[quote]hawaiilifterMike wrote:
Agreed except for Serge’s calves look a little better than Dexter’s.
[/quote]
You serious? If anything, they are extremely similar and calves can look extremely different depending on the angle you are viewing them. From his videos, Dex is ahead of Sergio in that department?
[quote]Professor X wrote:
MEYMZ wrote:
Dexter looks better in all senses.
I think anyone truly judging them without the “all drugs” bs mentality can see that. The bodybuilders today have improved greatly…and if the only way these guys can complain is to keep bringing up faults they thought they saw in Ronnie Coleman, then these arguments are pointless to start with.
Ronnie Coleman was amazing and expecting someone near 300lbs at 5’10" to have a tiny wasp waist is just retarded. The standards have also clearly changed since he was last on stage.[/quote]
Yeah, I think Kai and “The Gift” are guys to look at, these are clearly the division from the next generation.
From that one pic, I thought I saw a little lower insertion on Serge’s calves compared to Dexter’s, but I could be wrong. I would need to see more pics especially from the back.
a fuzzy pic of Serge. I just think he is a little fuller at the bottom of the calves, not necessarily bigger or more developed.
[quote]hawaiilifterMike wrote:
From that one pic, I thought I saw a little lower insertion on Serge’s calves compared to Dexter’s, but I could be wrong.
[/quote]
yah and that makes Serge better and Dexter less proportioned.
[quote]hawaiilifterMike wrote:
not necessarily bigger or more developed.
[/quote]
ok cheers.
[quote]MEYMZ wrote:
hawaiilifterMike wrote:
From that one pic, I thought I saw a little lower insertion on Serge’s calves compared to Dexter’s, but I could be wrong.
yah and that makes Serge better and Dexter less proportioned.[/quote]
Does it really? No, seriously.
No problem saying Serge is better than Dex, but to say that it’s their calves that set their physiques apart is stupid. At this point you are reaching in your attempt to glorify old guys and criticize this generation.
[quote]BONEZ217 wrote:
MEYMZ wrote:
hawaiilifterMike wrote:
From that one pic, I thought I saw a little lower insertion on Serge’s calves compared to Dexter’s, but I could be wrong.
yah and that makes Serge better and Dexter less proportioned.
Does it really? No, seriously.
No problem saying Serge is better than Dex, but to say that it’s their calves that set their physiques apart is stupid. At this point you are reaching in your attempt to glorify old guys and criticize this generation.
[/quote]
Oh come on man I was joking, I just posted before that I’m all Dex on that pic.
I changed my mind, even though Serge does have lower insertions of calves, it looks skinny overall compared to Dexter’s.
[quote]SirFlexAlot wrote:
The shape is not “lost” , their training and eating habits are probably the same arnie squatted and so did coleman , Lou curled and so does cutler , the main difference between the two physiques of bb`ers from the 70s and 80s and today is the increase in substance abuse ,
in the old days they used performance enhancing drugs to a much lower degree compared to now , back than all they used was a little deca and a little dbol and you were done , and now most bb`ers who go on stage at the olympia level have a little chimstry lab cooking inside them.
personally? i like arnie but whan I watch the big O bring on the mass monsters and keep the other guys at the fitness Expo.[/quote]
Not an increase of sunstance use - as they used to eat Dbol and shoot T like there was no tomorrow too… but there is a difference in the substances used.
T3 allows one to not only bulk more effectively, but get to a lower bodyfat, you got GH and IGF which are both very very effective, insulin used when dieting is useful for a really full and dry look, then you have tren and other newer steoids that werent around in the 70’s.
Of course Tren and T3 and GH were being used in the 90’s and the biggest of the big back then you could tell were really straining to be at that level (Dorian for example) - whereas these days there are a small number of BB who need to ‘manage’ their mass gains at the higher echelons of the sport, rather than getting as big as humanly possible as they know the judges will not score for that and that alone.
They HA to award that size Ronnie had, it was an amazing feat - never seen before, but now it has been done it allows us to get more refined.
We won’t get increasingly bigger, as essentially the sport isn’t JUST about size, but about the aesthetic of the human physique in fitness (essentally), characterised by the guidelines:
I personally love the old-school physiques of aforementioned BB’s, but i also love many of the modern day guys, but i like a certain aesthetic.
The Brits among us who know their BB will know who i mean when i say i find the pure muscularity AND perfect symmetry and balance of James Llewellin to be truly awe inspiring, better than Flex Lewis in my book.
Brook
95% of people that say this are the ones who have no idea about bodybuilding. The last few years haven’t been exactly great but the physiques are damn awesome at the moment, and for the last 10-20 years.
