Achieve better back tightness and torso bracing. Many different kind of cues can work: Chris likes pulling the bar into your back. Ur thinking about elbows which I reckon is not an effective cue. Elbows up down side ways whatever does not a tight back make.
A tight back is about active tension in the muscles of your upper back and shoulders. Personally I don’t really cue anything specific but try to set my back deliberately during the set up and maintain shoulder blades retracted and depressed throughout
Don’t think about elbows. Think about setting up your back and let your elbows go where they will depending upon your flexibility and relative body proportions.
I disagree, if elbows pop up and the bar rolls forward up the back after you hit the hole (like what happens in his video) it’s because your elbow position sucks and you’re literally countering any attempts at pushing your BACK into the bar with pushing the bar FORWARD with your arms. He’s also torquing the bar when his elbows pop, which rolls the bar up his back into a disadvantageous position AND causes a forward spin of the plates, which creates a moment force pulling him forward that he now has to combat as well. I guarantee this can be fixed with better upper body positioning and more effective “wedging” into the bar before the unrack.
Around 1:40 of the Will Crozier video he talks about elbow positioning and also states they need to be pushed forward. He does say that you want to avoid going too far forward and loosing shoulder blade retraction, which I agree with, but personally the way I wedge myself into the bar there is physically no way my shoulders could lose retraction, regardless of how much forward elbow cue I use.
The juggernaut video also sites “push your elbows under the bar” as “step 3”
@chris_ottawa posted a couple good side videos of some heavy squats that, in my opinion, really show a good “elbows under the bar” position throughout the whole squat, not just the setup.
Point being, just because you see a failure point (yes, his upper back did start to loose tightness) doesn’t mean that’s the primary issue.
I don’t think it’s possible to keep your upper back tight without your elbows down. Part of staying tight is engaging your lats, and if your elbows are shooting back then it’s a sign that your lats are not properly engaged. In his video you can see some spinal flexion as he comes up, the lats help to stabilize the spine and would reduce or eliminate that.
Well ur Dr Squat so I won’t dispute ya. I’m saying I reckon OP isn’t creating a tight back because he is only thinking about elbows not enough about scapula
Either way, I think the big takeaway is that it’s ALL important. Just to clarify because I didn’t say it in my previous post, I absolutely agree that generating and maintaining a tight upper back (and really, tight everything) is extremely important. Just wanted to point out that you can have all the tightness in the world and if something is out of position from the get-go, your technique can quickly go to crap.
What do you recommend to have a better “wedging”? Push the bar against the rack, removing the slack?
And what cue do you use to have a good upperback position?
Thanks
Rack height is super important. If it’s too high, it’s going to be much more difficult to wedge into the bar, actually looking at your 355 video you might benefit from lowering the rack a bit. Personally, I think it’s way better to have your rack set significantly too low, than even the slightest bit too high, so always error on the side of lower.
As @guineapig and others have commented, “pinching” your shoulder blades together is an important cue for bracing the upper back. However, you have to be careful, because when you pinch them together you want your shoulders themselves to anchor downwards. It’s a more natural tendency for people, if you tell them to pinch their shoulders together, to do it while pulling their shoulders up into a sort of shrug position. Just feeling around on myself (hey now), I can feel how if I pinch and shrug up, the elbows are placed into a high position, whereas if I pinch and pull the shoulders down, it’s more natural to have the elbows more down and forward.
Something to keep in mind, make sure you’re still devoting plenty of time and effort on building size and strength. Yes, technique is extremely important, but you still have a lot of potential quality mass and foundational strength to add too. If you’re going in every week just trying to find where your form breaks down and fix that, in 6 months you might end up with a really pretty 400 lb squat… but not make any real strength or muscle mass gains. Point is, it’s a balancing act and you need to make sure you’re working to progress all attributes of your sport.
I agree, the rack I was using in that attempt was high. I usually use one that is adjustable, but has no security support. I will pay more attention to that, preferably lower.
Yes, I understand, I will focus on scapular depression
That is a big problem of mine, I always make changes on the technique and never progress on one.
Thankss
I forget if it’s specifically mentioned in the vids but what a lot of lifters do me included is to set their back/brace and wedge/push into the bar a bit to make sure everything feels stable and locked in. Then get hips under breathe/brace bigger and unrack.
It’s kinda hard to describe but here’s my set up vid:
So you set your back shoulders elbows and shit properly before you get under the bar because once ur wedged into the bar you probably can’t readjust too much. Push into the bar a bit to see if it’s stable and lock it in then final big breathe and unrack
It’s not something I usually do, but I remember doing it. What I usually do when I have my hip below the bar is to make a “mini squat” take off the rack bar, rest it and take it out again. I feel that I take out all the slack and feel lighter.
In the rack I used in the 355 attempt it definitely didn’t work out because of the high height.
thank you i will take your video as a reference.
@guineapig@tasty_nate@chris_ottawa
Today I was playing around with the squat grip, and I recorded this. Which option are more solid or correct in your opinion? grip video
A: bench width thumbless
B: same but thumb arround
C: little finger across the ring (thumbless)
Closer is better for back tightness but can put pressure on ur wrists/elbows and shoulders. I think that the closer u grip while still having elbows closer than your wrists is better. Try closer grip after warming up ur shoulders a bit
I’m like 5cm away from the smooth for grip width on squat pretty comfy
I like thumbless because I’m less likely to support the bar with arm strength so I’m using my back like I’m supposed to.
Luckily I have good mobility and I don’t feel pain, but I always warm up well.
I also use that measurement, I put my thumb from the beginning of the knurling as a distance reference, which is approximately 5cm.
I agree and add that in my opinion it is more wrist friendly
Did you position the elbows well in option A?
Thanks.
My bench is just about there too right now lol. A smidge wider actually but still close. So elbows is about the same for me.
The widest I’ve held is like 5cm in from the bench press ring. Still comfortable/tight.
Hard to say about elbows because I think about my scapula/back a lot and when that’s tight the elbows go where they are supposed to. I guess it’s important they don’t move from that position but again I’m not really aware of em. Soz
The maximum I feel comfortable on the bench is using the middle finger on the ring, if I exceed that I feel that I am going to break my shoulders. The funny thing is that I have relatively long arms.
I think all those grips, and your form in general, looked great. So like @chris_ottawa said stick with what feels best and gets you tightest.
After seeing that your form looks fine with sub-maximal weights, I would say the biggest thing you need to do now is be consistent with your form and get almost all of your work in with weight that lets you maintain perfect form.
