School Board Shooting

Off Topic
101

[quote]goldengloves wrote:

[quote]Iron Dwarf wrote:

[quote]goldengloves wrote:

[quote]Iron Dwarf wrote:
George W. Bush ducked TWO flying shoes from a single thrower 30 feet away in a crowded room of reporters and such, yet these old fat fuckers didn’t budge to save their own lives from a man aiming a pistol within 10 feet?

FAIL.

Thank God the shooter was a shitty shot.[/quote]

I think it’d be a little easier to dodge the shoe from 30 ft than a bullet from 10 ft. You’ve to remember that these are fat old men too, they probably start breathing heavy while walking to vending machine to purchase 3 candy bars, chips, and a diet Coke. Bush also kept his body in peak physical condition because he realized haters are going to hate, that’s why he’d the reflexes of a mongoose and guns of a US military armory.
[/quote]

My point was that Bush had a room full of distractions while the shoes headed his way. These old fat fuckers had the man right in front of them, the focus was on HIM and they didn’t even duck when the gun emerged.

BTW, I was no fan of Bush. FAR from it. I just think he was awesome in that particular shoe situation (especially popping up with a smile on his face).
[/quote]

Personally, I wonder why they didn’t call security the moment the man stood up and started spray painting the wall. Is he just going to spray paint a V then sit back down? I really doubt anyone would do that.

[/quote]

I agree. IMHO, I think as a society we’ve become so complacent, that our constant exposure to over-the-top action in film and television has made us non-reactive to the real thing. It’s as if these people sat there as spectators watching a drama unfold before them on a screen.

102

A guy makes a rolling stop at a stop sign, and gets pulled over by a local policeman.

  The guy hands the cop his driver's license, insurance verification, plus his concealed
  carry permit.

  "Okay, Mr. Smith," the cop says, "I see your CCW permit. Are you
  carrying today?"

  "Yes, I am."

  "Well then, better tell me what you got."

  Smith says, "Well, I got a .357 revolver in my inside coat pocket.
  There's a 9mm semi-auto in the glove box. And, I've got a .22 magnum
  derringer in my right boot."

  "Okay," the cop says. "Anything else?"

  "Yeah, back in the trunk, there's an AR15 and a shotgun. That's about it."

  "Mr. Smith, are you on your way to or from a gun range...?"

  "Nope."

  "Well then, what are you afraid of....?"

  "NOT A FUCKIN' THING ..."
103

To carry a handgun in Canada you need:
1)A permit to have the gun
2)A permit to carry the gun
3)Registered to a shooting range
4)Restricted gun license (obvious)
5)Carry it unloaded bullets no where near the gun in a locked case.
6)All paper work needs to be with the gun

I have my restricted because it was another $20 for the test to get it during non-restricted testing.

104

[quote]Fuzzyapple wrote:
To carry a handgun in Canada you need:
1)A permit to have the gun
2)A permit to carry the gun
3)Registered to a shooting range
4)Restricted gun license (obvious)
5)Carry it unloaded bullets no where near the gun in a locked case.
6)All paper work needs to be with the gun

I have my restricted because it was another $20 for the test to get it during non-restricted testing. [/quote]

No.

What you need is

  1. A gun.
105

[quote]Professor X wrote:
One thing to add…when this country was first founded, little boys were taught to handle a rifle before the age a kid can drive today. That is no longer the case. What we have now is a nation filled with weak video game playing fuckers who are nowhere near the level of “roughneck” people were 200 years ago. We have super powered rifles compared to back then but millions of people with less education of how to even handle the smallest weapon in combat…yet the idea is to arm all of these fuckers?

LO fucking L.

I am trying to imagine what the world would be like if the average moron who cuts me off on the freeway were all armed…or that kid who can’t count my change correctly at Wendy’s if the cash register goes down…or the same people in that vid who froze in place when the shit hit the fan.

I think it should be regular practice for “gun bootcamp” to be a requirement to get a weapon like that.

That is just my honest opinion. People can argue all they wish.[/quote]

This is true. Obviously there are guys that get guns because they like them and know how to use them, but I think the majority of CCW’s go to guys that are scared.

My father-in-law falls into this second category, average white guy who has never been in a serious altercation that buys a gun for protection. Problem is when he pulls that gun on someone that can handle themselves they’re going to knock his teeth out with it or worse.

