly, I’m liking the results I’m seeing with my current program so I’m going to give it the ol 6 month effort (I’m three months in) and then switch over. I realize that this might mean I lose the potential extra three months of gains from the program you listed but I make my own comparisons with enough months (6+) of data for each program I do so I can understand more about how my body responds and I can improve my technique on the new lifts. I have done this with all programs except one because it was not a long term program. It was meant to just be a few months.

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No worries, whatever program you like most, tends to be the best program.

Either way, I would put an emphasis on improving your biggest lifts.

Bench - 12x160, 8x160
Incline - 9x125, 7x125
DB bench - 12x55, 11x55
Tricep pushdown - 11x110, 9x110
Decline crunch sit-up - 12x27.5, 12x27.5

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DB Row 12x105, 12x105
Lat Pull Down - 12x180, 11x180
BB curl - 12x75, 12x75
Calf Raises 20x200, 20x200
Squats - 12x70, 12x70 (slow negatives)
RDL - 12x110, 12x110

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Bench - 12x160, 8x160
Incline - 9x125, 6x125
DB bench - 12x55, 9x55
Crunch sit-up - 12x30, 12x30
Triceps extension 10x110, 9x110

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RDL - 12x155, 12x155
Kroc row - 12x110, 12x110
Lat pull down - 185x12, 185x12
DB curl - 12x80, 8x80
Calf Raises - 12x260, 15x260

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Crunch sit-up - 12x30, 12x30
Tricep push down 12x110, 12x110
Bench - 10x160, 9x160 (had another in me be no spotter)
Incline - 10x125, 7x125
DB bench - 12x52.5, 10x52.5 (one 55 was missing from the rack and I couldn’t find it)

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RDL 12x225, 14x225
Kroc row 12x115, 12x115
Lat Pull down - 10x200, 8x200
BB curl - 12x80, 5x80
Calf raises - 12x260, 15x260
Squat 12x155, 12x155
Leg curl 12x90, 12x110
Seated calf raises - 12x135, 12x135

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