[quote]MEYMZ wrote:
BONEZ217 wrote:
MEYMZ wrote:
hawaiilifterMike wrote:
From that one pic, I thought I saw a little lower insertion on Serge’s calves compared to Dexter’s, but I could be wrong.
yah and that makes Serge better and Dexter less proportioned.
Does it really? No, seriously.
No problem saying Serge is better than Dex, but to say that it’s their calves that set their physiques apart is stupid. At this point you are reaching in your attempt to glorify old guys and criticize this generation.
Oh come on man I was joking, I just posted before that I’m all Dex on that pic.[/quote]
My bad
[quote]BONEZ217 wrote:
MEYMZ wrote:
BONEZ217 wrote:
MEYMZ wrote:
hawaiilifterMike wrote:
From that one pic, I thought I saw a little lower insertion on Serge’s calves compared to Dexter’s, but I could be wrong.
yah and that makes Serge better and Dexter less proportioned.
Does it really? No, seriously.
No problem saying Serge is better than Dex, but to say that it’s their calves that set their physiques apart is stupid. At this point you are reaching in your attempt to glorify old guys and criticize this generation.
Oh come on man I was joking, I just posted before that I’m all Dex on that pic.
My bad [/quote]
no worries bro, I was just speaking with my brother and watching a cooking segment. They say this dish that has 300 calories and I said “wtf!!! everything above 100 calories is bad”, and he almost began to argue with me because he thought I meant it. I don’t know if I have to work on emphasizing the sarcasm.
Why can’t “purists” let people theorize that it is INDEED substance abuse that’s ONE OF the factors?
Read IDs first post. Holy fuck.
[quote]B.L.U. Ninja wrote:
Why can’t “purists” let people theorize that it is INDEED substance abuse that’s ONE OF the factors?
Read IDs first post. Holy fuck. [/quote]
Because substance ABUSE is the wrong term completely. If you want to claim that todays pros are using a wider array of drugs than those in the past, fine. But there is no way that ANYONE here knows the magnitude of drugs used today compared to 40 years ago.
The fact of the matter is that professional bodybuilders have elite genetics. Elite genetics doesn’t just apply to the shape of their muscles or how easily they gain mass or the thickness of their muscle facsia. It also has to do with how well they respond to androgens. There is no doubt in my mind that larger amounts of total drugs are being used by amateurs messing around at the national level or guys who barely turn pro and never win a big show then the guys who fly up the ranks and make an impact at the big shows.
Kai Greene is an excellent example of how good professionals respond to drugs. He was absolutely huge when he was competeing at a natural. Lee Priest has also been very vocal about the relatively small amount of drugs he would take, going as far as saying he would only use PEDs in contest prep.
These arguments stem from the fact that people toss around the term ‘substance abuse’ and ‘drug abusers’ like they are referring to junkies who are ruining their own lives and the lives of people around them.
arnold vs dorian
bodybuilding today, as a sport, has some crazy insane bodies. now, i dont imagine i’ll ever be a pro. but i sure can appreciate the amount of energy and pain these guys go through. just like watchin hockey i’ll watch bodybuilding.
now i may think mats sundin is the best, most well rounded maple leaf ever, cause whenever i see old highlights it looks like a high school game. i sometimes think i can play hockey with the likes of frank mahovlich just because the game im used to is so much faster than the game that used to be played. in the same tone, looking like frank zane, or serge nubret is somethin i can almost realistically strive for, especially becasue these two men both reportedly stayed relatively lean. so i can prefer old timers aesthetically, its a whole new trunkgame nowadays.if jay cutler walked onstage, arnold may have had a heart attack, or at least came at the sight of jay posing.
as anything evolves, things that never mattered (goalies wearing helmets) become second nature. arnold won with the chest, franco had the density, frank had conditioning, while dexter won with the chest, density, and conditioning that will be considered meager in a decade or 2 (extreme calf hypertrophy the new benchmark?)
What the fuck is the point of this forum. Almost every single thread turns into a bunch of people bitching at each other.
I guess I’ll join in with this post.
[quote]B.L.U. Ninja wrote:
Why can’t “purists” let people theorize that it is INDEED substance abuse that’s ONE OF the factors?
Read IDs first post. Holy fuck. [/quote]
They had completely different standards in the 60’s. No one was even trying to build legs up like people today. They didn’t even start to focus on that until the 80’s around the time that Tom Platz hit the scene. Like all things in bodybuilding, those who take things to an extreme help redefine the sport. To jump over all of that and blame “substance abuse” isn’t just short sighted, it takes away from the hard work of the guys competing today.
Most of the people even making these threads about how great guys were in the 60’s completely ignore current bodybuilding which is why Ronnie Coleman gets mentioned first when he isn’t even the current Mr. O…Dex is.
dillet ferrigno