Michigan has some fairly stringent CCW laws (must take classes, must attend range practice, can’t take your weapon into anyplace that serves alcohol, etc…) but considering the morons I encounter daily it is a pretty scary scenario that they might be packing.

106

That video was hilarious

107

[quote]Testy1 wrote:
average white guy who has never been in a serious altercation that buys a gun for protection. Problem is when he pulls that gun on someone that can handle themselves they’re going to knock his teeth out with it or worse.[/quote]

Would it be better for a guy who gets into serious altercations to have a gun then, a level headed person who tries to avoid them.

In most states that allows you to use a pistol for self defense, requires you to have �¢??held a reasonable fear of imminent peril of death or great bodily harm to himself or herself or another when using defensive force that is intended or likely to cause death or great bodily harm to another" is how my state words it.

I will admit there are a few people that have a CCW that don’t know how to use their weapon, want to use it as a first resort, or even know the law, if that is the case they won’t have their CCW license for very long, they would either be dead or in jail.

I don’t believe these people should prevent me from getting my license and carring.

108

Oklahoma Satistics

2009 Applications Granted 35,962.
2009 Applications Denied 1,015.

2009 License Revoked 14*
6 for “Establish a residency in the State of Oklahoma”
4 for “Ineligible to possess a pistol due to any felony conviction”
2 “domestic abuse”
2 “Ineligible to possess a pistol”

2009 License suspended 44
1 “Carrying weapons under influence of alcohol”
7 “Notification to police of gun”
24 “arrest for an alleged commission of a felony offense”
11 “other perclusions” ie. drugs domestic abuse,dui,attempted suicide
1 “discharding”

http://www.ok.gov/osbi/documents/SDA%202009%20Report.pdf

109

Luckily, this guy turned out to be one of the worst shots of all-time…especially when he shoots next to his feet twice. Reminds me of when Harry tries to shoot the people at the end of Dumb and Dumber.

“Harry! You’re alive! And you’re a terrible shot!”

110

[quote]Ty Carlson wrote:
Luckily, this guy turned out to be one of the worst shots of all-time…especially when he shoots next to his feet twice. Reminds me of when Harry tries to shoot the people at the end of Dumb and Dumber.

“Harry! You’re alive! And you’re a terrible shot!”[/quote]

Just a question…but to those calling him a bad shot, you all have fired a weapon in a tense situation?

Guess what, your hands are shaking, your perception is off and only trained individuals will overcome that in most circumstances.

For instance, if a man has a heart attack in a restaurant, watch how many people just stand around or start fidgeting but doing nothing productive. A trained medical provider will usually have to YELL for someone to go call 911 before anyone moves.

Yeah he missed…thank goodness…but my guess is, most people would or they would hit targets randomly by accident.

That is why it is a little off to ASSUME that any of you will do better if you have never dealt with that before at all.

111

[quote]ExtremistPullup wrote:

[quote]Testy1 wrote:
average white guy who has never been in a serious altercation that buys a gun for protection. Problem is when he pulls that gun on someone that can handle themselves they’re going to knock his teeth out with it or worse.[/quote]

Would it be better for a guy who gets into serious altercations to have a gun then, a level headed person who tries to avoid them.

In most states that allows you to use a pistol for self defense, requires you to have �?�¢??held a reasonable fear of imminent peril of death or great bodily harm to himself or herself or another when using defensive force that is intended or likely to cause death or great bodily harm to another" is how my state words it.

I will admit there are a few people that have a CCW that don’t know how to use their weapon, want to use it as a first resort, or even know the law, if that is the case they won’t have their CCW license for very long, they would either be dead or in jail.

I don’t believe these people should prevent me from getting my license and carring.
[/quote]

You are making a lot of assumptions. Just because someone has been in altercations doesn’t make them a hot head, nor does a lack of sack make them level headed. My point was that if my father-in-law were to pull a gun on someone who could handle themselves he would probably get it shoved down his throat. If he is pulling it on someone who is not a serious threat, why does he need a gun?

In Michigan you can’t take a concealed weapon into a bar or sporting event or a whole host of other venues. So you can take it to Detroit to see a Wings game but you have to leave it in your car. This kind of defeats the purpose if you ask me.

I’m not against CCW’s I just think the majority aren’t fit to have them. I’m also not anti gun either, as I have quite a few of my own.

