Shackled Warrior: Yet Another Israel-Thread

Off Topic Politics & World Issues
21

[quote]lixy wrote:
FightinIrish26 wrote:
LIFTICVSMAXIMVS wrote:
Israel shouldn’t even be a state.

Case closed.

Agreed. Unfortunately it is, now, so we’ve got to deal with it.

There should be two states- an Israeli and Palestinian one. Why this is so hard to negotiate I’ll never understand.

Why negotiate when you’re a thousand times stronger militarily than your opponent?

When you’re the world leader in foreign aid per capita, why change anything before your benefactor’s well dries up?

Why strive for peace when maintaining the status quo long enough would make you look like the victim in the eyes of (history-naive) newer generations?[/quote]

I see you are back spouting your bullshit. You cannot negotiate a solution when both parties are adamantly opposed to what is being proposed.

22

[quote]Sifu wrote:
LIFTICVSMAXIMVS wrote:
IrishSteel wrote:
LIFTICVSMAXIMVS wrote:
IrishSteel wrote:
LIFTICVSMAXIMVS wrote:
Israel shouldn’t even be a state.

Case closed.

You’re being facetious . . . . .right?

No. Why should Israel exist as a state? It never was until the West intervened.

Why don’t we just go into the middle east and start drawing boarders in the sand, too…? oh, wait. We already did that. Hello, Iraq.

I will grant you that Britain really screwed up the world with their arbitrary lines in the sand - but you cannot deny that there was a historical Israel with roughly the borders it possesses today . . . they were simply given that historical territory by the withdrawing Brits that was traditionally Israel prior to the onslaught of the Muslim hordes as a means to deal with the displaced Jewish populations and as recompense for the horrors they have suffered throughout history at the hands of the nations they lived in. Something the UN supported at the time

The UN charter granting Israel nationhood was designed to meet the needs of both Jew and Arab by creating two states - one Palestinian and one Jewish - however, the apportionment of the territory for a Palestinian state was blocked by Egypt, Lebanon, Syria and Jordan.

Historically and legally - Israel has the right to exist, and by fait accompli of the wars launched against them managed to add territory by defeating those who tried to destroy it (West Bank, Gaza, Golan Heights)

Are you really going to spout UN nonsense? Come on. I thought you were a conservative.

I think you do not really understand what a right is. States do not have rights. Individuals do. No one has the right to take power collectively in the name of other individuals.

Historically, if Israel were capable of being a real state it would have existed without intervention by other governments and would have been recognized as such.

People need to put down their mythology books and properly analyze reality.

If that is the case the United States shouldn’t exist either. Because it was funding from European Jews and French troops that made the revolution a success. [/quote]

obvious truth is obvious

23

[quote]LIFTICVSMAXIMVS wrote:
jsbrook wrote:
Lifty shouldn’t even be a person.

Case closed.

The difference is that I actually exist and Israel doesn’t.

[/quote]

Israel doesn’t…what the hell is all the fighting about?

24

Well, here’s proof that ignorance leads to war

Let’s sit back and enjoy the global meltdown - it won’t be long before Muslims have nuclear weapons - then what a wonderful world it will be as we race into oblivion - stock up on the rum - it’ll be gone before you know it . . .

25

[quote]IrishSteel wrote:
Well, here’s proof that ignorance leads to war

Let’s sit back and enjoy the global meltdown - it won’t be long before Muslims have nuclear weapons - then what a wonderful world it will be as we race into oblivion - stock up on the rum - it’ll be gone before you know it . . .[/quote]

Muslims won’t have nukes…for long. There are plenty of people in their region take care of this possibility if the threat becomes real. We don’ have to worry about nukes that can’t reach us anyway.

26

[quote]IrishSteel wrote:
Well, here’s proof that ignorance leads to war

Let’s sit back and enjoy the global meltdown - it won’t be long before Muslims have nuclear weapons - then what a wonderful world it will be as we race into oblivion - stock up on the rum - it’ll be gone before you know it . . .[/quote]

The Islamic Republic of Pakistan doesn’t count in your eyes?

27

[quote]lixy wrote:
IrishSteel wrote:
Well, here’s proof that ignorance leads to war

Let’s sit back and enjoy the global meltdown - it won’t be long before Muslims have nuclear weapons - then what a wonderful world it will be as we race into oblivion - stock up on the rum - it’ll be gone before you know it . . .

The Islamic Republic of Pakistan doesn’t count in your eyes?[/quote]

Nope - cuz they are scared of India - so as long as the Pak govt has control of them - they’re gonna keep them for that purpose - but let the Taliban get ahold of them - whole different scenario unfolds there - oh wait, sorry - I let geopolitics interrupt your point . . . .

28

A guy just can’t have a good rant anymore - here I was feeling all apocalyptic and Lixy keeps trying to depress me even more . . . .

29

We the United States really have no business being intertwined with the affairs of the Jews. That said, they are looking like better partners than a militant unrepentant Islam.

30

[quote]Erasmus wrote:
Hi!

I found this interview would like to present it to you.
I particularly liked this question:
Q: Has Europe betrayed Israel?

Glick: I think that the root of Europe?s refusal to support Israel is Europe?s refusal to accept the true lessons of the Holocaust. The lesson that Europe took from the Holocaust is that nationalism is bad. This of course, is absurd. Nationalism is neutral. Its relative badness or goodness is a direct function of how any specific nation behaves. The true lesson of the Holocaust is that nations and individuals have a responsibility to distinguish between good and evil and to support good and fight evil.

Israel?s struggle against its neighbors, who refuse to accept it as a sovereign state just as Europeans refused to accept Jews as individuals in the 20th century, constitutes a moral challenge to Europe. And since Europe has refused to discard its moral relativism for moral choice, Europeans project their own moral blindness and weakness on Israel.

http://article.nationalreview.com/?q=ZTVkMWYzYjRkOWViM2NmYzYyOTU3NTg5NThhMTNlYTc=&w=MQ== [/quote]

I think a much better lesson would be not to do any evil.

Not start wars, not torture, relatively simple things.

We do not want to make it too difficult for bureaucrats.

31

[quote]LIFTICVSMAXIMVS wrote:
dhickey wrote:
LIFTICVSMAXIMVS wrote:
Are you really going to spout UN nonsense? Come on. I thought you were a conservative.

I think you do not really understand what a right is. States do not have rights. Individuals do. No one has the right to take power collectively in the name of other individuals.

Well, historically this is how all nations are defined.

Historically, if Israel were capable of being a real state it would have existed without intervention by other governments and would have been recognized as such.

Why does interventions by other nations change anything? If they would have raised an army by themselves and taken the land, would your opinion be any different? What if they could have defended the territory in the 9th century and retained control? Same land, same people.
[qutoe]
People need to put down their mythology books and properly analyze reality.
What exactly is based in mythology?

Here is one test that can happen. Let Israel defend itself without any funding from the US.[/quote]

No, the true test is to take away the oil from the Arabs and drop the funding of Israel from the US. Then see who will come out on top.

32

[quote]IrishSteel wrote:
Well, here’s proof that ignorance leads to war

Let’s sit back and enjoy the global meltdown - it won’t be long before Muslims have nuclear weapons - then what a wonderful world it will be as we race into oblivion - stock up on the rum - it’ll be gone before you know it . . .[/quote]

That’s not going to be a problem because all the Muslims want to die a martyr’s death to get 40 virgins in hell (I mean in heaven). So how far do you think a nuclear missile is going to fly with 20 Muslims lashed to it?

33

brings Dr. Strangelove to mind.