112

[quote]Testy1 wrote:

You are making a lot of assumptions. Just because someone has been in altercations doesn’t make them a hot head, nor does a lack of sack make them level headed. My point was that if my father-in-law were to pull a gun on someone who could handle themselves he would probably get it shoved down his throat. If he is pulling it on someone who is not a serious threat, why does he need a gun?

In Michigan you can’t take a concealed weapon into a bar or sporting event or a whole host of other venues. So you can take it to Detroit to see a Wings game but you have to leave it in your car. This kind of defeats the purpose if you ask me.

I’m not against CCW’s I just think the majority aren’t fit to have them. I’m also not anti gun either, as I have quite a few of my own.
[/quote]

You are making a lot of assumptions about other people based on your father in law, Just because someone has a gun doesn’t mean thir going to pull it every time they feel threatened. If it comes out, its going to be used and the threat will stop. If someone is not a threat you don’t inject that into a confrontation. The gun is something to fall back on as a last resort.

You believe the majority aren’t fit to have them but, CCW are the one’s less likely to commit a crime. Saying a Majority of people who qualifty for a CCW shouldn’t have them anyway is very anti CCW

If the only thing he does is go to bars and pro sports, he might just want to leave it at home.

here is an example in the news
Houston store owner kills 3 would-be robbers

113

[quote]Amiright wrote:
Thats totally fucked up… luckily that guy sucks at shooting… as messed up as it is… how the hell do you miss from 10 feet?!? Thankfully those people are ok… [/quote]

if i’d missed all those shots from 10 feet i’d have killed myself too…out of embarrassment.

114

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]Ty Carlson wrote:
Luckily, this guy turned out to be one of the worst shots of all-time…especially when he shoots next to his feet twice. Reminds me of when Harry tries to shoot the people at the end of Dumb and Dumber.

“Harry! You’re alive! And you’re a terrible shot!”[/quote]

Just a question…but to those calling him a bad shot, you all have fired a weapon in a tense situation?

Guess what, your hands are shaking, your perception is off and only trained individuals will overcome that in most circumstances.

For instance, if a man has a heart attack in a restaurant, watch how many people just stand around or start fidgeting but doing nothing productive. A trained medical provider will usually have to YELL for someone to go call 911 before anyone moves.

Yeah he missed…thank goodness…but my guess is, most people would or they would hit targets randomly by accident.

That is why it is a little off to ASSUME that any of you will do better if you have never dealt with that before at all.[/quote]

I understand what you’re saying but this situation was premeditated, obviously. Because of that, he had more time to mentally prepare for this “tense” situation. It would make more sense for a guy to miss multiple shots from 10 feet when he is completely caught off guard like a cop who suddenly needs to fire their weapon after 15 years of not ever firing it. I get what you’re saying though. The guy was probably shitting himself because he knew he was dying momentarily. Either that or going back to prison which he said wasn’t an option.

115

[quote]TD54 wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]Ty Carlson wrote:
Luckily, this guy turned out to be one of the worst shots of all-time…especially when he shoots next to his feet twice. Reminds me of when Harry tries to shoot the people at the end of Dumb and Dumber.

“Harry! You’re alive! And you’re a terrible shot!”[/quote]

Just a question…but to those calling him a bad shot, you all have fired a weapon in a tense situation?

Guess what, your hands are shaking, your perception is off and only trained individuals will overcome that in most circumstances.

For instance, if a man has a heart attack in a restaurant, watch how many people just stand around or start fidgeting but doing nothing productive. A trained medical provider will usually have to YELL for someone to go call 911 before anyone moves.

Yeah he missed…thank goodness…but my guess is, most people would or they would hit targets randomly by accident.

That is why it is a little off to ASSUME that any of you will do better if you have never dealt with that before at all.[/quote]

I understand what you’re saying but this situation was premeditated, obviously. Because of that, he had more time to mentally prepare for this “tense” situation. It would make more sense for a guy to miss multiple shots from 10 feet when he is completely caught off guard like a cop who suddenly needs to fire their weapon after 15 years of not ever firing it. I get what you’re saying though. The guy was probably shitting himself because he knew he was dying momentarily. Either that or going back to prison which he said wasn’t an option.
[/quote]

Just a tip…it doesn’t matter how much you “mentally prepare” for an altercation like that. Until you get your hands dirty in the middle of shit, you will not know how you will react. That goes for anyone from the MT who arrives on the job day one and has to treat a massive injury or dealing with some guy pulling a gun on you.

Most people are not anywhere near as badass as they wish they were when faced with something like that. This is why I respect the counsel-man to some degree for keeping a level head. I am willing to bet most people’s reaction would be to piss themselves, cry, or freeze in one place. Most would NOT immediately try to calmly talk the shooter down.

116

You are definitely right X. The only somewhat adequate comparison is hunting , and that’s if you see, identify and d
shoot your target under stress very quickly.

I say that because you’re killing something. And that’s still so far from the real thing. Example, my kid missed a ten point buck while sitting right next to me. Before he cools register a hit or miss I threw ip my gun and shot it in the spine.

And I’d be kidding myself to the nth degree if I thought that made me some kind of gunfighter.

117

[quote]NvrTooLate wrote:
Have you ever heard of the gun show loophole?
Sale of guns at gun shows is pretty much unsupervised and done without checks of any kind. [/quote]

Quit watching fantasy movies and actually go to gun show and try it. Report back with your findings.

118

To handle a gun under stress takes a lot of practice and training. Most shooting instructors I know font think the amount of training a police officer and average military person gets is adequate. These fellows believe 500 rounds per month is the bare minimum to maintain proficiency. Now let’s say you have 50 officers in your depth.

You’re looking at 1800$ a year minimum in ammo costs per man. Times that times 50$ and you have 90k per year per dept. I seriously that’s happening. That’s for 9mm btw. Put that up by 1/3 for 45 acp. Maybe 20% for 40 x
cal or 357 sig.

That’s not including other fees etc. This I’d one reason statistically private citizens shoot as well as the average cop. Now there are him guys in both categories. But a motivated private citizen can be much better prepared than a cop doing the minimum. I can tell you stories upon stories about this. One hilarious one was a local pd where they all used one guy’s gun so they only had to clean one. And this was all they shot that year.

And one of the cops told me this. It was their annual qualification btw. Another cool story was the member of the Pa state police that took five rounds to kill a road hit deer wounded on the side of the road the deer was on the ground immobile after bring hit by a vehicle. Distance was five feet tops.

Would you want that guy protecting you?

119

[quote]SteelyD wrote:

[quote]NvrTooLate wrote:
Have you ever heard of the gun show loophole?
Sale of guns at gun shows is pretty much unsupervised and done without checks of any kind. [/quote]

Quit watching fantasy movies and actually go to gun show and try it. Report back with your findings.[/quote]

Here’s a (long) rant on the so-called gunshow loophole by a friend of mine (we contribute political/2nd Amendment commentary to a local media outlet), Jeff Zimba, contributing editor at Small Arms Review. The man is an expert in firearms and firearm law.

â?¢First rule: The “Gun Show Loophole” does not exist. Yup. Simple as that. It is a fabricated buzzword, just like “Saturday Night Special”, “Plastic Handguns”, “Cop Killer Bullets” and “Semiautomatic Assault Weapon” to generate emotion, lie to the people and pass more unnecessary gun laws that are not needed. These phrases are just solutions for problems that do not exist. The Anti-Gun, Anti-Freedom, Gun (People) Control groups peddle in this stuff and have for years.

To simplify, those who are licensed federal firearms dealers have specific rules to follow. VERY specific. It is not even legal for them to complete a transaction ANYPLACE except their licensed premises. The ONLY exception is at a sanctioned gun show. The gun show is, for legal purposes, considered a temporary extension of the licensed premises. FACT. Since background checks are necessary at the dealers shop, they are also mandatory at gun shows. You will notice gun dealers with cell phones yakking with NICS to get approvals as much as they are dealing with customers. Same rules, laws, paperwork. NO EXCEPTIONS. As a matter of fact, it is only valid for a gun show in the dealerâ??s home state. If a dealer sets up a display in a state other than his licensed premises, they cannot complete a transaction at all. They can sell a gun but they cannot deliver it. PERIOD. They must return to their shop and ship the gun to another licensed dealer in the state of the person who bought it so their dealer can finish the transaction for them, adhering to their own local and/or state laws as well as the federal laws. This is how it works in the real world, not the fantasy, smoke and mirror, symbolism over substance world of the anti-gun groups.

Now, here is their little rub they seem to leave out of their sensational stories. Private citizens can still buy, sell, swap and trade an occasional firearm without having to go through all the mountain of paperwork a dealer does. JUST LIKE AN AUTOMOBILE transaction. If you buy a car from your neighbor you do not have to fill out mountains of paperwork and have mandatory warranties, etc as from a licensed car dealer. It’s just a legal commodity being sold among private parties. This is the kind of sale the gun grabbers are crying about and it is part of their end game to have all sales go through federally licensed dealers. They like to use the term “unlicensed dealer” and again (surprise) there is no such thing. If someone is selling more guns than they should and it has gone past the hobby stage, the nice ladies and gentlemen at the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (BATEF) are happy to let them know they need to get a license of face some pretty severe penalties. These Federal Agents are not an uncommon sight at such trade shows. They are usually welcomed with open arms by the dealers who are happy to comply with the laws they work within every day.

It is uncommon for someone without a license to have a table at a gun show, and I know this because I have been involved in promoting some of the largest shows in the entire United States for as long as a few decades. I did not learn what I know by reading propaganda handed out at someone’s peace march.

That said, there are occasions where someone will be thinning out a collection for retirement purposes, for poor health, to upgrade a collection, to settle en estate, and several other small-scale situations. These are individuals, not dealers. (please revert back to the car dealer vs. individual situation). The Gun Grabbers like to call these people “Unlicensed Gun Dealers” which does not exist and again, BATFE is happy to make sure of this. BATFE watches gun shows, Craigâ??s List, Uncle Henrys, Newspapers, etc. They can spot a bad apple a mile away and deal with them swiftly.

So, what is the REAL goal of the anti-gunners you may ask? It’s simple and their actions prove it. They have boldly asked, even in Maine State legislation to make many of these guns illegal, calling for their forfeiture, confiscation and seizure. Bold moves like this don’t work well (like the boil the frog slowly theory) so they chip away at our freedoms a tiny bit at a time. If they can stop law abiding citizens from trading a legal item with another law abiding citizen in a specific place on a specific date (like a gun show) what is to stop them from banning you from selling a firearm, legally to the neighbor you have known for years who has been recently threatened. What is to stop them from banning you from selling a hunting rifle to your brother the night before a surprise-hunting trip? What is to stop them from making it illegal to give your daughter a firearm who is moving to an unfamiliar place? Nothing. They don’t care about “gun shows” and there is no “loophole” to begin with. It is another feeble attempt to slide their foot further in the door to get to their original intentions of taking them all away. Again, if you think this is silly or paranoia, look up some of Ethan Strimling’s bills in the Maine Legislature just a few years ago asking for their REAL wish list. The actual legislation actually called for FORFEITURE, SEIZURE and CONFISCATION. Not paranoia, just simple FACT and Thank God we were paying attention.

In case you missed it, by the way, the bad guys and criminals do not follow ANY of the laws so this foolishness only affects the people who are of no threat at all. That is what makes bad guys, bad guys, and gun control laws so damn ineffective. Those of us who DO follow the law have some 20,000 laws on the books to jump through already. The bad guys don’t give a snake’s spit about them when they are going to rape, assault, and murder other citizens.

All the states with the lowest violent crime rates have the highest percentage of gun ownership and the fewest gun laws. It doesn’t take a Harvard degree to figure out why. Take a peek at the FBI Uniform Crime Report and see for yourself. No propaganda from anyone, just the FBI’s own statistics. Maine has the lowest violent crime rate in the entire nation and the highest number of firearms per capita. The gun control groups give Maine a “D-” or an “F” in their rating systems. The District of Columbia has a violent crime rate of over 11x higher (ELEVEN FREAKIN TIMES HIGHER) than ours and they usually rate an “A” with the gun grabbers. Whose well-being are they looking out for? The citizens of the states or their own twisted agenda? It’s a pretty simple answer.

Again, in summary, there is no such thing as a “Gun Show Loophole” it is just the current gun control buzzword du’jour.

Additionally, he’s got the best damn job in the world:

120

[quote]HERC410 wrote:

[quote]Amiright wrote:
Thats totally fucked up… luckily that guy sucks at shooting… as messed up as it is… how the hell do you miss from 10 feet?!? Thankfully those people are ok… [/quote]

if i’d missed all those shots from 10 feet i’d have killed myself too…out of embarrassment.[/quote]

It’s real easy to miss from 10 feet when you’re not proficient with the firearm, use shitty control, or are in an elevated adrenaline state. Talk to enough LEO’s who have had to discharge a weapon and inevitably you’ll find that even professionals trained to be proficient with firearms miss at close range in some circumstances.